Trading Zuccarello was a mistake

[rangersfansince08]

We'll see. The reason for my whining? Because this path will stick NYR into the infamous bubble team range. They won't be able to succeed in the playoffs - if they get there at all, which they usually won't. The reason I'm whining is because the return the Rangers got for the pieces shipped out was quite pathetic all over. That was other franchises taking full advantage of an open letter of a rebuild in full force.

They will maybe have a chance in 5-10 years. It should've realistically been in 5, but because of the awful trades, it's more likely to be 10. Sure, you can glare at the nice gold pieces. The core will still be inadequate and NYR will be in effective 9-12 range, which is the worst range.

Nonsense. The bubble team range is what a team like Montreal is in. A team that makes (or barely misses out on) the playoffs mosts years , is not good enough to go deep in the playoffs, but not bad enough to ever get high end talent at the top of the draft.

This team got a second overall, a first overall, had Fox essentially force his way onto the team and got one of the best players in FA want to sign with them over anybody else. They got at least FOUR high end pieces. Two because of luck and two because NY is where Fox and Panarin wanted to play. This is not a team in the bubble team range in any sense of the phrase.

 

[egelband]

Loved Zucc when he was here, and he HAD earned the right to better communication from the team...

BUT, the trade had to happen, regardless of the return. You don't pay top line money to a guy who is a 1/2 line tweener, and you certainly don't do it when they are already in their 30s. This was my concern with Strome this past offseason (though he has been doing better than I thought he'd do)--we won't be a contender with a Strome at 2C. This is my concern with Buch--I hope he isn't looking to be paid as a first line RW, but if he is, then it's best to move him at the right time also (and Buch is one of my favorites on the current roster). Half of the problem with the Rangers has been a general lack of high end talent. The other half of the problem has been the fact that we pay mid-level talent at high end prices because that's where they played for us. Pay Buch as a top line RW and we will be in a world of trouble when Kakko and/or Kravtsov surpass him. Suddenly we have a very expensive 3rd liner. Only very rare players earn the right to decide when and how their time on a team is over. IMO, there have only been two or three in my lifetime (Leetch, Lundkvist, and Messier). Again, the communication should have been better, but moving Zucc was the right thing for the team to do.

Exactly. There’s a time and a place for everyone. Sometimes it doesn’t match up. And after all is said and done I think both parties did fine by each other. Sometimes it’s just not in the cards and mature heads appreciate that and move forward.

 

[egelband]

I think a lot of you easily dismiss the impact Zucca would've had on this current lineup.
That's all I have to say..

Sure. But is that more weighty than his impact on the cap?

(Of course, you could say that had we re-signed Zucc we might have been forced to trade ADA - for something decent. Which would have been nice )

 

[egelband]

I understand liking certain players but never understood getting so attached to a player rather than the team.

I agree, on the whole but if I were building a team I do like the idea of one or two “continuity” guys. Which is why I was ok with the Henrik and Kreider deals. But i was also happy to let Zucc and Hayes and Fast go. It’s a balance.

 

[rangersfansince08]

I also don't see how anybody could be upset with our roster turned out.

 

[LeetchisGod]

I also don't see how anybody could be upset with our roster turned out.

No doubt, this is a much more talented team than what we used to have.

 

[Bluto]

Riddley and Miller for Carpenter was a mistake
JT Miller for Namestnikov was a mistake
Jean Ratelle and Brad Park for Esposito was a mistake.
Zubov and Nedved for Samuelsson and Robitaille was a mistake.
Kovalev for Nedved was a mistake.
Trading Brian Leetch was a mistake.

The Zuccarello trade does not reach the level of mistake of the above trades and thus is not worthy of its own thread.

 

[Chimpradamus]

Nonsense. The bubble team range is what a team like Montreal is in. A team that makes (or barely misses out on) the playoffs mosts years , is not good enough to go deep in the playoffs, but not bad enough to ever get high end talent at the top of the draft.

This team got a second overall, a first overall, had Fox essentially force his way onto the team and got one of the best players in FA want to sign with them over anybody else. They got at least FOUR high end pieces. Two because of luck and two because NY is where Fox and Panarin wanted to play. This is not a team in the bubble team range in any sense of the phrase.

Those are good arguments, I can't say it's wrong to think so. If the prospects pan out, sure, I can see it. If not, well it will be harder. I have to say the cap problems in New York are very managable compared to alot of other teams. The classic NYR tradition of albatross contracts on the roster is gone, so I will say that's a huge plus for the team.

NYR have to attain more depth, especially at D. It's a weak point for sure, the blueline needs more quality. Just having Fox and an overpaid Trouba isn't enough. Same with the offensive depth. Losing role players like Fast really hurt the roster.

So yes, I might whine way too much about this history. It's true, I won't deny it. But I'm still pissed Zuccarello is gone. Ok?

 

[Webster]

Bring him home, Mats will always be a Ranger...

And you'll get Webster for free

 

[True Blue]

It......is........alive.........

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Riddley and Miller for Carpenter was a mistake
JT Miller for Namestnikov was a mistake
Jean Ratelle and Brad Park for Esposito was a mistake.
Zubov and Nedved for Samuelsson and Robitaille was a mistake.
Kovalev for Nedved was a mistake.
Trading Brian Leetch was a mistake.

The Zuccarello trade does not reach the level of mistake of the above trades and thus is not worthy of its own thread.

No it wasn't. Miller was never, ever going to hit his potential here. He needed a change of scenery.

 

[NYSPORTS]

JT Miller for Namestnikov was a mistake
.

but we got Howden

 

[NYR]

No it wasn't. Miller was never, ever going to hit his potential here. He needed a change of scenery.

Miller was a 20 goal scorer when he was here but much like ADA, he had an attitude problem.

Maybe this organization should stop taking the little bitch route.

You need players with a chip on their shoulder in order to compete.

Maybe some day JG will "get it" but I won't hold my breathe..

 

[NYSPORTS]

Miller was a 20 goal scorer when he was here but much like ADA, he had an attitude problem.

Maybe this organization should stop taking the little bitch route.

You need players with a chip on their shoulder in order to compete.

Maybe some day JG will "get it" but I won't hold my breathe..

so you prefer the Al Bundy type rather than the Gentlemen of Sport?

Give me two lines of Rick Tocchet and i’m good.

 

[NYR]

so you prefer the Al Bundy type rather than the Gentlemen of Sport?

Give me two lines of Rick Tocchet and i’m good.

Hockey is a physical sport and you aren't winning on skill alone so..All day long..

 

[jay from jersey]

Exactly. There’s a time and a place for everyone. Sometimes it doesn’t match up. And after all is said and done I think both parties did fine by each other. Sometimes it’s just not in the cards and mature heads appreciate that and move forward.

What we got for him was a mistake. We for sure should have got a late first instead of this maybe 2 first 2 2nd nonsense. Ranger luck will always rear it’s ugly head and give us the shaft

 

[Bluto]

A good team with halfway decent leadership can control the 'headcases'. If JT Miller could never have succeeded here, it just means team leadership failed at the top. DeAngelo, Miller, Lias to an extent.... good leadership can get the best out of those players. The Rangers have always had a problem with terrible leadership in the FO... and it's just a trickle down from Dolan being a worthless sack of garbage.
You're seeing it now with the Giants too. They'll take the boy scout who sucks over the guy who smokes weed and is pro bowl caliber. NYG would probably trade prime Lawrence Taylor in 2021.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

What's this nonsense about JT Miller being traded because he was a headcase?

He was a pretty mediocre player here, despite being a good scorer, he was a liability in all the other facets of the game. He never showed up in the playoffs (1G in 40GP). He was far from a cornerstone player that the Rangers messed up by moving.

Tampa moved on from him despite good offensive numbers and there's smoke that Vancouver does too. He's not someone who really elevates a team.

 

[FireGerardGallant]

Bring him home, Mats will always be a Ranger...

And you'll get Webster for free

 

[The New Russian Five]

Extending Zuccarello would have been a much bigger mistake. I know hes had a hot start to the season, but remember Callahan was a PPG for the first 30 games or so during his first full season with Tampa before that carriage turned into a pumpkin. It looks nice now, but he will revert back to what he really is soon enough. Funny how you didn't mention how much he sucked last year which was a MUCH bigger sample size than what hes done this year.

Years 3-4-5 were always going to be the biggest issue with him. Moving on from him was the RIGHT move, the only reason why he didn't return more than he did is because he coasted for the first 3 months of 2018-19 and then chased the money/security in Minnesota instead of a chance to win in Dallas (which was 100% his right.) Zuccarello pouted on his way out of town, what makes you think he would have been capable of handling the load in the room under difficult situations? If anything, the evidence points to it being more likely that he would have completely folded.

Also, if they kept him, they likely don't have Kakko OR Lafreniere. These things are all connected. LOL at Grabner for Peanuts. What the f*** did you think he was going to return? Did you forget that part of his return was used to trade up to get Miller, who is currently eating 20+ minutes a night for our team right now?

This is a contender for the worst post of 2021 which is saying something because the DeAngelo thread and the Panarin thread both exist.

This man understands the butterfly effect.

 

[007]

This man understands the butterfly effect.

Are you suggesting our hockey management is chaos?

 

[Webster]

This man understands the butterfly effect.

Except he got most of it wrong.

Ranger fans know what Zucc brings, and now when he's recovered from a complicated arm fracture he's back on his game. Works hard every shift with success, and the Wild are thrilled.

The Rangers got plenty in return for him, two 1st round picks were in play. The first one was Zucc's decision, he only had to sign with the Stars. But they couldn't offer more than 4 years, they were worried about future cap space. Two other teams offered 5 years. The second 1st round pick was also very close, in fact only one goal, but the opponent scored and moved on.

He was angry with Rangers management, after many years of loyalty and dedication to this team. But people shouldn't question his mental strength, this is the second time he works his way back to this league after a serious injury. But he understands the business part, he got the letter. It was more the lack of communication.

The Rangers got many talented and skilled young players now. What you probably miss about Zucc is his personality, there was a reason why Hank cried on tv. Anyway, was it a mistake to trade him? Well maybe if you need a character guy and some leadership, but I understand the decision too, the Rangers went for a rebuild.

 

[haohmaru]

Thought about this for a few days and, honestly, I had to ask myself "Why do I watch hockey?"

For some it's the Stanley Cup and the allure of all that goes with it. The playoff battles, the heroes, the disappointments, the come-from-behind wins, exceeding expectations, not meeting expectations, hoping the King could seal the deal, etc...

And, I think that's what bugs me the most about the Zuccarello deal - not that I think we should've gotten more (we should have), but the fact that the guy is just really easy to cheer for, fun to watch, and as engaging a teammate that you could ever ask for. I get the business side of things, the draft side of things, the Cap side of things, etc...

But, I don't get to watch Zuccarello play for the New York Rangers anymore. And that just sucks no matter how much sense it might've made. I watch hockey to watch players like HIM play for MY team.

That's what bothers me the most about it.

 

[Edge]

I liked Zucc. I wish him well in his journey.

Can't say I've ever given a second thought to trading him.

 

[The New Russian Five]

Except he got most of it wrong.

Ranger fans know what Zucc brings, and now when he's recovered from a complicated arm fracture he's back on his game. Works hard every shift with success, and the Wild are thrilled.

The Rangers got plenty in return for him, two 1st round picks were in play. The first one was Zucc's decision, he only had to sign with the Stars. But they couldn't offer more than 4 years, they were worried about future cap space. Two other teams offered 5 years. The second 1st round pick was also very close, in fact only one goal, but the opponent scored and moved on.

He was angry with Rangers management, after many years of loyalty and dedication to this team. But people shouldn't question his mental strength, this is the second time he works his way back to this league after a serious injury. But he understands the business part, he got the letter. It was more the lack of communication.

The Rangers got many talented and skilled young players now. What you probably miss about Zucc is his personality, there was a reason why Hank cried on tv. Anyway, was it a mistake to trade him? Well maybe if you need a character guy and some leadership, but I understand the decision too, the Rangers went for a rebuild.

Except, if the rangers kept Zucc, we would not be able to sign Panarin, and we likely end up higher in the standings and not win either of the last two lotteries. That is the butterfly effect buddy.