Two games, at most three within Canada, with the expected trips being 4 total... verses half a season of back and forth (MLB), and 3/4 of a season (MLS) back and forth, that's why it was accepted.
Blue Jays Discussion: Vladdy named ASG MVP. Draft Over. Now all that's left is the trade deadline
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phillipmike
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- Oct 27, 2009
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No problem and in case you were looking for the quote, here it is;
Toronto Blue Jays ask Canada for permission to return home by July 30
This is the municipal and provincial agreement from 2020;
Ontario OKs Blue Jays to play in Toronto, now it’s up to the federal government
Not sure why that matters. Either its safe or its not.
phillipmike
Registered User
- Oct 27, 2009
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A mid-season check-in on players Blue Jays nearly landed last winter
Its fitting that i wanted;
-Lindor - underperforming
-Kim - really underperforming
-Kluber - hurt
And was skeptical of;
-Gausman - one of the best pitchers in the league
-Hendriks - top 10 closer
-Brantley - top 50 in position player WAR, in the mix for the best LF in the game
At least i got Semien over LeMahieu right.
Imagine we got Gausman, Hendriks and Brantley. Moved Grichuk and re-signed Walker. Likely dont go after Matz, Yates, Chatwood and Phelps. If we got Ray and Gausman, i know we likely dont bring back Walker but its cool to think about.
Lineup:
Semien - 2B
Bichette - SS
Guerrero Jr. - 1B
Brantley - DH
Springer - CF
Hernandez - RF
Biggio - 3B
Gurriel - LF
Kirk - C
Bench: Jansen, Espinal, Davis and Dickerson
Rotation:
Ryu
Gausman
Ray
Walker
Manoah/Stripling
Bullpen:
Hendriks - CL
Merryweather - SU
Romano
Borucki
Mayza
Richards
Cimber
That's the number 1 or 2 offense with a top 5 rotation and pen.
Its fitting that i wanted;
-Lindor - underperforming
-Kim - really underperforming
-Kluber - hurt
And was skeptical of;
-Gausman - one of the best pitchers in the league
-Hendriks - top 10 closer
-Brantley - top 50 in position player WAR, in the mix for the best LF in the game
At least i got Semien over LeMahieu right.
Imagine we got Gausman, Hendriks and Brantley. Moved Grichuk and re-signed Walker. Likely dont go after Matz, Yates, Chatwood and Phelps. If we got Ray and Gausman, i know we likely dont bring back Walker but its cool to think about.
Lineup:
Semien - 2B
Bichette - SS
Guerrero Jr. - 1B
Brantley - DH
Springer - CF
Hernandez - RF
Biggio - 3B
Gurriel - LF
Kirk - C
Bench: Jansen, Espinal, Davis and Dickerson
Rotation:
Ryu
Gausman
Ray
Walker
Manoah/Stripling
Bullpen:
Hendriks - CL
Merryweather - SU
Romano
Borucki
Mayza
Richards
Cimber
That's the number 1 or 2 offense with a top 5 rotation and pen.
CatchyTune
JOHN TAVARES IS A MAPLE LEAF
Isnt that a lot more money spent though too? If we got all those guys and Springer/Semien we overspend what was expected.
Cool to think about for sure. That team is stacked.
metafour
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- Apr 6, 2008
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You don't like the way he's being described by whom? It seems like you're being very selective and trying to infer a lot from a few(?) blurbs - have you considered that some of those may have been written in a vacuum of info lagging behind what he was doing prior to being injured? I'm probing because I can find you just as many writeups that are extremely complimentary of his upside and pitches - which is why it seems weird to me seeing people attach labels to him that aren't even being voiced by the prospect sites. You're obviously free to conclude whatever you want; but there is a reason why he was seen as a consensus Top 10 pick prior to his injury - and this was more or less industry consensus, and not just "armchair evaluation". He was right there behind Leiter and Rocker (in fact, had he remained healthy he very likely could have flipped past Rocker who was kind of up and down this season and facing some scrutiny, we'll see if that was just over-analysis and prospect fatigue or not).
The important point I want to make is that scouting pitchers has become much more intricate and detailed by way of advanced metrics. As such, it has become much more accurate to truly judge pitch quality and arm talent. Teams don't draft "low ceiling" pitchers with Top 15 picks anymore, because there is data available to weed those guys out. So given him being a consensus Top 10 pick this year prior to an injury, what makes you believe he is "low ceiling"? If he was low ceiling, why would he carry a Top 10 grade? Who was the last truly "average-stuff" low ceiling college pitcher to carry a draft grade that high? Do you want to know why you should be legitimately excited about his upside? Even though he's recovering from TJ surgery and might not even pitch next season, he was drafted above two healthy college pitchers who throw high 90's (Gavin Williams & Ryan Cusick). And that just wasn't us making some stupid, low-upside pick - per reports he very likely would have gone at the very next pick to the Yankees. Absolutely none of that suggests a low ceiling arm, unless you think that in the modern revolution of pitch-data there exists a handful of teams that for some reason coveted an injured, low ceiling pitcher amongst multiple other options (Hoglund was actually in play for several teams before us too).
Good thing we didn't move Grichuk. He was responsible for a bunch of wins early on. There really isn't much point in moving him. Nobody seems to want him for some reason and having a guy who is well rounded is a great player to have around when your star outfielder is so injury prone. He's also signed during his best years and his contract will end right when things might start going south for him. Pretty much the perfect set up in his case.
Walker ended up being a real kick in the nards, but to be fair, look where he is pitching. Even Dickey looked good in New York, heh.
Missing out on players doesn't really bother me. It was clearer more than ever how much most of those guys don't want to play in Toronto. Ultimately we only got Semien and Springer because we overpaid.
It's the same reason why you go shopping for food during a pandemic and not shopping for fun. If you limit the trips that you take there is less chance of anything being contracted. 3 trips (NHL) verses 12 teams coming in and 5 return trips to Canada (MLB).
So it's much easier to green light a small amount of trips over a short period than green lighting the team coming back for something over the course of 3/4 months, in which things could conceivably go wrong and you have to accommodate them somewhere else again. Imagine the backlash if they came back and in 8 weeks they have to go somewhere else?
Not only the amount of trips, but the teams that come in (Jays and TFC inlcuded), will have been touring around the US before entering Canada whereas the teams coming in for hockey would have been traveling between two US cities at most in the weeks leading up to entering Canada.
I feel it could be done safely for July 30th, but I agree with you that it is a different situation than hockey.
phillipmike
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- Oct 27, 2009
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All depends on what the budget was and if you could move Grichuk's contract I believe Shapiro said the Jays could have spent up to $165M this year. If true the Jays could have made it happened with Springer and Semien.
Jays payroll is currently at $142M if you factor in Dickerson's payments.
If you remove;
Grichuk - $10.33M
Yates - $5.5M
Matz - $5.2M
Chatwood - $3M
Phelps - $1.75M
You save $26M. We are at $116M with Springer and Semien.
If you add the rumored deals;
Brantley - $15M
Gausman - $14M
Hendriks - $13M
Walker - $10M
You add $66M to $116M you get $182M. If you could have gotten rid of Roark's salary in the offseason then you are at $169M. But it is likely the Jays dont sign Walker in this scenario so you are looking at $172M.
But if they made these signings in the offseason everyone would be under contract for 2022 except for Semein and Ray but you would have Roark, Tulo, Yamaguchi and other's money coming off the books. Jays would be looking at the same team minus Ray and Semien with a payroll of $176M. They could re-sign both and stay under the LT. Things would get expensive in arb for Vladdy, Bichette and Biggio but that would be only a problem in one year (2023) as Ryu, Brantley, Gausman, Hendriks and Walker would have all expired. By then our next wave of Martin, Pearson, Moreno, Groshans, SWR, Manoah, should be in the majors or ready.
phillipmike
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In hindsight yeah it worked out for Grichuk but if we moved Grichuk and had Brantley would might be in a better position. Defense would take a hit but you could try Gurriel or Teo again in CF with Brantley playing LF. Or run 1 of Gurriel, Teo and Brantley as DH in a given night and play Davis in CF.
Grichuk in CF and Tellez at DH: 0.0 fWAR (0.5 for Grichuk and -0.5 for Tellez)
Davis in CF (prorated) and Brantley at DH: 1.5 fWAR (-0.6 for Davis and 2.1 for Brantley)
metafour
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- Apr 6, 2008
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It literally makes no difference. The MLB teams have been flying around the United States every night. Hundreds of trips so far this season to different cities, and the actual facts throughout that are clear: there has been a 0.03% positive test rate in the MLB throughout the 2021 season. At some point you need to re-enter reality and re-evaluate what the actual "threat" (or lack thereof) is.
dredeye
BJ Elitist/Hipster
- Mar 3, 2008
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As much as I'm not for vaccine passports, I think this is a reasonable request and stipulation to put in place to start allowing for cross-border travel again amongst the teams.
That 0.03% is 64 total positive tests, with how the virus is so contagious I am fine with those people not entering the country at the expense of our teams playing at home. I want them to play at home again, and I feel we are getting close to it, but comparing the situation to the NHL doesn't seem rational to me. If you want to have that opinion then that is your opinion to have, I don't necessarily agree with it, and you obviously don't agree with mine, but that is the nature of our system.
TheMadHatTrick
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- Nov 2, 2008
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You didn't want Brantley? I thought all of us wanted him here.
I didn't have strong opinions on Semien, but I wasn't super enthused by the signing. I was more like, sure why not.
Hiraldo and Martinez just went back to back. Two homers for Martinez today.
phillipmike
Registered User
- Oct 27, 2009
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You didn't want Brantley? I thought all of us wanted him here.
I didn't have strong opinions on Semien, but I wasn't super enthused by the signing. I was more like, sure why not.
Prior to the Springer signing, I wanted Brantley on a 2 year deal to complement Gurriel and fill in at DH. Brantley was my number 2 position player target. Semien was 1 and Turner was 3.
But once we signed Springer I wasn’t interested in Brantley anymore. I think Springer is a phenomenal player but I believe I was one of few who didn’t want him for more than 4 years. I said he was always hurt and in less than 3 years he would have to move to a corner spot. And with us already having 3 corner OFs (Grixhuk is on ok CF), I didn’t think signing Springer would age well especially on 6 years. So to add in a 5th corner OF in Brantley might have not been a good move.
That being said, I made my assumption thinking Grichuk had negative trade value. I wasn’t crazy about giving Brantley 3 years but if it meant we got to trade Grichuk without paying for his contract, I would have jumped at the opportunity.
Signing Brantley on 3 years after signing Springer was a non starter for me but trading Grichuk with no money provided huge value just by getting rid of Grichuk’s money.
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