WCSF Gm#6: KINGS vs. Sharks - 5/26/13 - One More Win.

[Ron*]

Wow, really? Where'd you see that?

A couple of tweets confirming it from the NHL. Looks like a half day of work for me.

They sure don't care much about their STH. A-holes...learned nothing from the lockout.

 

[Sydor25]

I'm fine with Clifford on the fourth line over Nolan. Would rather see Toffoli on the top line if you want to split up brown and Kopitar.

 

[etherialone]

I think that's a copout. The Kings lost tonight despite playing 30 very strong minutes, then getting plain outplayed by every Shark on the ice in the other 30. That isn't beating ourselves, that's being beaten by a better squad.

The only way that any of the sharks outplayed us in any way was due to the fact that we didn't play up to our usual level. It isn't that they were better than us in so much as we didn't bring our A game.

The sharks are at best an average team and are reaping the benefits of having eliminated our best face off man in exchange for losing an insignificant and mostly useless player. Say what we will losing Stoll is having an enormous impact on this series.

The games we have won we have been better in the face off department and the games we have lost we weren't. The same thing happened again tonight. sj won 31 face offs to our 22 and won the game.

We simply must be better if we are going to win. If we played up to the level that we are capable of it wouldn't matter what the sharks did because we all know that we are a much better team. So the only way we can be beaten by the sharks is if we don't bring the type of effort that we know it will take to win another cup.

We beat ourselves tonight by not playing our best game, giving our best effort. So I don't give them any credit at all beyond being present and reaping the benefit of our less than stellar play. At this time of year an average team can beat a great team if the best the great team can do is play average.

All we have to do to win is be great and we know that we can do that.

 

[Herby]

Everyone played way too long of shifts in the third, The coaches didn't manage minutes good at all.

Every player that mattered on the Kings was dead with two minutes left.

The Sharks kept shifts short. The Fourth line not giving the Kings good shifts, is killing them on the road.

Well generally teams that are behind will shorten the bench, not exactly going to play Regehr and Nolan in the final minutes down a goal.

The Kings not having a timeout really hurt, but we can thank Sutter and his ridiculous insertion of Nolan into the lineup for that. if he really played him because of Adam *** Burish then he deserves a ton of blame, that is Johnny Utah style coaching, totally letting Mclellan dictate the lineup.

Still baffled by his obsession with Clifford. Kyle would have been more useful in the Blues series, maybe in a bottom line role. Having him with Kopitar is stupid, there is no other word for it, stupid.

 

[damacles1156]

Well generally teams that are behind will shorten the bench, not exactly going to play Regehr and Nolan in the final minutes down a goal.

The Kings not having a timeout really hurt, but we can thank Sutter and his ridiculous insertion of Nolan into the lineup for that. if he really played him because of Adam *** Burish then he deserves a ton of blame, that is Johnny Utah style coaching, totally letting Mclellan dictate the lineup.

Still baffled by his obsession with Clifford. Kyle would have been more useful in the Blues series, maybe in a bottom line role. Having him with Kopitar is stupid, there is no other word for it, stupid.

No idea with Clifford other than Energy and lack of options.

Toffoli is a right winger....The kid has played very little on the left side (like never). King ? yah that's not happening, only one left is Richardson and Brown.

Brown looks fresh with lots of space on the third line. Also with Toffoli on the left side, he would not be able to get his stick in a shooting position, he would always have to end up on the right side anyway.

Williams is not a LW.



Sutter will get last change at home. Also the home team gets to have better looks in the dots due to stick arrangements.

 

[Live in the Now]

The only way that any of the sharks outplayed us in any way was due to the fact that we didn't play up to our usual level. It isn't that they were better than us in so much as we didn't bring our A game.

The sharks are at best an average team and are reaping the benefits of having eliminated our best face off man in exchange for losing an insignificant and mostly useless player. Say what we will losing Stoll is having an enormous impact on this series.

The games we have won we have been better in the face off department and the same thing happened again tonight. sj won 31 face offs to our 22 and won the game.

We simply must be better if we are going to win. If we played up to the level that we are capable of it wouldn't matter what the sharks did because we all know that we are a much better team. So the only way we can be beaten by the sharks is if we don't bring the type of effort that we know it will take to win another cup.

We beat ourselves tonight by not playing our best game, giving our best effort. So I don't give them any credit at all beyond being present and reaping the benefit of our less than stellar play. At this time of year an average team can beat a great team if the best the great team can do is play average.

All we have to do to win is be great and we know that we can do that.

In all honesty, I don't know what the Kings level is anymore. It surely isn't the same as the Kings from last season.

The first line tonight, Kopitar and Williams played fine, but even Clifford's best isn't good enough to play with those guys. That's why the Kings should have acquired a left winger at the deadline, to prevent this from ever happening. Clifford should never be playing top line minutes.

The second line gave a strong effort but was beaten like a mule by Thornton and that's been the case numerous times. That line is just better than anything we can put on the ice.

Our third line was our best but it is extremely limited in what it can do.

And our fourth stunk.

The Kings can be better sure, but if the Sharks play like they did in that third period, I don't know how much better the Kings can be. They shut the Kings down completely. And all things considered, the Kings have been great once these playoffs. The Sharks have been in many games, both in the first round and in this one.

If the Kings can't win enough faceoffs in Game 7 with their top two lines and keep from getting pinned in their D zone as has happened too often in this series, no, the Kings are not the better team. The Kings are also playing two D short in my opinion. Guys like Hannan have stepped up for the Sharks, Regehr and Muzzin have not. And so we're in a tied series going into one last game.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

The Kings got away from establishing their physical game early on due to the penalties committed and then later on they started to get some chances with the man advantage, which is going to negate physical play for the Kings.

The team gained momentum from killing the 4 min. penalty on Williams, but it seemed like they were zapped in the 3rd. They were turning over pucks, couldn't chip the puck behind the Sharks and couldn't even retrieve it if they did get the puck in deep. There was too much hesitation on the Kings' part and it appeared as though they didn't want to exert all of their energy. Very odd to see such little push from a team that was playing from behind.

You would have to think that they have a lot left to offer in the deciding game at home. Once again, stay out of the damn box and that'll limit the Sharks' scoring by quite a bit.

 

[etherialone]

No idea with Clifford other than Energy and lack of options.

Toffoli is a right winger....The kid has played very little on the left side (like never).

Sutter will get last change at home. Also the home team gets to have better looks in the dots due to stick arrangements.

Toffi has played both LW and C and has done terrible at it when he did.

The kid is an RW died in the wool. Much like trying to make Boyle a Dman or Lokti a winger, it just isn't going to work especially not at the NHL level. You are right, no Toffoli on LW or anywhere else.

 

[Reclamation Project]

Emphasize. A. Great. Start.

 

[Peter James Bond]

I get that part of why Sutter changed things up was to try to jumpstart things but I don't get Clifford up there, other than Sutter loves him. Didn't understand King being on the 2nd line either for far too long this year.
By his post game comments, it looks like he's keeping the 3rd line together. Hopefully the right half of the Jekyll and Hyde team shows up on Tuesday.
It doesn't make sense that a team can play so well at home and do a 360 on the road.

And why can't anybody win faceoffs???

I agree, but at least Clifford makes a few things happen. It's not like Sutter has
a lot of talent to work with on LW. I would put Toffoli in somewhere in the top 2 lines. He wasn't stellar in his last game, but has proven he can play and make plays for his teammates and is a true goal scorer. Penner hasn't really doen much lately. He looks slightly better than the regular season again and not his stepped up playoff game that we need. King is abysmal, period. Makes me wish we had Holloway, about now. Oh well.

 

[damacles1156]

Toffi has played both LW and C and has done terrible at it when he did.

The kid is an RW died in the wool. Much like trying to make Boyle a Dman or Lokti a winger, it just isn't going to work especially not at the NHL level. You are right, no Toffoli on LW or anywhere else.

This ^

Lets not try and fit a square peg into a round hole like Loki.

Toffoli is a RW....Lock stop and barrel.

 

[Herby]

No idea with Clifford other than Energy and lack of options.

Toffoli is a right winger....The kid has played very little on the left side (like never). King ? yah that's not happening, only one left is Richardson and Brown.

Brown looks fresh with lots of space on the third line. Also with Toffoli on the left side, he would not be able to get his stick in a shooting position, he would always have to end up on the right side anyway.

Williams is not a LW.



Sutter will get last change at home. Also the home team gets to have better looks in the dots due to stick arrangements.

Brad Richardson and Tanner Pearson would be better options, dead serious, Clifford has been that hideous. LITN said it best, his only contribution has been a one-timer that was going wide and hit Dan Boyle and fell down right on Kopi's stick.

There has been no energy, the only two notable hits Clifford has made he ended up in the box. He blew a chance that any NHL player should finish. He is a step behind everything, he is slow, he isn't intimidating or anything.

WORTHLESS

 

[damacles1156]

Brad Richardson and Tanner Pearson would be better options, dead serious, Clifford has been that hideous. LITN said it best, his only contribution has been a one-timer that was going wide and hit Dan Boyle and fell down right on Kopi's stick.

There has been no energy, the only two notable hits Clifford has made he ended up in the box. He blew a chance that any NHL player should finish. He is a step behind everything, he is slow, he isn't intimidating or anything.

WORTHLESS

Richardson maybe, But Pearson wouldn't be, the Kid is not ready for top six Minutes in game Seven of the playoff's

Pearson would have to play 18+ minutes. Against MEN.

 

[Live in the Now]

They're better options, but what I said stands. The Kings should never have to depend on one of those three options to play decent minutes, and that falls on the GM.

What's done is done, but I think we'd be better off if a move was made to shore that up earlier. Oh well.

 

[AKAY47]

It's time to split Carter and Richards up, like Herby said. I'm starting to question Sutter's decision-making lately.

 

[Herby]

Richardson maybe, But Pearson wouldn't be, the Kid is not ready for top six Minutes in game Seven of the playoff's

Pearson would have to play 18+ minutes. Against MEN.

If the alternative is Kyle Clifford playing Game 7 on Kopitar's wing, give me Pearson.

Kopitar should write into his next contract that he never has to play with awful players named "Kyle" again. Poor guy.

 

[Sydor25]

Game seven probably comes down to effort. I just think the sharks want it more than the kings. Last year the kings had a tremendous drive to win. Just don't see it this season.

Kings must score first on Tuesday. Early start is going to **** with the kings too. Their best game was the only 7:30 start time.

 

[etherialone]

In all honesty, I don't know what the Kings level is anymore. It surely isn't the same as the Kings from last season.

The first line tonight, Kopitar and Williams played fine, but even Clifford's best isn't good enough to play with those guys. That's why the Kings should have acquired a left winger at the deadline, to prevent this from ever happening. Clifford should never be playing top line minutes.

The second line gave a strong effort but was beaten like a mule by Thornton and that's been the case numerous times. That line is just better than anything we can put on the ice.

Our third line was our best but it is extremely limited in what it can do.

And our fourth stunk.

The Kings can be better sure, but if the Sharks play like they did in that third period, I don't know how much better the Kings can be. They shut the Kings down completely. And all things considered, the Kings have been great once these playoffs. The Sharks have been in many games, both in the first round and in this one.

If the Kings can't win enough faceoffs in Game 7 with their top two lines and keep from getting pinned in their D zone as has happened too often in this series, no, the Kings are not the better team. The Kings are also playing two D short in my opinion. Guys like Hannan have stepped up for the Sharks, Regehr and Muzzin have not. And so we're in a tied series going into one last game.

Its funny because I am reading your posts and agreeing with everything with the exception that the sharks are responsible for dictating the outcome more than our lack of ability to play up to the level that we are capable of playing is.

The Kings are the better team and would have gutted the sharks if we had Stoll to take our critical face offs. So without Stoll we are left to asking our lesser talented face off men to fill the void left by Stoll's absence. When we win more face offs then the sharks we win the game. When we win critical face offs the sharks can't pin us in our own zone so easily or so often.

I see us as being the much better team and stand by the idea that we aren't being beaten by a better team. Only that due to our opponent taking out our top face off C for the series and our inability to play up to our typical level we now have to play in a game 7.

The Blues were outplaying us often in the first round and were a much better team but we stepped up our team play and beat them. In this round a lesser team is pressing an advantage as often as possible and has won 3 games as a result.

That is what I am seeing though I do however agree that we aren't seeing the same team as last year but of course how could we? We are without our best SAH and our top face off man. We are capable still of being a great team and that is what it will take to win the next game and the cup again.

I posted before the playoffs that I hadn't seen us dominate any teams in the same way we did last year and that was absolutely true. Until we faced the Blues in the playoffs and started playing dominating shutdown hockey again.

I believe that we have that level of play in us still and that we will see it next game.

I don't think that the sharks have much to do with where we are now but that is just me.

 

[KingPuckChoo]

who is so mad right now that they are willing to beat somebody up? say I !

 

[Herby]

It's time to split Carter and Richards up, like Herby said. I'm starting to question Sutter's decision-making lately.

I'm not even advocating doing this when we are at home.

Sutter is able to keep Richards away from Thornton at Staples, he wasn't able to do so in San Jose. And in the process he not only lost his #2 center, he lost his best goal-scorer.

 

[Sydor25]

Live or die with your best available lineup:

Brown-Kopitar-Williams
Penner-Richards-Carter
King-Lewis-Tofolli
Clifford-Fraser-Empty

Regehr-Doughty
Scuderi-Voynov
Greene-Martinez
Muzzin

Quick

I would go with seven defensemen.

 

[TonySCV]

Saying the team has played too many games, which is nonsense.

Plenty of teams have had series go Seven games and won the Cup.

it's also completely irrelevant in a lockout year. They've played 30+ fewer games this season than last.

Both teams are excellent at home and we are seeing that. It's no surprise that it is going 7.

Sharks and Kings are two good teams who match up well. Last change has made all the difference. That "meaningless" regular season win slotting us 5th vs. 6th means a hell of a lot right now.

 

[Herby]

Live or die with your best available lineup:

Brown-Kopitar-Williams
Penner-Richards-Carter
King-Lewis-Tofolli
Clifford-Fraser-Empty

Regehr-Doughty
Scuderi-Voynov
Greene-Martinez
Muzzin

Quick

I would go with seven defensemen.

I'd go with Richardson over Clifford. But that is a small detail, that is the lineup I would go with.

 

[Live in the Now]

Live or die with your best available lineup:

Brown-Kopitar-Williams
Penner-Richards-Carter
King-Lewis-Tofolli
Clifford-Fraser-Empty

Regehr-Doughty
Scuderi-Voynov
Greene-Martinez
Muzzin

Quick

I would go with seven defensemen.

The Kings had more even strength goals with King-Lewis-Brown and Clifford-Kopi-Williams than that top line had. That isn't the answer either, and honestly, if that top line came back together on Tuesday, barring an unreal performance by the second line we would likely be out of the playoffs. I think Sutter took the wrong guy off the top line. Go with Brown-Kopitar-Toffoli, push Williams down to the third line.

The top line from last year should be done for the rest of this postseason. They haven't done a thing since the middle of the season.

 

[Sydor25]

I'd go with Richardson over Clifford. But that is a small detail, that is the lineup I would go with.

Wouldn't bother me with Richardson over Clifford. He does play on the PK. I just want Martinez back in the lineup. He is the only one besides doughty they can skate the luck out of his zone. He also gets his shots through, something Muzzin is unable to do at this time. Muzzin has gone full Pejorative Slur, but I think Sutter likes his size against the sharks.