When does the Yzerplan start getting criticized?
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JediOrderPizza
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People will troll about Copp and Holl still while most Wings fans are eyeing the thing that matters. The prospects.
This defense needs a god damn overhaul tho. I'd like to see a move on that finally.
JoeThorntonsRooster
Don’t say eye test when you mean points
You’re seriously telling me that ROR (Selke winner, 31st in scoring in his Cup year), Eichel (10th place scoring finish in his last full year in BUF), and Stone (11th place scoring finish and Selke finalist 2 years before Cup) are equal to or worse than Raymond/Larkin, neither of whom have ever finished as high in scoring as even ROR in his Selke year?
JediOrderPizza
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I believe Larkin is equal to ROR and Eichel in his cup form yes. He's been a PPG center for three seasons now.
jfrank21
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Ryan O'Reilly had a career high 77 points in 82 games when he was 27...in what world has Larkin ever come close to that??
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Oh wait, that's right, here in the real world Larkin has had 69 in 71, 79 in 80 and 69 in 68 the past 3 season as a 25, 26, and 27 year old. Meanwhile, the "superstar" Jack Eichel had a career high 82 points in 77 games 6 years ago. Now granted, Eichel is doing well to start this season, but just because he was drafted #2 overall, doesnt make him this elite tier player compared to Larkin.
Oddbob
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Seen him play, he isn't elite. Less than ppg and no other intangibles are not elite numbers. Visually nothing elite either.
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ricky0034
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seeing people bring up the same 1-2 teams that arguably won without elite talent over and over again in this thread is honestly so tiresome
personally even if for the sake of argument you assume the Wings have comparable players like people keep insisting i'd actually like a higher bar than "these 2 examples in the past couple decades prove that it's not literally impossible for my team to win!"
personally even if for the sake of argument you assume the Wings have comparable players like people keep insisting i'd actually like a higher bar than "these 2 examples in the past couple decades prove that it's not literally impossible for my team to win!"
JediOrderPizza
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It's not the model I would follow, I answered a question is all. We don't know what we have yet.
ricky0034
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to be clear it's more of a general comment than anything directed at you specifically
it just feels like every time I open this thread I see people talking about Vegas or St. Louis dozens of times dating back to the beginning of this thread
JoeThorntonsRooster
Don’t say eye test when you mean points
Take a look at the league scoring rates in the years they did that. Eichel (and Stone)‘s scoring placements were not comparable at all to Larkin’s. ROR’s we’re, but he won a Selke.
What else are you supposed to do without lottery picks falling in your lap? Just wish them into existence?
Guys like Copp and Holl are still relevant to the discussion. Getting prospects is easy though, the league is setup to funnel the best ones to teams missing the playoffs. On the other hand, it's a poor sign that a GM will be able to build a competitive team out of said prospects if he's frequently bombing free agent signings.
JediOrderPizza
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You're right it's not irrelevant, I just don't care all that much about those. There have been good like Gostisbehere, Perron, Kane, Compher, Fischer, and Maatta. It's not all bad.
Akrapovince
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Detroit has created a great time line, they have internal development while also having chips stacked to turn the corner.
They are already a middle of the pack team that will scrap for a playoff spot, and have so many prospects cooking and players on the roster taking additional steps.
Envious as a Senators fan, we have no more help coming and no picks or prospects to bring help in. Obvious example of trying to turn the corner too fast will keep us in the bad to average tier.
Has Yzerman really signed any long term crippling FA? Not really. He’s helped a team be competitive without buying in too much on a temporary commodity.
NyQuil
Big F$&*in Q
Why are you talking about thing that happened years before they won the cups? lol.
Raymond is 22 years old.. you think he’s done?
Then there’s this guy named Seider who’s pretty damn good.
Akrapovince
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You’re right, totally overlooked on my part.
A top four right handed defensemen on an entry level contract that can become a #1RD is franchise altering. I’m a little more optimistic with that in mind.
NyQuil
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Raistlin
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I think it's fair to say that if you don't have elite producing forwards, you better have a Selke level forward in your lineup, and Detroit does not. Yzerplan didn't fail. But the days calling him the best GM in the league is long over. The glow from the Tampa years has faded.
WarriorofTime
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He peaked out at 33rd in points one time, it's not like he's a Selke guy to make up for it.
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I like Larkin, but Eichel is a bad comparison. As is O'Reilly's peak years.
Dotter
THE ATHLETIC IS GARBAGE
Draft another future stud and keep building. This team looks like they are about to break out.
I've been critical of it for months, maybe even a year at this point.
I don't think he's a good GM, I think he's done a terrible job, he's been their 5 years they should be a playoff team by now.
Any other GM in any other sport would be fired by now.
But It's Yzerman, and It's Detroit so that's not going to happen, nobody in Detroit is going to fire arguably the greatest Red Wing.to ever live, It's either him or Howe.
And because that's not going to happen the Red Wings aren't going to get better.
They use to be the class of the NHL.
Now they are stuck at the bottom.
I don't think he's a good GM, I think he's done a terrible job, he's been their 5 years they should be a playoff team by now.
Any other GM in any other sport would be fired by now.
But It's Yzerman, and It's Detroit so that's not going to happen, nobody in Detroit is going to fire arguably the greatest Red Wing.to ever live, It's either him or Howe.
And because that's not going to happen the Red Wings aren't going to get better.
They use to be the class of the NHL.
Now they are stuck at the bottom.
1. My opinion. I think you need a superstar #1 center to win a Cup. If it's just a "star" center like Eichel then they need to elevate themselves as Eichel did, and as Kuznetsov did for the Caps.
2. Larkin might be able to do the same but hasn't had the opportunity yet. I won't just assume that he'll put up 26 points in 22 games in his first Cup run like Jack did. It's a stretch, and it's not ideal having him as your top guy.
bleedgreen
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I doubt anyone in their organization assumed they’d be in the playoffs by now. They missed last year by one point. You’ve got an interesting view of “the bottom”.
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