What is the single worst decision your team ever made?

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Currently: Avs scouting to the point they've fired two head scouts in less than fourteen years. They hit on all their top 5 picks, but they struggled at 10th overall picking busts such as Jost and Siemens and it's even worse when you go beyond that (lol, picture struggling to draft at 10th overall). Conor Timmins I think has been the only successful non-first-round pick in a very long time for the scouting staff and he isn't even with the team.

Past I: Avs having faith in David Aebischer to replace Patrick Roy. It wasn't that Aebischer was truly awful, but he was severely overrated by the Avs staff which led to at least one other Cup not being won until the salary cap destroyed the core permanently.

Between past and present: Avs signing Iglina and Beauchemin. Both players were completely passed it in the worst way possible and boggled down speed, talent...everything, just so they can play respected veterans 20 minutes a night and give free goals to opponents.

I have no problem picturing teams struggling to draft at 10OA, because 10 OA is not a great pick, historically. Over the last ~25 years, the three best 10OA picks are Rantanen, Nuke and Nik Antropov, and the talent level drops off very significantly after that. As it stands today, Jost is above average for a 10OA pick over the last quarter century. And Siemens was an 11 OA pick.

Also, by the time Roy retired, the Avs prospect pool was empty, having spent every bit of trade capital over the previous 5+ years, so they couldn't exactly trade for another big name goalie. It's not like goalies of Roy's caliber grow on trees. And there was only a single year between Roy retiring and the lockout, which was the Kariya-Selanne year (2003-04). Given how poorly that experiment worked, and Forsberg only playing 39 games, it's not exactly fair to blame Aebischer for them not winning.

As for Iginla and Beauchemin, you have to remember that Sakic inherited a team in complete disrepair, with 5 or 6 good players (some of whom were disgruntled), a bunch of AHL caliber filler, and Siemens as their best prospect by default. They were arguably still some of the better pieces he could get to ice a team without giving up any picks/prospects, while he set about the 3-4 year process building his team with talented youth. Yes, it was difficult to watch them lose, but it absolutely served a purpose.

 

[SensFactor]

I really like Mark Stone...

 

[broncoitis]

Scott Darling

 

[Howboutthempanthers]

They did draft 5th overall and took defenseman Luke Schenn ahead of Erik Karlsson and Roman Josi. I wonder how they would have used their other picks.

 

[oldunclehue]

Rangers: Never made any mistakes
Jets: Byfuglien fiasco and keeping Maurice too long.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Hiring Bob Nichsolson precedes a lot of these.

It wasn’t an exhaustive list by any means.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Keeping Holland around post 2010 in Detroit.

Mike Ilitch tried promoting Holland in 2010 to make room for Yzerman as GM but Holland declined the promotion.

 

[Tkachuk4MVP]

Sharks also passed on Pronger in the draft

Yup. Those two were essentially the same bad decision, lol.

 

[Pyrophorus]

Leafs really struggled with goaltending in that time frame

They also traded the pick that became Logan Couture for Vesa Toskala

JS Aubin was really quite good, for his short time.

The Leafs with the 13th overall pick, traded that for Vessa.
The Sharks traded with the Blues to move up to 9th, to select Couture.
The Blues picked Lars Eller at 13.

EK65 was not ranked that high.

There are 10 other teams to wag your finger at.

 

[Mitch nylander]

We can really pack a lunch when it comes to awful decisions the Rangers made, be it trades, drafting, FA signings, coaches, GMs, you name it. But as far as awful trade in recent memory.......

Mike Ridley and Kelly Miller for Bob Carpenter.

Mattias Norstrom, Ray Ferraro, Ian Laperriere, Nathan Lafayette, and a 4th for Jari Kurri, Marty McSorley, and Shane Churla

Sergei Zubov and Petr Nedved for Luc Robitaille and Ulf Samuelsson

Mike Gartner for Glenn Anderson

Dan Cloutier, Niklas Sundstrom, 2000 1st, 2000 3rd for Pavel Brendl

Luc Robitaille for Kevin Stevens

Dave Gagner and Jay Caufield for Jari Gronstrand and Paul Boutilier

Todd Marchant for Craig MacTavish

Pavel Buchnevich for Sammy Blais and a 2nd

2005-2013 leafs gotta be there.

Tukka Rask for Andrew Raycroft

Pick 30 (Rickard Rakell) + Pick 39 (John Gibson) for Pick 22 (Tyler Biggs)

Carlos Colaiacovo & Alex Steen for Lee Stempniak

2 1sts (Tyler Seguin, Dougie Hamilton) and a 2nd (Jared Knight) for Phill Kessel

1st (Lars Eller), 2nd (Aaron Pelushaj) & 4th (Craig Smith) for Vesa Toskala and Mark Bell

-----

Drafting Stuart Percy, Tyler Biggs, Freddy Gauthier in round 1



Missed the playoffs every year, other than 2013, where we had the collapse against boston.

 

[CaptainShark]

Not lottery-protecting the 1st-round-pick in the Erik Karlsson deal…

 

[S E P H]

I have no problem picturing teams struggling to draft at 10OA, because 10 OA is not a great pick, historically. Over the last ~25 years, the three best 10OA picks are Rantanen, Nuke and Nik Antropov, and the talent level drops off very significantly after that. As it stands today, Jost is above average for a 10OA pick over the last quarter century. And Siemens was an 11 OA pick.

You defending all these moves is strange to me because all of them were mistakes and trying to explain mistakes...still makes them mistakes lol. I knew Siemens was 11th overall, but I decided to group him at 10th for rounding. You are right that the 10th overall pick in terms of history has produced more busts than not, however, the matter of the story is that there are players afterwards including at 11th overall that became amazing NHLers. It is shambolic if you do not get at least a top-six forward or top-four defenceman at that selection if the draft class is talented enough. Additionally, there isn't some sort of voodoo where great drafting teams somehow draft busts if they have the 10th overall pick. There is some psychology that plays into it for sure, but that's because more teams tend to focus on overall consensus than going against the grain (which the best drafting teams do).

Also, by the time Roy retired, the Avs prospect pool was empty, having spent every bit of trade capital over the previous 5+ years, so they couldn't exactly trade for another big name goalie. It's not like goalies of Roy's caliber grow on trees. And there was only a single year between Roy retiring and the lockout, which was the Kariya-Selanne year (2003-04). Given how poorly that experiment worked, and Forsberg only playing 39 games, it's not exactly fair to blame Aebischer for them not winning.

Roy retired at the end of the 2003 season. In the 2000 season, Avs had 11 draft picks and in 2001 they had 13 picks including multiple 2nds and 3rds. Trade a ton of these prospects, picks, and players for somebody passable as the starter, the trading was so one-sided at times back then that you could've gotten a bad GM to sucker into some of those prospects. Aebischer was always a 2A at best, Lacroix eventually realised this, and traded him for an actual starter in Theodore. That trade didn't necessarily work out for the best long term, but Jose was much worth the gamble since he won the Hart. The team was already sort of falling apart after the lockout anyways and Pierre refused to rebuild by 2007 when Sherman took over two years or so afterwards. However, it could have been done as you saw with the Red Wings. They had Hall-of-Fame teams that were also destroyed by the cap, but they made shrewd decisions and were relevant for the longest time.

As for Iginla and Beauchemin, you have to remember that Sakic inherited a team in complete disrepair, with 5 or 6 good players (some of whom were disgruntled), a bunch of AHL caliber filler, and Siemens as their best prospect by default. They were arguably still some of the better pieces he could get to ice a team without giving up any picks/prospects, while he set about the 3-4 year process building his team with talented youth. Yes, it was difficult to watch them lose, but it absolutely served a purpose.

Sakic inherited? Mate, he was making decisions alongside with Roy where he would be getting the last say on the decision. I do think Roy's worst enemy is his ego and I loved him when he was head coach, I would've rather won the Cup with Roy than Bednar IMO, but that doesn't excuse him or Sakic in making an extremely flawed roster piled high with veteran players who gave up their desire for hockey long ago. They know they're going to get their playing time even if they're a -8 in a game because they "earned their spot" based on seniority. That is why Sakic decided to do a 180 after Roy left because he was smart enough to know that what he and Patrick were building simply wasn't working. Sometimes you got to fail your way to success and I suggest that Sakic did just that. That doesn't excuse the mistakes that were made during this time, I am just happy that it taught everyone.

 

[Howboutthempanthers]

EK65 was not ranked that high.

There are 10 other teams to wag your finger at.

It's not that deep. It's just a joke.

 

[wonton15]

Oliver Ekman Larsson

 

[Ace Card Bedard]

1979 Draft

With the 7th overall selection the Chicago Blackhawks take defenseman Keith Brown.
With the 8th overall selection the Boston Bruins take defenseman Raymond Bourque.

Oops!

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDo]

Seems a little dramatic for a franchise that has multiple bankruptcies and threats of relocation.

And signing Jack Johnson to 4x3.25M contract after he’d been in the league 10+years.

 

[SomeDude]

And signing Jack Johnson to 4x3.25M contract after he’d been in the league 10+years.

Hey now, JR knows why he was scratched in Columbus...he'll tell us the same day he tells us why he quit the team on a whim and when Eugene Melynk's estate publishes the Matt Cooke investigation findings.

 

[NJDevils#4]

I think it was probably Lou’s flawed loyalty to his declining players and then bringing in Jagr, Ryder, Larionov etc…instead of just going rebuild. It was time, and Lou was trying to make one last run or show himself as a good guy for another GM job when he saw the foundation in NJ falling apart.

Also had a real poor run of draft picks after ‘05 with their top picks being Bergfors, Corrente, Hoeffel, Tedenby, Josefson, Merrill, Larsson, Matteau, Santini, Quenneville…. Also a big mistake by Lou taking that penalty a year too late for Kovalchuk.

Really a combo of bad moves not just 1 I’d say.

 

[Voight]

Trading most of the team at the '94 deadline and in parts of '95 to get tougher.

They could have built a dynasty around Messier, Leetch, Zubov, Amonte, Weight, Gartner, and Kovalev, knowing Gretzky wanted to come here.

Everyone on that list but Leetch was by '98, mostly for bottom sixers and hitting.

That wasn't a guarantee tho. He was interested in signing with the Canucks, Ducks, Leafs as well.

 

[Aaaaaaaaaaaaa]

Trading future 50 goal scorere Jesse Puljajarvi.

Just kidding. Trading Gretzky, obviously.

But didn't Gretzky essentially force that trade?

Only once he found out Pocklington was shopping him around for cash. Then is I remember right he gave the Oilers a shortlist of teams he'd go to.

 

[Thallis]

Shanahan Tampering, Keenan, & Checketts Parking/TV deals

 

[Poppy Whoa Sonnet]

Probably not steering directly into a rebuild after Kovalchuk retired, something Lou would never do. Other options:

• Poking the bear with first Kovalchuk contract and losing a 1st
• Not forfeiting the 2012 1st and taking Stefan Matteau's son
• Letting too many guys go UFA after the salary cap was instituted (Niedermayer + Parise in particular)

 

[f7ben]

Marcus Johansson for a 3rd?

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

You defending all these moves is strange to me because all of them were mistakes and trying to explain mistakes...still makes them mistakes lol. I knew Siemens was 11th overall, but I decided to group him at 10th for rounding. You are right that the 10th overall pick in terms of history has produced more busts than not, however, the matter of the story is that there are players afterwards including at 11th overall that became amazing NHLers. It is shambolic if you do not get at least a top-six forward or top-four defenceman at that selection if the draft class is talented enough. Additionally, there isn't some sort of voodoo where great drafting teams somehow draft busts if they have the 10th overall pick. There is some psychology that plays into it for sure, but that's because more teams tend to focus on overall consensus than going against the grain (which the best drafting teams do).

Roy retired at the end of the 2003 season. In the 2000 season, Avs had 11 draft picks and in 2001 they had 13 picks including multiple 2nds and 3rds. Trade a ton of these prospects, picks, and players for somebody passable as the starter, the trading was so one-sided at times back then that you could've gotten a bad GM to sucker into some of those prospects. Aebischer was always a 2A at best, Lacroix eventually realised this, and traded him for an actual starter in Theodore. That trade didn't necessarily work out for the best long term, but Jose was much worth the gamble since he won the Hart. The team was already sort of falling apart after the lockout anyways and Pierre refused to rebuild by 2007 when Sherman took over two years or so afterwards. However, it could have been done as you saw with the Red Wings. They had Hall-of-Fame teams that were also destroyed by the cap, but they made shrewd decisions and were relevant for the longest time.

Sakic inherited? Mate, he was making decisions alongside with Roy where he would be getting the last say on the decision. I do think Roy's worst enemy is his ego and I loved him when he was head coach, I would've rather won the Cup with Roy than Bednar IMO, but that doesn't excuse him or Sakic in making an extremely flawed roster piled high with veteran players who gave up their desire for hockey long ago. They know they're going to get their playing time even if they're a -8 in a game because they "earned their spot" based on seniority. That is why Sakic decided to do a 180 after Roy left because he was smart enough to know that what he and Patrick were building simply wasn't working. Sometimes you got to fail your way to success and I suggest that Sakic did just that. That doesn't excuse the mistakes that were made during this time, I am just happy that it taught everyone.

I completely agree that the Avs drafting has generally sucked if they aren't drafting in the top 5. But a 10OA pick is far from a sure thing, so it's hard to call Jost that much of a mistake when he's at least a 300+ game NHL player. No, he's not Rantanen, but not every lottery ticket is going to win the grand prize. And just because guys picked later in the draft end up becoming much better players doesn't mean that it was evident when the draft happened. I also struggle to think that they made a conscious decision to suck at drafting.

And the year after Roy retired, Aebischer was top 10 in the 3 major metrics, putting up a 0.924 SV% (5th best - 30 games minimum), a 2.09 GAA (7th best) and 32 wins (7th best) in the regular season, and a 0.922 SV% and a 2.08 GAA in the playoffs. To my eye, he certainly looked passable for a starter. But, since that was such a mistake, who exactly was available that would have been so much better that season? Or could have dragged the team to the Cup after the salary cap decimated the roster?

And the Red Wings stayed relevant because they didn't spend the 5-7 years before the lockout trading every remotely good youngster they drafted like the Avs did. So, after the lockout, they still had good players Datsyuk and Zetterberg to add to the roster and build a young team around. It has nothing to do with trading for a goalie before they needed one.

And yes, Sakic/Roy inherited a bad team from Sherman/LaCroix. The roster in 2013-14 was Duchene, Landeskog, ROR (already disgruntled), MacKinnon, Stastny (pending UFA), EJ, Barrie, Varly and whoever they could find on the UFA/waiver market. The only even remotely promising prospect left was Siemens. Where the hell were they going to be find more good young players who wanted to win, given what they had to start with? Should they have gone after better players and traded away the 2015 1st round pick? What about 2017? Should they have given that up for someone to help them that year too? Or, did keeping those picks make them a much better team in the long run?

 

[fm]

Getting Kane instead of depth