HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #80

[Weltschmerz]

If you took the time to read my post I said wanting out isn't a problem, telling The jets isn't a problem. Going public IS a problem. He tanked his value and that's probably why he wasn't traded already.

His agent came out and said he wants to be a Hab. You think any other team will give major assets to get him knowing he will/might bail in 2 years? Or you think The Habs will pay major assets when they know that they can get him for free in 2 years?

He tried to force his way out of Winnipeg and it didn't work and now he had to settle for less money and its a PR nightmare. I hope he is ready cause Jets fans will boo him for 2 years.....

Wasn't that some insider to reported Jets want a long term contract and he doesn't? How is that him going public?

 

[BargainBinSpecial]

He didn’t sign it as a genuine UFA, it was an extenuating circumstance given the complicated nature of a RFA Offersheet.

What’s important to keep in mind is Carolina can buy-out his contract and since he’s under a certain age, they will pay only 1/3 of the salary owed over double the time. I think his buyout would be less than 1m a year.

If you want to bring up exceptional cases we can bring up PL Dubois who does not want to stay in Winnipeg but is forced to for at least one more year. His only other options were to force a trade (he tried, didn’t materialize as he has no action he could take) or to not sign his QO and not play hockey and not get paid at all.

We have no confirmation that PLD wants out of Winnipeg. Everything is pure speculation at this point. Huberdeau just signed a monster deal with the Flames right after french reporters claimed he wasn't a happy camper.

 

[HabzSauce]

Arizona will have three years to improve their prognosis, play good hockey, and convince Bedard to stay. Why should he be stuck there for 7+?

Three years isn't always enough time for most clubs to go from basement dwellers to playoff contention.

If Bedard leaves then it sends AZ right back to the basement where they started....back to square one.

For smaller markets like AZ it would be near impossible for them to ever crawl out of the basement if all their highest assets leave in 3 years time.

And like the other poster mentioned - these kids are getting paid big money. If they don't like the rules (IMO these rules are fair and help give teams a chance to actually build through the draft), then they can go play in any other professional hockey league.

That's their choice

 

[ReHabs]

Three years isn't always enough time for most clubs to go from basement dwellers to playoff contention.

If Bedard leaves then it sends AZ right back to the basement where they started....back to square one.

For smaller markets like AZ it would be near impossible for them to ever crawl out of the basement if all their highest assets leave in 3 years time.

And like the other poster mentioned - these kids are getting paid big money. If they don't like the rules (IMO these rules are fair and help give teams a chance to actually build through the draft), then they can go play in any other professional hockey league.

That's their choice

It’s not the player’s responsibility to turn a bad hockey club around lol

And we’re just talking here, change never happens if everyone shrugs their shoulders and dismisses the possibility of change at any cost

 

[HabzSauce]

It’s not the player’s responsibility to turn a bad hockey club around lol

And we’re just talking here, change never happens if everyone shrugs their shoulders and dismisses the possibility of change at any cost

Never said it's the players job. I was just saying it will be very hard for owners/GMs to build a long term successful hockey club if all their young assets can leave after 3 years without getting anything back in return

 

[DAChampion]

Arizona will have three years to improve their prognosis, play good hockey, and convince Bedard to stay. Why should he be stuck there for 7+?

A good argument is that the average total salaries of players depends on the league as a whole being viable. If there are just two or three super teams, many of the middle teams will fail, and thus eventually the TV deal as well.

In the long run, both players and owners benefit from parity, but that requires an investment/sacrifice in the short term.

 

[ReHabs]

Never said it's the players job. I was just saying it will be very hard for owners/GMs to build a long term successful hockey club if all their young assets can leave after 3 years without getting anything back in return

Why would a team not be able to sign its own player?

Unless you mean the only way a poorly run team can keep good players is by force and coercion?

 

[ReHabs]

A good argument is that the average total salaries of players depends on the league as a whole being viable. If there are just two or three super teams, many of the middle teams will fail, and thus eventually the TV deal as well.

In the long run, both players and owners benefit from parity, but that requires an investment/sacrifice in the short term.

A good argument is that the average total salaries of players depends on the league as a whole being viable. If there are just two or three super teams, many of the middle teams will fail, and thus eventually the TV deal as well.

In the long run, both players and owners benefit from parity, but that requires an investment/sacrifice in the short term.

The league hasn’t cared about viability in a long time. It’s been treating players and talent with ruthless calculus while eating losses hand over fist with owners/teams.

The point is, with a hard (and harsh) salary cap there cannot be super teams. The Rangers wouldn’t be able to stock on talent even if they wanted to — so why restrict young players’ wages with an artificial cap (ELC) and a prolonged and oppressive rights restriction? All it does is enable bad teams to waste players, it gives no impetus to a badly run team to actually do better, to treat their players better, to treat the league better, etc.

You have 3 years from the day they start their ELC. If that’s not enough to convince the player to re-up, give some one else a chance.

 

[DAChampion]

The league hasn’t cared about viability in a long time. It’s been treating players and talent with ruthless calculus while eating losses hand over fist with owners/teams.

The point is, with a hard (and harsh) salary cap there cannot be super teams. The Rangers wouldn’t be able to stock on talent even if they wanted to — so why restrict young players’ wages with an artificial cap (ELC) and a prolonged and oppressive rights restriction? All it does is enable bad teams to waste players, it gives no impetus to a badly run team to actually do better, to treat their players better, to treat the league better, etc.

You have 3 years from the day they start their ELC. If that’s not enough to convince the player to re-up, give some one else a chance.

The time until UFA adds even more parity/viability, and I think that the league is in fact growing.

But it is also sad to see, for example, Connor McDavid's career get wasted. An option would be to reduce the UFA age by one year, or alternatively, to decrease the penalties for RFA compensation.

 

[ReHabs]

The time until UFA adds even more parity/viability, and I think that the league is in fact growing.

But it is also sad to see, for example, Connor McDavid's career get wasted. An option would be to reduce the UFA age by one year, or alternatively, to decrease the penalties for RFA compensation.

Something! Anything to help make the league more internally competitive.

Right now it’s as if everybody is in a perverse race to stock up on underpaid young players as their only path to viability. Futures are worth more than presents — which is ridiculous on its face.

 

[DAChampion]

Something! Anything to help make the league more internally competitive.

Right now it’s as if everybody is in a perverse race to stock up on underpaid young players as their only path to viability. Futures are worth more than presents — which is ridiculous on its face.

They also need to change the rules on 35+ players.

As it is, there is a universal long contract to LTIR cap circumvention strategy.

 

[CHfan1]

Something! Anything to help make the league more internally competitive.

Right now it’s as if everybody is in a perverse race to stock up on underpaid young players as their only path to viability. Futures are worth more than presents — which is ridiculous on its face.

The decreased revenues and issues outside of the league’s control due to Covid has put the the NHL and the players in a tough spot. It’s resulted in a flat cap, a high escrow debt, and cap space being a premium. I think the league is doing the best they can from a bad situation. They worked with the NHLPA in 2020 to ensure the cap didn’t get lowered. It will start growing again in a couple years or so as escrow gets paid off. Revenues have gone up again with the help of a new franchise and big US TV deals.

Teams have known about the cap situation for multiple off seasons now. They should have been able to plan for it.

 

[HabzSauce]

Why would a team not be able to sign its own player?

Unless you mean the only way a poorly run team can keep good players is by force and coercion?

Lmao what force and coercion? How is it force and coercion when the players WILLINGLY sign a contract knowing those are the rules??

They're getting paid MILLIONS too! If they don't like it, then they can make a little less money and play in ANY other professional hockey league in the world. Sorry I don't buy your victim complex argument at all.

Smaller market teams will naturally have a hard time keeping/signing players, even WITH the current rules we have set in place. Imagine we let all those assets walk in 3 years for nothing as apposed to 7...those teams will suck forever!

If a team has 7 years of control on a player, it gives the team much more flexibility and opportunity to either hopefully sign the player long term, or ship him out for assets at the very least. This is very good for team building.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Why would a team not be able to sign its own player?

Unless you mean the only way a poorly run team can keep good players is by force and coercion?

Competition and a few at the top might work for many industries, but professionhal sports needs a degree of parity to create more excitement.

Salary cap is not enough if for example some destinations are inherently more attractigve than others theeby giving those cities a huge competitive advantage.

A system where teams have to invest in development requires a reasonable length of time of control, even though the amount of financial advantage of this control diminishes over the 7 years a team typically has.

 

[26Mats]

Unusually how? Dressed like a boy scout? Wearing football gear? Pretending to be a Chippendale dancer?

Unusually fast. As in Remarkably fast.

 

[jrom]

We have no confirmation that PLD wants out of Winnipeg. Everything is pure speculation at this point. Huberdeau just signed a monster deal with the Flames right after french reporters claimed he wasn't a happy camper.

I don’t pay attention to the media for these but if you listen to the recent David Savard interview on 91.9 (good friend of PLD), he all but says he wants to play in MTL.

Doesn’t mean it will happen, etc.

 

[General Fanager]

Wasn't that some insider to reported Jets want a long term contract and he doesn't? How is that him going public?

 

[Captain Mountain]

We have no confirmation that PLD wants out of Winnipeg. Everything is pure speculation at this point. Huberdeau just signed a monster deal with the Flames right after french reporters claimed he wasn't a happy camper.

Source? Because the reporting afterwards was that he wasn't happy with Florida after being traded but was happy to feel wanted by Calgary.

 

[Scriptor]

Arizona will have three years to improve their prognosis, play good hockey, and convince Bedard to stay. Why should he be stuck there for 7+?

No sense in having teams anymore under your system. Just organize random drafts around a pint of beer like we do for fantasy leagues and start over regularly with the lineups.

It takes more than three years to build a solid, perennial contender, but you need some certainty regarding the assets you have control over.

 

[Sterling Archer]

This is old article from 25 days ago that came out before he was signed.

 

[Scriptor]

We have no confirmation that PLD wants out of Winnipeg. Everything is pure speculation at this point. Huberdeau just signed a monster deal with the Flames right after french reporters claimed he wasn't a happy camper.

it was claimed that he wasn't a happy camper the way Florida handled the contract negotiations before the trade and the trade itself, not that he hated going to CAL.

 

[Weltschmerz]

lol come on that was way after the initial report when media asked him stupid questions

what is he supposed to say? no not interested in the habs?

 

[themilosh]

We have no confirmation that PLD wants out of Winnipeg. Everything is pure speculation at this point. Huberdeau just signed a monster deal with the Flames right after french reporters claimed he wasn't a happy camper.

this is what all the armchair GMs think will happen, we just get PLD for nothing in 2 years! crazy talk.. Huberdeau just maxed out with Calgary, I guarantee he had no intentions of being traded there, or even wanting to play there, but when the team goes max - players sign.

PLD is on the precipice of being a highly valuable commodity - now is the absolute time to get him (even if contract needs to be negotiated in Jan). Not only will he have a break out year as he legit is a star player --- if we wait, he is not going to sign for under $7M x $7 - which is what we can get for him now.

think about it - the cap is going to go up soon... salaries are "About" to bump up... getting a PLD for 7-7.5 x 7 will be a steal.

 

[ReHabs]

No sense in having teams anymore under your system. Just organize random drafts around a pint of beer like we do for fantasy leagues and start over regularly with the lineups.

It takes more than three years to build a solid, perennial contender, but you need some certainty regarding the assets you have control over.

What?!

Ending RFA nonsense would end teams as we know it? Can you elaborate?

 

[jellybeans]

We have no confirmation that PLD wants out of Winnipeg. Everything is pure speculation at this point. Huberdeau just signed a monster deal with the Flames right after french reporters claimed he wasn't a happy camper.

Don't twist what reporters said they said he wasn't happy with how the trade happened he never said anything negative about Calgary.