GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART X

[Stigma]

Alright then...thanks for the Hagg responses. To be honest, I haven't really watched him closely over the years. He's just someone Carlo C. keeps bringing up for the Leafs to target.

 

[Sypher04]

Alright then...thanks for the Hagg responses. To be honest, I haven't really watched him closely over the years. He's just someone Carlo C. keeps bringing up for the Leafs to target.

makes sense. Colaiacovo is a moron

 

[WTFMAN99]

Liljegren is just scratching the surface of his capabilities. He's already a pretty good mid pairing defenseman for the foreseeable future. Solid skater, solid skill and solid defensively. I was a little down on him a few months ago because the Leafs refused to play him but now... I don't know why anyone would want him traded anytime soon.

Dermott is the perfect depth defenseman going into the playoffs. Especially with how injuries can pile up.

I’ve mentioned Pysyk a few times around here. I think he’d be a solid, and probably reasonably low cost option.

Not interested in moving Liljegren. Young, costa controlled asset, who looks solid and is only scratching the surface of his potential. He and sandin are untouchable to me unless we are swinging for the fences on a move. Even then not sure

Dermott, Holl & Liljegren all offer redundant skill sets. We have guys that can make a good pass, skate the puck out and help transition in Sandin, Brodie and Rielly. After that, I want 3 guys that are defensive and/or physical, you need guys like that. Ideally your skill guys to have it in them too but ours don't.

 

[SprDaVE]

Dermott, Holl & Liljegren all offer redundant skill sets. We have guys that can make a good pass, skate the puck out and help transition in Sandin, Brodie and Rielly. After that, I want 3 guys that are defensive and/or physical, you need guys like that. Ideally your skill guys to have it in them too but ours don't.

What matters is their effectiveness and how they defend. Just because they seemingly offer the same "skill set" it doesn't make them bad defensively.

The logic that you'd trade, for example, someone like Byram away just because you already have Makar, Girard and Toews on defense is really... weird.

Brodie is also someone I'd consider a defensive defenseman. So I don't get that part. Holl is nowhere near the same as Liljegren and Dermott either.

 

[Sypher04]

Dermott, Holl & Liljegren all offer redundant skill sets. We have guys that can make a good pass, skate the puck out and help transition in Sandin, Brodie and Rielly. After that, I want 3 guys that are defensive and/or physical, you need guys like that. Ideally your skill guys to have it in them too but ours don't.

i don’t disagree that we need different styles of D to be successful, we just don’t need to move Liljegren to achieve that. And I think it would be a mistake to do so. It’s not like we won’t need more than 6 going forward and into the playoffs anyway.

I’ve recently been advocating for getting Chiarot (if cost doesn’t include a 1st) and Schenn so I see it. Once Muzzin returns that would really change the complexion of our D considerably.

Rielly - Chiarot
Muzzin - Brodie
Schenn - Lyubushkin
Sandin - Liljegren

our net front would be no fun for the opposition forwards

 

[TheGroceryStick]

Rielly - ____ (internal)
Chychrun - Brodie
Muzzin - _____(internal)

Is a strong group.

Most good teams have a player on their top pair, that Leaf fans would turn their nose up to. (Hedman makes Ruuta, McAvoy makes Rielly , Slavan makes Bear etc etc)

We need to get over the "paper champ" syndrome...we did it with Hyman on L1 (Bunting for a bit too)

We have good players in every position... we need to find the right mix, promote each players ability (as long as they fit) and be able to come at teams in waves.

 

[hockeynorth]

My defensive pairs for the playoffs:

Morgan Rielly - Ilya Lyubushkin
Jake Muzzin - TJ Brodie
Rasmus Sandin - Carson Soucy

 

[WTFMAN99]

What matters is their effectiveness and how they defend. Just because they seemingly offer the same "skill set" it doesn't make them bad defensively.

The logic that you'd trade, for example, someone like Byram away just because you already have Makar, Girard and Toews on defense is really... weird.

Brodie is also someone I'd consider a defensive defenseman. So I don't get that part. Holl is nowhere near the same as Liljegren and Dermott either.

Well, Girard isn't that good defensively which is why his name has popped up time to time, likely because they don't think they'd be losing much. You're also talking about Byram/Toews/Makar/Girard vs Holl, Dermott and Liljegren, not even the same universe.

Brodie is really good in helping transition from defense to offense with his passes and skating. Holl is just slightly taller guy, he's not gritty, he's made a hit a couple times and succeeded in getting punched out a couple of times. One time Simmonds came to his defense to avenge it and then last night Domi just dummied him. Not a tough guy.

i don’t disagree that we need different styles of D to be successful, we just don’t need to move Liljegren to achieve that. And I think it would be a mistake to do so. It’s not like we won’t need more than 6 going forward and into the playoffs anyway.

I’ve recently been advocating for getting Chiarot (if cost doesn’t include a 1st) and Schenn so I see it. Once Muzzin returns that would really change the complexion of our D considerably.

Rielly - Chiarot
Muzzin - Brodie
Schenn - Lyubushkin
Sandin - Liljegren

our net front would be no fun for the opposition forwards

Chiarot can't play RD and Schenn can't play LD. Schenn shouldn't be playing heavy minutes with Rielly and yea...just not good fits.

You got Lybushkin, no need for Schenn, you need a higher quality of player.

 

[SprDaVE]

Well, Girard isn't that good defensively which is why his name has popped up time to time, likely because they don't think they'd be losing much. You're also talking about Byram/Toews/Makar/Girard vs Holl, Dermott and Liljegren, not even the same universe.

Brodie is really good in helping transition from defense to offense with his passes and skating. Holl is just slightly taller guy, he's not gritty, he's made a hit a couple times and succeeded in getting punched out a couple of times. One time Simmonds came to his defense to avenge it and then last night Domi just dummied him. Not a tough guy.
.

Brodie is really good defensively with the ability to of course help the transition game, which is important. He's not physical but he uses high hockey IQ, among other things, to be effective defensively. You want to trade Liljegren because we already have Rielly, Brodie and Sandin, thus the comparison of trading someone good just because we have 3 other defenseman that seemingly offer the same skill set. So the comparison of Rielly/Brodie/Sandin/Liljegren is VS Byram/Toews/Makar/Girard. That has nothing to do with Dermott and Holl, who are clearly done developing and they are who they are.

Being physical does not equal being good defensively. You don't have to be physical to be good defensively either. Holl, for all his faults, is pretty good defensively and using his size for blocks or using his reach. It's the one redeeming quality of his game.

 

[LeafChief]

Maybe Seattle can leave Carson Soucy behind after the leave tonight.

Can't wait to see the overreaction in here about McCann's extension.

 

[Zero1]

Damn 5x5 for McCann.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Brodie is really good defensively with the ability to of course help the transition game, which is important. He's not physical but he uses high hockey IQ, among other things, to be effective defensively. You want to trade Liljegren because we already have Rielly, Brodie and Sandin, thus the comparison of trading someone good just because we have 3 other defenseman that seemingly offer the same skill set. So the comparison of Rielly/Brodie/Sandin/Liljegren is VS Byram/Toews/Makar/Girard. That has nothing to do with Dermott and Holl, who are clearly done developing and they are who they are.

Being physical does not equal being good defensively. You don't have to be physical to be good defensively either. Holl, for all his faults, is pretty good defensively and using his size for blocks or using his reach. It's the one redeeming quality of his game.

Any good defenseman who would be here longer term, the other team will want Liljegren or Sandin.

If the cost on Chychrun is Liljegren, 1st...and we likely need to add $$ to work it out...yea I am making that deal.

Am I trading Liljegren for Chiarot? No.

 

[Legion34]

Maybe Seattle can leave Carson Soucy behind after the leave tonight.

Can't wait to see the overreaction in here about McCann's extension.

We couldn’t have afforded that…… either could Pitt.

 

[Sypher04]

Chiarot can't play RD

Not sure that’s true, but either way they just were meant as examples stylistically. Not married to specific names

 

[Judas Tavares]

Maybe Seattle can leave Carson Soucy behind after the leave tonight.

Can't wait to see the overreaction in here about McCann's extension.

People will probably be steaming, but the reality is if he were here, he would probably have 12-15ish goals, not 21, and people would be complaining the contract was an overpay, which happens here with every player other than league minimum Spezza. But since we don't have McCann and we tend to want what we can't have, complain and overreact away.

 

[Cor]

Muzzin will be back before the playoffs it feels like. Already back skating and he’s only missed two weeks. Obviously with concussions you never know, as he could do this workout today and then have symptoms tonight or tomorrow morning and be back at square one, however given he was at the arena watching practice shortly after likely means he wasn’t suffering from severe symptoms.

All that to say, I fully expect Rielly, Brodie. Muzzin, Lybushkin, Sandin and then either Liljegren or Holl to be the d-core heading into the playoffs.

Perhaps I’m pessimistic but I just don’t see the value in giving up assets to remove Timothy Liljegren from the lineup, given how he has played, and even Justin Holl has looked much better the last 10 or so games.

I think Nick Robertson has looked good on Line 2 and if there’s a possibility to grab another 3rd/4th liner on the cheap you can do so, though I don’t think it’s necessary. Forward wise, unless we are trading Robertson + whatever for a guy like Forsberg to go all in, I’m not sure what the point is.

To me, the priority needs to be goaltending. It’s been the only consistent hole over the last couple of months. Even with average goaltending, we are likely on top of the division right now.

If I’m Kyle Dubas, I’m doing whatever it takes to convince Fleury to come here and working out that deal with Chicago.

 

[DraftSchmaft]

Maybe Seattle can leave Carson Soucy behind after the leave tonight.

Can't wait to see the overreaction in here about McCann's extension.

I dunno....now that he makes 5 mil I more expect it's team Kerfoot now lol. No thanks for 5 mil.

 

[ACC1224]

Damn 5x5 for McCann.

Look at the bright side, they still have Holl.

What does 5x5 translate to in Dubas dollars?

 

[LeafChief]

I dunno....now that he makes 5 mil I more expect it's team Kerfoot now lol. No thanks for 5 mil.

Personally I'd like to see Kerfoot moved. Not that he's been bad at all. Having a solid year. Just that he's a lesser version of our top players and doesn't bring a different element. Would love to see his 3.5 AAV spent on a winger that can crash and bang.

 

[Legion34]

Look at the bright side, they still have Holl.

What does 5x5 translate to in Dubas dollars?

No tax state? About 5.5-5.75

 

[SprDaVE]

Muzzin will be back before the playoffs it feels like. Already back skating and he’s only missed two weeks. Obviously with concussions you never know, as he could do this workout today and then have symptoms tonight or tomorrow morning and be back at square one, however given he was at the arena watching practice shortly after likely means he wasn’t suffering from severe symptoms.

All that to say, I fully expect Rielly, Brodie. Muzzin, Lybushkin, Sandin and then either Liljegren or Holl to be the d-core heading into the playoffs.

Perhaps I’m pessimistic but I just don’t see the value in giving up assets to remove Timothy Liljegren from the lineup, given how he has played, and even Justin Holl has looked much better the last 10 or so games.

I think Nick Robertson has looked good on Line 2 and if there’s a possibility to grab another 3rd/4th liner on the cheap you can do so, though I don’t think it’s necessary. Forward wise, unless we are trading Robertson + whatever for a guy like Forsberg to go all in, I’m not sure what the point is.

To me, the priority needs to be goaltending. It’s been the only consistent hole over the last couple of months. Even with average goaltending, we are likely on top of the division right now.

If I’m Kyle Dubas, I’m doing whatever it takes to convince Fleury to come here and working out that deal with Chicago.

Yeah seems really likely Muzzin is back before the playoffs, or at the very least for the playoffs. We'll see in the next few weeks.

I am not convinced the Leafs are overly confident in Liljegren and Sandin going into the playoffs for some reason. They are really testing them right now, and they are doing well, but I think Dubas is thinking of adding a veteran that can play regardless of Muzzin being back or not. Not saying he would trade Sandin or Liljegren but just using them as depth. I disagree with doing it, but just a gut feeling.

Some one like say, Calvin De Haan who is a pretty good defensive defenseman veteran that can play LD or RD. Chiarot probably fits this as well (I know I know).

I have very little interest in adding a goaltender. Fleury seems ok if Chicago takes Mrazek back but he doesn't want to be moved, so I don't really like his motivation already.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Yeah seems really likely Muzzin is back before the playoffs, or at the very least for the playoffs. We'll see in the next few weeks.

I am not convinced the Leafs are overly confident in Liljegren and Sandin going into the playoffs for some reason. They are really testing them right now, and they are doing well, but I think Dubas is thinking of adding a veteran that can play regardless of Muzzin being back or not. Not saying he would trade Sandin or Liljegren but just using them as depth. I disagree with doing it, but just a gut feeling.

Some one like say, Calvin De Haan who is a pretty good defensive defenseman veteran that can play LD or RD. Chiarot probably fits this as well (I know I know).

I have very little interest in adding a goaltender. Fleury seems ok if Chicago takes Mrazek back but he doesn't want to be moved, so I don't really like his motivation already.

I can tell you as someone with Chicago as their 2nd team...CDH is not that good...don't listen to charts (I don't know what they show) etc etc.. Bad shoulders, maybe 3rd pairing quality and don't even think about putting him at RD.

Hagel was someone I have been talking about since last year but seems like the rest of the hockey world caught on.

 

[CDN24]

Ok let's be realistic here. He's far from awful. What he is, is being in an absolute awful team who's goalies can't even save a beach ball. Chiarot is what Muzzin was when he first got here, less offense but more defense. Which personally I believe is exactly what this team needs.

Exactly this. Habs starting goalie has played 0 games, backup has played 24. An assortment of 3rd/4th and 5th string guys have played the rest. Chiarot is also not a black hole offensively. His 7G 9A and 16 points would tie him for second on Leafs D for points with Brodie and those 7 goals would be 1st on the Leafs.

Come playoff time he plays a real heavy game and is tough to play against. Not sure what the cost would be to acquire him but he is exactly the type of D this team needs. It will cut down on the rebound chances and tips that the Leafs goalies are seeing. He has no issues playing on the 2nd pair.

 

[Cor]

Yeah seems really likely Muzzin is back before the playoffs, or at the very least for the playoffs. We'll see in the next few weeks.

I am not convinced the Leafs are overly confident in Liljegren and Sandin going into the playoffs for some reason. They are really testing them right now, and they are doing well, but I think Dubas is thinking of adding a veteran that can play regardless of Muzzin being back or not. Not saying he would trade Sandin or Liljegren but just using them as depth. I disagree with doing it, but just a gut feeling.

Some one like say, Calvin De Haan who is a pretty good defensive defenseman veteran that can play LD or RD. Chiarot probably fits this as well (I know I know).

I have very little interest in adding a goaltender. Fleury seems ok if Chicago takes Mrazek back but he doesn't want to be moved, so I don't really like his motivation already.

Liljegren provides as much defensive impact as CDH and much much more than Ben Chiarot.

Why are we giving up assets for older players to play over our talented young players that are establishing themselves? Makes no sense. If Muzzin was done for the year, then I can see us adding someone like CDH to replace him.

It also hasn’t been confirmed Fleury doesn’t want to be moved. There’s been mixed reports and article today quoted Allan Walsh saying “no decisions have been made and all options are on the table”

 

[kb]

Look at the bright side, they still have Holl.

What does 5x5 translate to in Dubas dollars?

Probably $3.75-$4 x 4