Trades and Free Agency - 2022/2023 Trade Deadline Edition

[SprDaVE]

We need a big bruising defensive dman that blocks shots and keeps the front clear.

Philly, Montreal, Islanders and the Blue Jackets are top 5 in the league in blocked shots. The Leafs are ahead of the Bruins and Lightning in blocked shots. I think they are fine here. The Hurricanes, probably seen as one of the best defensive teams in the league around here, are dead last in blocked shots by a lot.

"Keeps the front clear" is such a vague statement that doesn't really make sense to me. Who fits this and does a good job defensively?

 

[MarMarSab3]

Upgrading the bottom pair marginally doesn't make sense to me, the hope would be to add a top 4 guy to bump Gio to 3rd pair, gavrikov, kulikov, McCabe don't do that.

I'm ok rolling Sandin, Holl, Benn, Timmons on the 3rd pair, to spend assets for marginal improvement seems pointless. Upgrading 2LD and bumping Gio down to 3LD is much better

 

[TMLAM34]

Moving so many draft picks in the ROR deal, I think it takes us out of any Chychrun possibility.

Gavrikov would be interesting, I’d even be willing to move someone like Niemela if Gavrikov would sign an extension but all reports indicate he’s heading to UFA.

That basically leaves McCabe and Orlov (If the Caps stay on the outside looking in). Both defenceman would be an upgrade on Sandin or Giordano on the left side.

Upgrading the bottom pair marginally doesn't make sense to me, the hope would be to add a top 4 guy to bump Gio to 3rd pair, gavrikov, kulikov, McCabe don't do that.

I'm ok rolling Sandin, Holl, Benn, Timmons on the 3rd pair, to spend assets for marginal improvement seems pointless. Upgrading 2LD and bumping Gio down to 3LD is much better

Gavrikov, McCabe or potentially Orlov definitely bump Sandin/Giordano down to the third pair. Any of those guy would form a good shutdown pair to play with Brodie.

 

[MarMarSab3]

Moving so many draft picks in the ROR deal, I think it takes us out of any Chychrun possibility.

Gavrikov would be interesting, I’d even be willing to move someone like Niemela if Gavrikov would sign an extension but all reports indicate he’s heading to UFA.

That basically leaves McCabe and Orlov (If the Caps stay on the outside looking in). Both defenceman would be an upgrade on Sandin or Giordano on the left side.


Gavrikov, McCabe or potentially Orlov definitely bump Sandin/Giordano down to the third pair. Any of those guy would form a good shutdown pair to play with Brodie.

Orlov definitely, McCabe and Gavrikov I don't see as that great of an improvement, Gavrikov seems to be flavor of the month and those guys always scare me, sometimes the devil you know is better then the devil you don't.

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

Moving so many draft picks in the ROR deal, I think it takes us out of any Chychrun possibility.

Gavrikov would be interesting, I’d even be willing to move someone like Niemela if Gavrikov would sign an extension but all reports indicate he’s heading to UFA.

That basically leaves McCabe and Orlov (If the Caps stay on the outside looking in). Both defenceman would be an upgrade on Sandin or Giordano on the left side.


Gavrikov, McCabe or potentially Orlov definitely bump Sandin/Giordano down to the third pair. Any of those guy would form a good shutdown pair to play with Brodie.

after not giving up a significant prospect in the ROR deal, giving up Niemela for a MUCH worse player in Gavrikov would be terrible value.

Gavrikov plays a shutdown role but he hasn't been good at it this year. Yes his team is terrible but you would think at least his isolated value would look good given the prices we are talking about.

He certainly wouldn't bw bumping Gio/Lily/Holl down the lineup

 

[Leafed]

I wonder what it'd take to get Ekholm or McDonaugh retained. McD was traded for negative value in the summer so a retention deal shouldn't be astronomical.

 

[SprDaVE]

I wonder what it'd take to get Ekholm or McDonaugh retained. McD was traded for negative value in the summer so a retention deal shouldn't be astronomical.

There's no way Nashville retains on either for 3 more seasons.

 

[Dreakmur]

That comment speaks to your dislike of Holl, your appreciation of Liljegren, but still leaves a hole in our D. That hole has to be filled. Are you comfortable with Timmins or Benn? I'm not, at least if the hope is winning. For me that means we have to pay to get someone else. What price are you willing to pay and for whom?

I’m as comfortable with Timmins and Benn as I am with Holl.

 

[nuck]

There's no way Nashville retains on either for 3 more seasons.

I believe Muzzins update is this week. They may not need retention beyond this year.

 

[Peace Frog]

Still want Dubas to pull off another big, unexpected move to really put this team over the top. More, more, more!!! Lol

 

[Judas Tavares]

I also don't see too many options on the blue line. Chychrun is likely unrealistic. McCabe and Gavrikov don't move the needle enough, especially at the asking price. Really unsure of who would be out there right now that would be available. Right after the ROR deal I sensed there would be another medium-ish deal, but at this point my sense is there would only be a small depth move.

 

[TMLAM34]

after not giving up a significant prospect in the ROR deal, giving up Niemela for a MUCH worse player in Gavrikov would be terrible value.

Gavrikov plays a shutdown role but he hasn't been good at it this year. Yes his team is terrible but you would think at least his isolated value would look good given the prices we are talking about.

He certainly wouldn't bw bumping Gio/Lily/Holl down the lineup

The only player that you mentioned that I said he’d bump down is Gio, another being Sandin. I know he wouldn’t bump down Holl or Liljegren.

 

[Rob Brown]

I also don't see too many options on the blue line. Chychrun is likely unrealistic. McCabe and Gavrikov don't move the needle enough, especially at the asking price. Really unsure of who would be out there right now that would be available. Right after the ROR deal I sensed there would be another medium-ish deal, but at this point my sense is there would only be a small depth move.

Yeah I'm thinking it'll be more of a depth move as well.

Mayfield is a UFA and if the Isles are going to miss then maybe they look to move him. Not sure if he fits into their long term plans but he'd be a decent add - RHD, physical etc.

I'd like Orlov as well but I'd imagine the Caps will re-sign him.

 

[SprDaVE]

 

[SprDaVE]

Yeah I'm thinking it'll be more of a depth move as well.

Mayfield is a UFA and if the Isles are going to miss then maybe they look to move him. Not sure if he fits into their long term plans but he'd be a decent add - RHD, physical etc.

I'd like Orlov as well but I'd imagine the Caps will re-sign him.

Leafs are in a weird spot with their defense. It's very strong already in terms of depth. Any sort of move has to be about quality.

Not sure I see the Leafs trading for a "depth" defenseman, unless of course there's a big injury in the next couple weeks.

Leafs in theory could waive Benn and put him in AHL purgatory just like Simmonds if they acquire someone without removing any of their regulars. Once the playoffs start, you can bring them up since there are no roster size or cap. But if they do that... who sits for the new guy? Or are they just press box material at which point... why bother with another press box guy?

 

[Rob Brown]

Leafs are in a weird spot with their defense. It's very strong already in terms of depth. Any sort of move has to be about quality.

Not sure I see the Leafs trading for a "depth" defenseman, unless of course there's a big injury in the next couple weeks.

Leafs in theory could waive Benn and put him in AHL purgatory just like Simmonds if they acquire someone without removing any of their regulars.

Agreed, I just don’t see Kyle dropping a ton more assets on a big fish D, so if we do anything it’ll be more depth.

 

[showtime8]

Leafs are in a weird spot with their defense. It's very strong already in terms of depth. Any sort of move has to be about quality.

Not sure I see the Leafs trading for a "depth" defenseman, unless of course there's a big injury in the next couple weeks.

Leafs in theory could waive Benn and put him in AHL purgatory just like Simmonds if they acquire someone without removing any of their regulars. Once the playoffs start, you can bring them up since there are no roster size or cap. But if they do that... who sits for the new guy? Or are they just press box material at which point... why bother with another press box guy?

Yeah, it seems like they have a lot of viable options for that 3rd pairing. The point that you made about quality has to be the focus.

In a 7 game series, if the bottom pairing is going to be Giordano & one of Holl/Benn/Timmins etc. then I think you'll be okay and that's why you have to focus on that 2nd pairing.

Ultimately, I think Sandin is the guy that is traded if anything happens. You like his ability to move the puck, but I think I'd be concerned with having him defend below the hashmarks.

 

[SprDaVE]

Yeah, it seems like they have a lot of viable options for that 3rd pairing. The point that you made about quality has to be the focus.

In a 7 game series, if the bottom pairing is going to be Giordano & one of Holl/Benn/Timmins etc. then I think you'll be okay and that's why you have to focus on that 2nd pairing.

Ultimately, I think Sandin is the guy that is traded if anything happens. You like his ability to move the puck, but I think I'd be concerned with having him defend below the hashmarks.

I can probably agree to a certain degree but Sandin and Liljegren have been one of the best bottom pairings in the entire league. If you do pull the trigger on replacing Sandin, it has to be someone really damn good and locked up. Sandin's value can't be seen as low at all in this.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Nice energy player but doesn’t seem like a fit with the acquisition of Acciari

 

[showtime8]

I can probably agree to a certain degree but Sandin and Liljegren have been one of the best bottom pairings in the entire league. If you do pull the trigger on replacing Sandin, it has to be someone really damn good. Sandin's value can't be seen as low at all in this.

Okay, so then here in lies the problem that I see.

Do you trust Giordano - Holl to be your 2nd pairing? Personally, I don't. I think Holl continues to be exposed and I'm not sure that I want another 7 games and then he walks out the door for nothing.

I don't think Dubas has the stones to move him either. They held steadfast in protecting him against the expansion draft and he continues to be a part of the top 4.

That's why I think if there is a major upgrade, it will be Sandin traded.

 

[VanW27]

Philly, Montreal, Islanders and the Blue Jackets are top 5 in the league in blocked shots. The Leafs are ahead of the Bruins and Lightning in blocked shots. I think they are fine here. The Hurricanes, probably seen as one of the best defensive teams in the league around here, are dead last in blocked shots by a lot.

"Keeps the front clear" is such a vague statement that doesn't really make sense to me. Who fits this and does a good job defensively?

Blocked shots is a difficult thing to assign a worth to based purely amount of blocks. Bad teams block more shots than good teams because they give up more shots and spend more time in the defensive zone. But that doesn't mean shot blocking isn't important for good teams, they just don't need to do it as often.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

 

[Peace Frog]

Blocking shots is good and all, but imo, I’d rather see the forward on the PK, getting into the shooting lanes quickly enough that the defencemen won’t bother shooting.

I just cringe when I see a dman setting up to block a shot. Last thing I want to see is a guy blocking a shot and then getting injured and being out for a lengthy period of time.

Clear the path and let the goalie see the shot. If he can see it, he should be able to stop it!

 

[OVO16]

Dont see us trading picks for players anymore. Player for player is what I think will happen.

Kerfoot + Dahlstrom for Soucy?

 

[SprDaVE]

Okay, so then here in lies the problem that I see.

Do you trust Giordano - Holl to be your 2nd pairing? Personally, I don't. I think Holl continues to be exposed and I'm not sure that I want another 7 games and then he walks out the door for nothing.

I don't think Dubas has the stones to move him either. They held steadfast in protecting him against the expansion draft and he continues to be a part of the top 4.

That's why I think if there is a major upgrade, it will be Sandin traded.

I don't see why you'd have a problem trusting with Giordano and Holl. They've been steady the entire year. Let's not forget the minutes Holl plays and the quality he faces, and he generally does well. He doesn't get caved and doesn't get dummied. He makes mistakes and he ain't perfect but I can promise you whoever you want to replace him will make mistakes just the same.

There isn't a single defenseman available right now that is an upgrade on Holl as a RHD. Chychrun is a LHD that can ***maybe*** play RD... maybe. And Coyotes are asking the world for him. So while in a perfect world you'd have all these perfect pieces available and easy to grab, they just aren't.

This also goes for Sandin, who's value for some reason is relatively low around here but if they were part of another team it would be different. It's crazy how much people put on top of Sandin just to try to get Chychrun.

Blocked shots is a difficult thing to assign a worth to based purely amount of blocks. Bad teams block more shots than good teams because they give up more shots and spend more time in the defensive zone. But that doesn't mean shot blocking isn't important for good teams, they just don't need to do it as often.

Pretty much. So why bother with shot blocking, when it's already something the Leafs do well, and not focus on a much more important part of the equation?