HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #80

[HABitual Fan]

Question

i know we have first claim on waivers but lets say theres 3 of them we like can we claim all of them or is there a rule against it

You don't lose your priority by making a claim, unlike fantasy leagues.

 

[Sorinth]

ROR is actually a great Suzuki comparison, no reason to doubt Nick will continue to progress and deliver comparable impact to ROR as he hits his prime.

The question is will we have the elite talent around him in the lineup... Like a Pietrangelo & Tarasenko, to make the most of his prime years.

Minute eating top tier caliber #1D, and top tier caliber #1 G are the two biggest areas of need HuGo have to address over the next 2-3 years. That's what we don't have in the pipeline (unless Primeau & one of Guhle/Barron/Mailloux make a Shea Weber-esque massive jump in their early 20's).

More likely, is that we'll need to fill those 2 big holes via schrewd trade or ufa signing.

Plenty of teams have shown you can get away without a top tier #1 D or #1 G, but you probably need 1 if you lack the other. We went to the SCF without Weber being a top tier #1 D but Price was top tier, and Colorado won without a top tier G but with a top tier #1 D. So I'd argue you only actually have to fill one of those 2 big holes which is certainly possible.

 

[Vachon23]

Plenty of teams have shown you can get away without a top tier #1 D or #1 G, but you probably need 1 if you lack the other. We went to the SCF without Weber being a top tier #1 D but Price was top tier, and Colorado won without a top tier G but with a top tier #1 D. So I'd argue you only actually have to fill one of those 2 big holes which is certainly possible.

Weber played like a #1 during those playoff though

 

[Scriptor]

ROR is actually a great Suzuki comparison, no reason to doubt Nick will continue to progress and deliver comparable impact to ROR as he hits his prime.

The question is will we have the elite talent around him in the lineup... Like a Pietrangelo & Tarasenko, to make the most of his prime years.

Minute eating top tier caliber #1D, and top tier caliber #1 G are the two biggest areas of need HuGo have to address over the next 2-3 years. That's what we don't have in the pipeline (unless Primeau & one of Guhle/Barron/Mailloux make a Shea Weber-esque massive jump in their early 20's).

More likely, is that we'll need to fill those 2 big holes via schrewd trade or ufa signing.

Add a 1st pairing, offensive, puck-moving, RHD and a platoon quality #1G via the UFA market or through a shrewd trade that doesn't mortgage your core and Montreal is looking quite good, especially if they can get another top-6 C at the 2023 draft.

Guhle and that 1st pairing righty is a good pairing. Edmundson and Barron is a good second pairing, but that 2nd pairing could become Hutson - Mailloux, with Harris Barron as a 3rd pairing.

Up front, depth at wing will be strong over the next years, even once we get rid of the dead wood that currently makes our depth at wing strong... on paper.

at C, if we get a top-6 C at the 2023 draft, we'll be swinging in talent with Dach, Beck, Evans, Mysak and Kidney for bottom 6 roles -- and we haven't even considered getting Dubois off the UFA market!

In three years, this team could be competing for something if HuGo pull the right strings and the recently assembled development department works wonders.

 

[ReHabs]

Weber played like a #1 during those playoff though

Compare Weber’s contribution to that of Makar or even Hedman and it’s night and day

 

[1909]

Having the very 1st pick opportunity from next waivers is great, but Hughes will have to clear $$$$ under his cap space. And that could be difficult.

 

[Karma Police]

Compare Weber’s contribution to that of Makar or even Hedman and it’s night and day

Not the same type of player. at all.

 

[ReHabs]

Not the same type of player. at all.

I think it's clear Weber wasn't a #1 d-man in his last few years despite being a formidable player. In the modern NHL the #1 d-man tilts the ice in a massive way, Roman Josi got 96 points last season!

 

[Sorinth]

Weber played like a #1 during those playoff though

He played great but he did not play like a #1. He had 1 goal and 6 points, sure he was great defensively but so were Petry, Chiarot, and Edmundson but nobody is going to claim they payed like #1 D. When you compare Weber's performance to the #1 D of previous cup winners/contenders like Hedman, Makar, or Pietrangelo and you can see Weber's performance is not even close.

What Weber and company did show is that with the right goaltending you don't need that superstar #1 D, if you have a group of guys that can play ~50min a game of great shutdown hockey.

Not the same type of player. at all.

Correct, Hedman/Makar are #1 Ds and Weber is/was not anymore.

 

[smirob]

I think the glaring hole is at RHD right now.....

Guhle/Slaf excluded - who is the best prospect we should consider trading to fill this hole?

 

[Miller Time]

Plenty of teams have shown you can get away without a top tier #1 D or #1 G, but you probably need 1 if you lack the other. We went to the SCF without Weber being a top tier #1 D but Price was top tier, and Colorado won without a top tier G but with a top tier #1 D. So I'd argue you only actually have to fill one of those 2 big holes which is certainly possible.

MacKinnon, Rantanen, Makar are all top 2-3 in their respective roles, and mac/Makar are arguably "generational" talents... so yeah... If you've got multiple elite/HOF top skaters, including C & D, the #1G need shifts.

We don't have one skater in that pedigree right now, maybe Slaf or CC get there, but I'd hesitate to bank on that.

Our SCF run was fun, but it was on the back of a #1G playing at a performance level matching the best PO runs of the past 20+years, and we were clearly outclassed in the finals... Not a model for success to build around.

Short of 2 or 3 of our current skaters making a Rantanen/Makar type jump to league best at their respective positions, top tier #1D & #1G are needs if the intent is to build a contender from the core/prospects we have in place.

 

[Miller Time]

Add a 1st pairing, offensive, puck-moving, RHD and a platoon quality #1G via the UFA market or through a shrewd trade that doesn't mortgage your core and Montreal is looking quite good, especially if they can get another top-6 C at the 2023 draft.

Guhle and that 1st pairing righty is a good pairing. Edmundson and Barron is a good second pairing, but that 2nd pairing could become Hutson - Mailloux, with Harris Barron as a 3rd pairing.

Up front, depth at wing will be strong over the next years, even once we get rid of the dead wood that currently makes our depth at wing strong... on paper.

at C, if we get a top-6 C at the 2023 draft, we'll be swinging in talent with Dach, Beck, Evans, Mysak and Kidney for bottom 6 roles -- and we haven't even considered getting Dubois off the UFA market!

In three years, this team could be competing for something if HuGo pull the right strings and the recently assembled development department works wonders.

Why would we need to add a "platoon quality #1G"? Isn't that exactly what Allen is?

I'd agree that how Guhle/Barron develop will impact what D addition is needed to the top pairing... And would not exclude the possibility that one of them makes a jump like Weber did from good prospect to elite #1D within their first few years as pro...

But at this point, we can't firmly pencil either of them in as locks to be top 4 dmen on a contender, let alone both of them... So until that forward progress happens, I'd still suggest that a #1D is a need if building a contender over the next 3-4 years is the priority

 

[BaseballCoach]

Why would we need to add a "platoon quality #1G"? Isn't that exactly what Allen is?

Because if you are platooning, you need two of them.

 

[HuGort]

Compare Weber’s contribution to that of Makar or even Hedman and it’s night and day

Weber was a beast

 

[DiglettDangles]

I think the glaring hole is at RHD right now.....

Guhle/Slaf excluded - who is the best prospect we should consider trading to fill this hole?

Dach might be considered as a legit centerpiece if he still has top-6 C value in 2 years - of which I'm doubtful myself.
By then our foreseeable center line might be Suzuki-Bedard/Fantilli/Carlsson/Dvorsky and Dubois might still be batting his eyelashes at us.
Trade Dach+ as an established and cost-controlled C for a young D on the brink of blooming (Johansen/Jones 2.0), like a properly developed Nemec/Jiricek or a high-profile RFA that won't sign with their team.

 

[HuGort]

Been talk on Facebook we can get Chiarot type return for Edmunston now. Would you make the trade? A first in this upcoming draft, plus two throw ins

 

[Scriptor]

Why would we need to add a "platoon quality #1G"? Isn't that exactly what Allen is?

I'd agree that how Guhle/Barron develop will impact what D addition is needed to the top pairing... And would not exclude the possibility that one of them makes a jump like Weber did from good prospect to elite #1D within their first few years as pro...

But at this point, we can't firmly pencil either of them in as locks to be top 4 dmen on a contender, let alone both of them... So until that forward progress happens, I'd still suggest that a #1D is a need if building a contender over the next 3-4 years is the priority

Yeah. That's half a platoon. We need another. Then, it's winner keeps the net, except for back to backs.

Been talk on Facebook we can get Chiarot type return for Edmunston now. Would you make the trade? A first in this upcoming draft, plus two throw ins

I just doubt we easily get a first for 2023.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Been talk on Facebook we can get Chiarot type return for Edmunston now. Would you make the trade? A first in this upcoming draft, plus two throw ins

...if that were the case, I imagine HuGo would have already moved him...Zito panicked at the Deadline and gave waaaaaayy too much for Shyterot's reputation...doubt any other GM right now would be as moronic...

 

[RationalExpectations]

...if that were the case, I imagine HuGo would have already moved him...Zito panicked at the Deadline and gave waaaaaayy too much for Shyterot's reputation...doubt any other GM right now would be as moronic...

TBL paid the same price for Savard, they did not complain.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

TBL paid the same price for Savard, they did not complain.

...they certainly did the next season...again, GMs watch this shyte unfold before their own eyes; if they don't learn lessons from it, that's on them and they know it...not saying some moronic GM won't eventually overpay for the services of a Dman like Mr. Ed, but they do learn their lessons most of the time and I can't see one panicking to get him this early...Deadline, maybe; there's always one or two who go Full Nutbag, even when past failures for soing as much are staring them in the face...

 

[Lockin17]

I think the glaring hole is at RHD right now.....

Guhle/Slaf excluded - who is the best prospect we should consider trading to fill this hole?

Mysak - Roy - Kidney -Beck could be involve.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Mysak - Roy - Kidney -Beck could be involve.

...as has been discussed alot on the Trade Boards, Mysak+ could be used to nab Nils Lundkvist from the Rangers...they are looking for a Centre prospect and we are looking for a RD...

 

[Sorinth]

MacKinnon, Rantanen, Makar are all top 2-3 in their respective roles, and mac/Makar are arguably "generational" talents... so yeah... If you've got multiple elite/HOF top skaters, including C & D, the #1G need shifts.

We don't have one skater in that pedigree right now, maybe Slaf or CC get there, but I'd hesitate to bank on that.

Our SCF run was fun, but it was on the back of a #1G playing at a performance level matching the best PO runs of the past 20+years, and we were clearly outclassed in the finals... Not a model for success to build around.

Short of 2 or 3 of our current skaters making a Rantanen/Makar type jump to league best at their respective positions, top tier #1D & #1G are needs if the intent is to build a contender from the core/prospects we have in place.

Sure but St-Louis also won the cup without any real generational players and it's not like Binnington just got hot at the right time given his SV% was 0.914 and GAA of 2.46 during the playoffs.

Now obviously if we have the chance to get a true #1 G/D we should do it but we shouldn't resign ourselves to tanking until then either. You can build a winner without those types of players though it is harder.

 

[smirob]

I would probably do a Mysak for Lundkvist trade.

Owen Beck has something about him that I wouldn't want to give up.

 

[Lockin17]

...as has been discussed alot on the Trade Boards, Mysak+ could be used to nab Nils Lundkvist from the Rangers...they are looking for a Centre prospect and we are looking for a RD...

How about Brandt Clarke for Mysak + Roy ??