HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #87: 2024 Season Finale

[ReHabs]

Lots of smoke and Hughes has been known to want to pull the trigger on trades, with even Gorton saying he’s had to rein him in in the past.

Hmm, can you share more? When/where was this said?

 

[Sterling Archer]

Not even sure you go after him with the core in place. Tampa paid a high price for him and he really has not helped them like they expected.



No doubt about it. Hughes will be on the phone a lot. The real question is do we force something we shouldn't do or is there really another Dach quality to be traded for.

Personally, I think we should not make any unnecessary moves. Like trading for Necas for example. I'd be open to Dubois but Kings won't like my offer (Anderson, Gallagher, B+ for Dubois with retention below Suzuki and a 1st in the 24 or 25th drafts). That's the only way I would trade for him.

Anyways, the main point here is next year is another transition year. We get to evaluate Dach, Slaf, Guhle, Newhook, Roy, Xhekaj, Primeau, Barron a bit more and we also got Reinbacher, Hutson, Mailloux. Lots of guys to evaluate still and another top 10 pick (even if 5-10 range) can help this pool even more

I don't think Hughes will deal just to deal, especially with Gorton there. If it makes sense and contributes to the Habs winning, I think he'll make it.

Remember, you can "lose" a trade and still win it as long as you get the best player for your team that get's you to where you need to. Most times, asset for star trades go to the team getting the best player. and not the sack of picks and prospects. So if Hughes needs to overpay for the player that adds what we need most, so be it. At worst it doesn't work out and he can trade that player for more assets later, it's a wash like the Nieuwendyk v Iginla trade, or a win like most other star for package deals.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I don't think Hughes will deal just to deal, especially with Gorton there. If it makes sense and contributes to the Habs winning, I think he'll make it.

Remember, you can "lose" a trade and still win it as long as you get the best player for your team that get's you to where you need to. Most times, asset for star trades go to the team getting the best player. and not the sack of picks and prospects. So if Hughes needs to overpay for the player that adds what we need most, so be it. At worst it doesn't work out and he can trade that player for more assets later, it's a wash like the Nieuwendyk v Iginla trade, or a win like most other star for package deals.

I am sure Gorton/Hughes will turn over every stone in terms of what we can and can't do.

 

[Sterling Archer]

Hmm, can you share more? When/where was this said?

Gorton was being interviewed and joked how Hughes loves to deal and that he needs to put the brakes on him from time to time or he'd trade all the time. Obviously paraphrasing, but Gorton has said multiple times that they're always looking for deals to be made. I don't have the clip, just the memory of Gorton saying that but this article goes to this sentiment. Stu Cowan: Jeff Gorton is pulling the strings in Canadiens' rebuild

 

[le_sean]

He only has 1 year left.
I wouldn’t mind him for our bottom 6.
Xhekaj, Jeannot, Anderson and Pezetta is not to be mess with.

Please don’t list Anderson there.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Hmm, can you share more? When/where was this said?

We got to be careful with how we comprehend what they say in press conferences. Media/fans want to know their exact plan and they can't speak in detail at things they are currently looking at and things they might look into that develop.

Everyone agrees that we should start moving up and competing. Some will comprehend this as playoffs and some will comprehend this as a pick from 10-15 range vs 1-5 or 5-10.

I do remember Gorton talking about how much Hughes is on the phone talking various options. He really is very active. It was just a side comment from Gorton. At the end of the day, both of these guys are going to look at development/growth from what we currently have and then see what is available on the market to compliment what we have more.

We also all agree that we have a deep pool and lots of draft power to get in on trades. How we guess the futures moves is difficult. It's fluid and circumstance on timing plays a huge factor.

Gorton was being interviewed and joked how Hughes loves to deal and that he needs to put the brakes on him from time to time or he'd trade all the time. Obviously paraphrasing, but Gorton has said multiple times that they're always looking for deals to be made. I don't have the clip, just the memory of Gorton saying that but this article goes to this sentiment. Stu Cowan: Jeff Gorton is pulling the strings in Canadiens' rebuild

Yup, I recall something along the lines of Gorton saying Hughes was on the phone a lot and reviewing lots of trade options with Gorton.

Gorton is probably not use to a GM who is so active.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

I’m hearing that more and more that Hughes is going big this and next summer. McGuire said the same when he was saying he thought Hughes was going to be “big game hunting” this offseason.

Lots of smoke and Hughes has been known to want to pull the trigger on trades, with even Gorton saying he’s had to rein him in in the past.

I’m looking forward to seeing what Hughes can do and get a step closer to being a competitive team, contending for the cup!

It seems like those who think he'll go big this year is a trade and next year is free agency. Next year's crop is looking good. This year's was looking good, but next years looks even better.

 

[ReHabs]

Gorton was being interviewed and joked how Hughes loves to deal and that he needs to put the brakes on him from time to time or he'd trade all the time. Obviously paraphrasing, but Gorton has said multiple times that they're always looking for deals to be made. I don't have the clip, just the memory of Gorton saying that but this article goes to this sentiment. Stu Cowan: Jeff Gorton is pulling the strings in Canadiens' rebuild

We heard the “Bergevin working the phones” thing often too. Amounted to a fart in the wind if you ask me. I’m glad Gorton is there to share his experience though.

 

[the]

No way I would trade Jeff Gorton if it was possible even for a high draft pick. He’s clearly the architect of this team and his fingerprint is all over this franchise.

We have seen what bad management can do to damage a team with Bergevin.

 

[Sterling Archer]

We heard the “Bergevin working the phones” thing often too. Amounted to a fart in the wind if you ask me. I’m glad Gorton is there to share his experience though.

Bergevin worked the phones to make the best deal. Hughes working the phones to make the best team.

How many 1sts did Bergevin trade for even after saying you had to build through the draft? How many centers did he trade for after saying they were impossible to trade for while center after center was traded?

Apples and bicycles difference here.

 

[The Great Weal]

Please don’t list Anderson there.

I don't even know why Pezz is listed on there, the guy never steps up for anyone but himself

 

[le_sean]

I don't even know why Pezz is listed on there, the guy never steps up for anyone but himself

True. But at least he’s a willing combatant when push comes to shove. Anderson seems to avoid it as much as he possibly can.

 

[ReHabs]

Bergevin worked the phones to make the best deal. Hughes working the phones to make the best team.

How many 1sts did Bergevin trade for even after saying you had to build through the draft? How many centers did he trade for after saying they were impossible to trade for while center after center was traded?

Apples and bicycles difference here.

You don’t need to convince me Bergevin was a clown. The fact that we heard he was active on the phones and now we hear Hughes is active on the phone means the exact same to me: nothing. Until we have a good team it’s all meaningless.

 

[The Great Weal]

You don’t need to convince me Bergevin was a clown. The fact that we heard he was active on the phones and now we hear Hughes is active on the phone means the exact same to me: nothing. Until we have a good team it’s all meaningless.

At the very least Hughes is committing to a direction. Bergevin was unable to do that. The guy went from wanting to trade Subban to the Oilers for a bunch of high end young pieces only to decide to trade him for an older dman like a couple of hours later. It's like a complete 180 in terms of strategy which makes no sense. The only time he sold a meaningful asset was when Pacioretty wanted out.

I can't really evaluate Hughes yet, but he's at least committing to a rebuild unlike MB.

 

[Sterling Archer]

You don’t need to convince me Bergevin was a clown. The fact that we heard he was active on the phones and now we hear Hughes is active on the phone means the exact same to me: nothing. Until we have a good team it’s all meaningless.

If Hughes was sitting on his hands or getting us Martinsen, King and Ottt, I'd agree with you. But that fact he's getting guys like Dach and Newhook and wanting to do more gives me much more hope and faith in what he's doing.

 

[sampollock]

Who is vta sports? Fodder?

In my opinion, Patrik Laine could make a significant contribution to Martin St-Louis' top-6. We are still talking about a second choice overall, he who has already scored an impressive total of 44 goals in a single season.

Also read on LetsGoHabs
Announcement on the future of Jean-François Houle: It would now be confirmed

Dismissal of Alex Burrows at the CH? A decision is made
However, his injury history raises legitimate concerns. Still, if Laine manages to stay healthy, he could have a major impact on the Canadian's offense, as evidenced by his 117 points, including 54 goals, in his last 129 games with the Columbus Blue Jackets.

“Laine is a natural marker who needs to be well looked after. With the emergence of Nick Suzuki and Juraj Slafkosvky and the presence of Cole Caufield as a scorer on the left wing of the first line, the 6'5" forward would not have to play the role of number 1 scorer with the CH and could flourish in a more discreet role.

What’s more, he could benefit from the advice of a team of coaches who prioritize coaching and development.” - VAT Sports

 

[ReHabs]

If Hughes was sitting on his hands or getting us Martinsen, King and Ottt, I'd agree with you. But that fact he's getting guys like Dach and Newhook and wanting to do more gives me much more hope and faith in what he's doing.

I felt like Hughes could've done more to improve the roster last summer but otherwise there isn't much to criticise. It's good to have faith, I think I want to see 'aggressive Hughes' as much as anybody -- I think he's a smart guy but he's also a competitive guy. You tend to forget he's a former hockey player and he probably has 'jock' (or 'chad') instincts he's had to funnel into his professional career as opposed to an athletic one. I want to see him build a team that wins.

 

[Tyson]

Who is vta sports? Fodder?

In my opinion, Patrik Laine could make a significant contribution to Martin St-Louis' top-6. We are still talking about a second choice overall, he who has already scored an impressive total of 44 goals in a single season.

Also read on LetsGoHabs
Announcement on the future of Jean-François Houle: It would now be confirmed

Dismissal of Alex Burrows at the CH? A decision is made
However, his injury history raises legitimate concerns. Still, if Laine manages to stay healthy, he could have a major impact on the Canadian's offense, as evidenced by his 117 points, including 54 goals, in his last 129 games with the Columbus Blue Jackets.

“Laine is a natural marker who needs to be well looked after. With the emergence of Nick Suzuki and Juraj Slafkosvky and the presence of Cole Caufield as a scorer on the left wing of the first line, the 6'5" forward would not have to play the role of number 1 scorer with the CH and could flourish in a more discreet role.

What’s more, he could benefit from the advice of a team of coaches who prioritize coaching and development.” - VAT Sports

Laine's career started off well then it just went downhill. There is an outside chance that in the right environment he could get himself untracked. I am not sure I would trade a whole lot for a guy who seems to be headed downward.

 

[Adam Michaels]

Laine's career started off well then it just went downhill. There is an outside chance that in the right environment he could get himself untracked. I am not sure I would trade a whole lot for a guy who seems to be headed downward.

I don't watch Laine game in and game out to see if he's truly trending downward. Because when you look at his stats since he's been with Columbus, he's been produtcive.

2021-22: 26 goals and 56 pts in 56 GP. He was PPG player and was on pace for a 38-goal, 82-point season prorated to 82 games.
2022-23: 22 goals and 52 pts in 55 GP. Just under a PPG and on pace for a 33-goal, 76-point season.

I think his main issue lately has been remaining healthy. He's missed time to injury (the Habs definitely don't need more of that) and last year he also entered the player assistance program. But before all that, he had 6 goals and 9 pts in 18 GP.

 

[Kosseca]

You don’t need to convince me Bergevin was a clown. The fact that we heard he was active on the phones and now we hear Hughes is active on the phone means the exact same to me: nothing. Until we have a good team it’s all meaningless.

Bergevin had two main flaws as a DG:
1- got too attached (or not at all - i.e Markov) to his player and couldn't negotiate a contract. That put the team in very bad position more then once.

2- When making a trade, he had to win it. Beside the Drouin/Dvorak ones, he rarely made a bad trade. When he couldn't win a significant trade, he would do garbage bin dive.... Which never really help.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Bergevin had two main flaws as a DG:
1- got too attached (or not at all - i.e Markov) to his player and couldn't negotiate a contract. That put the team in very bad position more then once.

2- When making a trade, he had to win it. Beside the Drouin/Dvorak ones, he rarely made a bad trade. When he couldn't win a significant trade, he would do garbage bin dive.... Which never really help.

I don't see how either of those are anywhere close to being near Bergevin's biggest flaws, but the second isn't even correct.

Bergevin was one of the most prolific traders during his tenure as GM, but apart from deadline moves) he didn't really try to win trades, but made hockey trades. The reason he would "garbage bin dive" has nothing to do with not winning trades, its that he never committed to a specific direction and so wasn't willing to pay up futures or give up present value unless he was almost forced to.

 

[417]

Lots of big names next year

for now...all the most interesting one's will be off the market by this time next year, and there's going to be similar guys who are available now.

 

[ReHabs]

Bergevin had two main flaws as a DG:
1- got too attached (or not at all - i.e Markov) to his player and couldn't negotiate a contract. That put the team in very bad position more then once.

2- When making a trade, he had to win it. Beside the Drouin/Dvorak ones, he rarely made a bad trade. When he couldn't win a significant trade, he would do garbage bin dive.... Which never really help.

I think Bergevin drafted badly and he didn't know what his team needed and that was his biggest flaw. The emotional aspect too, it was pathetic.

 

[therocket9]

Bergevin had two main flaws as a DG:
1- got too attached (or not at all - i.e Markov) to his player and couldn't negotiate a contract. That put the team in very bad position more then once.

2- When making a trade, he had to win it. Beside the Drouin/Dvorak ones, he rarely made a bad trade. When he couldn't win a significant trade, he would do garbage bin dive.... Which never really helpThe main flaw of

Bergevin had two main flaws as a DG:
1- got too attached (or not at all - i.e Markov) to his player and couldn't negotiate a contract. That put the team in very bad position more then once.

2- When making a trade, he had to win it. Beside the Drouin/Dvorak ones, he rarely made a bad trade. When he couldn't win a significant trade, he would do garbage bin dive.... Which never really help.

The main flaw of Bergevin by far was he never picked a direction never went for it hugged all his prospects other than the one who should have kept Sergachev and never trade away a first round pick to try and win needed a center and never even tried to get one in 10 years.

 

[Sorinth]

Bergevin had two main flaws as a DG:
1- got too attached (or not at all - i.e Markov) to his player and couldn't negotiate a contract. That put the team in very bad position more then once.

2- When making a trade, he had to win it. Beside the Drouin/Dvorak ones, he rarely made a bad trade. When he couldn't win a significant trade, he would do garbage bin dive.... Which never really help.

Bergevin might not have lost many trades but he also didn't win many trades either. His record is probably something like he won 5% of his trades, lost 5% of his trades and the other 90% were ties or completely meaningless depth moves.

Bergevin's #1 issue was his idea of what the job of management was supposed to be was stuck in 60s.