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Confirmed Trade: [VGK/STL] Ivan Barbashev for Zach Dean

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abo9 said:
I honestly just assumed since everyone points out that he's becoming UFA at the end of the year.

Do we know anything about why Barbashev was traded then? Obviously for the Blues it makes sense to recoup assets,then try to sign him again... he's a good player. But did Barbashev signal intent to chase money or another Cup?

They can be on good terms, but he's still gonna be UFA at the end of the day
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There was talk that Barbashev wanted a trade to get playoff hockey. People probably took that to mean that it meant more and he didn't want to be apart of a retool/rebuild with St. Louis, and that still could be the case, but it's still possible he returns. I don't expect him to return since we'll still be relatively tight on the cap and I imagine we have bigger moves planned.
 
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LickTheEnvelope said:
I can't see Dean ever having a 60 point season like Barbashev did a couple of years back but I think this trade makes perfect sense.
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Ask any Blues fan a year and a half ago if Barby would ever hit 60 pts and you’d be hard pressed to find 1 that’d say yes.

Barby hit 60 pts last season because the Blues were the prefect storm of 3 quality lines and everything fell their way, at least from an offensive standpoint. The Thomas and ROR lines were both hot almost all season so the 3rd line, primarily Barbashev-Schenn-Kyrou, absolutely feasted on the opposition’s 3rd/4th lines. That all fell apart this season but in 2021-22, it all fell right and Barby was a main benefactor.

Barby is a quality player though. Fits best at 3LW but can play C or W and anywhere up and down the lineup.

I’m very happy with the return of Dean though. About the same value as a late 2023 1st but he’s 2 years farther along on the development curve.
 
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I mean Barby’s got his cup, turns 28 in december. I bet he plans to sign a career deal. Something like 4.5Mx5
 
STL fan in IA said:
Ask any Blues fan a year and a half ago if Barby would ever hit 60 pts and you’d be hard pressed to find 1 that’d say yes.

Barby hit 60 pts last season because the Blues were the prefect storm of 3 quality lines and everything fell their way, at least from an offensive standpoint. The Thomas and ROR lines were both hot almost all season so the 3rd line, primarily Barbashev-Schenn-Kyrou, absolutely feasted on the opposition’s 3rd/4th lines. That all fell apart this season but in 2021-22, it all fell right and Barby was a main benefactor.

Barby is a quality player though. Fits best at 3LW but can play C or W and anywhere up and down the lineup.

I’m very happy with the return of Dean though. About the same value as a late 2023 1st but he’s 2 years farther along on the development curve.
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I'd like to see him test UFA. Be good fit in Montreal.
 
Barbashev is going to get a really nice deal come UFA time. If Vegas wants to keep him they’re going to have to move some money out. He’s going to have lots of interest.
 
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Hale The Villain said:
Basically can be boiled down to a late 1st for Barbashev, which is fair.
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Late first with 2 years of nice development is MUCH better than late first in the draft.

I did some quick maths (actually wasn't that quick) and out of 81 players drafted #24-#32 between 2010 and 2018, 45 have never become career NHL players. There is still significant risk involved in drafting there, ~50% chance you are getting nothing more but an AHL depth/NHL call-up level player. When getting a 20-year-old prospect like Dean, that risk is probably reduced 4 times or so.
 
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wetcoast said:
They have to be the favorite coming out of the Q this year no?
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Gatineau or Quebec, both are extremely strong. I’d give Gatineau the upper hand, they are 23-1-1 in their past 25 games, haven’t lost on regulation in 25, had a 21 game streak.

Halifax had a very good year, but are not a strong team, record was helped by their division.
 
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wetcoast said:
They have to be the favorite coming out of the Q this year no?
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Well they are ranked #1 in Canada but there are 4 teams with about the same point total. They absolutely smashed the 67's in back to back wins who finished first by quite a bit ahead of anyone else in the OHL. But yes I dont see how they arent the favorite but all top 4 teams in the Q are really good.
 
SoundAndFury said:
Late first with 2 years of nice development is MUCH better than late first in the draft.

I did some quick maths (actually wasn't that quick) and out of 81 players drafted #24-#32 between 2010 and 2018, 45 have never become career NHL players. There is still significant risk involved in drafting there, ~50% chance you are getting nothing more but an AHL depth/NHL call-up level player. When getting a 20-year-old prospect like Dean, that risk is probably reduced 4 times or so.
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Dean's development hasn't been that impressive. He's probably met expectations for a late 1st but I don't know how much he'd go higher in a re-draft.

There's definitely time value in getting a 2 year head start by trading for a 19YR old prospect instead of a 1st that will likely be used on a 17YR old, but I would say any risk reduction is more than offset by losing the lottery ticket nature of the draft pick having the chance (albeit slim with a late 1st) of turning into a star player if used correctly.
 
Hale The Villain said:
Dean's development hasn't been that impressive. He's probably met expectations for a late 1st but I don't know how much he'd go higher in a re-draft.
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Yes, it doesn't mean his ceiling got higher, it just reduces the risk. He is becoming the player he was supposed to be on the draft day.

Regarding the 2nd part of your post, a lottery ticket is exactly right. Taking the same drafts, same positions and same 81 players, 3 of them became elite-ish: Kuznetsov, Pastrnak, Tage Thompson. So that's ~50% chance to be left with relatively speaking nothing and ~4% chance to score big. Proving exactly my point - lotteries are bad idea fueled by wishful thinking. And the fallacy here is that there is no such thing as "using the pick correctly" the same way as there is no such thing as buying the right lottery ticket. All those teams tried to do their best and pick the best player for their franchise.

And even if, now that's debatable, but even if we were to agree Dean would be picked in around the same spot in the re-draft doesn't change the fact that we now have 2 years of hindsight to prove he belongs there. And now we know Boucher and Cossa don't belong where they have been drafted and Moser or Knies doesn't belong where they were. And we can bet here and now, out of those picked in the spots 24 - 32 in the year 2021 around half aren't going to make it in the NHL.
 
Dean is a much better prospect than given credit for here. Takes very few viewings to see that.

Complete gamer that can play in every situation and excel that teams are going to hate playing against
 
It’s usually the trades that aren’t talked about the most, that make the most difference in the playoffs. They gave up a nice prospect but it was well worth it.

Barbashev has been a difference maker in the playoffs. He’s made himself a lot of money this postseason.

It’s going to be real tough for Vegas to keep him but he was a big part of this Cup run and he’ll have quite a few suitors come July.

He’d be a great fit with the Sens…
 
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