Speculation: Trade Rumors/Speculation Thread Part V: Zib-a-dabba-do

[Dorado*]

For me the issue with Del Zotto has always been his bonehead plays not his horrible pinches. I get it Del Zotto has an offensive minded attitude (something Ranger fans want and the coaching staff wants out of him). That doesn't change the fact the kid hasn't progressed and is still making bonehead plays like trying to dangle someone when he's the last player to the goalie, making horrendous cross ice passes that often get intercepted, and leaving his guy open in front of the net. Michael Del Zotto has had all 3 happen this season and he makes the most mistakes on the blue line. His hockey IQ that was raved about when he came up has regressed instead of progressed. With Connor Allen and Dylan McIlrath getting ready to become NHL caliber and Del Zotto becoming a RFA this season, I think the Rangers need to move him now.

For people talking about a blockbuster package trade, that'll change the whole team, why? I'd much rather do a straight up for straight up trade like:

Chris Neil and a pick for Del Zotto OR
Wayne Simmonds for Del Zotto and a pick OR
Del Zotto and a pick for Yakupov.

Anything like this is more ideal for the Rangers.

if you could get Siimmonds straight up fpr DEl Zotto straight up you do it . Not sure about the cap ramifications but a player like Simmonds is exactly what the NYR need , big , athletic , tough , good in tight . NYR need to get faster , bigger and more athletic .

 

[NYR Viper]

I would like Jared Cowen in our organization. At the expense of Del Zotto?--I don't know.

They are two different kinds of d-men. Cowen would add a physicality to the back line somewhat equal to Falk only he's a better player with pretty decent upside to get even better. It would still leave us lacking a d-man who can qb a pwp. OTOH Del Zotto has been doing a piss poor job of that pretty much since his rookie season and McDonagh (who never ever really got much pwp time in previous years) has pushed him out of that.

I would like a little more than Cowen for DZ--but actually my preference in the first place would be for a forward. To be honest I think you add to Del Zotto to get Zibanejad. OTOH Lazar is an interesting player--but Ottawa adds to him because Lazer does nothing for us now. That's if we're doing something with those guys.

Cowen is another LD and another defensive d-man.

I think the idea is that McIlrath is close to ready on the right side. They like McDonagh, Girardi, Staal, Moore and Stralman. Where does everyone play?

It needs to be a young power forward (something the organization lacks outside of Kreider).

 

[NYR Viper]

if you could get Siimmonds straight up fpr DEl Zotto straight up you do it . Not sure about the cap ramifications but a player like Simmonds is exactly what the NYR need , big , athletic , tough , good in tight . NYR need to get faster , bigger and more athletic .

Not sure I do that straight up. Maybe. I think I would rather Schenn. Younger, more skill, can play LW or C, which are needs.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

I think Del Zotto looking like "he got the death penalty" is the telling symptom of the real problem - his mental game and especially his resiliency.

He has always been a player who rides the roller coaster of emotion up and down. His good stretches are very good. At times great. But he gets in funks that just look impossible to break - sometimes lasting for shifts, other times games, other times chunks of seasons. "Maybe he needs a new coach or a fresh start" - isnt that what he had this season? I seem to remember him embracing it in the summer. Cant always be waiting for an out, at some point you need to internalize it.

Maybe that's a maturity thing and the Rangers will regret moving him. Maybe it's a personality thing and the time to strike is now.

 

[NYR Viper]

For me the issue with Del Zotto has always been his bonehead plays not his horrible pinches. I get it Del Zotto has an offensive minded attitude (something Ranger fans want and the coaching staff wants out of him). That doesn't change the fact the kid hasn't progressed and is still making bonehead plays like trying to dangle someone when he's the last player to the goalie, making horrendous cross ice passes that often get intercepted, and leaving his guy open in front of the net. Michael Del Zotto has had all 3 happen this season and he makes the most mistakes on the blue line. His hockey IQ that was raved about when he came up has regressed instead of progressed. With Connor Allen and Dylan McIlrath getting ready to become NHL caliber and Del Zotto becoming a RFA this season, I think the Rangers need to move him now.

For people talking about a blockbuster package trade, that'll change the whole team, why? I'd much rather do a straight up for straight up trade like:

Chris Neil and a pick for Del Zotto OR
Wayne Simmonds for Del Zotto and a pick OR
Del Zotto and a pick for Yakupov.

Anything like this is more ideal for the Rangers.

I like the last (2). If they can find a Chris Neil type that is younger, around 24-25, I would jump at that in a heartbeat. Neil is too old.

 

[Dorado*]

Not sure I do that straight up. Maybe. I think I would rather Schenn. Younger, more skill, can play LW or C, which are needs.

i like this also B schenn has much needed size at Center . Im not one of your garden variety Boyle haters as long as he is used as what he is a 4th line center or wing who is good at blocking shots and PK and winning FOs. His lack of skating and athleticism is problematic against and with faster skating players but his pluses are on par with his minuses .
Im ready to move away from Brassard . NYR need to replace him with a center with size and physicality that can win faceoffs and score . Step , Richards and Brass as your top 3 C is not physically competitive enough .

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Somehow I don't think Neil/pick for Del Zotto makes sense if you can get Yakupov for DZ/pick...

 

[JohnC]

And in 4 years he'll only be 27!

Can confirm that 23 + 4 = 27

 

[NYR Viper]

Somehow I don't think Neil/pick for Del Zotto makes sense if you can get Yakupov for DZ/pick...

What? How does this make sense. You cray...

i like this also B schenn has much needed size at Center . Im not one of your garden variety Boyle haters as long as he is used as what he is a 4th line center or wing who is good at blocking shots and PK and winning FOs. His lack of skating and athleticism is problematic against and with faster skating players but his pluses are on par with his minuses .
Im ready to move away from Brassard . NYR need to replace him with a center with size and physicality that can win faceoffs and score . Step , Richards and Brass as your top 3 C is not physically competitive enough .

Schenn would be ideal. I will not stop harping on the fact that I wanted Schenn + Simmonds + for Gaborik way back when. Oh how much better off we would be if that deal had gone through...

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Viper I remember liking your proposal a lot but having major doubts that it could actually be a possibility.

You are right on in the type of player the Rangers should be looking to add. Schenn/Simmonds definitely fit the mold. Will the Rangers make a deal with Philly? Just not sure I see that happening. Never say never I guess.

 

[NYR Viper]

Viper I remember liking your proposal a lot but having major doubts that it could actually be a possibility.

You are right on in the type of player the Rangers should be looking to add. Schenn/Simmonds definitely fit the mold. Will the Rangers make a deal with Philly? Just not sure I see that happening. Never say never I guess.

Probably not which is unfortunate. They each have what the other needs.

I think Ottawa, TB and Minnesota make the most sense. They have what the Rangers would want in terms of players (Coyle, Connolly, Zibanejad), are out of the division and non-rivals, and have a need within their entire organization for another puck mover.

I know Dallas needs defense but they have a young defense as it is and have players like Oleksiak close to making it. It's not as much of an organizational need as much as a NHL need right now. I don't buy the fact that they are THAT interested.

 

[JaeTM]

Somehow I don't think Neil/pick for Del Zotto makes sense if you can get Yakupov for DZ/pick...

I was thinking the same thing.

Probably not which is unfortunate. They each have what the other needs.

I think Ottawa, TB and Minnesota make the most sense. They have what the Rangers would want in terms of players (Coyle, Connolly, Zibanejad), are out of the division and non-rivals, and have a need within their entire organization for another puck mover.

I know Dallas needs defense but they have a young defense as it is and have players like Oleksiak close to making it. It's not as much of an organizational need as much as a NHL need right now. I don't buy the fact that they are THAT interested.

It does suck because neither player is a game breaking star. I understand not wanting to trade in the division, but it's not like MDZ will haunt us for years to come if we trade him to Philly. He's no Karlsson, OEL, Pietrangelo, etc. It's understandable when teams don't want to trade their really good players within the division (Nash, Schneider/Luongo, Yakupov) because these guys can literally kill you 6 times a year for years to come. Del Zotto and Simmonds aren't superstars, and is a solid trade that could benefit both teams.

 

[NYR Viper]

I was thinking the same thing.



It does suck because neither player is a game breaking star. I understand not wanting to trade in the division, but it's not like MDZ will haunt us for years to come if we trade him to Philly. He's no Karlsson, OEL, Pietrangelo, etc. It's understandable when teams don't want to trade their really good players within the division (Nash, Schneider/Luongo, Yakupov) because these guys can literally kill you 6 times a year for years to come. Del Zotto and Simmonds aren't superstars, and is a solid trade that could benefit both teams.

Simmonds can be a difference maker though with his style. Same goes for Schenn who is the player I would covet more just because of his position and age. He has the skill to be a #1b/2 center in the NHL.





From Katie Strang's chat yesterday:

Adrian (Poland)

Hi Katie! Obviously Del Zotto's the hottest topic in Rangerland right now... Both Craig Custance and Pierre LeBrun mentioned that there are 5-6 teams interested in him, what's your take on that? Can we expect a trade in the near future?
Katie Strang (3:16 PM)

I think the Rangers would be more than happy to move him, honestly. That's been true for a while now, but Alain Vigneault certainly does not seem to be his No. 1 fan. Just a few hours ago he said that he's "heard that Michael Del Zotto is a much better defenseman than he's seen." Ouch. Has played himself out of a regular spot in the lineup. Though he returns Thursday night after being scratched three games straight, he'll have to fight to stay there. Biggest problem for the Rangers moving him now is his diminishing value. I'd be surprised though, if the 23-year-old finishes out the season in NY

cjamny (NY)

Hi Katie, virtually every Ranger D man has struggled at some point adjusting to AV's system as recently as last night when Girardi made a horrible turnover that luckily Hank saved. So what have you seen that makes DelZotto's play so much worse that they're rumored to be shopping him?
Katie Strang (3:18 PM)

When Del Zotto was first scratched before Montreal, I assumed it was his defensive shortcomings that had him in the dog house, too. Not so. Vigneault rattled off all the things he had heard about Del Zotto's offensive abilities coming in. THAT was what he identified as the problem. Doesn't feel DZ is living up to his billing as a talented offensive-defenseman

http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chat/_/id/49467

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

Simmonds would be a glorious pick up imo

 

[NYR Viper]

Simmonds would be a glorious pick up imo

I just worry a bit with where he would play. Nash, Callahan, Simmonds all on the RW? Zuccarello is a natural RWer who can play on the left if need be.

 

[JaeTM]

Simmonds can be a difference maker though with his style. Same goes for Schenn who is the player I would covet more just because of his position and age. He has the skill to be a #1b/2 center in the NHL.

Well, yeah, obviously every player in the NHL can be a difference maker throughout the season. That's why they're in the NHL. I just seem that at equal grounds of "difference making." Neither player is a superstar that is going to burn you for years though.

B. Schenn, I'll be honest, I haven't seen him play much. The only games I've ever seen him would be the ones against the Rangers. I know he's young and was once touted as the best prospect, but I'd just rather have Simmonds at this point. There's not many players like him. It's not like he's old either. He just turned 25 not too long ago. He's a player I'd rather have that could really help out in the playoffs within the next few years while Hank is on top of the league.

 

[Clown Fiesta]

Simmonds is what he is, 40-50 points a year playing a hard nosed game. Basically Prust on steroids as far as production goes. We all like players like that, some of us more than others as I think they're probably the most overrated type of player. Can they continue to produce with fewer minutes? Can they raise their game to replace someone whose injured?

With Simmonds I don't see a whole lot more growth or any real surprises.

With Schenn you've got a younger guy who is trending upwards and has produced at the same pace as Simmonds for their careers. Big difference I see is the PO numbers, 12 in 23 for Simmonds and 9 in 11 for Schenn. If that trend continues he will make a lot of fans very happy. He obviously has more upside, it's a gamble in terms of whether or not he'll reach it. If he doesn't you end up with a really good 3rd line Center, if he does then we won't be worrying about center depth for quite some time with Stepan/Schenn/Miller/Lindberg or however it pans out.

I choose Schenn.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

I just worry a bit with where he would play. Nash, Callahan, Simmonds all on the RW? Zuccarello is a natural RWer who can play on the left if need be.

Yeah that is actually a good point. He just is just a nice combination of toughness and youth with a touch of scoring. If he is available, especially for DZ I think you take that deal and then worry about lines later. It isn't often that a team is willing to get rid of a guy like him.

 

[Punxrocknyc19*]

how about this


Rangers trade Del Zotto, St.Croix and Pouliot to Sharks.
Sharks trade Matt Tennyson, Daniil Tarasov, Freddie Hamilton,
Brodie Reid to Rangers...

Rangers get a young RH Dman with some games at the NHL level, and 3 mid prospects...Sharks get an offensive dman with potential, after Boyle they dont have much scoring from the blueline..

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

Simmonds is what he is, 40-50 points a year playing a hard nosed game. Basically Prust on steroids as far as production goes. We all like players like that, some of us more than others as I think they're probably the most overrated type of player. Can they continue to produce with fewer minutes? Can they raise their game to replace someone whose injured?

With Simmonds I don't see a whole lot more growth or any real surprises.

With Schenn you've got a younger guy who is trending upwards and has produced at the same pace as Simmonds for their careers. Big difference I see is the PO numbers, 12 in 23 for Simmonds and 9 in 11 for Schenn. If that trend continues he will make a lot of fans very happy. He obviously has more upside, it's a gamble in terms of whether or not he'll reach it. If he doesn't you end up with a really good 3rd line Center, if he does then we won't be worrying about center depth for quite some time with Stepan/Schenn/Miller/Lindberg or however it pans out.

I choose Schenn.

Not to argue your other points, but I see some growth potential for Simmonds. He's only 25 and last season was on a 60 point pace if it were a full season. Not saying he'll score 100 points but maybe a 70-75 point season or 2 isn't out of the question.


Also, consider that Schenn has been traded once and is now on the block again at such a young age? Isn't that sort of a red flag?

 

[Clown Fiesta]

Not to argue your other points, but I see some growth potential for Simmonds. He's only 25 and last season was on a 60 point pace if it were a full season. Not saying he'll score 100 points but maybe a 70-75 point season or 2 isn't out of the question.


Also, consider that Schenn has been traded once and is now on the block again at such a young age? Isn't that sort of a red flag?

I don't see a 70-75 point season in his future I may be wrong but I just don't, he's rather inconsistent. Scoring was up all over the league last season which might have skewed things a bit. I wouldn't say 60 is out of the realm of possibility though, and yeah he isn't very old either. I just don't see his game evolving too much more.

Yeah you could say it's a knock, I've never heard anything negative about him really. His hype was pretty crazy and LA fans really fed into it, but his value was high and he was traded for a proven commodity. I hate everything about the Flyers but Mike Richards is a pretty damn good player.

As far as him being available now, who knows how much of it is true. Also remember this is Holmgren, he'll trade absolutely anyone. Couturier is also rumored to be available. I think it's just a matter of Holmgren not having a lot of valuable assets to be honest. Not without making Hartnell or Giroux available.

 

[NYR Viper]

Yeah that is actually a good point. He just is just a nice combination of toughness and youth with a touch of scoring. If he is available, especially for DZ I think you take that deal and then worry about lines later. It isn't often that a team is willing to get rid of a guy like him.

I like him, don't get me wrong. I would love him on this team, but he doesn't exactly fill the big hole that will be here after this season. LW is a bigger concern.

Kreider, Hagelin, ?/Hrivik/Fast/Zuccarello

Nash, Callahan, Fast/Miller/Kristo/Hrivik/Zuccarello

 

[Trxjw]

I think Del Zotto looking like "he got the death penalty" is the telling symptom of the real problem - his mental game and especially his resiliency.

He has always been a player who rides the roller coaster of emotion up and down. His good stretches are very good. At times great. But he gets in funks that just look impossible to break - sometimes lasting for shifts, other times games, other times chunks of seasons. "Maybe he needs a new coach or a fresh start" - isnt that what he had this season? I seem to remember him embracing it in the summer. Cant always be waiting for an out, at some point you need to internalize it.

Maybe that's a maturity thing and the Rangers will regret moving him. Maybe it's a personality thing and the time to strike is now.

I'm sure he did embrace the "fresh start" but was it really a fresh start? He's in the exact same situation he was last season: Second fiddle on the PP, playing his off-side, and Moore continues to earn time on the left side, which means he's playing the right-side no matter what pairing he's on.

If he doesn't fit, trade him. I really don't see the point in beating his value, and his mental state into the dirt the way they've been doing. Del Zotto's value was higher to start the year than it is now, and nothing between then and now has changed. Somehow they thought Del Zotto was going to break out, despite being in the exact same position he was last year. It makes no sense.

 

[nyrpassion]

The more I look at this situation, the more I feel we'll be let down at the return. Personally, I'd be ecstatic at a Yakupov return, but HIGHLY doubt that'll happen. But Sather does pull magic tricks out of his ass, so you never know.

 

[RGF]

How about DZ for PHX Rundblad straight up

Both arent playing a lot and need a change of scenery