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GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread -- To trade or not to trade...

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I’m not responding to anyone in particular, but the D market has changed.
The idea that Mo will sign for 6.2 or less (an idea thrown around here - his current aav plus Kessel retention money) is now in the past.
I think the best you can hope for in the 5-6 range on the open market will be a solid defensive LD.
 
ToneDog said:
Dubas must have a plan (I hope). IMO Leafs needed to get in front of this and moved him prior to July 28th. How many posters were saying trade Rielly and sign <insert dman here> ?? Still has time but the longer he waits the lower the return and higher the price to sign him.
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I guess Rielly is part of the core he's sticking with
 
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BlueForever75 said:
But you cant bend to his demands either. Leaf nation should and will understand not paying him more than 6 million a season. Truly that is what he is worth. He is no more important to the Leafs than Muzzin and Brodie, SIMPLE!!!! Paying him more says he is, and that is an inexcusable offence.

He doesnt play in any key situations. Last season with a one goal lead in last minute he was never on ice!!! Doesnt play PK. And was recently vanished from PP1. If that doesnt tell management and the fanbase that if there is a market to sell him as Jones was to do it. Then Im sorry this franchise will forever be going no where.

I am a huge Leafs backer, I will protect them till the bitter end. But to not trade Reilly and bend to his demands. Giving him a contract that he simply isnt worth. That would be hard to support or defend.
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You are way light on $6m for Rielly. Rielly is much better than Krug and Faulk and they got $6.5. Rielly may not be worth a $9m dman but he is certainly worth 90%. I'm no agent but I am certain I could negotiate at least $8m for Rielly. Dubas needs to realize this and get his ass in gear and pay him or move him or it will be Hyman all over again.
 
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Dreakmur said:
They should have traded Gardiner, Bozak, and van Riemsdyk. The rest on that list were either acquired rental players or players should should have kept for the play-offs.

I don't think we should have acquired Plekanec or Boyle, but once we did, they were walking for nothing.
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They were all reportedly available at the one-year left mark, but it didn’t sound like the offers outweighed their value to winning. Which is sound enough logic.

I would have preferred some fancy footwork too, but I get the reasoning.
 
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People have this misguided notion of playoff teams selling off their UFAs every year. It really doesn't work like that as often as people assume. And for this reason, every time we keep someone, despite countless other teams operating the same way, people lose their shit we didn't get assets.

It's calculated. What is more valuable? The pieces returned in a trade of a UFA, or the contribution of that good player for another year to a club with aspirations of winning? Sometimes that's easy to see, others it's not. Nevermind that even a player that leaves in UFA still results in the return of a valuable asset. Cap space.
 
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BlueForever75 said:
The prospect coming back can be an already controlled and younger dman that plays either side as we have 2 players in our D that can play either side (Brodie and Dermott).

Reilly isnt irreplaceable people. What exactly does he provide that a player like Sandin, or Lilly or Dermott cannot provide? Why because he scored 20 goals ions ago!!! Cause he can put up 50pts a season? Believe me, give Dermott or Sandin his minutes and they too will produce offensively. He doesnt play PK and was taken off PP. So other than his 24 minutes plus a game given with the number one pairing. What does he provide? His D is horrible!!!!!
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This is quite a weird post if you saw our playoffs this year. What does Morgan provide that Sandin/Lilly/Dermott cannot?

Well, we saw Morgan play 26 minutes of mistake-free hockey against the Habs. We saw Sandin playing limited minutes making crucial mistakes that cost us games. Travis was a little better, but he too made a mistake resulting in a crucial goal against.

If you think that replacing Morgan with rookies will not have a massive negative impact on our playoff performance you are completely wrong.

Now, if we got a good top pairing veteran dman to replace Morgan's minutes - sure, let's explore that. But replacing his minutes with rookies/2nd year players is a recipe for disaster.
 
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ToneDog said:
You are way light on $6m for Rielly. Rielly is much better than Krug and Faulk and they got $6.5. Rielly may not be worth a $9m dman but he is certainly worth 90%. I'm no agent but I am certain I could negotiate at least $8m for Rielly. Dubas needs to realize this and get his ass in gear and pay him or move him or it will be Hyman all over again.
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Reilly is exactly worth Krug and Faulk money and nothing more.

He plays the exact same game and he isnt worth anything more. That is a great comparable. If Reilly is looking for anything more Dubas should put an offer in front of him if he declines you deal him. Immediately.

Sorry people Reilly isnt worth it and it will be a contract the Leafs will be burdened with for years to come. I would rather have two 4 million dmen than Reilly. Simple. Develop your offensively younger dmen in Sandin, Lilly and Dermott. Trade Reilly's ass.
 
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Dreakmur said:
They should have traded Gardiner, Bozak, and van Riemsdyk. The rest on that list were either acquired rental players or players should should have kept for the play-offs.

I don't think we should have acquired Plekanec or Boyle, but once we did, they were walking for nothing.
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Agreed
Hyman - Dubas should have known he was going to be priced out
Andersen - he was never coming back and was sub-par anyway, so why keep him around?

These moves were made b/c year after year the GM thinks they're better than they are. He (they ) were wrong. Asset management has been terrible
 
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Lumberg said:
Agreed
Hyman - Dubas should have known he was going to be priced out
Andersen - he was never coming back and was sub-par anyway, so why keep him around?

These moves were made b/c year after year the GM thinks they're better than they are. He (they ) were wrong. Asset management has been terrible
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The one year they did not think they were better than they were, even then they failed to move Barrie and Cliffy at the TDL. Leaking assets since Shanny took over and it is slowly catching up to them.
 
Lumberg said:
Agreed
Hyman - Dubas should have known he was going to be priced out
Andersen - he was never coming back and was sub-par anyway, so why keep him around?

These moves were made b/c year after year the GM thinks they're better than they are. He (they ) were wrong. Asset management has been terrible
Click to expand...

Totally agree. This has been the Leafs demise. They should have known that Hyman wasnt coming back. The same as they knew Gardiner, Bozak and JVR were not coming back.

And they should know right now that Reilly isnt coming back. Unless they gut their team further and hand out another horrible contract.

Reilly isnt worth anything more than what Krug or Faulk got on open market. Simple.

If he doesnt want that deal his ass.
 
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aingefan said:
They were all reportedly available at the one-year left mark, but it didn’t sound like the offers outweighed their value to winning. Which is sound enough logic.

I would have preferred some fancy footwork too, but I get the reasoning.
Click to expand...

It's one thing to just list a bunch of players, but you can't make a true evaluation without looking at the context of each move. I think we thought we were contenders a lot sooner than we actually were. I think last season is the first season that we should have started unloading futures for rentals.
 
ToneDog said:
Dubas must have a plan (I hope). IMO Leafs needed to get in front of this and moved him prior to July 28th. How many posters were saying trade Rielly and sign <insert dman here> ?? Still has time but the longer he waits the lower the return and higher the price to sign him.
Click to expand...

I keep wondering.... Eichel and Dahlin for Marner and Reilly as a basis... maybe we have to move a pick or something to even it up. ... Sign Dahlin to a 3 years x $5.5 mil bridge. It's not something Dubas would do, but Dahlin solves the LD issue.... Eichel's injury is a concern no doubt, (as is his attitude) but then we make a change in the core, as a result of Marner not showing up in the playoffs... Sure, Dahlin isn't all that proven yet either, but paired with Brodie, I could see him blossoming. Give's Buffalo some quality players now and build around.
 
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Sypher04 said:
People have this misguided notion of playoff teams selling off their UFAs every year. It really doesn't work like that as often as people assume. And for this reason, every time we keep someone, despite countless other teams operating the same way, people lose their shit we didn't get assets.

It's calculated. What is more valuable? The pieces returned in a trade of a UFA, or the contribution of that good player for another year to a club with aspirations of winning? Sometimes that's easy to see, others it's not. Nevermind that even a player that leaves in UFA still results in the return of a valuable asset. Cap space.
Click to expand...

It's years of the GM thinking they're legit contenders and not only letting people walk, but trading pics at the deadline. And this team can't be compared to any other - no other tea has had the failures they have and the constant no-shows when it counts the most. As someone else said, the bigger the game, the bigger the choke job
 
Fogelhund said:
I keep wondering.... Eichel and Dahlin for Marner and Reilly as a basis... maybe we have to move a pick or something to even it up. ... Sign Dahlin to a 3 years x $5.5 mil bridge. It's not something Dubas would do, but Dahlin solves the LD issue.... Eichel's injury is a concern no doubt, (as is his attitude) but then we make a change in the core, as a result of Marner not showing up in the playoffs... Sure, Dahlin isn't all that proven yet either, but paired with Brodie, I could see him blossoming. Give's Buffalo some quality players now and build around.
Click to expand...

That would need a huge add from the Leafs in regards to Marner/Reilly for Eichel/Dahlin even with Eichels injury concern.
 
BlueForever75 said:
Reilly is exactly worth Krug and Faulk money and nothing more.

He plays the exact same game and he isnt worth anything more. That is a great comparable. If Reilly is looking for anything more Dubas should put an offer in front of him if he declines you deal him. Immediately.

Sorry people Reilly isnt worth it and it will be a contract the Leafs will be burdened with for years to come. I would rather have two 4 million dmen than Reilly. Simple. Develop your offensively younger dmen in Sandin, Lilly and Dermott. Trade Reilly's ass.
Click to expand...
Completely wrong by any and all measures (yet another "ignoring facts for feelings" post)....but you do you.
 
Isaac Nootin said:
That would need a huge add from the Leafs in regards to Marner/Reilly for Eichel/Dahlin even with Eichels injury concern.
Click to expand...


Not so sure. 16/44 are bonifide players and Marner owed $6mx4. Eich injury and Dahlin not bonifide. Reminds me a bit of the Jays' trade for Carter and Alomar.
 
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Dreakmur said:
It's one thing to just list a bunch of players, but you can't make a true evaluation without looking at the context of each move. I think we thought we were contenders a lot sooner than we actually were. I think last season is the first season that we should have started unloading futures for rentals.
Click to expand...
Initially, the team hoped to win while having the kids on ELC’s. It was a deep forward group, so logical.
The off-seasons (and TDL’s) before JVR and Bozak we’re UFA, the team fielded offers, but were underwhelmed.
Gards was shopped when Calvin DeHaan was a free agent, who the reported plan was to sign and gather assets.
In each of these cases, the return was viewed as less meaningful than their respective contributions to winning.
Would be nice to have those assets, but winning first has consistently been the MO of the FO.
Reasonable stance.
 
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Lumberg said:
It's years of the GM thinking they're legit contenders and not only letting people walk, but trading pics at the deadline. And this team can't be compared to any other - no other tea has had the failures they have and the constant no-shows when it counts the most. As someone else said, the bigger the game, the bigger the choke job
Click to expand...

Jacques Martin's Ottawa Senators era says hi.

I also have to ask at what point do you stop just selling assets for futures? How do you know?
 
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