GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART V

[dubplatepressure]

If FLA and TB are the kind of teams in on Chychrun, then I want to win that bidding war even if it's a bit of an overpay.

Sandin, Knies, 1st rounder.

But if it's teams like NYR bidding I'm not so interested in winning that bidding war.

That's a hefty price to pay for a team who IMO doesn't have a terribly deep prospect pool. I suppose we should all kind of expect more of these win-now moves though - the time to develop prospects with 2-3 year timelines was a few years ago and our core players are in their prime now.

 

[LeafSteel]

Trades with Knies in them are like fingernails on a chalkboard.

He should not be traded under any circumstances.

Knies, Topi, Amirov represent future talent at cap friendly ELC’s.

They need to stay in our pipeline. Period.

 

[TMLAM34]

To Toronto: Connor Murphy + Marc Andre Fleury (50% retained)
To Chicago: Petr Mrazek + Travis Dermott + Nick Ritchie + Nicholas Abruzzese


A deal like this would be the best course of action to take for the Leafs. Trading players like Kerfoot or Muzzin during the season when the team sits in the top 10 in the league probably isn’t the best move for team chemistry.

Imagine a backend of:

Rielly - Murphy
Muzzin - Brodie
Sandin - Liljegren

Campbell - Fleury

 

[Leafs at Knight]

I want what you guys are drinking.

"am I out of touch?" "no it's the children who are wrong", vibes from you.

 

[aingefan]

Trades with Knies in them are like fingernails on a chalkboard.

He should not be traded under any circumstances.

Knies, Topi, Amirov represent future talent at cap friendly ELC’s.

They need to stay in our pipeline. Period.

I generally agree, but it takes willingness and confidence from the team to trust those players through their learning curves.
It’s been more the case this year than the couple before, and hopefully a trend that continues.
The cap seems to have resulted in more good talent available at a shade over ELC though, and a competitive team has to weigh those options.

 

[zeke]

Trades with Knies in them are like fingernails on a chalkboard.

He should not be traded under any circumstances.

Knies, Topi, Amirov represent future talent at cap friendly ELC’s.

They need to stay in our pipeline. Period.

Unless you're trading for a young cost controlled core-caliber player, of course.

Not sure if Chychrun is that guy, but if our scouts (and TB and FLA's scouts) think he is then I'm willing to throw in a very good winger prospect to get him

 

[Judas Tavares]

Who are some sneaky big name targets that are out there? Not the normal big names we always see like Chychrun or Klingberg. Someone with 2-4 years left on their deal, on a middling or weak team looking to start a rebuild. I wonder if there is a surprise name that can be unearthed to be the team's big fish at deadline day, rather than a bidding war for the talked about names.

 

[deprw]

Unless you're trading for a young cost controlled core-caliber player, of course.

Not sure if Chychrun is that guy, but if our scouts (and TB and FLA's scouts) think he is then I'm willing to throw in a very good winger prospect to get him

He has great contract and if seen suitable by our scouts would be one of those players I would use our top prospects to trade for. Though it would affect our back end in long run, because I don't know if we could then keep Rielly, Muzzin ja Brodie with Chychrun.

Though I don't see us having assets to make that trade.

 

[showtime8]

Who are some sneaky big name targets that are out there? Not the normal big names we always see like Chychrun or Klingberg. Someone with 2-4 years left on their deal, on a middling or weak team looking to start a rebuild. I wonder if there is a surprise name that can be unearthed to be the team's big fish at deadline day, rather than a bidding war for the talked about names.

I think there will be a couple names from Seattle that could be out there that the media isn't mentioning.

With a team that is likely not going to be in the playoffs and want to build a good system, I bet you could get Vince Dunn or Jaden Schwartz. I'm not sure there would be anything that would work with Toronto, but that's a team that could be a good spot for teams to dump contracts.

 

[pspot]

To Toronto: Connor Murphy + Marc Andre Fleury (50% retained)
To Chicago: Petr Mrazek + Travis Dermott + Nick Ritchie + Nicholas Abruzzese


A deal like this would be the best course of action to take for the Leafs. Trading players like Kerfoot or Muzzin during the season when the team sits in the top 10 in the league probably isn’t the best move for team chemistry.

Imagine a backend of:

Rielly - Murphy
Muzzin - Brodie
Sandin - Liljegren

Campbell - Fleury

IMO forget MAF, get Strome, pair him with Marner
roll
Bunting/Matthews/Nylander
Strome/JT/Marner

Also gives them the ability to go 4 deep which they made need for playoffs

Bunting/Matthews/Nylander
Mik/Strome/Marner
Kerfoot/JT/Simmonds or Spezza

 

[MoreMogilny]

Unless you're trading for a young cost controlled core-caliber player, of course.

Not sure if Chychrun is that guy, but if our scouts (and TB and FLA's scouts) think he is then I'm willing to throw in a very good winger prospect to get him

If the rumoured cost of 3 first round picks (equivalent to past years)+ is accurate, then we are likely out of the running, or about to mortgage a significant portion of our future for one D that I’m not convinced pushes the needle far enough.

While I’m open to moving solid prospects for assets controlled beyond this season, I’d hesitate with just how much we’d need to surrender for any one player.

Trading Knies would be a tough pill to swallow in any deal. I’d hope he’s near the top of Dubas’ list of guys he’d like to avoid moving.

 

[Scion]

I wouldn't trade Knies or Robertson for Chychrun personally. The Leafs need cheap young talent that is close and it would take more than what I think Chychrun is to justify it. That said, I'm also lower on Chychrun than most.

 

[TMLAM34]

IMO forget MAF, get Strome, pair him with Marner
roll
Bunting/Matthews/Nylander
Strome/JT/Marner

Also gives them the ability to go 4 deep which they made need for playoffs

Bunting/Matthews/Nylander
Mik/Strome/Marner
Kerfoot/JT/Simmonds or Spezza

Strome is pretty awful. Chicago probably won’t even give him a QO this summer so I’d rather just wait to sign him.

Fleury gives us a very good insurance policy in net for the playoffs and also frees up Mrazek’s contract in the summer to use towards re-signing Campbell.

 

[zeke]

If the rumoured cost of 3 first round picks (equivalent to past years)+ is accurate, then we are likely out of the running,

the package i put together matches that pretty closely, and I'd say it's one I'd do if the scouts think Chychrun is a legit core calibre piece.

 

[Scion]

That's a hefty price to pay for a team who IMO doesn't have a terribly deep prospect pool. I suppose we should all kind of expect more of these win-now moves though - the time to develop prospects with 2-3 year timelines was a few years ago and our core players are in their prime now.

I think the opposite is true. Because of how capped out the Leafs are it is more critical than ever to develop and promote cheap young talent to remain competitive. I also think it's a fools gamble to go 'all in' in the Atlantic division. The best bet is to remain competitive for as long as possible and hope to get lucky one year.

 

[pspot]

Strome is pretty awful. Chicago probably won’t even give him a QO this summer so I’d rather just wait to sign him.

Fleury gives us a very good insurance policy in net for the playoffs and also frees up Mrazek’s contract in the summer to use towards re-signing Campbell.

I don't know what's been going on with him, he's currently their number 1 C and has 5 pts in last 6 games. I think they are trying to figure out how to get he and Dach into top 6 ....probably showcasing him right now

For sure think a vet back up would be great. I was saying Holtby and Faksa before

 

[Scion]

Trades with Knies in them are like fingernails on a chalkboard.

He should not be traded under any circumstances.

Knies, Topi, Amirov represent future talent at cap friendly ELC’s.

They need to stay in our pipeline. Period.

I think there are definitely circumstances you trade Knies, but for me it would take alot. His combination of size, grit, skill and passing ability doesn't really exist in the game right now. I personally have him ranked as the Leafs best prospect by quite a margin in terms of ceiling.

 

[MoreMogilny]

the package i put together matches that pretty closely, and I'd say it's one I'd do if the scouts think Chychrun is a legit core calibre piece.

Sorry I didn’t see your proposal on the previous page.

I could certainly be comfortable with a package containing Sandin. That allows us to keep a few of our potential impact prospects.

I guess it would depend on what Arizona thinks about Sandin. I’m sure a number of teams aren’t offering solid young roster players to their proposals which could be a plus.

Like you said though, if it’s a bidding war type of situation and a team like NYR or LA is willing to flex their muscle we simply cannot compete with the type of high end prospects they have.

 

[Jozay]

Leafs should keep their firsts and top prospects.

Probably just trade a 2nd for a guy who can be in the lineup everyday I guess. Maybe on the D or maybe up front.

Sucks when you trade a first round pick to get out of the Marleau contract and then another one for Nick Foligno. Things might be different if they used those picks better.

 

[Stigma]

I think there are definitely circumstances you trade Knies, but for me it would take alot. His combination of size, grit, skill and passing ability doesn't really exist in the game right now. I personally have him ranked as the Leafs best prospect by quite a margin in terms of ceiling.

I agree with this. His combo of strengths are very rare these days. All of our other prospects are replaceable.

 

[zeke]

Sorry I didn’t see your proposal on the previous page.

I could certainly be comfortable with a package containing Sandin. That allows us to keep a few of our potential impact prospects.

I guess it would depend on what Arizona thinks about Sandin. I’m sure a number of teams aren’t offering solid young roster players to their proposals which could be a plus.

Like you said though, if it’s a bidding war type of situation and a team like NYR or LA is willing to flex their muscle we simply cannot compete with the type of high end prospects they have.

Not just that the Rangers might outbid us z but more that I don't trust the Rangers talent evaluation.

But if it's teams like FLA and TB bidding then I trust their talent evaluation and would be much more inclined to outbid them even if its an overpay.

 

[MoreMogilny]

Leafs should keep their firsts and top prospects.

Probably just trade a 2nd for a guy who can be in the lineup everyday I guess. Maybe on the D or maybe up front.

Sucks when you trade a first round pick to get out of the Marleau contract and then another one for Nick Foligno. Things might be different if they used those picks better.

We are seeing good teams getting their recent first rounders into the fold quickly which helps drive depth.

The Leafs certainly had the opportunity to do that but at this stage with the trades made in the past and Amirov’s injury, there isn’t really anyone who is close to contributing in a meaningful way.

That leaves Dubas at a crossroads. Either double down and utilize future assets to support the core you’re going with, or sit back, and hope your team fares better in the playoffs than they’ve been able to since 2016.

I’m no mind reader but I’d guess he’s leaning towards the former.

I’m sure the plans made around the team hinged on the cap continuing to rise, but unfortunately nobody could predict the pandemic so here we are.

While I wholeheartedly support not surrendering first round picks in pursuit of rental players, I don’t think Dubas really has any other option. The years with this core won’t last forever as more contracts expire and players look for raises, or to depart the team altogether.

My hopes are that Dubas makes the best “hockey trade” he can and acquires asset(s) that can contribute to this team through next season at the very least. Either way, I don’t think our current lineup cuts it against teams like Tampa or Florida in our division, or some of the top teams that would be along the path to the top.

 

[TML1967]

Who are some sneaky big name targets that are out there? Not the normal big names we always see like Chychrun or Klingberg. Someone with 2-4 years left on their deal, on a middling or weak team looking to start a rebuild. I wonder if there is a surprise name that can be unearthed to be the team's big fish at deadline day, rather than a bidding war for the talked about names.

Would Hagel fall into this? He plays a similar game to Bunting, but with a bit more skill IMO.
His numbers look good, and 2 more years at $1.5m. If he can replace Kerfoot, you can either drop Kerfoot down to the third line, or move him while his value is high. If you keep him, your depth starts looking pretty insane when healthy.

Bunting-Matthews-Marner
Hagel- Tavares-Nylander
Mikheyev-Kerfoot-Kase
Engval-Kamf-Spezza/Simmons

 

[TheShape]

To Toronto: Connor Murphy + Marc Andre Fleury (50% retained)
To Chicago: Petr Mrazek + Travis Dermott + Nick Ritchie + Nicholas Abruzzese


A deal like this would be the best course of action to take for the Leafs. Trading players like Kerfoot or Muzzin during the season when the team sits in the top 10 in the league probably isn’t the best move for team chemistry.

Imagine a backend of:

Rielly - Murphy
Muzzin - Brodie
Sandin - Liljegren

Campbell - Fleury

No. Chicago are selling low on Murphy here and would get more value trading the two separately.

 

[Americanadian]

To LAK: Muzzin, Hirvonen, Amirov/Robertson, Ritchie, 2022 1st
To TOR: Arvidsson, Roy

Cap in: 7.4M
Cap out: 8.125M

Reasoning for Leafs: Leafs need a minute eating RHD. Roy fills that void and has 2 years after this at 3.15M. Muzzin is slowing down and the Leafs would benefit from moving on from his contract. LA may be the only place he waives his NMC for. Arvidsson is a better defensive and offensive LW than Kerfoot for the 2nd line. Both players have 2 years left after this season.

Reasoning for LA: LAK have the best RHD depth in the league maybe: Doughty, Roy, Walker all capable of 20 mins/game. Durzi, Grans, Faber, Clarke are all in the system. Muzzin can help shepherd the new crop of RHD. Arvidsson has played well this year for LAK and they have a chance to cash out on a half season for more assets than they gave up.

To SEA: Kerfoot
To TOR: Soucy

Cap in: 2.75M
Cap out: 3.5M

Reasoning: Rumor was SEA wanted Kerfoot at the expansion draft until McCann became available. SEA picks up offense for defense.

Leafs lines:

Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Arvidsson - Tavares - Nylander
Mikheyev - Kampf - Kase
Engvall - Spezza - Simmonds

Rielly - Brodie
Soucy - Roy
Sandin - Liljegren

Campbell
Mrazek

Total cap savings: 1.475M