Trades & Free Agency Thread: Off-season Edition

[WTFMAN99]

Is there anything to backup that he didn't waive for Utah?

Not from anyone credible online that you'd find publicly.

Just remember if you see something in 32 thoughts next year

 

[Fogelhund]

Tavares was helped a lot by playing mainly with a guy who put up the 13th most ES points last year.

THe guy who put up the 13th most ES points last year, was helped a lot by having a top C on his line.....

 

[ACC1224]

It's come out a bit.

I guess he didn't like Utah.

I asked if he was if the Leafs asked him to leave and was told 'No' but this was May long weekend, I suppose it could have occurred later.

Him no waiving would be huge news, I find it hard to believe it wouldn't have come out.

 

[WTFMAN99]

I asked if he was if the Leafs asked him to leave and was told 'No' but this was May long weekend, I suppose it could have occurred later.

Him no waiving would be huge news, I find it hard to believe it wouldn't have come out.

I have no doubt that someone like Friedman already knows but might not be reporting it because he was told not to. Friedman has said that it is a frustrating part of the job as he can't always report or risks burning a bridge.

I don't want to go too far down the rabbit hole because I come off as amateur insider but I have a strong feeling like half way through the year you'll get one of those snippets in his 32 thoughts such as "Toronto thought they had a deal with Utah for Marner but Marner didn't waive"

I'm thinking the timeline of when you were told nothing was up and when this happened didn't line up, believe this occurred afterwards. I'm getting second hand info but the info is pretty damn good.

 

[Torontonian]

We already need a 2C, JT is no longer a 2C

He's a fine 2nd line C still, but you generally do not want to pay your 2nd line centreman 11m.

Bring his cap hit down to 5m next season and suddenly people aren't up in arms about his 65 points last season and 80 the year before that.

 

[Fogelhund]

I agree with all of this. I really wanted Marner for Wright + a 1st or Larsson or Oleksiak. The cap space savings would have covered Roy or Tanev (or both). I am still hopeful that Marner can be moved this month, but really is just hope. Is Necas and Nikishin too much to ask for? Could Sergachev get moved twice in one off-season?

As for Nylander; yep defensive questiona. I wonder about supporting him with defensive wingers to start?

Knies Matthews Domi
Jarnkrok Nylander Marner
Robertson Tavares McMann

...something like that. Holmberg is an option too. This sort of configuration would be a matchup nightmare and Tavares would for sure fave third lines all year.

Who is our 2C if not Willy? Who can score like that, have a strong defensive game and be affordable?

Interesting... Canes and Kuznetzov just agreed to mutual contract termination... just for giggles, they would now have enough cap room for Marner if they are creative.

 

[notdoneyet]

I agree with all of this. I really wanted Marner for Wright + a 1st or Larsson or Oleksiak. The cap space savings would have covered Roy or Tanev (or both). I am still hopeful that Marner can be moved this month, but really is just hope. Is Necas and Nikishin too much to ask for? Could Sergachev get moved twice in one off-season?

As for Nylander; yep defensive questiona. I wonder about supporting him with defensive wingers to start?

Knies Matthews Domi
Jarnkrok Nylander Marner
Robertson Tavares McMann

...something like that. Holmberg is an option too. This sort of configuration would be a matchup nightmare and Tavares would for sure fave third lines all year.

Who is our 2C if not Willy? Who can score like that, have a strong defensive game and be affordable?

Willy is not strong defensively
He is below average in that category

 

[Americanadian]

Washington and Carolina are both in the clear now with this Kuznetsov termination. If Oshie doesn’t come back Washington has a good chunk of money to play with. They were always a good match for Marner. They have the young pieces (Leonard, Iorio, McMichael) and the cap filler (Protas, TVR) and the picks. Most importantly they have the need - their best RW is Wilson. They could use him to set up Ovechkin.

Leonard, McMichael, TVR would be a very strong base for a Marner deal.

 

[NMacrules]

Kuznetsov would be a decent pickup for cheap. Likely a year for 1.5? 2 for 2?

I think he needs a fresh start where a coach like Berube could light a fire under his ass.

He is uber talented but just lazy at times. Still only 31. Likely going to the KHL.

Washington and Carolina are both in the clear now with this Kuznetsov termination. If Oshie doesn’t come back Washington has a good chunk of money to play with. They were always a good match for Marner. They have the young pieces (Leonard, Iorio, McMichael) and the cap filler (Protas, TVR) and the picks. Most importantly they have the need - their best RW is Wilson. They could use him to set up Ovechkin.

Leonard, McMichael, TVR would be a very strong base for a Marner deal.

You must have missed the video where Marner says he is not going to waive and will playout the season in Toronto.

 

[notdoneyet]

I have no doubt that someone like Friedman already knows but might not be reporting it because he was told not to. Friedman has said that it is a frustrating part of the job as he can't always report or risks burning a bridge.

I don't want to go too far down the rabbit hole because I come off as amateur insider but I have a strong feeling like half way through the year you'll get one of those snippets in his 32 thoughts such as "Toronto thought they had a deal with Utah for Marner but Marner didn't waive"

I'm thinking the timeline of when you were told nothing was up and when this happened didn't line up, believe this occurred afterwards. I'm getting second hand info but the info is pretty damn good.

Well if we alll are blowing smoke out our ass
I believe leafs didn’t ask him to waive and next tear
Friedman will say the leafs never asked marner to waive not because other teams weren’t interested or offering value but because leafs management love his skill set

See anyone can become an amateur insider it’s easy
Just speak out of your ass and haters will believe you

 

[Fogelhund]

You must have missed the video where Marner says he is not going to waive and will playout the season in Toronto.

No such video exists. It isn't what was said.

 

[conFABulator]

Interesting... Canes and Kuznetzov just agreed to mutual contract termination... just for giggles, they would now have enough cap room for Marner if they are creative.

Toronto could even eat on Marner, it's only one year...if the return is strong enough. I honestly believe that Necas + Nikishin is possibly too much of a return for one year of Marner. Us eating on it might help balance the value.

Necas gives us a 2C that can resign for much lower than Mitch would and Nikishin becomes our top prospect, a dman, that is ready now or close to ready.

Willy is not strong defensively
He is below average in that category

I know, I am saying that is there someone out there that we can sign that has his offense AND is good defensively. Sorry if my wording was unclear

 

[Fogelhund]

Toronto could even eat on Marner, it's only one year...if the return is strong enough. I honestly believe that Necas + Nikishin is possibly too much of a return for one year of Marner. Us eating on it might help balance the value.

Necas gives us a 2C that can resign for much lower than Mitch would and Nikishin becomes our top prospect, a dman, that is ready now or close to ready.


I know, I am saying that is there someone out there that we can sign that has his offense AND is good defensively. Sorry if my wording was unclear

Necas or Jarvis?

 

[conFABulator]

Necas or Jarvis?

Jarvis would be the dream. I did mean Necas.

I don't think we get Jarvis and Nikishin for Mitch, even with retention.

 

[Fogelhund]

Jarvis would be the dream. I did mean Necas.

I don't think we get Jarvis and Nikishin for Mitch, even with retention.

Necas really hasn't been used as a C at the NHL level. Jarvis hasn't been used much either, but was getting some usage there last year. Jarvis is more of a natural C though, if the goal was to get a 2C. I'd could settle for just Jarvis, though Marner with an extension, Canes win the trade... though perhaps that does more for us long-term. Give them both 8 years x XX extensions before the trade, and get it done. Marner probably gets $12 mil, and Jarvis $8 mil.

 

[mydnyte]

Boston did that in these playoffs - double teamed Matthews and Nylander (when they played) and pretty much ignored both JT and Mitch until they got the puck, at which point someone would go and take it away.

thats how you defend a team that doesnt and couldnt use its defense

 

[notDatsyuk]

THe guy who put up the 13th most ES points last year, was helped a lot by having a top C on his line.....

Nylander had more goals than JT had assists, and twice as many assists as JT had goals.

Who helped who?

 

[notDatsyuk]

Willy is not strong defensively
He is below average in that category

Willy's defence is fine when playing with Matty but not when playing with JT.

Mitch's defence is fine when playing with Matty but not when playing with JT.

I wonder what the common denominator is?

 

[Fogelhund]

Nylander had more goals than JT had assists, and twice as many assists as JT had goals.

Who helped who?

In reality.. they helped each other.

 

[MarMarSab3]

In reality.. they helped each other.

Tavares helped no one, Nylander did what he did despite playing with Tavares, come on!

 

[notDatsyuk]

In reality.. they helped each other.

To an extent every player on the ice helps every other player on the ice.

As long as you can ignore the quantitative differences, you're right.

 

[Fogelhund]

Tavares helped no one, Nylander did what he did despite playing with Tavares, come on!

Hilarious take. This fanbase when it turns on someone loses all objectivity.

Meanwhile, most of the same posters who have turned on Tavares, pine for Kadri... the same age, less production the last two years.... it's hilarious. We get rid of Tavares, we'd be looking for someone near as good, despite his decline.

 

[Americanadian]

You must have missed the video where Marner says he is not going to waive and will playout the season in Toronto.

I did. Where was this?

 

[Kurtz]

Necas really hasn't been used as a C at the NHL level. Jarvis hasn't been used much either, but was getting some usage there last year. Jarvis is more of a natural C though, if the goal was to get a 2C. I'd could settle for just Jarvis, though Marner with an extension, Canes win the trade... though perhaps that does more for us long-term. Give them both 8 years x XX extensions before the trade, and get it done. Marner probably gets $12 mil, and Jarvis $8 mil.

You're right about Necas, he's a speedy winger who doesn't play defense and is terrible on the dot. Definitely not a C, let alone a 2C. Kind of the last thing we need is a Necas.

But the bolded part is just so weird to me. Usually fans on a message board will propose trades that we win. In this case it's a trade proposal where we clearly lose the trade by your own admission, but there's a chance that in the long run it may work out if we sign the right player with the $4m delta in their cap hits.

 

[conFABulator]

You're right about Necas, he's a speedy winger who doesn't play defense and is terrible on the dot. Definitely not a C, let alone a 2C. Kind of the last thing we need is a Necas.

But the bolded part is just so weird to me. Usually fans on a message board will propose trades that we win. In this case it's a trade proposal where we clearly lose the trade by your own admission, but there's a chance that in the long run it may work out if we sign the right player with the $4m delta in their cap hits.

My original suggestion of Necas was as the second part of a deal that included Nikishin. He is the centre piece and Necas rounds out the return. I had read that Necas was being groomed to be more of a C and most sites list him as one....though yes, terrible in the dot....so far.

My ideal would be

Marner @ 25% retained (one year, to make it work)

For

Jarvis and Nikishin.

We get a 2C and a top pairing Dman for the next eight years and probably save $3M to $4M per year for the next few years. That's a win, so much so maybe we have to add a bit.

I would "settle" for Necas in for Jarvis, but maybe a little add from Carolina. Necas can stay at wing if Willy can move to C.

Again, Nikishin is the big add. Having our top prospect being a dman without giving up a draft pick, Cowan, Minten, Grebyonkin, Niemela, Danford, Hildeby, or Akhtyamov is some nice work.