Speculation: Trade and Free Agency Talk - 2022-23 Edition - Postseason Success can't be a Myth!

[BuiumSaveUs]

Huh? Do you mean Boldy?

Wow autopiloted on that. That’s how you know it’s bad lol

 

[StateofCelly]

I mean, anybody with eyes can see that Addison isn't playing well defensively. I think they might be more frustrated that Addison appears to be content with where he's at, or at least the perception of being content.

Yeah but his D-partner has been equally as bad in the defensive zone, and not remotely as productive on offense, regardless of if its only due to PP time. One brings value to the team, the other is simply just below average at everything. Yet the one with the potential to learn and grow the part of his game he has struggled with is in the press box, while the 6th-7th d man at best seems to be free of any accountability

 

[57special]

I mean, anybody with eyes can see that Addison isn't playing well defensively. I think they might be more frustrated that Addison appears to be content with where he's at, or at least the perception of being content.

I don’t see that he is any worse than Goligoski or Merrill. There is a perception that Merrill is physical, because he is tall, but he is a p***ycat. Both are slower than Addison, and don’t get to pucks, so they don’t even get to be able to make a turnover. Merrill and Middleton are also far less confident and skilled handling the puck.
Our PP was mediocre last year, and the year before that, and the year before that, etc. They are now in the top 6. The only major change in the cast was using Addison, yet everyone seems to ignore that, and complain about his lack of 5 v 5 scoring. Scoring counts, no matter where you do it. He leads all rookie Dmen in scoring, over hyped early first rounders like Power and Sanderson, and by a good bit! He’s a specialist, and vg at what he does, and Dean is treating him like a 5 th wheel… it’s insane.

What Addison needs is encouragement to handle the puck more, and not have Dean jumping on him every time he makes a mistake. That’s what has him playing scared, and is hindering his development. I see Goligoski making bad pinches, Merril coughing up pucks or making like Nate Prosser, and Dumba repeatedly making turnovers, yet never a word in public about that.

Dean is doing the classic, bullying/ browbeating of a young player that he does because he can’t do it to an older player. He also seems to have a problem dealing with talented, but occasionally erratic, offensive players. With creative offensive players, you get mistakes. You live with them, manage when and where you play the player, and practice( oh, wait) fixing them. You don’t throw away a useful talent because he has a couple of flaws.

If he costs a 3rd or less to acquire I don’t see the big deal. If some other team outbids us, that’s fine. At least we can say we tried to improve the scoring depth.

A 3rd, absolutely.

 

[Minnewildsota]

I don’t see that he is any worse than Goligoski or Merrill. There is a perception that Merrill is physical, because he is tall, but he is a p***ycat. Both are slower than Addison, and don’t get to pucks, so they don’t even get to be able to make a turnover. Merrill and Middleton are also far less confident and skilled handling the puck.
Our PP was mediocre last year, and the year before that, and the year before that, etc. They are now in the top 6. The only major change in the cast was using Addison, yet everyone seems to ignore that, and complain about his lack of 5 v 5 scoring. Scoring counts, no matter where you do it. He leads all rookie Dmen in scoring, over hyped early first rounders like Power and Sanderson, and by a good bit! He’s a specialist, and vg at what he does, and Dean is treating him like a 5 th wheel… it’s insane.

What Addison needs is encouragement to handle the puck more, and not have Dean jumping on him every time he makes a mistake. That’s what has him playing scared, and is hindering his development. I see Goligoski making bad pinches, Merril coughing up pucks or making like Nate Prosser, and Dumba repeatedly making turnovers, yet never a word in public about that.

Dean is doing the classic, bullying/ browbeating of a young player that he does because he can’t do it to an older player. He also seems to have a problem dealing with talented, but occasionally erratic, offensive players. With creative offensive players, you get mistakes. You live with them, manage when and where you play the player, and practice( oh, wait) fixing them. You don’t throw away a useful talent because he has a couple of flaws.

Right, because he's clashed, and benched, Kaprisov so many times. This is all speculation based upon what people say on the forums and it snowballed into "Dean doesn't ...!"

It might be a weird concept but you know what you're getting with Goli and Merrill. Addison has the ability to be better. Why not challenge him? Benching him is a challenge sent to the player to be better.

 

[Digitalbooya]

I'll keep the lazy comparison going as long as it fits, but McDonagh had 18 points in 43 games in his 3rd college year.


You don't need to think long-term with Addison yet. You need to see what he's like 2 years from now.

Yep and that was on a loaded Wisconsin team too. Almost the entire defense was made up of future NHLers. Ryan McDonagh, Brendan Smith, Justin Schultz, Cody Goloubef, and Jake Gardiner. And just to be clear, McDonagh was outscored by Smith and Schultz. Points are not a great indicator for who the better dman is going to be in the NHL.

 

[57special]

Yea - I much prefer the opinions of fans that fancy themselves scouts after watching some hockey and listening to play by play guys for a few years.

Well, it’s really 60 years, and I grew up playing with a couple of pretty good Dmen, even pairing with a guy who had a long NHL career, but ok. Motzko knows more about hockey than I do, but he is in a different situation than I am. His job is to get his players to play for him, not to assess their abilities in an unbiased way for the media.

Are you really naive enough to think that coaches and GM’s tell you what they really think about players, publicly, in most cases? I bet you can go down the list of Motzko’s players, and if he is asked about them publicly, he will shower them with praise.

 

[Minnewildsota]

Well, it’s really 60 years, and I grew up playing with a couple of pretty good Dmen, even pairing with a guy who had a long NHL career, but ok. Motzko knows more about hockey than I do, but he is in a different situation than I am.

Are you really naive enough to think that coaches and GM’s tell you what they really think about players, publicly, in most cases? I bet you can go down the list of Motzko’s players, and if he is asked about them publicly, he will shower them with praise.

Yeah, but I believe there's a difference between spitting PR. "Oh, this player is good", rather than actually giving praise "This is the best player on the team".

 

[Obvious Fabertism]

I’m fine making changes at the deadline in hopes of winning some rounds in a weak western conference, though I’m skeptical it would work. However, I’ll play along. Let’s start with some ground rules. Our first is off the table. Kane is not getting moved without a first going the other way. End of story. The Ghost of ROR just got moved for a 1st, 2nd and 3rd.

The defense is great. Gus is great. We need secondary scoring. Priority 1 has to be to get Fiala.. ummm I mean Boldy… someone to play with. Addison for Beertuzzi? Sure. I’d hope Beetuzzi is a guy that we’d consider resigning if we can get a good deal and he fits well. Greenway needs to be moved for a better player. I’m game for Kapanen, though I haven’t watched him in a while. I’d keep dumba. The d core is good and you’re not going to get much for him. If you want sheary that’s fine but I think he’s more of a 4th line guy. Let’s toss a 3rd and the 4th we just got for him.

Here’s what I’m ok with. Add minor prospects and picks where you need to get it done.

Kaprizov-Hartman-Zuccarello
Boldy-Gaudreau-Bertuzzi/Kapanen
Foligno-Ek-Bertuzzi/Kapanen
Sheary-Dewar-Dihaime
Reaves

Middleton-Spurgeon
Brodin-Dumba
Goose-Merril
Faber

Gus Bus

I am ok with these moves, though the thought of a Kap-Zucc-Kane power play gives me a tingling feeling…

 

[StateofCelly]

Right, because he's clashed, and benched, Kaprisov so many times. This is all speculation based upon what people say on the forums and it snowballed into "Dean doesn't ...!"

It might be a weird concept but you know what you're getting with Goli and Merrill. Addison has the ability to be better. Why not challenge him? Benching him is a challenge sent to the player to be better.

Then why not do the same with the others? Everyone complains about what Boldy played with for talent half of the season, but yet try to justify Addison being paired with Merrill.

 

[BuiumSaveUs]

I am ok with these moves, though the thought of a Kap-Zucc-Kane power play gives me a tingling feeling…

I think you almost have to go 5 forwards in that situation. It would be awesome but I just can’t justify giving up a 1st for a month of Kane. Maybe Billy can. I don’t know, but it’d certainly be taking a shot.

 

[Minnewildsota]

Then why not do the same with the others? Everyone complains about what Boldy played with for talent half of the season, but yet try to justify Addison being paired with Merrill.

Who do you mean by "the others"?

 

[MNRube]

Then why not do the same with the others? Everyone complains about what Boldy played with for talent half of the season, but yet try to justify Addison being paired with Merrill.

You can’t have Addison in the Top 4. It’s too small a group. He would surely make a fine pair with Brodin in an alternate universe where we have Ekblad or Dobson as our 1RD instead of the diminutive Spurgeon.

 

[57special]

I’m fine making changes at the deadline in hopes of winning some rounds in a weak western conference, though I’m skeptical it would work. However, I’ll play along. Let’s start with some ground rules. Our first is off the table. Kane is not getting moved without a first going the other way. End of story. The Ghost of ROR just got moved for a 1st, 2nd and 3rd.

The defense is great. Gus is great. We need secondary scoring. Priority 1 has to be to get Fiala.. ummm I mean Boldy… someone to play with. Addison for Beertuzzi? Sure. I’d hope Beetuzzi is a guy that we’d consider resigning if we can get a good deal and he fits well. Greenway needs to be moved for a better player. I’m game for Kapanen, though I haven’t watched him in a while. I’d keep dumba. The d core is good and you’re not going to get much for him. If you want sheary that’s fine but I think he’s more of a 4th line guy. Let’s toss a 3rd and the 4th we just got for him.

Here’s what I’m ok with. Add minor prospects and picks where you need to get it done.

Kaprizov-Hartman-Zuccarello
Boldy-Gaudreau-Bertuzzi/Kapanen
Foligno-Ek-Bertuzzi/Kapanen
Sheary-Dewar-Dihaime
Reaves

Middleton-Spurgeon
Brodin-Dumba
Goose-Merril
Faber

Gus Bus

I think that keeping Goli, Dumba, and Merrill over Addison is borderline insane, but I guess I am alone in that. Trading him for anoft injured guy like Bertuzzi who will be next to impossible to re- sign next year will only compound the insanity, for me.

If we opt to trade our top scoring rookie Dman, for a mid 1st, sure, or maybe a really nice C prospect, ok, but for a couple of months of Bertuzzi, with this team? Crazy, to me. We have two vg Dmen in Brodin and Spurge. The rest are replaceable drek, with the xception of Addison, who is a specialist that has done a remarkable job this year on the PP. Spurgeon couldn’t do it, Suter couldn’t do it, Dumba couldn’t do it(maybe for a while 5 years ago).

Oh, and Addison is getting paid something like 880 K, not 7.5M like Suter or Spurgeon, or 6M like Dumba.

 

[Minnewildsota]

I think that keeping Goli, Dumba, and Merrill over Addison is borderline insane, but I guess I am alone in that. Trading him for anoft injured guy like Bertuzzi who will be next to impossible to re- sign next year will only compound the insanity, for me.

If we opt to trade our top scoring rookie Dman, for a mid 1st, sure, or maybe a really nice C prospect, ok, but for a couple of months of Bertuzzi, with this team? Crazy, to me. We have two vg Dmen in Brodin and Spurge. The rest are replaceable drek, with the xception of Addison, who is a specialist that has done a remarkable job this year on the PP. Spurgeon couldn’t do it, Suter couldn’t do it, Dumba couldn’t do it(maybe for a while 5 years ago).

Oh, and Addison is getting paid something like 880 K, not 7.5M like Suter or Spurgeon, or 6M like Dumba.

I'm with you on most of those points.

 

[57special]

I am ok with these moves, though the thought of a Kap-Zucc-Kane power play gives me a tingling feeling…

Kane and Boldy, also.

 

[57special]

I think you almost have to go 5 forwards in that situation. It would be awesome but I just can’t justify giving up a 1st for a month of Kane. Maybe Billy can. I don’t know, but it’d certainly be taking a shot.

You wonder if they would go for a guy like Lambos or Spacek instead of a mid/ late first, but CHI has a lot of D prospects. Hate to offer Bankier, and don’t know if they would go for him anyway. Bankier + 2nd?

Kane would be next to impossible to re-sign, also. I think he goes to Buffalo, if they can get their act together. They have a quite a few prospects to offer like Krebs, Peterka, and the like, and should be desperate to make the playoffs

 

[57special]

I think you almost have to go 5 forwards in that situation. It would be awesome but I just can’t justify giving up a 1st for a month of Kane. Maybe Billy can. I don’t know, but it’d certainly be taking a shot.

Net PP is a thing. 5 forwards invariably give up SHG’s, especially when the best defensive player, JEE, is playing down low.
In special circumstances, sure, like when you are down a goal late in the game, but otherwise…Forwards just don’t understand how to play on the Blue line, and can’t defend a rush, just like most Dmen can’t cycle down low, or play in the slot.

 

[BuiumSaveUs]

I think that keeping Goli, Dumba, and Merrill over Addison is borderline insane, but I guess I am alone in that. Trading him for anoft injured guy like Bertuzzi who will be next to impossible to re- sign next year will only compound the insanity, for me.

If we opt to trade our top scoring rookie Dman, for a mid 1st, sure, or maybe a really nice C prospect, ok, but for a couple of months of Bertuzzi, with this team? Crazy, to me. We have two vg Dmen in Brodin and Spurge. The rest are replaceable drek, with the xception of Addison, who is a specialist that has done a remarkable job this year on the PP. Spurgeon couldn’t do it, Suter couldn’t do it, Dumba couldn’t do it(maybe for a while 5 years ago).

Oh, and Addison is getting paid something like 880 K, not 7.5M like Suter or Spurgeon, or 6M like Dumba.

I don’t disagree on most of these point. I do vlaue Addison a bit less than most, but I still think he’s absolutely being mishandled.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Here we go

 

[BuiumSaveUs]

I’m fine with Boeser at the right price

 

[StateofCelly]

You can’t have Addison in the Top 4. It’s too small a group. He would surely make a fine pair with Brodin in an alternate universe where we have Ekblad or Dobson as our 1RD instead of the diminutive Spurgeon.

Not arguing that he should be top 4, I am arguing the quality of what he is sent out with every night. A guy who is learning the defensive end could be paired with someone more defensively sound, maybe even Goli. Yet Merrill makes mistake after mistake, and the brunt of it is put on the rookie that is atleast contributing. Calen is not a top 4 guy yet, and may never be... but pairing him with a defensive liability isn't going to help his confidence at all.

Who do you mean by "the others"?

Guys like Merrill, Greenway, Foligno, Reaves, there are plenty of guys that have deserved a few rides in the elevator. Yet keep getting propped up in positions for them to succeed, rather than putting strong players with players to support them.

 

[Digitalbooya]

I’m fine with Boeser at the right price

Same here. But any sort of trade has to have either the right amount of retention or say goodbye to Greenway and Foligno. If it’s the second thing, you better hope the price is cheap. Otherwise there is literally no reason Guerin can justify the Fiala trade.

 

[BuiumSaveUs]

The whole Boeser thing would just kinda be a slap in the face with all the Fiala BS that happened

 

[StateofCelly]

The whole Boeser thing would just kinda be a slap in the face with all the Fiala BS that happened

Honestly reading the article it seems like its more Hankinson just trying to draw interest to the player more than it is Billy showing true interest.

 

[ThatGuy22]

I’m fine with Boeser at the right price

How to get to that right price is near impossible seems to me. They'd have to retain half for next season. Greenway would obviously have to go the other way. What other pieces would they require to retain half when they are in their own cap crunch.

Seems impossible.

The whole Boeser thing would just kinda be a slap in the face with all the Fiala BS that happened

The only way it works is if they retain half (and we likely pay dearly for it). So Boeser at 3.25 and Fiala at 8 are apples and oranges.