Thirty One
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- Dec 28, 2003
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Speculation: Trade Rumors/Speculation Thread Part II (Mod warning post #861)
- Thread starter I Eat Crow
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I don't know if this is the right place for it, but would the Rangers consider waiving/dumping Pyatt for recently waived Jordin Tootoo? Tootoo is faster, scores about as much, hits a ton more, forechecks better, and is a true energy player. He also does something most people here seem to love: fight. I could see a line of Tootoo-Boyle-Dorsett as a wrecking ball nightmare for other teams, much moreso than Pyatt-Boyle-Dorsett. They make about $400k difference in salary.
NikC
Registered User
- Oct 7, 2008
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HatTrick Swayze
Just Be Nice
People don't want to admit it, but the KHL risk is very real. Regardless of what a player says, money talks. It doesn't mean you should never draft or acquire a Russian player. But is is absolutely a risk teams have to price in and take seriously. For example, could Sather have hardballed Burmistrov into Stepan's bridge deal? I doubt it. It's a risk you have to price in at all stages of your franchise.
Thirty One
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- Dec 28, 2003
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Clown Fiesta
Registered User
Here you go making accusations about a person's life experiences again...
I'd like to know what organized sport he played where the coach welcomed his players being openly disrespectful to his message.
Clown Fiesta
Registered User
I'd like to know how, outside of one quote you ascertained that he is disrespectful to his coaches.
BroadwayBlues
KK24
Its a direct quote, despite the conspiracy theories about how it was somehow lost in translation. Its certainly much much better evidence than your "Eakins is a psycho/control freak" nonsense.
Maybe next game Yakupov can wear a sign for you while hes refusing to engage on the defensive side of the puck.
Neither Kreider or Miller is being traded. I'd like to clump McIlrath in there too but I don't know if he's fallen out of favor in the organization's eyes.
There is absolutely 100% NO CHANCE Kreider or Miller get traded. AV likes speed. Since Kreider and Hagelin have come back our offense has been much more effective. AV's whole offensive philosophy is a fast transition - speed players help with that.
Miller will be our own version of Kessler when he develops. He hasn't filled into his body, he's been dealing with injuries both years here, he hasn't played on lines where the talent is set to optimize his production. People on this board may not realize it and think he's underachieving due to the hype but that's his ceiling, and since every report that's been said about him raves about his work ethic i'd imagine it'd be more likely than not that he realizes this ceiling.
Similarly, every report raves about Kreider's work ethic too. I'd imagine the Rangers FO view both as high likelihoods to reaching their ceilings.
Both prospects are non-starters for any trade proposal. As for Yakupov, he's similar to teams trading for Josh Gordon in the NFL. Except he hasn't put up any production yet either. He's been labeled a team headache, with immaturity, an inability to be coached, a defensive liability, and a risk to jet to Russia. All of these diminish the leverage the Edmonton GM has over other GMs.
Talent needs teaching. There is no veteran leadership on that team. It's as someone said last night "a frat house". He needs policeman ship and mentorship and a winning environment. Rangers can provide that.
People on here need to realize logic. When the Nash rumors came out everyone was willing to throw in our best prospects, the kitchen sink, and their last pair of underwear to seal the deal. Use some ****ing logic.
What has Yakupov done over the last 2 years? Nothing. What has he done this year? Been benched. He wants out of Edmonton and since the Russian M.O is to bolt back to the KHL that will scare off many teams - especially smaller market teams that can't afford to risk their futures to sign such a potential liability. It doesn't matter if any of you buy it or not... the risk is still present and the KHL has the ability to offer him much more money, a better fan reception, and an environment where he's comfortable talking to his team mates in a language he's comfortable with. It's a legitimate option if things continue to get worse here. He has shown he can't really play responsible defense. He's been called difficult to coach and a difficult team mate in general. To make matters worse, he's not producing so all of these factors are being compounded.
Edmonton will be lucky to get Brassard and MDZ for him. Why MDZ? Yes i'm on the bandwagon of people who want him gone and am frustrated by watching him play and make stupid mistakes but the answer is logical. We have ready replacements for him. Allen in the AHL could conceivably step in and play 3rd line minutes. Even Falk could do that. We're not asking whoever is being called up to take on the top defensive responsibilities and AV will put them in a position to succeed rather than throw them out into the fire or bench them like Torts did. MDZ is logical because he's young, has talent he's scratched at realizing but never fully utilized it (similarly to Yak), is signed to a team friendly contract, and is the logical player the Rangers can part with without really hurting the team.
Now the Rangers can opt to give a few prospects, a pick and a prospect, or an established player (or some combination) in addition to MDZ. I doubt the pick would be higher than a 2nd. After the Nash 1st round failure I don't think the Rangers will want to be without a first again. Meaning we'll have to give up a better prospect with that 2nd (likely one of McIlrath, Skjei, Lindberg, or Fast). They could offer a 1st and give a worse prospect (likely one of Yogan, MSC, or some other B level kid). Or they could give Brassard who is an RFA at the end of the year (I believe). He also makes sense (if we have to trade anyone) because we have Boyle, Moore, Miller, and Lindberg readily available to assume the 3c duties. Boyle is already on the 3rd line, it wouldn't make an incredible difference whether he was centering it or being a winger. Eventually, Lindberg will be the 3rd line center (Brassard on the team or not) - he's high energy, creative, and most importantly (for a 3c) defensively responsible.
If Edmonton requires either Kreider or Miller the trade won't be made. You don't just make a trade for the point of making a trade. You need depth in your team and Kreider and Miller promise to provide it for years to come. They're not being traded. No one should be ok with giving them up. It's silly on everyone's part here to be so accepting of that when their futures could be as bright as, if not brighter, than the guy we are going to get in this hypothetical scenario (Yakupov).
Use logic.
There is absolutely 100% NO CHANCE Kreider or Miller get traded. AV likes speed. Since Kreider and Hagelin have come back our offense has been much more effective. AV's whole offensive philosophy is a fast transition - speed players help with that.
Miller will be our own version of Kessler when he develops. He hasn't filled into his body, he's been dealing with injuries both years here, he hasn't played on lines where the talent is set to optimize his production. People on this board may not realize it and think he's underachieving due to the hype but that's his ceiling, and since every report that's been said about him raves about his work ethic i'd imagine it'd be more likely than not that he realizes this ceiling.
Similarly, every report raves about Kreider's work ethic too. I'd imagine the Rangers FO view both as high likelihoods to reaching their ceilings.
Both prospects are non-starters for any trade proposal. As for Yakupov, he's similar to teams trading for Josh Gordon in the NFL. Except he hasn't put up any production yet either. He's been labeled a team headache, with immaturity, an inability to be coached, a defensive liability, and a risk to jet to Russia. All of these diminish the leverage the Edmonton GM has over other GMs.
Talent needs teaching. There is no veteran leadership on that team. It's as someone said last night "a frat house". He needs policeman ship and mentorship and a winning environment. Rangers can provide that.
People on here need to realize logic. When the Nash rumors came out everyone was willing to throw in our best prospects, the kitchen sink, and their last pair of underwear to seal the deal. Use some ****ing logic.
What has Yakupov done over the last 2 years? Nothing. What has he done this year? Been benched. He wants out of Edmonton and since the Russian M.O is to bolt back to the KHL that will scare off many teams - especially smaller market teams that can't afford to risk their futures to sign such a potential liability. It doesn't matter if any of you buy it or not... the risk is still present and the KHL has the ability to offer him much more money, a better fan reception, and an environment where he's comfortable talking to his team mates in a language he's comfortable with. It's a legitimate option if things continue to get worse here. He has shown he can't really play responsible defense. He's been called difficult to coach and a difficult team mate in general. To make matters worse, he's not producing so all of these factors are being compounded.
Edmonton will be lucky to get Brassard and MDZ for him. Why MDZ? Yes i'm on the bandwagon of people who want him gone and am frustrated by watching him play and make stupid mistakes but the answer is logical. We have ready replacements for him. Allen in the AHL could conceivably step in and play 3rd line minutes. Even Falk could do that. We're not asking whoever is being called up to take on the top defensive responsibilities and AV will put them in a position to succeed rather than throw them out into the fire or bench them like Torts did. MDZ is logical because he's young, has talent he's scratched at realizing but never fully utilized it (similarly to Yak), is signed to a team friendly contract, and is the logical player the Rangers can part with without really hurting the team.
Now the Rangers can opt to give a few prospects, a pick and a prospect, or an established player (or some combination) in addition to MDZ. I doubt the pick would be higher than a 2nd. After the Nash 1st round failure I don't think the Rangers will want to be without a first again. Meaning we'll have to give up a better prospect with that 2nd (likely one of McIlrath, Skjei, Lindberg, or Fast). They could offer a 1st and give a worse prospect (likely one of Yogan, MSC, or some other B level kid). Or they could give Brassard who is an RFA at the end of the year (I believe). He also makes sense (if we have to trade anyone) because we have Boyle, Moore, Miller, and Lindberg readily available to assume the 3c duties. Boyle is already on the 3rd line, it wouldn't make an incredible difference whether he was centering it or being a winger. Eventually, Lindberg will be the 3rd line center (Brassard on the team or not) - he's high energy, creative, and most importantly (for a 3c) defensively responsible.
If Edmonton requires either Kreider or Miller the trade won't be made. You don't just make a trade for the point of making a trade. You need depth in your team and Kreider and Miller promise to provide it for years to come. They're not being traded. No one should be ok with giving them up. It's silly on everyone's part here to be so accepting of that when their futures could be as bright as, if not brighter, than the guy we are going to get in this hypothetical scenario (Yakupov).
Use logic.
- Jul 20, 2005
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Funny, I would say it was the opposite: anyone who thinks talented players do not get away with absolute murder has probably never played organized sports in their life. This goes double if the kid is a rare talent and quadruple if the sport/league is actually viewed as important or at least relevant.
For example Yakupov mouthing off to his youth hockey coaches probably got overlooked more than -31- mouthing off to his youth tumbling coaches.
For example Yakupov mouthing off to his youth hockey coaches probably got overlooked more than -31- mouthing off to his youth tumbling coaches.
Kokoschka
Registered User
- May 13, 2012
- 3,166
- 50
Actually, Kazan is quite a nice city.
On topic, how about Tootoo?
+ gritty, tough bottom 6 player who could take some weight off Dorsett's shoulders
- 1.9 mill $ is not nothing for a 4th liner who doesn't PK or take FOs
? cap situation?
How about no. Edmonton would take it and run and laugh at us for ever being so stupid.
Clown Fiesta
Registered User
Good one, another personal attack and another failure to actually answer a question. I've heard a direct quote from a previous coach of his that said he was an awesome kid. Now it's 1-1 so I'll a ask again. How did you ascertain that he was a disrespectful punk?
Maybe you're just making it up because you don't like him?
It's ok if it's an opinion, like my opinion of Eakins. That's not how you're presenting it though, you're staying it as fact.
Thirty One
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- Dec 28, 2003
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Inferno
Registered User
i love all the people saying Yakupov sucks and this and that.
That's kinda the point...he hasn't put it together, he has risks, HE'S A KID!!!
You're not going to get a 50 goal scoring rookie Ovechkin or Stamkos for MDZ...you're going to get a kid with flaws who needs to get it.
That's kinda the point here...its a risk. Yakupov has tremendous talent, but he hasn't put it together, mostly because he's been rushed to the NHL IMHO. Most kids are. He could use some time in the minors. That ain't happening, put him on a line with Cally and Brassard, see what happens.
That's kinda the point...he hasn't put it together, he has risks, HE'S A KID!!!
You're not going to get a 50 goal scoring rookie Ovechkin or Stamkos for MDZ...you're going to get a kid with flaws who needs to get it.
That's kinda the point here...its a risk. Yakupov has tremendous talent, but he hasn't put it together, mostly because he's been rushed to the NHL IMHO. Most kids are. He could use some time in the minors. That ain't happening, put him on a line with Cally and Brassard, see what happens.
And since he's a risk (a high risk at one) what it's going to take to trade for him won't be that high.
Thirty One
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- Dec 28, 2003
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Clown Fiesta
Registered User
Ail
Based and Rangerspilled.
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