Trades and Free Agency - 2022-23 Season Edition

[Punch Drunk Loov]

Sign ZAR to a contract

 

[Fogelhund]

Does that take him right into FA?

That could be a disaster in my opinion



I thought it was other way around. If you get terms you take less money
Nylander contract is also now 4 years. Not really comparable as market value has changed

No, Robertson is a RFA at the end of his contract.

Maybe if it's a one year contract, versus three, it's more for shorter... but four will be lower than six, seven, eight, especially when you are talking a RFA and buying UFA years. Market value is always the same, just look at % of cap hit, not absolute dollars.

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

I read that too and assumed I was misunderstanding. Did he say Jason Robertson will likely be as close to being as good as Auston Matthews?

This reminds me of the time somebody thought Anthony Duclair was more likely to continue scoring goals than Matthews when he had that hot start in Ottawa because he was playing a more "complete game" and then he proceeded to score like 3 goals the rest of the season.

Or when Vancouver fans wouldn't trade Boeser for Matthews after his rookie year.

Good player, good goal scorer, not close to that tier.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Robertson only needs to increase his peak season goalscoring by a tiny 50% to tie Matthews assuming Matthews stagnates from here on out.

 

[LeafChief]

40 goals in year two for a team that scored 6 more goals then the Sabers. But keep on with your idiocy solely because the stars didn't get dicked on the contract

Okay! Way to go man!

 

[Martin Skoula]

40 goals in year two for a team that scored 6 more goals then the Sabers.

The Sabres had Thompson put up 38 in 78, is he basically Matthews too? He also signed for cheaper and longer than Robertson and is a 6'7 center to boot. Probably a better comparison than Nylander no?

 

[LeafChief]

The Sabres had Thompson put up 38 in 78, is he basically Matthews too? He also signed for cheaper and longer than Robertson and is a 6'7 center to boot. Probably a better comparison than Nylander no?

Yes. He's as good as Matthews too.

Elias Lindholm and Filip Forsberg are also pretty much Auston Matthews. Roope Hintz too.

 

[Fogelhund]

We're losing our 1/2/4 LWs as it stands next year.

We are losing our 1/2/4 LW's next year? Can you please provide a link where the club says all of these guys are going? Is this fantasy or something?

We don't even know yet what ZAR will sign for, or the term... it might be for longer.

If management thought they were that strong we wouldn't have spent the off season collecting league min guys to see which 3/4 stick instead of giving them an opportunity. You also wouldn't see reports about us not waiving Simmonds.

So you think Robertson isn't being given an opportunity? You do realize that Knies is in the NCAA, and won't be here until near the end of the year... nothing to do with opportunity. Amirov of course the health, but hopefully he'll be playing for the Marlies by year end, to see what we have there. Holmberg is being given the opportunity. Hirvonen is still in Europe, but he'll be given a shot next year.

That's called looking down the highway, being able to see ahead. It's nothing about strength, it's about prospect development and when they are likely to be ready. It's highly probable, that if they are all healthy, two to four of these names will be on the roster next year... maybe not as LW, but they will likely be in the lineup.

We have a 12-17 ranked prospect pool which is great given the situation we've been in and where our regular season has ended placement wise and how that relates to picks.

But let's not act like they're a group guarantee to have one get 60+ points next season. We got lucky with bunting and it was a great pick up but even he wasn't signed to be the top line guy at the start.

To get 60 points with Matthews and Marner... you have to be good.. but not great. Hyman's pace his last two years was 60 points, Bunting did 60 points.... anyone competent will put up 60 points with them.

Yes, it's too early to pencil any of these guys into the lineup, but it's also too early to dismiss them, or jump to conclusions. You wait this season, to see what you have in everyone, before making future choices. If it looks highly probable that your ELC guys will be good enough, you don't tie up big dollars in long-term contracts there. If there is uncertainty, but promise.. you might go shorter term. If it doesn't look good, then you are going to have to retain what you've got.... but it's still preseason, not the time to worry about next year, when we lack the full information we need. But we do have potentially very strong LW prospects, that should be challenging to be on the team for next year, or already cemented their positions.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Yes. He's as good as Matthews too.

Elias Lindholm and Filip Forsberg are also pretty much Auston Matthews. Roope Hintz too.

Heck, Debrincat did it even younger than Robertson in a worse and lower scoring environment.

They're going to have to make like 15 Hart trophies next year when they all tie for league MVP.

 

[zeke]

.
To get 60 points with Matthews and Marner... you have to be good.. but not great. Hyman's pace his last two years was 60 points, Bunting did 60 points.... anyone competent will put up 60 points with them.

For the record Hyman was a ~50pt pace guy at even strength the past couple years here, while Bunting was at a 60pt pace at even strength.

Also, that line performed much better in all defensive and possession metrics with Bunting than it ever did with Hyman.

 

[Fogelhund]

For the record Hyman was a ~50pt pace guy at even strength the past couple years here, while Bunting was at a 60pt pace at even strength.

Also, that line performed much better in all defensive and possession metrics with Bunting than it ever did with Hyman.

2020/21 Hyman 33 points in 43 games. 33/43x82 = 62.9 points pace
2019/20 Hyman 37 points in 51 games 37/51x82 = 59.49 points pace

I never claimed even strength or not. I like Bunting more than Hyman, but the point was, all you have to be is good to get 60 point pace, with two stars of the game on your line.

Yes they did perform better in defensive and possession metrics, but you can't attribute that to solely Bunting can you? It appeared to me, that both Matthews and Marner worked very hard at rounding their games... Bunting helped, sure.

 

[zeke]

2020/21 Hyman 33 points in 43 games. 33/43x82 = 62.9 points pace
2019/20 Hyman 37 points in 51 games 37/51x82 = 59.49 points pace

Yes they did perform better in defensive and possession metrics, but you can't attribute that to solely Bunting can you? It appeared to me, that both Matthews and Marner worked very hard at rounding their games... Bunting helped, sure.

Even Strength

Hyman Prev 2yrs: 51pt pace
Bunting Last year: 60pt pace


Though we should probably look at 5v5 to really get a sense of how they did on that line.

5v5

Hyman Prev 2yrs: 41pt pace
Bunting Last Year: 60pt pace

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

One low key thing I love about Bunting is that he doesn't give a f*** about being the opposition's friend.

Too many nice guys in our lineup. Bunts brings a lot of vitriol and a lot of swagger.

 

[Fogelhund]

Even Strength

Hyman Prev 2yrs: 51pt pace
Bunting Last year: 60pt pace


Though we should probably look at 5v5 to really get a sense of how they did on that line.

5v5

Hyman Prev 2yrs: 41pt pace
Bunting Last Year: 60pt pace

They both had 60 point pace though. Hyman proved to be more useful on the PP than Bunting has so far... Splitting hairs here though.

 

[Voodoo Child]

Hyman and Bunting have different strengths.

Hyman is bigger and better at grinding it out in the rough areas and getting the puck to guys, and has a heavier shot.

Bunting is more of a Marchand-esque agitator with better playmaking chops and higher hockey IQ.

Hyman is more than three years older as well.

And, he’s had more troubles with injuries. We all remember Edler’s dirty knee-on-knee, but he also had a similar knee injury that caused him to miss 19 games at the start of 19-20. His style of play means more injuries in the future for him.

It would have been great to keep him but 5.5/7? He’s gonna become a problem sooner than later.

 

[zeke]

They both had 60 point pace though. Hyman proved to be more useful on the PP than Bunting has so far... Splitting hairs here though.

they did, but as a part of that top line Bunting was significantly more productive.

but it wasn't just the PP that made the difference.

Hyman last 2yrs vs Bunting last year

5v5

Hyman: 94gms, 21gls, 47pts (82gms, 18gls, 41pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 21gls, 58pts (82gms, 22gls, 60pts)

Power Play

Hyman: 94gms, 6gls, 11pts (82gms, 5gls, 10pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 2gls, 5pts (82gms, 2gls, 5pts)

Empty Net:

Hyman: 94gms, 6gls, 8pts (82gms, 5gls, 7pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 0gls, 0pts (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)

Penalty Kill

Hyman: 94gms, 1gls, 1pts (82gms, 1gls, 1pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 0gls, 0ps (82gms, 0gls, 0pts - didn't play the PK)

 

[Fogelhund]

they did, but as a part of that top line Bunting was significantly more productive.

but it wasn't just the PP that made the difference.

Hyman last 2yrs vs Bunting last year

5v5

Hyman: 94gms, 21gls, 47pts (82gms, 18gls, 41pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 21gls, 58pts (82gms, 22gls, 60pts)

Power Play

Hyman: 94gms, 6gls, 11pts (82gms, 5gls, 10pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 2gls, 5pts (82gms, 2gls, 5pts)

Empty Net:

Hyman: 94gms, 6gls, 8pts (82gms, 5gls, 7pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 0gls, 0pts (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)

Penalty Kill

Hyman: 94gms, 1gls, 1pts (82gms, 1gls, 1pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 0gls, 0ps (82gms, 0gls, 0pts - didn't play the PK)

Like I said, splitting hairs... bottom line, is that Matthews and Marner are the key guys there. Hyman and Bunting are complimentary players.

 

[WTFMAN99]

He had 45 points in 51 games and then 79 in 74 with 40 goals

Hes also signed to only one year less then AM

He's at a minimum between nylander and AM as a player and will likely be close to being as good as AM will.

This is a great deal

A friend of mine pointed out the shortened season that pro-rates to 72-73 points.

1.5 years and big cheddar now, I guess it is what it is these days.

 

[ToneDog]

they did, but as a part of that top line Bunting was significantly more productive.

but it wasn't just the PP that made the difference.

Hyman last 2yrs vs Bunting last year

5v5

Hyman: 94gms, 21gls, 47pts (82gms, 18gls, 41pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 21gls, 58pts (82gms, 22gls, 60pts)

Power Play

Hyman: 94gms, 6gls, 11pts (82gms, 5gls, 10pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 2gls, 5pts (82gms, 2gls, 5pts)

Empty Net:

Hyman: 94gms, 6gls, 8pts (82gms, 5gls, 7pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 0gls, 0pts (82gms, 0gls, 0pts)

Penalty Kill

Hyman: 94gms, 1gls, 1pts (82gms, 1gls, 1pts)
Bunting: 79gms, 0gls, 0ps (82gms, 0gls, 0pts - didn't play the PK)

So Bunting will be more unaffordable next year than Hyman was last year ?? Perhaps we should play him with Kampf and Kubel.

 

[zeke]

Like I said, splitting hairs... bottom line, is that Matthews and Marner are the key guys there. Hyman and Bunting are complimentary players.

I mean....a 40pt pace vs a 60pt pace on that line isn't really "splitting hairs". That's a huge difference.

 

[rocketman588]

A friend of mine pointed out the shortened season that pro-rates to 72-73 points.

1.5 years and big cheddar now, I guess it is what it is these days.

I think looking at comparables they did pretty well

Also still having team control at the end is a positive not a negative imo

 

[zeke]

So Bunting will be more unaffordable next year than Hyman was last year ??

could be. Though those western canadian teams that love to give huge money to our crappy leafs players don't have any more capspace next year to sign him to that so maybe not.

but if Bunting continues what he did last year i'd say a) he's worth more to us than Hyman was, and b) I suspect he's a little more appreciate of the leafs than Hyman was.

 

[rocketman588]

I mean....a 40pt pace vs a 60pt pace on that line isn't really "splitting hairs". That's a huge difference.

I think it is very much a skill to be able to keep up with and read the game with that level of a player

See Ritchie and Jumbo

could be. Though those western canadian teams that love to give huge money to our crappy leafs players don't have any more capspace next year to sign him to that so maybe not.

but if Bunting continues what he did last year i'd say a) he's worth more to us than Hyman was, and b) I suspect he's a little more appreciate of the leafs than Hyman was.

Much like jack this might be his one shot at getting paid

I wouldn't fault him for it

 

[WTFMAN99]

I think looking at comparables they did pretty well

Also still having team control at the end is a positive not a negative imo

Those tax laws coming through as an advantage again.

 

[Fogelhund]

""

Lias Andersson (LA) Former 7th OA, and just can't stick in the NHL. That 2017 draft just wasn't very good overall.