Trades and UFA’s - Trade Deadline Edition

[kb]

You dont have much left to sbow or develop at 25

He is a finished product in terms of his size, skating, shooting

At best he improves his instincts and awareness on the ice.

Your time to develope your skills once drafted and hone your body is 18-22 range when your coming up tbe system

At 25 your just looking to implement where your at on a consistent basis at an NHL level.

Is Lilly a finished product?

Same draft.

Your entitled to your factually wrong and short sighted opinion. He was injured a lot with a knee injury, and early on it was concussions, it was never performance issues.


Look at how many pro games he has played. Start there. Lily has way more pro experience.

He has a ton of developing left. Regardless of your opinion

 

[Magic Man]

Would a depth forward that can clear waivers and a future 3rd rd. pick be good value for Krok?

Jarnkrok for Nylander + PIT 2026 3rd rd. pick to reunite with Dubas

Jarnkrok for Noesen + CAR 2025 3rd rd. pick

Jarnkrok for Tierney + NJ 2025 3rd rd. pick

 

[Kurtz]

All three of Montour, Gio and Morrisey were good players in the NHL at ages 23 to 25

Montour for a deep ducks team with strong defense had

6 in 27 age 23
32 in 80 in age 24
25 in 62 in age 25

Gio had

15 in 48 as a 23 year old
19 in 58 as a 25 year old
His 24 year season he went to the KHL due to contract issues with the flames

Morrisey was the best of the three being a top 4D

31 in 59 as a 23 year old
31 in 65 as a 24 year old
21 in 56 as a a 25 year old

This was after playing in the NHL as a good bottom pairing D for a deep jets defense in his 21 and 22 year old seasons

It simply more common for a player to be an NHL regular by age 25/26 (multiple years of top4 or great bottom pairing service) and then expect a breakout or peak year then expecting Timmins who doesn't have a regular spot yet to break out on the team

It would be great if it happened but its very rare

I'm not suggesting that Timmins will be in Norris conversations - that's merely an example of 3 guys who took major strides well after they were 25. There are lots more like them too.

 

[ACC1224]

Timmins isnt up and coming lol

He was up and coming in Col

Now he is a Josh Leivo type too good AHLer but not consistent or complete enough to be a regular NHLer

He isnt anyone to sweat over.

Adam brooks, Josh Leivo, Ozgihanov, type of player


Leivo had like 15 in 20 in 2017.

Short sample size for a guy who isnt good enough to play consistently on a team with 39 year old Gio as one of the options

He isnt important to the team

Seems pretty shortsighted but I guess we’ll see.
Your comparisons are pretty silly though.

 

[VanW27]

Is Lilly a finished product?

Same draft.

Your entitled to your factually wrong and short sighted opinion. He was injured a lot with a knee injury, and early on it was concussions, it was never performance issues.


Look at how many pro games he has played. Start there. Lily has way more pro experience.

He has a ton of developing left. Regardless of your opinion

I definitely agree with the experience and development part, the difficult part is this though. What Timmins really needs to develop into the player he's capable of being is to play.

He's played 118 games over 4 seasons as a pro, plus he completely missed what would have been his first year as a pro. The best thing for him would be to play a bunch of games, I'm talking 100+, as a big minute, all situations defenseman. But in order to get that he needs to be in the AHL. Will he get that development as a 6/7 with sheltered usage at the NHL level?

For comparison Lilly has 141 games of NHL experience, plus 150 AHL games, for a total of 291 games of North American pro hockey experience to Timmins' 118 despite being from the same draft and Timmins being a year older (late birthday).

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

Mulling about it, and a Jarnkrok trade would solve our cap issues and does make sense. I like the guy, he's good for at least 15 goals a year, kills penalties, and is solid defensively. However, his playoff stats are pretty abysmal, lucky to get one goal on some decently sized runs over his career. With Matthews starting to PK along with the additions of Lafferty and Gambrell, he's not as needed on the PK as I first thought. His 20 goals while good could be adequately replaced with big seasons from Bertuzzi, Domi, and Klingberg. Not to mention a full season of Knies who looks poised to break out this year, and Robertson has a chance of that too. Lafferty also did get 12 goals last year, he could turn that into 15+ in the right circumstances.

Removing his $2.1 million cap hit would allow us to sign Gregor for cheap and be able to hold on to Timmins without waiving him. We could carry a 22 man roster with an extra forward and defenseman.

 

[hamzarocks]

Seems pretty shortsighted but I guess we’ll see.
Your comparisons are pretty silly though.

We'll see if he becomes nothing of note then comparisons are correct and fans will have to accept he isnt anything to worry over

 

[Americanadian]

With injuries to Timmins and Klingberg I wonder if the Leafs put a claim in on Thompson.

 

[hamzarocks]

I'm not suggesting that Timmins will be in Norris conversations - that's merely an example of 3 guys who took major strides well after they were 25. There are lots more like them too.

They were all low end top 4D before they exploded (montour and Morrissey qre likely 1 year wonders in terms of norris contention)

Timmins cant crack/stick at the NHL at 25. He is not comparable to those guys yet.

If he could stay healthy maybe he could develop into a Cody Franson type player. But he missed way to many games to be trusted as anything more than a 8/9D

Is Lilly a finished product?

Same draft.

Your entitled to your factually wrong and short sighted opinion. He was injured a lot with a knee injury, and early on it was concussions, it was never performance issues.


Look at how many pro games he has played. Start there. Lily has way more pro experience.

He has a ton of developing left. Regardless of your opinion

Yours is an opinion just like mine, but your pretending for some reason it isn't

There is no way of knowing if an opinion is factually correct at the moment, we will see over the next year and half if he develops into anything

Lilijgren again is a better player, who has two full seasons basically as a 5D on a contending team, not a guy who wasnt good enough for multiple orgs

Playing pro games is a sign that your capable, lilijgren was productive at the AHL level and continued to progress

Timmins is a walk bandaid and has seen his development stunted. He isn't lukely to ever recover from those missed years

Similar to a guy like Stuart Percy was for us.

We only got him b/c he was injury prone. If he was able to develop he would have been on Colorado still. Looking back what he was back in 2018-2020 is now irrelevent and does 't hold value in discussing his contribution and capabilities for the upcoming year

 

[ACC1224]

We'll see if he becomes nothing of note then comparisons are correct and fans will have to accept he isnt anything to worry over

It’ll be injuries that will have prevented him from making it not lack of ability. Your comparisons were always long shots and didn’t have the ability.

 

[hamzarocks]

It’ll be injuries that will have prevented him from making it not lack of ability. Your comparisons were always long shots and didn’t have the ability.

Leivo had similar injuries, he was projecting to do well before he missed a bunch of games.

Even became a near 40 pt player on the nucks then tore his ACL

Maybe Stuart Percy from the leafs is a better comp. He was looking good and trending well his first 3 years. Then he had injuries, his weaknesses never improved

Timmins in a similar boat. Injuries, didnt imporove defensively nor skating and it likely cost him a career as a Cody Franson type top 4D with better longeivty

 

[Americanadian]

…., because history is any player we trade to an opponent becomes an All-Star any and every time we play them.

Having said that, we are clearly going to lose Jones if he’s exposed, so get the best deal you can and whatever happens later happens later….

I'll take my chances. Jones can play well against the Leafs but he'll still be a below average goalie for the lightning this season thus benefitting the Leafs in the long-run.

 

[Legion34]

Is Lilly a finished product?

Same draft.

Your entitled to your factually wrong and short sighted opinion. He was injured a lot with a knee injury, and early on it was concussions, it was never performance issues.


Look at how many pro games he has played. Start there. Lily has way more pro experience.

He has a ton of developing left. Regardless of your opinion

?????? You are going way overboard on this guy.

It was never performance issues? He played 8 min a night for 2 games for the coyotes and was traded.

He was a scratch here. You get scratched for performance issues.

And the vast majority of players are finished products in terms of raw tools (skating/shooting) by 25. Positioning/reads take longer.

I don’t think anyone reasonably expects Lilly to develop a harder shot or substantially better foot speed. Sandin got traded because he couldn’t.

It’s rare to do that.

Also. Injuries don’t actually help development. Not being able to play a full season by 25 because of injury/performance is not a good sign.

Timmins has 1.1 x2 contract. That’s a substantial cost for a bubble NHL player.

I would be surprised if he got claimed.

It looks like a lot of Timmins level D may get through.

 

[Americanadian]

I would claim Harkins for the Gregor spot. He is an above average 4th liner.

 

[Shak19]

I like a trio of Lafferty-Kampf-Gregor on the 4th line. Lots of speed on the wings and Kampf is elite defender to take on opponents top line and defensive end draws.

 

[hockeywiz542]

McGuire: Three Atlantic Teams In On Kane; Bruins One Of Them?

Are the Boston Bruins once again in on the Patrick Kane sweepstakes Part Deux? The Boston Bruins were linked to longtime Chicago Blackhawks winger and future Hall of Famer Patrick Kane heading into the 2023 NHL Trade Deadline until about ten days before Kane ultimately waived his no-trade clause...

bostonhockeynow.com

According to longtime NHL analyst and former NHL executive Pierre McGuire, there are three Atlantic Division teams in on the Patrick Kane sweepstakes. In his regular TSN 690 (Montreal) segment on Thursday, McGuire was asked by co-host Jon Still if he thinks Kane would be a fit with his hometown team, the Buffalo Sabres.

“He’d be an amazing fit anywhere as long as he’s healthy because when he went to the Rangers, he wasn’t healthy,” Pierre McGuire said. “He still has game left. The one guy he really influenced a lot when he was in Chicago was Alex DeBrincat, and DeBrincat’s now in Detroit. I would say that you add him to a team that’s got DeBrincat, [Dylan] Larkin, [Lucas] Raymond, and David Perron, J.T. Compher, who came over from Colorado; you add Patrick Kane to that offensive arsenal that they’re starting to build in Detroit, he could make a massive difference.”

“One thing that I think people have over-looked when he was a kid growing up in Buffalo before he went to the London Knights, he went and played in Detroit for Honeybaked, he lived at Pat Verbeek’s house. ” McGuire pointed out. “Now, Pat’s obviously the general manager in Anaheim, but he lived at Pat’s house, and I know he got to know Steve Yzerman pretty well. So, I could see that being a fit in Detroit. I could see Buffalo being a fit, and I could see Toronto being a fit. I could see all three of those cities being a fit.”

On Friday morning, Boston Hockey Now reached out to McGuire to ask what he’s hearing about the Boston Bruins and Kane. From the sounds of it, the NHL betting odds at CasinoCanada on the Bruins signing Kane are low.

“Hard to think that he would come to Boston. They are a team that is going into a mini rebuild,” McGuire wrote back in a text.

But McGuire also added that Kane’s health is still an issue.

“Kane needs to be healthy to help anyone,” said McGuire.

 

[SprDaVE]

Kane to Buffalo makes a lot of sense. I guess how they do early in the season season will determine a lot of that.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Bertuzzi-Matthews-Marner
Domi-JT-88
Knies-Minten-Lafferty
Gregor-Kampf-Reaves

 

[Fogelhund]

""

On waivers today.

Placed:
#ANA

Glenn Gawdin

#ARI
Travis Barron
Cam Crotty
Jan Jenik
Steven Kampfer
Justin Kirkland
John Leonard
Ryan McGregor
Matt Villata

#BOS
Kyle Keyser

#CGY
Clark Bishop
Oscar Dansk
Ben Jones
Colton Poolman

#COL
Wyatt Aamodt
Corey Schueneman

#DAL
Gavin Bayreuther
Nick Caamano
Fredrik Karlström
Derrick Pouliot

#FLA
Rasmus Asplund
Lucas Carlsson
Gerald Mayhew

#NJD
Kyle Criscuolo

#PHI
Louis Belpedio
Adam Brooks
Rhett Gardner
Cooper Marody
Victor Mete

'"

 

[The Iceman]

Kane will not be eligible for performance bonuses. He's not an ELC player. He did not spend over 100 days on the IR last season. And he did not turn 35 before )une 30 of this year. In the latter 2 situations, performance bonuses are only available on one-year contracts.

I do not know, but I have heard TV heads say if Kane signs a contract after his 35th birthday he is eligible for a performance bonus contract.

 

[Fogelhund]

I do not know, but I have heard TV heads say if Kane signs a contract after his 35th birthday he is eligible for a performance bonus contract.

Talking heads get things wrong all the time.

What is a Performance Bonus?​

A Performance Bonus can be given to a player in addition to their salary. Performance bonuses are only paid to the player if they meet the requirements as defined by the bonus. Performance bonuses count against the salary cap; however, a team can exceed the salary cap due to performance bonuses by the maximum performance bonus cushion amount of 7.5 percent of the upper limit. Not all players are eligible for Performance Bonuses, and to receive a bonus within their contract, a player must meet one of the following criteria:

1. The player is on an entry-level contract.
2. The player has signed a one-year contract and is over 35 years old.
3. The player has signed a one-year contract after returning from a long-term injury (has played 400 or more games, and spent 100 or more days on the Injured Reserve in the last year of their most recent contract).

What is a 35-plus contract?​

A contract is designated a 35+ contract if the players age on the first year of the contract is 35 or older (as of June 30 prior to the year of the effective contract).

35+ contracts that are two years in length or longer and:
1. Have a signing bonus in the 2nd or later year, OR
2. Are front-loaded
Will not benefit from a reduced cap hit regardless of the players location of play, termination, retired status, or a buyout. This rule was introduced by the NHL to prevent teams from backloading contracts past when the player was expected to retire. An exception to this rule is that a team will receive a $100,000 cap hit reduction if the player is on the 2nd or later year of the contract and assigned to the minors

 

[TheGroceryStick]

I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again.
If we can upgrade on Brodie (ideally keeping him too), downgrade on Nylander (3rd line C) AND sign Kane with some of the cap savings - were in an unreal spot.

Knies-Matthews-Kane
Bertuzzi-Tavares-Marner
Domi-_____-Jarnkrok(maybe move depending on cap)
Gregor-Kampf-Lafferty
Reaves

Rielly-____
Brodie-Klingberg
McCabe-Liljgren
Giordano

 

[kb]

I do not know, but I have heard TV heads say if Kane signs a contract after his 35th birthday he is eligible for a performance bonus contract.

They are incorrect. 35 and over contracts are only eligible to players who are 35 as of June 30. When the contract is signed has zero bearing.

Which leads me to a pet peeve of mine (not specifically related to this post). Why do people listen to or watch talking heads in this day and age? Most would be in the bottom 20% of most knowledgeable posters on this board, they just happen to know someone.

I cut cable 8 years ago, and it has been glorious not to have narratives/propaganda shoved down my throat on any subject at every turn.

 

[notDatsyuk]

I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again.
If we can upgrade on Brodie (ideally keeping him too), downgrade on Nylander (3rd line C) AND sign Kane with some of the cap savings - were in an unreal spot.

Knies-Matthews-Kane
Bertuzzi-Tavares-Marner
Domi-_____-Jarnkrok(maybe move depending on cap)
Gregor-Kampf-Lafferty
Reaves

Rielly-____
Brodie-Klingberg
McCabe-Liljgren
Giordano

If you downgrade Nylander for a 3C, that means you have to use JT at 2C again, and that's not a good idea. You're weakening the second line, and if you move Marner down to compensate you're weakening the top line too.

 

[horner]

If Minten makes this team which at this point I would be shocked if he didn't.
Add Gregor and Holmberg.

Treliving could trade
Jamcrock and Lafferty

Start fixing the defence