HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #87: 2024 Season Finale

[sampollock]

Here but no longer posting regularly and it’s probably for the best.

You and others are doing a great job keeping exchanges interesting and that’s all that really matters.

hey there
you are the balance to the force. Luke S

 

[overlords]

Here but no longer posting regularly and it’s probably for the best.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Basu - Habs were one of many times who liked McGroarty in his draft year.

He used a stronger word, but I don't remember it.

 

[jaffy27]

Fans who wouldnt trade Matheson for the 10th OV. Are the same who wants to sign Perron/Stamkos and old folks. They dont understand competitive window and the point of a rebuild.

Explain how to rebuild then….


Take the Habs for instance, what’s the next step…?

 

[Rapala]

Not wanting to trade a guy like Matheson for a top 10 pick on the basis that the pick is essentially a lottery ticket is a big middle finger to your scouting staff and your development team imo. Then, why not trade away the 5th OA for an established player? At 10, if Bobrov says the guy available has the potential to be a gamebreaker (Sennecke or Iginla), you trade for him

And trading Matheson for a top ten pick on the basis that it's possibly a NHL player down the road is shoving a big middle finger in Suzuki Slaf Caufield Newhook Dach Guhle Xhekaj and others face. There is not a chance in the world management do this after what was said in the season debrief. So who do you want to show the digit to? Once again Matheson will not be traded until our RD has a clear number one and our LD has matured some. Minimum one year and most likely two. Now if you are trading Matheson and Savard for a top end youngish veteran RD that is an entirely different story. But that isn't what you are proposing.

 

[HabbyGuy]

Here but no longer posting regularly and it’s probably for the best.

You and others are doing a great job keeping exchanges interesting and that’s all that really matters.

How is it for the best?

I think I can speak for the rest of the board when I say, we'd disagree with that notion.

What's going on? You're literally a "glue" member of this community. I guarantee you're one of the most liked and respected on here as well.

 

[jaffy27]

Here but no longer posting regularly and it’s probably for the best.

You and others are doing a great job keeping exchanges interesting and that’s all that really matters.

For the best is when you share your opinions my friend, we are a lesser place without you, you’re a freggin legend here whether you like it or not….but I get it, take the time you need, I know we’ll see you back in the fight soon here at HF

How is it for the best?

I think I can speak for the rest of the board when I say, we'd disagree with that notion.

What's going on?

What’s going on is probably none of our business….when he’s ready, he will resurface in our discussions……you are right with your notion though

 

[McGuires Corndog]

Basu - Habs were one of many times who liked McGroarty in his draft year.

He used a stronger word, but I don't remember it.

It’s going to be interesting to see what the return is, tbh.

He was a mid-1st who’s performed pretty much as you’d expect for a mid-1st, maybe a tad better..

So you know from Winnipeg’s POV, it’s the 26th ++ from our end.

My initial thought is they’ll put value towards a similarly aged or slightly older prospect that is going to help them immediately before their window closes. So that being said, not sure we have the horses for that race.

 

[Runner77]

hey there
you are the balance to the force. Luke S

You’re way too kind, thx.

I really see no point spending all the hours I do just to see stuff vanish into the ether. Not a very productive way to spend time.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Ben Chariot got the Habs a 1st and 4th...you must mean Matheson falling off a literal cliff and ceasing to exist.

And Jeff Petry got Montreal Matheson, and then a year later got Montreal a 4th. For every Chiarot getting a 1st there's an Edmundson getting a 3rd, or worse.

No they're not...i'm not evetrying to be difficult or obtuse here, there are no 25+ min Dmen, with 60+ points and making less than 5M/yr that are on the market.

There just isn't...

Except this season was an outlier one for Matheson, on a bad team. There is not a team in the NHL that would look at Matheson and say that's the 25+ min, 60+ point D-man I need. And its not what Montreal should be thinking either.

yes you trust your scouting staff to do their jobs.

The amateur scouting staff job is to project the value of a player, and that is never a sure thing. This isn't even a debate unless you're talking about a Connor McDavid/Sidney Crosby/Alexander Ovechkin type of talent, and i'm sorry, but you're not drafting that at #10.

The pro scouting staff job is to properly gauge the value of players actually playing IN the NHL (I know you know this) and determining their value and if you look at the value of Dmen traded in the NHL in, well forever, their value is very well established and no Dman of the pedigree of Matheson is being traded for a lottery scratch ticket other than on message boards.

That's literally what I said. But lets not pretend there isn't overlap. Montreal didn't trade for the likes of Dach and Newhook solely because of what they did in the NHL, because they were incredibly underwhelming in the NHL. No front office is so rigid as to only consider one or the other.

I'm not FOR Montreal keeping Matheson, I do think his value is highest right now (2 years at 4.8M, coming off a career year).

I'm just not for giving him away and crossing my fingers the player we pick 10th overall is more Miko Rantanen than Tyson Jost.

Nah, no way...i'm giving up tangible value, I need tangible return.

This is my biggest problem, because you're crossing your fingers whatever way you go. You're either:

-crossing your fingers the player you pick at 10th overall is more Miko Rantanen than Tyson Jost.
-crossing your fingers the player you trade for is more Sam Reinhart than Jesperi Kotkaniemi.
-crossing your fingers that the 30 year old D-man who just had a career year will maintain their current performance and either have decent trade value later or will resign a good contract when Montreal can be realistically competitive.

There is zero reason to be reductive or to take an extreme position of no top-10 pick. Its a determination made based on the potential trade market and lots of inputs.

 

[Rapala]

Is it just me or is there a certain arrogance coming off some of these American prospects that is less than acceptable?
Holy crap kid make the frickin team before deciding what role you want to play. Like f*** right off.
Are you better than Nick Suzuki because I highly doubt it. Guess where he started f*** head.
rant over

 

[HabbyGuy]

For the best is when you share your opinions my friend, we are a lesser place without you, you’re a freggin legend here whether you like it or not….but I get it, take the time you need, I know we’ll see you back in the fight soon here at HF


What’s going on is probably none of our business….when he’s ready, he will resurface in our discussions……you are right with your notion though

That's fair, hope all is well @Runner77

 

[TheBuriedHab]

Why wouldn't a team like the Devils who are looking at guys like Iginla or Sennecke just trade 10 for Mcgroarty? Same with Buffalo at 11.

I feel like it will be hard for the Habs to come up with a winning trade offer for him.

 

[GrandmaCookie]

Is it just me or is there a certain arrogance coming off some of these American prospects that is less than acceptable?
Holy crap kid make the frickin team before deciding what role you want to play. Like f*** right off.
Are you better than Nick Suzuki because I highly doubt it. Guess where he started f*** head.
rant over

I agree but Suzuki played a single playoff game in the AHL lmao.

 

[Rapala]

You’re way too kind, thx.

I really see no point spending all the hours I do just to see stuff vanish into the ether. Not a very productive way to spend time.

Yeah I get it.
That sucks I've learned to ignore it over the years because it is sooo petty.

 

[General Fanager]

Fans who wouldnt trade Matheson for the 10th OV. Are the same who wants to sign Perron/Stamkos and old folks. They dont understand competitive window and the point of a rebuild.

Every serious contender has older guys that are there for the experience factor and most play a big role on their teams. Heck even the last few cup winners had plenty of guys over 30 and a few over 35.

 

[sampollock]

You’re way too kind, thx.

I really see no point spending all the hours I do just to see stuff vanish into the ether. Not a very productive way to spend time.

yes I get it. after July 1 I will cool down here to

 

[Rapala]

I agree but Suzuki played a single playoff game in the AHL lmao.

I was referring to the fourth line. But yeah.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Explain how to rebuild then….


Take the Habs for instance, what’s the next step…?

Liquid bad assets, make a trade for the future, develop kids.

Start clearing the bottom 6.
None of this should be from the UFA

 

[Rapala]

yes I get it. after July 1 I will cool down here to

Unless Dubois comes back on the market.

 

[GrandmaCookie]

I was referring to the fourth line. But yeah.

Specially when your whole life is dedicated to hockey and most likely you have been dreaming of wearing an NHL jersey since you we're 5 years old. How can you shit on this before playing a single pro game because you don't agree about the parameters is beyond insane.

 

[General Fanager]

Had to pick the team that got « hijacked » by a friend of his?
Doubt it…

thats why it will be hilarious.....

 

[Runner77]

How is it for the best?

I think I can speak for the rest of the board when I say, we'd disagree with that notion.

What's going on? You're literally a "glue" member of this community. I guarantee you're one of the most liked and respected on here as well.

My posts have become the object of excess scrutiny and that translates into limited posting freedom. If the individual or individuals doing this want(s) to contact me, I’d love to know what I’ve been doing wrong.

 

[417]

And Jeff Petry got Montreal Matheson, and then a year later got Montreal a 4th. For every Chiarot getting a 1st there's an Edmundson getting a 3rd, or worse.

Yes, the Penguins completely misevaluated not only Jeff Petry, but Mike Matheson. Hughes fleeced the Pens, I don't think that's necessarily reflective of Matheson's value or what he's become for the Habs.

You don't like the Chiarot example, use the host of other Dmen who have been traded in recent years. Hell, just look at this past deadline, Chris Tanev, Erik Johnson, Joel Edmunson went for a 3rd and a 5th for God's sake lol.

Except this season was an outlier one for Matheson, on a bad team. There is not a team in the NHL that would look at Matheson and say that's the 25+ min, 60+ point D-man I need. And its not what Montreal should be thinking either.

Except this season past season, looked a lot like Matheson's first year in Montreal and I suspect that if he's here again this year and is healthy, his numbers are going to look very similar.

Of course, most NHL teams wouldn't look at Matheson as a 25+ min, 60+ point Dman they need, but I think there's quite a bit who would say that there's a player I can plug into my top 4, who won't cost me a lot in salary, whose productive, is one of the NHL's best skaters.

Like come on man lol i'm not Matheson's biggest fan...but we're watching a Stanley Cup Final where there's guys like Philip Broberg, Darnell Nurse, Dmitry Kulikov, OEL and Mikkola playing top 4 mins.

Can we stop acting like Matheson is some scrub please?

That's literally what I said. But lets not pretend there isn't overlap. Montreal didn't trade for the likes of Dach and Newhook solely because of what they did in the NHL, because they were incredibly underwhelming in the NHL. No front office is so rigid as to only consider one or the other.

Of course not, but there was some track record...and furthermore, the Habs didn't trade an established top pairing (whether you think he is or not, that's what he is in Montreal) to acquire either player.

Matter of fact, Kent Hughes traded Alex Romanov and a 4th round pick to acquire a 13th overall pick that he flipped for Dach, and somehow, you think Matheson AND a 1st round pick is worth a 10th overall?

All due respect, but something not adding up there.

This is my biggest problem, because you're crossing your fingers whatever way you go. You're either:

-crossing your fingers the player you pick at 10th overall is more Miko Rantanen than Tyson Jost.
-crossing your fingers the player you trade for is more Sam Reinhart than Jesperi Kotkaniemi.
-crossing your fingers that the 30 year old D-man who just had a career year will maintain their current performance and either have decent trade value later or will resign a good contract when Montreal can be realistically competitive.

There is zero reason to be reductive or to take an extreme position of no top-10 pick. Its a determination made based on the potential trade market and lots of inputs.

Again, I think the gap here is that I think Matheson is a huge trade chip, he's an established player...he's not a "hopeful" player, he's not a prospect. He's a top 4 Dman on a great contract, whether you rate Matheson or not, there is huge value for that.

If the Habs are so thirsty for another 1st round pick, they can pull off a trade like they did with Romanov for the 13th overall.

While Romanov has turned into a nice player, to suggest he had more value 2 years ago vs what Matheson is worth today, is completely ridiculous, all due respect.

 

[Rapala]

My posts have become the object of excess scrutiny and that translates into limited posting freedom. If the individual or individuals doing this want(s) to contact me, I’d love to know what I’ve been doing wrong.

Just so you know I've always scrutinized your posts excessively when I come across them...


Just Sayin