Prospect Info: Tyler Boucher (F) - PART III

[Ice-Tray]

to me swinging for the fences is taking a guy you think could be the next kucherov or point.

trying to snipe the next raffi torres or josh anderson is not swinging for the fences, its the opposite.

Of course that’s how it is for you. I think we all know the types of players that you value, and don’t value, by now.

 

[bicboi64]

14 points in 24 games with the 67s. Dorion really set this kid up to fail by picking him in the top 10. I don't think he has the offensive talent to produce like a top 6 forward. I just hope Boucher gets some time with Belleville and can learn how to hit hard, but not dirty and play smart with the puck. We can still get a solid NHL body out of him, but the pressure might be absurd.

 

[Icelevel]

14 points in 24 games with the 67s. Dorion really set this kid up to fail by picking him in the top 10. I don't think he has the offensive talent to produce like a top 6 forward. I just hope Boucher gets some time with Belleville and can learn how to hit hard, but not dirty and play smart with the puck. We can still get a solid NHL body out of him, but the pressure might be absurd.

He WILL be an nhl player. And a useful one. How much offense he can contribute is the question. The answer doesn’t matter till we get it.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Swinging for the fences is taking high variance bets. That is not the same as taking low probability bets.

If you think anyone assumes what you stated, you need to get your thinking checked.

Do you believe Sens scouts drafted players at 10 and 12 overall thinking they had a high probability of being poor NHLers?

 

[Micklebot]

Do you believe Sens scouts drafted players at 10 and 12 overall thinking they had a high probability of being poor NHLers?

I think what he means is low payoff, so the analogy would be betting on 37 in roulette would be swining for the fence the same as drafting a bust or boom player, where as betting Black would be low payoff but safe in a similar fashion to picking Boucher.

I don't think we picked boucher thinking he's likely a bust, but I also don't see it as swinging for the fence with the bases loaded knowing there's a strong chance you'll pop fly or strick out and get nothing out of it.

 

[Dino Tkachuk]

I think what he means is low payoff, so the analogy would be betting on 37 in roulette would be swining for the fence the same as drafting a bust or boom player, where as betting Black would be low payoff but safe in a similar fashion to picking Boucher.

I don't think we picked boucher thinking he's likely a bust, but I also don't see it as swinging for the fence with the bases loaded knowing there's a strong chance you'll pop fly or strick out and get nothing out of it.

Isn't there audio of Mann after the draft acknowledging this was a high risk pick and one he never would have made early on in his career?

Using your analogy above, there is also an equal chance you still hit a single even though you were swinging for the fence, score a couple runs and bring up the next batter to try to win the game. Just because Boucher becomes a 4th line physical player in the NHL doesn't mean that this was their intent when drafting him and I suspect the Sens would be very disappointed with that result.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Isn't there audio of Mann after the draft acknowledging this was a high risk pick and one he never would have made early on in his career?

Using your analogy above, there is also an equal chance you still hit a single even though you were swinging for the fence, score a couple runs and bring up the next batter to try to win the game. Just because Boucher becomes a 4th line physical player in the NHL doesn't mean that this was their intent when drafting him and I suspect the Sens would be very disappointed with that result.

IMO this was a pick based on a identity profile that Dorion prioritized on trying to put pieces in place.
I don't think it hurt that there were some relationships with the father and the general lack of scouting and scouting opportunities. A perfect storm doesn't always work out well.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

I think what he means is low payoff, so the analogy would be betting on 37 in roulette would be swining for the fence the same as drafting a bust or boom player, where as betting Black would be low payoff but safe in a similar fashion to picking Boucher.

I don't think we picked boucher thinking he's likely a bust, but I also don't see it as swinging for the fence with the bases loaded knowing there's a strong chance you'll pop fly or strick out and get nothing out of it.

I think they took Boucher for a super simple reason that maybe people are having a hard time coming to terms with becuase they’re pros.

They thought Boucher and Brown were the best players available at that pick. And for Logan brown they were certainly wrong. Boucher remains to be seen l

 

[ijif]

Do you believe Sens scouts drafted players at 10 and 12 overall thinking they had a high probability of being poor NHLers?

I cannot say for certain what they think or thought.

I know what I think, and based on all available evidence at the time of the draft, Ottawa took players that do not have a high chance of playing 200+ games or being star players. It's that simple. Of course, that is relative to draft position and other available players.

And yes, I am fully aware people disagree.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

I cannot say for certain what they think or thought.

I know what I think, and based on all available evidence at the time of the draft, Ottawa took players that do not have a high chance of playing 200+ games or being star players. It's that simple. Of course, that is relative to draft position and other available players.

And yes, I am fully aware people disagree.

Logan browns stats and size indicated he would be a decent nhler. Even in the AHL. (I don’t know if we’re still talking about Brown). But his profile even as a pro playing against men. Indicated he would be center in the NHL. And a good one.

Boucher maybe not. But Sens scouts thought he would

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

So...is Boucher going to be on the roster for Belleville? Getting a few playoff games might be just the spark he needs.

 

[Icelevel]

So...is Boucher going to be on the roster for Belleville? Getting a few playoff games might be just the spark he needs.

Already played great playoff hockey for the 67s but yeah would be nice to continue on.

 

[BondraTime]

So...is Boucher going to be on the roster for Belleville? Getting a few playoff games might be just the spark he needs.

It’s what I had assumed, and they very well may, but looking at it rationally he’d be a downgrade from any player that would sit in favour of him. He wasn’t much of a help in the OHL playoffs, not sure the AHL playoffs would be a good idea.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

It’s what I had assumed, and they very well may, but looking at it rationally he’d be a downgrade from any player that would sit in favour of him. He wasn’t much of a help in the OHL playoffs, not sure the AHL playoffs would be a good idea.

I can't see Mann using him unless he is told to

 

[Ice-Tray]

No one is going to tell Mann who to play, let’s be real here. If Boucher gets into the lineup it’s because Mann wants him there.

This is the playoffs after all, not mid season where players are getting a look. No chance management of the Sens starts playing roster games in my opinion.

Do we know if he has been sent to Belleville?

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Of course that’s how it is for you. I think we all know the types of players that you value, and don’t value, by now.

lol what does that mean?

I value players who win hockey games, any which way they do it. If Boucher ever gets good enough to play a role in us winning hockey games I will like him.

I would like a Josh Anderson or a Raffi Torres on my team, doesn't mean acquiring them is swinging for the fences lol.

 

[Ice-Tray]

lol what does that mean?

I value players who win hockey games, any which way they do it. If Boucher ever gets good enough to play a role in us winning hockey games I will like him.

Naw, you’ll passive aggressively undercut him at every turn like you do other players of his ilk (Brady).

Then you’ll play the victim card in here acting confused as to why you’re getting backlash for your comments.

Rinse and repeat. It’s ok, everyone has their thing on this board.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Naw, you’ll passive aggressively undercut him at every turn like you do other players of his ilk (Brady).

Then you’ll play the victim card in here acting confused as to why you’re getting backlash for your comments.

Rinse and repeat. It’s ok, everyone has their thing on this board.

I like Brady and I also praise him for things he does well all the time.. Doesn't mean I have to ignore when he is playing bad or pointing out things he can do better.

Some fans here, especially you, are just weirdly insecure about Brady.

 

[OD99]

It’s what I had assumed, and they very well may, but looking at it rationally he’d be a downgrade from any player that would sit in favour of him. He wasn’t much of a help in the OHL playoffs, not sure the AHL playoffs would be a good idea.

Yes I am thinking more he goes down, gets to practice and be around pros and keep his development going for a few more weeks before he is on to off season training.

Maybe if Belleville is in a pinch or feels they need a physical spark he gets a game but don't see him getting in the lineup any other way.

Kelly and Kastelic will be back to help and depending on his injury/playoff success would imagine Greig gets in ahead of him as well.

 

[Micklebot]

I think they took Boucher for a super simple reason that maybe people are having a hard time coming to terms with becuase they’re pros.

They thought Boucher and Brown were the best players available at that pick. And for Logan brown they were certainly wrong. Boucher remains to be seen l

Of course they thought those guys were the best available, nobody disputes that they thought that. The point I commented on was whether they were swinging for the fence or not. We swung for the fence drafting Karlsson after weighing his potential vs his likelihood of reaching that potential, we did the same with less beneficial results taking Brown instead of say MacLeod, where as we took a more conservative approach in drafting Lazar for example, when a guy like Mantha was available who looked like a higher potential, higher risk option. Both are cases of us drafting the guy we thought we the best available pick, but they got to that valuation in different ways. Not a right or wrong determination, though some certainly think we should be prioritizing potential at 10OA

 

[Big Muddy]

Naw, you’ll passive aggressively undercut him at every turn like you do other players of his ilk (Brady).

Then you’ll play the victim card in here acting confused as to why you’re getting backlash for your comments.

Rinse and repeat. It’s ok, everyone has their thing on this board.

So, let's get back to talking about hockey versus posters.

 

[Alf Silfversson]

Naw, you’ll passive aggressively undercut him at every turn like you do other players of his ilk (Brady).

Then you’ll play the victim card in here acting confused as to why you’re getting backlash for your comments.

Rinse and repeat. It’s ok, everyone has their thing on this board.

Could not care less about 95% of this post, but Boucher and Brady are not of the same ilk.

Brady put up 32 points in 40 NCAA games prior to being drafted while Boucher put up 3 in 17 games POST draft. Then put up 16 points in 28 OHL games. Can you imagine Brady in the OHL in his D+1 year? Holy hell, he would have scored about 40 goals and 100-120 points.

By age 19 Brady was a player with very promising offense and a power forward's game.

By age 19 Boucher is a player with promising physicality/aggression and next to no offense. Hopefully he improves but at the same age there is very little that is similar about these two.

 

[R2010]

Of course they thought those guys were the best available, nobody disputes that they thought that. The point I commented on was whether they were swinging for the fence or not. We swung for the fence drafting Karlsson after weighing his potential vs his likelihood of reaching that potential, we did the same with less beneficial results taking Brown instead of say MacLeod, where as we took a more conservative approach in drafting Lazar for example, when a guy like Mantha was available who looked like a higher potential, higher risk option. Both are cases of us drafting the guy we thought we the best available pick, but they got to that valuation in different ways. Not a right or wrong determination, though some certainly think we should be prioritizing potential at 10OA

In the Lazar year Burakowsky was another one who was high risk-high reward at the time.
Another example was Bowers over Robertson.

 

[sfulefty]

A little birdie (with decent intel) told me: 2021 draft was considered a weak one. Likely would have had a different pick at #8 or #9. All players drafted around there (Dylan Guenther, Cole Sillinger, Isak Rosen, and even Chaz Lucious) have warts in their game and questions as to whether they will be more than 2nd line players. So they went with some who has a potential top end skill, that being physicality, certainly the top on his draft class in that area. With shortened seasons due to COVID, they saw this as a safer choice, in that his skill set is undeniable, physicality. And some of the other picks around that area, have no guarantees to develop any better thank some of Ottawa's later picks in previous drafts (ie. Greig, Pinto, etc..) So they choice Boucher, instead of someone who has to work on his skating to become at Top 6 forward. LA drafts Brandt Clarke at #8 and he didn't even get invited to the World Junior tryout. Yet, just about all scouts still believe he's going to be a good player for the Kings. GIve him time boys.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

A little birdie (with decent intel) told me: 2021 draft was considered a weak one. Likely would have had a different pick at #8 or #9. All players drafted around there (Dylan Guenther, Cole Sillinger, Isak Rosen, and even Chaz Lucious) have warts in their game and questions as to whether they will be more than 2nd line players. So they went with some who has a potential top end skill, that being physicality, certainly the top on his draft class in that area. With shortened seasons due to COVID, they saw this as a safer choice, in that his skill set is undeniable, physicality. And some of the other picks around that area, have no guarantees to develop any better thank some of Ottawa's later picks in previous drafts (ie. Greig, Pinto, etc..) So they choice Boucher, instead of someone who has to work on his skating to become at Top 6 forward. LA drafts Brandt Clarke at #8 and he didn't even get invited to the World Junior tryout. Yet, just about all scouts still believe he's going to be a good player for the Kings. GIve him time boys.

well they played themselves cuz the draft is looking pretty solid so far, and we have no where near the skill level that we can sacrifice top 10 picks for physicality.

Bourgault
Bolduc
Othman
Coronato
Wallstedt
Johnston
Knies

and many more all had monster years.

Maybe Boucher is more safe than most of these players because he is better physical package. But what does it say that he clearly has such nice tools and still struggles to produce at a level like the OHL ?

Remember Lazar? He could bully the kids at the CHL level but his hockey iq was exposed at the NHL level. So I don't agree that Boucher is some super safe middle six guy. Rooting for the guy though.