Speculation: What was this Teams biggest mistake?

[Nineteen67]

I can only assume you defend our star players and their production because they've played injured multiple seasons as well.

We are the point where we start to questions whether they are stars or just good players.

 

[notbias]

We are the point where we start to questions whether they are stars or just good players.

They outproduce guys like Barkov and Tkachuk and I'd consider them stars, so I assume most would.

And remember, they've been injured so that forgives them of any bad play like you mentioned it did for Hyman, can't forget that.

 

[Nineteen67]

They outproduce guys like Barkov and Tkachuk and I'd consider them stars, so I assume most would.

And remember, they've been injured so that forgives them of any bad play like you mentioned it did for Hyman, can't forget that.

They haven’t been injured for 7 yrs. But you’re probably right, the Leafs core needs a leader to drive the bus.

In series to get into the playoff round of 16, PLD stood out compared to the Leafs stars. In a gift series, TTOE beat those stars. At this point we have to question their ability.

 

[Racer88]

What if i told you his boss was in control the whole time?

I would ask you if you took the red pill or the blue pill

you're probably right since Shanny hired all his buddies from the Soo and forced them on the Dumbass

I want Shanny out because he hired an incompetent back stabbing weasel like Dubas and allowed him free reign , others want Shanny out because he fired the incompetent back stabbing weasel .

And he is an incompetent clown operating from his penthouse in New York

 

[robertmac43]

I would ask you if you took the red pill or the blue pill

Wheres the lie though? There are multiple reports of Shanny axing Dubas trades... These issues stem from the top. I'm not saying Dubas is free of criticism, but it's clear he was not the one with final say.

 

[Bust]

Well that’s a garbage take if I’ve ever seen one.

That’s ok - you don’t agree, that doesn’t make it a “garbage take”.

Isles have heart. We do not. They would absolutely beat us in a best of 7.

We have been focused on PR and virtue signalling here in Toronto. It feels less so now that Tre is here, but it will take time to change the culture to one that would represent a winning program.

Isles are a few pieces away, we have the pieces but need a full culture change - debatable as to what’s easier to acquire.

 

[ACC1224]

Wheres the lie though? There are multiple reports of Shanny axing Dubas trades... These issues stem from the top. I'm not saying Dubas is free of criticism, but it's clear he was not the one with final say.

Unless the GM also has the Presidents role this would be the same for any team.
Any meaningful change would be a group discussion, minor changes would be the GM's responsibility.

 

[Bust]

Wheres the lie though? There are multiple reports of Shanny axing Dubas trades... These issues stem from the top. I'm not saying Dubas is free of criticism, but it's clear he was not the one with final say.

Ya, there’s reports of Shanny denying dubas from trading Knies+1st+ for Hagel and MAF - that would have been another disaster.

There’s also a report of Shanny shutting down a Karlsson acquisition - again, the correct move.

Dubas was a huge problem and I’m glad he’s gone. I was a fan of his at first admittedly.

 

[Sypher04]

That’s ok - you don’t agree, that doesn’t make it a “garbage take”.

Isles have heart. We do not. They would absolutely beat us in a best of 7.

We have been focused on PR and virtue signalling here in Toronto. It feels less so now that Tre is here, but it will take time to change the culture to one that would represent a winning program.

Isles are a few pieces away, we have the pieces but need a full culture change - debatable as to what’s easier to acquire.

You didn’t just say they’d beat us, you said they would demolish us.

Beating us is at least plausible, but far from any garauntee.

I stand by my initial assessment

 

[Bust]

You didn’t just say they’d beat us, you said they would demolish us.

Beating us is at least plausible, but far from any garauntee.

I stand by my initial assessment

You want to dispute the adjective “demolish”? Whatever floats your boat.

They would grind us down and embarrass us, 100%. Their fans would chase us out of their building, 100%. We would have no response, 100%.

How many times do the NYI have to embarrass us? The “JT” game was an absolute embarrassment and was a huge indication of the culture. We can’t get up for games and fight through adversity, that is NYI’s bread and butter.

Your “assessment” of my take is a clear indication of the surface level knowledge this fanbase possesses as to what it takes to win a cup in this league and shows a lack of self awareness as to where this team is currently at.

 

[hotpaws]

Unless the GM also has the Presidents role this would be the same for any team.
Any meaningful change would be a group discussion, minor changes would be the GM's responsibility.

any even when they have both roles the ultimate power rests with the owner(s)

 

[Sypher04]

You want to dispute the adjective “demolish”? Whatever floats your boat.

They would grind us down and embarrass us, 100%. Their fans would chase us out of their building, 100%. We would have no response, 100%.

How many times do the NYI have to embarrass us? The “JT” game was an absolute embarrassment and was a huge indication of the culture. We can’t get up for games and fight through adversity, that is NYI’s bread and butter.

Your “assessment” of my take is a clear indication of the surface level knowledge this fanbase possesses as to what it takes to win a cup in this league and shows a lack of self awareness as to where this team is currently at.

No, it’s your take that is more of a clear indication of the ‘grass is always greener’ mentality that is held by so much of this fanbase.

The current Isles are not a good team and your claims that all these things would 100% happen if we faced off are rooted in absolutely nothing tangible.

 

[weems]

The biggest call we've made during this era was 4F-1D and the setup of that build has always involved the same five players.

If we don't win something soon, It's entirely fair to question if this model was the right choice or that we just didn't select the best, most balanced collection of the potential five players.

 

[notbias]

Ya, there’s reports of Shanny denying dubas from trading Knies+1st+ for Hagel and MAF - that would have been another disaster.

There’s also a report of Shanny shutting down a Karlsson acquisition - again, the correct move.

Dubas was a huge problem and I’m glad he’s gone. I was a fan of his at first admittedly.

Pretty sure that rumor was not true, also, would have been a great trade in hindsight.

 

[Bust]

No, it’s your take that is more of a clear indication of the ‘grass is always greener’ mentality that is held by so much of this fanbase.

The current Isles are not a good team and your claims that all these things would 100% happen if we faced off are rooted in absolutely nothing tangible.

We’ve had the same team for what, the last 5 years? Nothing has really changed, well except for less experienced goaltending. Not sure why you expect a different outcome.

My claims, are rooted from past experiences in playing the isles, and teams built like them - a team whom is built for post season, long, grindy style games. Think Boston. Think florida. Teams that embarrass us often.

Look at bostons forward lines. How do they beat us as often as they do?

Not being happy with team construction and basing my takes on past experiences has nothing to do with “grass is greener mentality”. How many more times do we need to be beaten the same way for you to change your opinion?

I think you’re dreaming if you believe that they will eventually just “figure it out”. That seems to be your stance here.

Pretty sure that rumor was not true, also, would have been a great trade in hindsight.

I assume you mean the deal with CHI?

3 prime assets for a backup goalie and another small forward? Ya Hagel punches out of his weight class, but Knies has potential to be much more than Hagel.

There’s also the contact aspect, pretty sure Hagel is on one of those “Tampa style” contracts, Dubas wouldn’t have gotten that done. He’d be making 7+ here most likely.

 

[tuckerintensity]

My take is a clear indication of the surface level knowledge this fanbase possesses as to what it takes to win a cup in this league and shows a lack of self awareness as to where this team is currently at.

Now you're cooking with gas.

 

[Hellcat]

Kyle Dubas’ dirty dozen 12 worst moves during his time with the Toronto Maple Leafs
=========================================================================

1). Letting Zach Hyman walk as UFA, suggesting $5 mil AAV was too rich for Leafs. Hyman coming off a 70 goal season (54 regular and Salary Cap record 16 playoff goals).

Which is better? Tavares and no Kadri + no Hyman or Kadri + Hyman and no JT? Interesting thought..

 

[ACC1224]

We’ve had the same team for what, the last 5 years? Nothing has really changed, well except for less experienced goaltending. Not sure why you expect a different outcome.

My claims, are rooted from past experiences in playing the isles, and teams built like them - a team whom is built for post season, long, grindy style games. Think Boston. Think florida. Teams that embarrass us often.

Look at bostons forward lines. How do they beat us as often as they do?

Not being happy with team construction and basing my takes on past experiences has nothing to do with “grass is greener mentality”. How many more times do we need to be beaten the same way for you to change your opinion?

I think you’re dreaming if you believe that they will eventually just “figure it out”. That seems to be your stance here.



I assume you mean the deal with CHI?

3 prime assets for a backup goalie and another small forward? Ya Hagel punches out of his weight class, but Knies has potential to be much more than Hagel.

There’s also the contact aspect, pretty sure Hagel is on one of those “Tampa style” contracts, Dubas wouldn’t have gotten that done. He’d be making 7+ here most likely.

Islanders lost to Carolina in the first round in 5 games.

 

[Sypher04]

We’ve had the same team for what, the last 5 years? Nothing has really changed, well except for less experienced goaltending. Not sure why you expect a different outcome.

My claims, are rooted from past experiences in playing the isles, and teams built like them - a team whom is built for post season, long, grindy style games. Think Boston. Think florida. Teams that embarrass us often.

Look at bostons forward lines. How do they beat us as often as they do?

Not being happy with team construction and basing my takes on past experiences has nothing to do with “grass is greener mentality”. How many more times do we need to be beaten the same way for you to change your opinion?

I think you’re dreaming if you believe that they will eventually just “figure it out”. That seems to be your stance here.

Lot of assumptions here. I haven’t even really stated an opinion that could qualify as needing to be changed.

All that I have stated is that us losing to teams like Boston and Florida, who are both considerably better than the current iteration of the Isles, doesn’t equate to any kind of garauntee we’d lose to the Isles, let alone be embarrassed by them.

 

[notbias]

I assume you mean the deal with CHI?

3 prime assets for a backup goalie and another small forward? Ya Hagel punches out of his weight class, but Knies has potential to be much more than Hagel.

There’s also the contact aspect, pretty sure Hagel is on one of those “Tampa style” contracts, Dubas wouldn’t have gotten that done. He’d be making 7+ here most likely.

A lot of guessing and hoping, right now that trade would look great if they made it.

If Knies turns into a Hagel type or 75% of the player he is, I'll be very happy.

I still don't think the trade was offered.

 

[hamzarocks]

you're probably right since Shanny hired all his buddies from the Soo and forced them on the Dumbass

I want Shanny out because he hired an incompetent back stabbing weasel like Dubas and allowed him free reign , others want Shanny out because he fired the incompetent back stabbing weasel .

Shanahan sucks ass

His hiring of dubas shows this

But his complete inability to change the direction if the team during Dubas years and now with Treliving also shows this

Dubas should not have been our GM but Shanahan should never have been made president. His stupid wait and see cost us Mcdavid in 2015 draft when he tried to make the playoffs and his team failed horribly to do so

Shanahan + Dubas are the opposite of Sakic & MaCFarland from the Avs

 

[Racer88]

Wheres the lie though? There are multiple reports of Shanny axing Dubas trades... These issues stem from the top. I'm not saying Dubas is free of criticism, but it's clear he was not the one with final say.

Not implying or even thinking you are wrong but I saw a chance to slide in some comedy by referencing the Matrix movie

 

[Gabriel426]

This lack of mental toughness and talent of those three might be the biggest problem.

Like I said, they weren’t properly developed.
They needed vets but Lou got the wrong one in Marleau.

 

[Mess]

Like I said, they weren’t properly developed.
They needed vets but Lou got the wrong one in Marleau.

I beg to differ,

Patty Marleau was a great mentor and beloved by Marner and Matthews and almost essentially adopted into the Marleau Family.

When Lou Lam brought Patty in to help the young players and set the example he did his job.

In 2017-18 playoffs Marleau almost helped the Leafs win a tough 7 game 1st round series against Boston.

He lead the Leafs in goals with 4 (which was what Marner & Matthews & Nylander combined scored)

After losing the 1st 2 games Marleau rallied the Leafs with 2 goals in game #3 giving the Leafs a win and avoiding potential series sweep after losing game #4.

In game #7 Patty Marleau set the stage for a potential Leafs series win by scoring the first 2 goals for the Leafs where Leafs were up 4-3 heading into the 3rd period.

I don't think you could expect much more than that in terms of making an impact.

To call the Leafs leading playoff goal scorer a mistake to help a young team try and win a playoff round is misdirected, IMO

 

[Bust]

Lot of assumptions here. I haven’t even really stated an opinion that could qualify as needing to be changed.

All that I have stated is that us losing to teams like Boston and Florida, who are both considerably better than the current iteration of the Isles, doesn’t equate to any kind of garauntee we’d lose to the Isles, let alone be embarrassed by them.

Lot of assumptions here. I haven’t even really stated an opinion that could qualify as needing to be changed.

All that I have stated is that us losing to teams like Boston and Florida, who are both considerably better than the current iteration of the Isles, doesn’t equate to any kind of garauntee we’d lose to the Isles, let alone be embarrassed by them.

Cool story. History shows otherwise.

Keep crossing your fingers that this group grows a set and figures it out. What’s another 7 years eh?