Speculation: Trade Deadline: March 8, 2024

[Mangosteen]

Man the lack of intestinal fortitude on this board...I sure hope AM isn't near as jumpy!

Amigo, I just don't see the plan. The timeline you posted I believe is to long for our market. I think the GM owes it to the fans and season ticket holders a timeline for the rebuild. Saying we are in the next phase but not explaining what the phases are and no timeline is wrong.

Easy way to escape accountability.

 

[Sinurgy]

I'm assuming BA will take similar approach to this off season as last. If so trading those guys to playoff teams will probably play in his favor when it comes to signing free agents this summer.

 

[Sinurgy]

Amigo, I just don't see the plan. The timeline you posted I believe is to long for our market. I think the GM owes it to the fans and season ticket holders a timeline for the rebuild. Saying we are in the next phase but not explaining what the phases are and no timeline is wrong.

Easy way to escape accountability.

Is what it is, I don't see a better way forward. The pipeline must be restored. The fans will be fine once the Coyotes are winning.

 

[moosemeister]

So fill in the blanks for defense time, right?

Moser - Durzi
??? - Soderstrom
??? - Kesselring

Over pay for someone for one year to fill a slot. This way the year after Simashev can plug into the bottom ??? Spot.

My question is what do we do about the middle ??? spot

 

[Mangosteen]

??? - ??!
Moser - Durzi
??? - Soderstrom

 

[Dead Coyote]

It really makes no sense that we couldn't claim Gagner and Bjornfoot. Who the hell are we expecting to play? We just sent Guenther down sooooo.

 

[Jamieh]

It really makes no sense that we couldn't claim Gagner and Bjornfoot. Who the hell are we expecting to play? We just sent Guenther down sooooo.

Guenther was a paper transaction to make him AHL playoff eligible, he's playing tonight,

 

[rt]

I really don’t care about the Dumba and Zucker returns. They had lousy seasons. And it’s worse for them than us. They cost themselves many millions of dollars. So long. Easy to forget.

I’m pretty ticked we didn’t beat Calgary’s offer for Okhotyuk. I’d have loved to add that kid to this squad.

I probably would’ve claimed Lemieux, too. We need a spark plug. And Bjornfot because why not?

And I’d have moved Schmaltz to the first team willing to give me a 2nd, free and clear.

—

On the list of disappointments, failing to sell low on Schmaltz, failing to acquire a player who only cost a 5th; and failing to make a couple of waiver claims ranked about 798th overall on my list of times this team has disappointed me.

Today really didn’t matter at all.

 

[Mangosteen]

BA fell sleep at the wheel

 

[Foggy1097]

BA fell sleep at the wheel

He’s patient and has a plan and is sticking to it…not an overly emotional and irrational fan that gets swept up in recency bias, and enticed by every shiny object in front of his face. Stevie Y didn’t do a damn thing at the deadline either and he has a team in a wildcard spot…is he stupid too? Or does he have a long term plan and isn’t willing to jeopardize it for minimal short term gains?

 

[DustyDangler]

I really don’t care about the Dumba and Zucker returns. They had lousy seasons. And it’s worse for them than us. They cost themselves many millions of dollars. So long. Easy to forget.

I’m pretty ticked we didn’t beat Calgary’s offer for Okhotyuk. I’d have loved to add that kid to this squad.

I probably would’ve claimed Lemieux, too. We need a spark plug. And Bjornfot because why not?

And I’d have moved Schmaltz to the first team willing to give me a 2nd, free and clear.

—

On the list of disappointments, failing to sell low on Schmaltz, failing to acquire a player who only cost a 5th; and failing to make a couple of waiver claims ranked about 798th overall on my list of times this team has disappointed me.

Today really didn’t matter at all.

If we don't mess around with Coke sniffers, we shouldn't mess around with cannibals.

 

[BAdvocate]

I wanted to re-sign Stecher. Zucker I'm on the fence about. But I think he could be a lot more useful if we put him with a playmaker like Macelli and didn't play him with Kerfoot and Carcone. I'm not sad about him leaving but I would have rather kept him for another year than traded him for what essentially amounts to nothing.

Stencher can come and go as he sees fit. love him. Zucker in my opinion was always a 1 year stop. Sounds like he helped Cooley a lot so kudos to him for that. I wish Dumba well.

 

[lanky]

I'm glad the roster wasn't gutted.
Dealing Kerfoot or Bjugstad or Veggie or Schmaltz would've made holes that are not that easy to fill.
We're in the rebuild, not the tank.

 

[Dead Coyote]

Guenther was a paper transaction to make him AHL playoff eligible, he's playing tonight,

Okay, cool, who else are we going to replace Zucker and Stecher with? Are they upgrades on Zucker and Stecher? Are they kids who haven't gotten a shot yet?

Listen if we bring up Jenik and play him instead of Zucker than fine, at least we're doing something right. But I doubt that's going to be the case and even if it is we still could have done better. It's not world shattering or anything but...we still could have done better. Dunno what the rush is when GMBA has usually been extremely patient at letting people sit until he gets a good deal for them. We're really quibling about an extra 1m? That's how desperate we are? Wasn't that long ago GMBA was saying he wanted a 1st.

 

[Arizonatah Coyetis]

Amigo, I just don't see the plan.

You see it, you just don't like it.

Obviously if a GM says he's building through the draft the timeframe will depend on how fast these kids develop and earn a spot on the roster.

The timeline you posted I believe is to long for our market.

Why? The standings have zero effect on getting an arena and do nothing to keep the team from relocating, so how could our situation possibly get worse than it is right now? I'd argue that this is the perfect time to do a rebuild.

Besides, enticing new fans requires 3 things: Arena + competitive team + marketing. All 3 are necessary. By opening night at the new arena we should have all 3 in place.

I think the GM owes it to the fans and season ticket holders a timeline for the rebuild.

That's impossible. Too many variables to treat this like there's a standard cookie cutter procedure. Even the cable guy can't make a commitment better than a 4 hour window lol.

Saying we are in the next phase but not explaining what the phases are and no timeline is wrong.

Easy way to escape accountability.

BA did explain the phases back in October. Here's a link:

Armstrong talks status of Coyotes rebuild in Q&A with NHL.com | NHL.com

 

[MIGs Dog]

So fill in the blanks for defense time, right?

Moser - Durzi
??? - Soderstrom
??? - Kesselring

Over pay for someone for one year to fill a slot. This way the year after Simashev can plug into the bottom ??? Spot.

My question is what do we do about the middle ??? spot

I think Szuber leapfrogs Soda.

 

[IrishFin]

We got rid of two players without retention with contracts that teams typically need to add picks to get rid of in this current cap climate. Their play dictated their value this year. I have no issues with the return or initial signings. The real positive is that this team will likely end up with another pick in the top ten after over performing early in the year. That has more value to me than any return people thought we might get on Zucker or Dumba. They didn’t play up to their contracts this year and their next deals will show their value around the league.

 

[Jakey53]

We got rid of two players without retention with contracts that teams typically need to add picks to get rid of in this current cap climate. Their play dictated their value this year. I have no issues with the return or initial signings. The real positive is that this team will likely end up with another pick in the top ten after over performing early in the year. That has more value to me than any return people thought we might get on Zucker or Dumba. They didn’t play up to their contracts this year and their next deals will show their value around the league.

Good post. I get a kick out of that idiot Morgan. He said the Coyote's would have received better picks if they would have retained on their salaries but couldn't because the Coyote's couldn't afford it. What he doesn't understand is that the salaries are already in the budget and we only have 2 retain salaries remaining and I'm sure BA wanted to keep those open just in case he was working on something else and thought he might have to retain.

 

[Mangosteen]

You see it, you just don't like it.

Why? The standings have zero effect on getting an arena and do nothing to keep the team from relocating, so how could our situation possibly get worse than it is right now? I'd argue that this is the perfect time to do a rebuild.

Besides, enticing new fans requires 3 things: Arena + competitive team + marketing. All 3 are necessary. By opening night at the new arena we should have all 3 in place.

That's impossible. Too many variables to treat this like there's a standard cookie cutter procedure. Even the cable guy can't make a commitment better than a 4 hour window lol.

BA did explain the phases back in October. Here's a link:

Armstrong talks status of Coyotes rebuild in Q&A with NHL.com | NHL.com

First off excellent answer and it's your given right to be wrong

I don't see his plan because it's way to vague. I am going to build through the draft. Love this all good team do this.

Then he goes on to say there are 4 phases to this rebuild. Ok sounds good. What are these phases and and what are the goals. How do we measure when we have moved from phase to phase?

Timing of the rebuild. Rebuilds are tough on players. Players are competitive and want to win. The ones I hung out with were even competitive about eating breakfast or drinking a beer. When you losing everything multiplies. Your personal life, work life and head space is a disaster. You add to that not having an arena, relocation and crap being in the media all the time.
For the players sake this is a horrible time. Even BA said everyone wanted out. Careers are short.

The second reason why this is not the time for a rebuild is corporate spending. This is huge for a teams revenue. I don't know this but I am worried that the Yotes are receiving very little.

Scorch earth "may" be the final straw that leads to relocation.

I believe we should of retooled. Go scorch earth 1 or 2 years. Then do everything possible to make a playoff team. Yes probably not a cup contender this way but enough to keep the team and watch some exciting hockey.

 

[Naych_PHX]

I'm not that upset about the trade returns. We're not buyers but shipping out 3 players I would think at least pick someone on waivers. Maybe it's the money. I know last time we picked a waiver it didn't work out.

 

[Arizonatah Coyetis]

Then he goes on to say there are 4 phases to this rebuild. Ok sounds good. What are these phases and and what are the goals. How do we measure when we have moved from phase to phase?

It's obvious you didn't read the article.

Phase 1 - "...when I came in my presentation was about building a championship front office and sticking to that gameplan of realizing that behind the scenes you have to become a championship organization off the ice before you can become a championship organization."

(This is what BA did his first year as GM.)

Phase 2 - "...have some good young players to come and we'll put some veterans around them..."

(This season the young players that graduated were Cooley & Guenther, the vets brought in to mentor them were Kerfoot, Zucker, and Dumba. Next season will be more of this until the team shows they're moving on to phase 3, which will happen on it's own. It's the player development stage basically.)

Phase 3 - "That's when your young players start to be good and you've got to make that step to make the playoffs,"

(This is when your young players now have NHL experience and have developed into NHL regulars.)

Phase4 - "The fourth one is building that championship team and putting it on the ice."

(This is the trade assets to fill in the gaps and go for it phase)

I believe we should of retooled. Go scorch earth 1 or 2 years. Then do everything possible to make a playoff team. Yes probably not a cup contender this way but enough to keep the team and watch some exciting hockey.

How does winning hockey games help AM buy land and build an arena? That's step one to keeping the team in AZ. By the time we have an arena we'll also be competitive.

Making the playoffs 9 times in 28 seasons and making it past the first round once isn't exciting hockey in my opinion. If that was good enough for you, great! I'm tired of it. But that's what retooling has always done for us in the past. Nothing.

 

[Mangosteen]

I did read the articles but those phases are as vague as possible. These phases are not specific or measurable. No time line for success.

So his plan is draft players, surround them with vets till the young players are good and then win the Stanley cup. Ohh and hire him.

I understand that this is hockey futures and really a draft forum but kinda sick of rebuilds. Want to talk about hockey trades (not selling for picks and future s), fighting for playoffs, rivals but not for tanking, skipping the draft because we invested in today to win. Some times tomorrow never gets here. Hello SLC

 

[Arizonatah Coyetis]

I did read the articles but those phases are as vague as possible.

They aren't as vague as possible. They're as detailed as possible.

These phases are not specific or measurable. No time line for success.

They are pretty specific IMO. But of course they're not fully measurable. It's silly to think they could be measured and given a timeline given all the working parts and variables involved. It's unrealistic.

I understand that this is hockey futures and really a draft forum but kinda sick of rebuilds.

You said you are ok with retools, which is all they've ever really done in the past. Chayka's "rebuild" went from rebuild to confirmed retool the moment he traded for Taylor Hall. So we've never actually experienced a rebuild before.

There's a reason the saying "rebuilds are painful" exists. We haven't gone through this before and we're all more miserable than ever right now.

With the way things are right now, there's better times ahead no matter what lol. (Unless they can't get an arena done)

 

[Mangosteen]

Thanks for the discussion and it's ok to disagree. Time will be the judge

 

[Coyotedroppings]

I'm assuming BA will take similar approach to this off season as last. If so trading those guys to playoff teams will probably play in his favor when it comes to signing free agents this summer.

Yep, guys that just don’t have it anymore crave another opportunity and guys who do still have it, tire of being pawns.