Leafs may lack talent but they compensate with relentless puck pressure and team structure.
What has been keeping them from a decent record are lack of finish and poor execution at times.
They haven't looked like an easy team to play against.
Post-Game Talk: We Lost. Again. 52 Shots For. Small Building Steps. Can't Complain
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Leafs may lack talent but they compensate with relentless puck pressure and team structure.
What has been keeping them from a decent record are lack of finish and poor execution at times.
They haven't looked like an easy team to play against.
Obviously. I don't think anyone thinks the habs played well last night but that can be explained by the back to back and also how difficult it can be for players to get motivated and focussed enough to be at their best when playing against a bottom feeder. After all many top teams will often not play their best games in these situations.
Also teams will be bringing their best game against the Habs this year, not only because they want to be the team to kill the streak but also most teams always play there best against the habs. Especially the Leafs who have often played at their best against us.
I don't think that has happened in a very long time...at least not since MT has been the coach so I don't see why it would happen this year especially since we are a much better team than we ever were before...at least in the 21st century...maybe even up to 93
Does anyone still think Bernier is a number one?
I don't. He isn't even a top 20 goalie, he is 0 4 1 and yet the Leafs keep playing him. Under Babcock the defense is better and so is the effort,for now. But weak goaltending and outplaying the other team night after night,takes it toll on any hockey player. Toronto has too many glaring holes in critical positions i.e C and Goal and we no longer have that many good wingers either.I think Bernier has gotten away from a lot of well deserved blame, he hasn't played consistently well in a long time now. The Leafs are playing better and getting the same results, that won't last forever and if our goaltending doesn't start winning the games we outplay the other team, then what?
I don't. He isn't even a top 20 goalie, he is 0 4 1 and yet the Leafs keep playing him. Under Babcock the defense is better and so is the effort,for now. But weak goaltending and outplaying the other team night after night,takes it toll on any hockey player. Toronto has too many glaring holes in critical positions i.e C and Goal and we no longer have that many good wingers either.I think Bernier has gotten away from a lot of well deserved blame, he hasn't played consistently well in a long time now. The Leafs are playing better and getting the same results, that won't last forever and if our goaltending doesn't start winning the games we outplay the other team, then what?
Westcoasthabsfan
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bobermay
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While I somewhat agree any time a team puts up 50+ it raises eyebrows. Habs are off to a fantastic start and my hats off to them however I remember 93-94 when the Leafs went 10-0-0 to start the season. It masked the fact they only played .500 the rest of the season.
SeaOfBlue
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We are reducing shots, but the critical mistakes are still just as bad. Far too many bad penalties (partially due to the refs) last game that led to two PPG's. That is not on Bernier. A SHG that was a 2 on 1 that should never happen. A bad rebound goal where our defense was absolutely undressed and an own goal off our own team's skate. So which ones should Bernier have stopped?
The way I look at it is the team as a whole is not getting it done. Three of the five games Bernier has been .929+, and the two he was not the team sucked, specifically the PK.
Both our goalies are not numbers 1's, but they will do for now during the rebuild. When we start to come on the upswing of the build than we can look for a replacement in net, whether from internal or external means. No rush in replacing right now.
Bluelines
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Not true without out #1 we would be better ..
Not debating the Habs are a good team but I thought they mentioned last night that the Habs advance stats suggest they are playing more like of a middle of the pack team. Is that a fair statement?
Nithoniniel
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9 out of 27 shots that Bernier faced was of the high danger variety. The Habs almost matched us there. We didn't do a good job of cutting down quality scoring chances, we did a good job of limiting bad shots and moving the puck out again.
Not defending Bernier. He had a weird game. He made more high quality saves than one should expect, but I think he should have had both #3 and #4.
Not defending Bernier. He had a weird game. He made more high quality saves than one should expect, but I think he should have had both #3 and #4.
Bernier was .923 before last game. Starting him was 100% the right call.
Using W/L to judge any goalie is backwards.
SeaOfBlue
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I can do that: While SOG tends to equal greater scoring chances, it is not always the case. I wouldn't call it a useless stat because most of the time you are out shot (especially by this much), you lose. Though the difference between us and them is that Montreal were getting far better opportunities with the few shots they had. If you only have 20 shots but half of them you break down the defense for goals or hard saves, then you are going to win over a team that had 50 shots that are routine stops (or you have Price in net saving everything).
SeaOfBlue
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I can agree with that, but I still think there was little that he could have done with #3 and #4. No matter what people say, #4 should have never have been a shot in the first place, weak or not. Especially since they were short handed. Any two on one is a quality scoring chance, because if he did somehow save it, the second guy could have easily taken the rebound in for a goal.
#3 was just bad luck. It happens, it sucks that it did, but it happens. I don't blame Bernier for that, but I'm sure he wish he could have had that back.
QuattroFTW
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Out of curiosity guys, have any of you been noticing any positive changes having Babs behind the bench this year? I know your record isn't the best but from what i'm hearing and reading, there seems to be at least some good work ethic on the team, and a no giving up attitude. Wish I could say the same about the Sens though 
Westcoasthabsfan
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How many were actually good quality scoring chances? That is the stat that matters here?
bobermay
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But how does it make it an overrated stat? If you use it in the right context, its a helpful and telling stat IMO.
There is a reason why there are strong correlations between Shots on Goal and Goals scored (ie: The highest goal scorers in the league have the most shots on goal), as well as shots on goal and team records. Look at the teams with the most shots on goal last season, and look where they finished in the standings. Sure, it doesn't represent quality of scoring chances... but overall, its useful.
Daisy Jane
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Out of curiosity guys, have any of you been noticing any positive changes having Babs behind the bench this year? I know your record isn't the best but from what i'm hearing and reading, there seems to be at least some good work ethic on the team, and a no giving up attitude. Wish I could say the same about the Sens though
yup. v. positive.
he's challenging Rilely to be more balanced (which is a good).
he's actually giving Jake or was, before he got injured a lot of loving too.
he's actually challenging players (pep/get your poop together talk to Bernier comes to mind)
and something that we were hoping for for ages - if Player isn't doing well (ish), he doesn't play see Holland
16 high-danger scoring chances for, 10 against; 45 scoring chances for, 17 against.
http://war-on-ice.com/game.html?mansit=2&scoresit=2&tab=1&seasongcode=2015201620108
hockeyes
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Teams don't pick and choose who they want to play well against. If you make everyone you play look good your probably not actually playing that good.
So are you saying Price isn't that good because of the poor quality shots he faces?
Gary Nylund
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The question you were answering I believe was is he a #1 goalie. There are 30 teams so IMO it makes more sense to ask if he's a top 30 goalie.
Last season he was a top 30, the year before he was top 15. This year he hasn't been great so far but overall, yeah I'm comfortable saying he's a top 30 goalie. I wish I could say he's a lot better than that bu I can't. But low end #1, sure I think that's fair.
W/L is a team stat and not very useful here. JMHO.
Agree with all this. Not sure why people are so impatient. Do they think that if we give up on Bernier and roll with Reimer we're going to make the playoffs or something?
BoardsOfFun
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Good quality scoring chances by the most talented players is a more important stat, you can put Daffy Duck out on a breakaway but you know the results beforehand, basically raw talent trumps pretty much everything, including hard effort as this game easily showed. What you really strive for is talent + hard work but having the luxury of both is so had to attain and such a rare occurrence. We saw a glimpse of it at the Olympics when our Canadian squad shut down the opposition, I've never seen such dominant hockey my entire life and I've been watching hockey for over 40 years now, it was like OMG is this for real?
I was totally gobsmacked and was so proud of our boys!!!
Theeze0504
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So are you saying Price isn't that good because of the poor quality shots he faces?
SOG is an over-rated stat as is the +/- rating in general. 50 shots is basically shooting the puck from anywhere, yeah Price was peppered with shots but how many of them were actual threats (scoring chances) and how many of them were easy enough to pad a goalie's stats?
Not every shot is a scoring chance if the area they are shooting from is a low percentage area. That's like saying I took 60 shots at a team and 40 of those shots were from centre ice.
While the habs were tired, it's not entirely an excuse as they should have done a better job at preventing all those shots, but 50 shots is not a telling stat, it just means, they were shooting from everywhere.
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