Player Discussion Vitali Kravtsov - Signed 2-Year Deal with Traktor Chelyabinsk

[iceburg]

If the thought that he's not in great shape is accurate, trying him at centre just might be disastrous. He's already struggling with poor reputation re development curve. He has the greatest chance to succeed on the wing. He can be creative and use his skill while developing a much simpler defensive game. Once he's mastered that, maybe try him at centre to see how he does.

 

[nyr2k2]

As I noted elsewhere a few days ago, Kravtsov is probably playing out of position and was a top CENTRE as a junior at both the U20 Four Nations and WJC, but the insanely talented development department of both the Rangers and the Canucks have, more or less, exclusively play(ed) him as a winger. Maybe, just maybe, they should try him at a position he thrived at late in his development and see if he excels. What have they got to lose; a dented ego in their coaching staff or development department?

Kravtsov, " played center for the Russians at the U20 Four Nations tournament this past November in Honodin, CZE. Kravtsov also has experience at the center position in the MHL, where he was used as a center out of necessity, as well as his skill allowing him to be more involved in the play as a center. Kravtsov also played as a center at the WJC earlier this year, recording six points (2G, 4A) in seven games as his unique playmaking ability and high hockey IQ allowed him to acclimate to playing an unfamiliar position and succeeding. "

Kravtsov or Chytil as the Rangers 2nd line center


The Universe is knocking, but the Canucks coaching staff are all out to lunch.

He's has been a winger as a professional. At Traktor, where he has played the overwhelming majority of his professional games, he played on the wing. It's not just the Rangers or the Canucks. Professional teams see him as a wing.

I have no real position on whether or not the Canucks should try him at center, but the idea that he's playing out of position doesn't really seem to match the historical record. And, as we know, many, many young players skate as centers through their junior/teenage years even though they end up on the wing long term. So, I'm not sure him playing a handful of games at C in junior tournaments or in the MHL really changes the narrative much.

 

[EdJovanovski]

You really over here shitting all over the Rangers because the guy whose nuts you've been dangling from for several years has flopped, Ed? Come on, man.

None of what you all are seeing with Kravtsov is new. Every time the kid was back in the KHL, I'd always comment, "wow, other than being committed more defensively, he looks exactly the same as he did last year!" I also had this guy pegged as a 30-40 point upside player because he's just not that dynamic in terms of his vision and creativity. He can dangle and make the occasional great pass, but so can most of the third line forwards in the league. The Kravtsov we as Rangers fans saw this year was the same guy we saw when he debuted, to a tee.

Amusingly, several years ago, back when Kravtsov first peaced out back to the motherland, there was this weird story that came out about how he was upset because the organization criticized him that his heart rate wasn't high enough during training--or at least that's how it was stated in translated interviews. And almost everyone in Rangers Land absolutely KILLED the team, taking about how crazy it was that we would use something so arbitrary to criticize this f***ing stud and ruin his confidence. Turns out, guy is a goddamn cream puff and apparently can't/won't train for shit, and the Rangers had identified that long ago.

I hope Kravtsov works out for you guys. I do. I think he's an entitled, immature brat, but he doesn't seem like a "bad" guy in any objective sense, so I hold no grudges. Please understand however that EdJo has literally been obsessed with this player for years, and has staked his entire player assessment reputation on the outlandish claims he has made about this guy. Stuff that started off as legitimately absurd but sincere praise, that got so ridiculous it jumped the shark and even Ed had to turn it into a game because otherwise no one would respond to him seriously. If you want the inside scoop on Kravy from people who have watched him for years, and who don't feel being right about him is some life or death proposition, feel free to come ask on the Rangers board.

Apologies for the unsolicited post. I just saw Mrs. Kravtsov in here and, once I picked myself up off the floor and regained consciousness after laughing for 20 consecutive minutes, I thought I'd chime in.

EDIT: It might actually be tricky to ask on the NYR board, because our Kravtsov thread got locked. Because of Ed turning it into a Tribute Thread.

He looks exactly the same as last time? Lets take a little trip down memory lane before the revisionist history.

I can provide links to the GDT's from every game he played during that stint if people want to read them and see how Ranger fans really felt about him before he hurt their feelings when he went back to Russia. He was unanimously considered one of our very best players pretty much every single game, absolutely miles ahead of Kakko & Lafreniere, etc. Then these very same posters now claim that he looked awful in those 20 games.

The reason I changed that to a Tribute thread was because that was the only way it could've possible stayed open a little longer since it was posthumous, there were people calling to close the thread as soon as the trade happened before I changed the title because it was a player discussion thread for a player who isn't on our team any longer. There are a large contingent of fans who absolutely despise him because of the off ice stuff and begin seething at any mention of him, there are literally posts you can find saying any mention of Kravtsov should be banned board-wide. He's like Voldemort to them, if you say his name something very bad will happen. People were losing their minds because someone posted his assist in the Around the NHL thread in his second game after the trade.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

This is a player who came into camp at 186 pounds. For reference, he was 184 at the draft combine and has been listed as high as 195.

He was 2 pounds heavier at camp than he was an an 18 year old draft eligible player. What ever he did work out wise, even if he was waking up at 5 AM to do it, didn't work. This player also scoffed at a training program the Rangers put together for him a few summers ago and completely ignored doing it and said that he'd rather do his own thing.

Yea I wasn’t saying that in regard to strength issues, I’m saying in regard to his stamina. He’s sat most of the year so he’s not settled in and up to game speed, especially when our practises are lower intensity than most and even then he’s skating as an extra

Lol the excuses never end.

He doesn't play enough where stamina will/should be an issue. Its not like hes being asked to play 20 minutes a game.

He has a bigger problem. He sucks.

Buchnevich had similar issues to Krav when he first came over, kept injuring his back because of a lack of core strength

Heres the difference, Buchnevich actually DID what the Rangers asked of him which was basically the bare minimum but he did it. Kravtsov didn't even do that.

 

[DonnyNucker]

As I noted elsewhere a few days ago, Kravtsov is probably playing out of position and was a top CENTRE as a junior at both the U20 Four Nations and WJC, but the insanely talented development department of both the Rangers and the Canucks have, more or less, exclusively play(ed) him as a winger. Maybe, just maybe, they should try him at a position he thrived at late in his development and see if he excels. What have they got to lose; a dented ego in their coaching staff or development department?

Kravtsov, " played center for the Russians at the U20 Four Nations tournament this past November in Honodin, CZE. Kravtsov also has experience at the center position in the MHL, where he was used as a center out of necessity, as well as his skill allowing him to be more involved in the play as a center. Kravtsov also played as a center at the WJC earlier this year, recording six points (2G, 4A) in seven games as his unique playmaking ability and high hockey IQ allowed him to acclimate to playing an unfamiliar position and succeeding. "

Kravtsov or Chytil as the Rangers 2nd line center


The Universe is knocking, but the Canucks coaching staff are all out to lunch.

He can’t play wing at the moment so I’m not sure how a more challenging position will help him. He would be overwhelmed.

 

[haohmaru]

Personally, I want Kravtsov to be successful in the NHL (hopefully as a Canuck for your sakes) but he's got to commit to the doing the things that are necessary that are being discussed here. He needs to bulk up, needs to stay on his skates and work on puck possession deep in the O zone, and, most importantly, needs to believe that he has to do more to be an NHL player instead of thinking he deserves to be an NHL lineup.

The guy has the talent. He needs to commit physically and between his ears.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Personally, I want Kravtsov to be successful in the NHL (hopefully as a Canuck for your sakes) but he's got to commit to the doing the things that are necessary that are being discussed here. He needs to bulk up, needs to stay on his skates and work on puck possession deep in the O zone, and, most importantly, needs to believe that he has to do more to be an NHL player instead of thinking he deserves to be an NHL lineup.

The guy has the talent. He needs to commit physically and between his ears.

As Canucks fans we’re well versed in reclamation projects not working out..I think most fans here have sober expectations for Kravtsov.

He’s giving us some glimpses of why he was a high pick..but he definitely needs to pick up the pace.

This is likely his last opportunity to be a useful player in the NHL.

 

[VanJack]

Let's be candid here.....the Rangers basically gave up on Kravstov. I mean a return of an AHL forward like Lockwood and a seventh round draft pick for a guy you picked in the top-10 of the draft, is a reflection of what they thought of him.

So hopefully Kravstov uses that as motivation. You can see flashes of the talent that made him such a high pick. Now Tocchet and the Canucks just need to find a way to unlock it consistently.

I suppose he has a chance to be Nichushkin- Gurianov type of player.....or at the other extreme, an Alexander Burmistrov. It's up to him.

 

[haohmaru]

As Canucks fans we’re well versed in reclamation projects not working out..I think most fans here have sober expectations for Kravtsov.

He’s giving us some glimpses of why he was a high pick..but he definitely needs to pick up the pace.

This is likely his last opportunity to be a useful player in the NHL.

Yes, the caveat being that a lot of this is of his own making and he's behind the curve in his development because of bad career/development choices that I won't re-litigate here.

I'd love to see the Canucks be patient with him and not limit this opportunity to these last ~15 games. Assuming he's willing (and that's a big assumption) to sign a cheap 2 way contract, I'd jump at that risk/reward if I were Vancouver. The potential is there and the cost was negligible.

 

[krutovsdonut]

this guy is like a vintage honda civic if it only had a one gallon gas tank.

he looks good and can keep up with highway traffic, but when he tries to pin the throttle or gear down there is no available extra hp or torque. he just has not got any extra jam to accelerate or make power moves.

and he runs out of gas too quickly.

hopefully he can bulk up and add some endurance.

 

[VanillaCoke]

VK looks good nearly every game, lacks some strength, conditioning, and confidence but he's smart and has the skills.

Probably needs to be in Abbotsford with Pod for several months and an off season or two of strength and conditioning.

 

[wonton15]

I can see him being given every chance to win a spot next training camp but he’ll come up short for Hoglander and Podkolzin. Back to Russia if he won’t play in the AHL

 

[Calad]

As I noted elsewhere a few days ago, Kravtsov is probably playing out of position and was a top CENTRE as a junior at both the U20 Four Nations and WJC, but the insanely talented development department of both the Rangers and the Canucks have, more or less, exclusively play(ed) him as a winger. Maybe, just maybe, they should try him at a position he thrived at late in his development and see if he excels. What have they got to lose; a dented ego in their coaching staff or development department?

Kravtsov, " played center for the Russians at the U20 Four Nations tournament this past November in Honodin, CZE. Kravtsov also has experience at the center position in the MHL, where he was used as a center out of necessity, as well as his skill allowing him to be more involved in the play as a center. Kravtsov also played as a center at the WJC earlier this year, recording six points (2G, 4A) in seven games as his unique playmaking ability and high hockey IQ allowed him to acclimate to playing an unfamiliar position and succeeding. "

Kravtsov or Chytil as the Rangers 2nd line center


The Universe is knocking, but the Canucks coaching staff are all out to lunch.

Kravstov played C for Russia at that WJC, because the entirety of Russia's center depth was injured or out with covid for the tournament. He played there out of necessity, nothing more. Yes, he dominated his peers when he played vs a bunch of U20 kids who also don't train anywhere near the same level as pros do in the NHL. He also played well in the KHL where most players also don't train at a level that would be considered acceptable in the NHL. Both David Quinn and Gerard Gallant did not give him much opportunity, two VERY DIFFERENT kinds of coaches, but with both he ended up with the same result.

His problem is, he will always be limited by his commitment to the work he's willing to put in off ice. Maybe it's immaturity, maybe it's ego, maybe he just doesn't enjoy the game? Whatever it is, its been the same story for 5 years now. If he can get past this big developmental road block, then he has the skills to become a good player. I wanted so badly for the kid to succeed here in NY, but it was pretty clear he wore out his welcome. I hope he gets it together for you guys.

 

[TomWillander1RD]

this guy is like a vintage honda civic if it only had a one gallon gas tank.

he looks good and can keep up with highway traffic, but when he tries to pin the throttle or gear down there is no available extra hp or torque. he just has not got any extra jam to accelerate or make power moves.

and he runs out of gas too quickly.

hopefully he can bulk up and add some endurance.

I see the analogy but a vintage Civic doesn't look good in any environment.

Hope 'bulk up' doesn't mean adding a fake muffler just making noise.

 

[krutovsdonut]

I see the analogy but a vintage Civic doesn't look good in any environment.

Hope 'bulk up' doesn't mean adding a fake muffler just making noise.

disagree. a vintage civic was a transformative engineering feat that changed how we drive in north america. for those of us old enough to remember the garbage on offer from north american makers they have a certain style, grace and even beauty that revealed itself unmistakably when you stood in a showroom looking at one immediately after visiting an oldsmobile dealership.

but i was not suggesting kravtsov actually looks like a honda civic.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Kravstov played C for Russia at that WJC, because the entirety of Russia's center depth was injured or out with covid for the tournament. He played there out of necessity, nothing more. Yes, he dominated his peers when he played vs a bunch of U20 kids who also don't train anywhere near the same level as pros do in the NHL. He also played well in the KHL where most players also don't train at a level that would be considered acceptable in the NHL. Both David Quinn and Gerard Gallant did not give him much opportunity, two VERY DIFFERENT kinds of coaches, but with both he ended up with the same result.

His problem is, he will always be limited by his commitment to the work he's willing to put in off ice. Maybe it's immaturity, maybe it's ego, maybe he just doesn't enjoy the game? Whatever it is, its been the same story for 5 years now. If he can get past this big developmental road block, then he has the skills to become a good player. I wanted so badly for the kid to succeed here in NY, but it was pretty clear he wore out his welcome. I hope he gets it together for you guys.

That tournament was in 2018 going into 2019 man, they weren't out with Covid lol

 

[joelCAMEL]

disagree. a vintage civic was a transformative engineering feat that changed how we drive in north america. for those of us old enough to remember the garbage on offer from north american makers they have a certain style, grace and even beauty that revealed itself unmistakably when you stood in a showroom looking at one immediately after visiting an oldsmobile dealership.

but i was not suggesting kravtsov actually looks like a honda civic.

What year are you talking about?

 

[krutovsdonut]

What year are you talking about?

he doesn't look like any year of honda civic.

 

[Cupless44]

Just curious

Does anyone actually think Kravtsov is better than Hoglander?

I sure don't. I know who I would rather have in Vancouver.

 

[Calad]

That tournament was in 2018 going into 2019 man, they weren't out with Covid lol

Ok so they were all injured then? Whats the point you're making here?

 

[EdJovanovski]

Ok so they were all injured then? Whats the point you're making here?

4 centers, only 1 got injured and missed 2 games. Klim Kostin has also played center too. Kravtsov was their 1C because he was their best player and because he is good at center, not because other centers were injured nor because they had Covid in Dec 2018 - Jan 2019.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

Really not impressed with this player. If his name was Travis Johnson and he was drafted in the 6th round back in 2019 then none of is would fret about him being released.

Dime a dozen player that has the tools to be an NHLer but has too much going against him mentally to ever be serviceable in a meaningful sort of way.

We can see why not many teams were rushing to acquire him at the price the NYR originally wanted.

 

[joelCAMEL]

he doesn't look like any year of honda civic.

I don't want to hijack this thread but I am curious about your analogy. What transformative engineering feat did Honda do, that changed how we drive in North America?

 

[CherryToke]

Just curious

Does anyone actually think Kravtsov is better than Hoglander?

I sure don't. I know who I would rather have in Vancouver.

He's like the opposite of Hoglander. Good shot with horrendous conditioning and strength.

 

[NickyFotiu]

He looks exactly the same as last time? Lets take a little trip down memory lane before the revisionist history.

I can provide links to the GDT's from every game he played during that stint if people want to read them and see how Ranger fans really felt about him before he hurt their feelings when he went back to Russia. He was unanimously considered one of our very best players pretty much every single game, absolutely miles ahead of Kakko & Lafreniere, etc. Then these very same posters now claim that he looked awful in those 20 games.

The reason I changed that to a Tribute thread was because that was the only way it could've possible stayed open a little longer since it was posthumous, there were people calling to close the thread as soon as the trade happened before I changed the title because it was a player discussion thread for a player who isn't on our team any longer. There are a large contingent of fans who absolutely despise him because of the off ice stuff and begin seething at any mention of him, there are literally posts you can find saying any mention of Kravtsov should be banned board-wide. He's like Voldemort to them, if you say his name something very bad will happen. People were losing their minds because someone posted his assist in the Around the NHL thread in his second game after the trade.

Were those preseason games?