Speculation: Trade and Free Agency Talk - 2022-23 Edition - Postseason Success can't be a Myth!

[f7ben]

It’s like nobody on this board even watches games. Has nobody watched the wild the last month? This team doesn’t even remotely pass the eye test as even a bubble team. They are bad and the next 10 games will end the playoff hunt for this year. There never should have been a playoff hunt this year. That was ended with tossing Fiala away. Now it’s rebuild time and Kap gets to ride it out and then leave. Plan for the team to be competitive again in 3-4 years. That’s the best plan.

 

[Minnewildsota]

It’s like nobody on this board even watches games. Has nobody watched the wild the last month? This team doesn’t even remotely pass the eye test as even a bubble team. They are bad and the next 10 games will end the playoff hunt for this year. There never should have been a playoff hunt this year. That was ended with tossing Fiala away. Now it’s rebuild time and Kap gets to ride it out and then leave. Plan for the team to be competitive again in 3-4 years. That’s the best plan.

Correct. Nobody here has watched a single game. We all just play the games in our head and extrapolate from that. Good catch.

 

[BuiumSaveUs]

I would personally prefer a rocky finish to the year, which is exactly why I know they’ll pick it up a bit and stay in the hunt until the very end.

 

[Wildabeast]

So, trying to reconfigure the team on the fly never works because it didn't work with the Granlund era Wild but you can't think of any long-term tankjob rebuilds that didn't produce a champion? I can think of plenty of teams that made the finals (and even won some of them) without a scorched earth rebuild and weren't considered contenders. They rode a hot goalie, made a smart trade, found value outside of the top 5 picks in the draft. People can disagree on the best path forward but no one KNOWS the future.

Sports are a distraction. The large majority of people would rather have a fringe playoff team that can win on any given night than a team that they know has no chance before the season even starts. People aren't going to spend $100 to go watch a last place team and they aren't going to watch many games on TV. The owner realizes this and refuses to trade tens of millions of dollars per year for some magic beans. He knows there is no guarantee that tearing it all down will produce a title contender.

Every team for the most part did do this though to get the players that are dominating. If you're afraid to take risks, you'll never get anywhere. And they haven't. I know many people that don't pay attention to the wild at all anymore because they are boring to watch and sick of the same sh** every year. Goes both ways.

 

[Digitalbooya]

I would personally prefer a rocky finish to the year, which is exactly why I know they’ll pick it up a bit and stay in the hunt until the very end.

That’s usually what happens.

If they really want to drive up the value of their pick, they should play Rossi/Walker/Hunt/O’Rourke. Rookie mistakes galore. Trade Dumba, Foligno, Greenway, Middleton.

Kap-Rossi-Zucc
Boldy-Eriksson Ek-Walker
Duhaime-Gaudreau-Hartman
Shaw-Dewar-Reaves

Goligoski-Spurgeon
O’Rourke-Brodin
Hunt-Addison
Merrill

MAF
Gus

f*** it, that forward group looks better than what we have currently.

 

[Jesus comma Brodin]

That’s usually what happens.

If they really want to drive up the value of their pick, they should play Rossi/Walker/Hunt/O’Rourke. Rookie mistakes galore. Trade Dumba, Foligno, Greenway, Middleton.

Kap-Rossi-Zucc
Boldy-Eriksson Ek-Walker
Duhaime-Gaudreau-Hartman
Shaw-Dewar-Reaves

Goligoski-Spurgeon
O’Rourke-Brodin
Hunt-Addison
Merrill

MAF
Gus

f*** it, that forward group looks better than what we have currently.

This is essentially what I wanted during the dead cap era anyways, let your young guys learn and grow, albeit with some expected growing pains but this would also give us an opportunity to see what we have.

Also, can someone whose watched a lot of Iowa (@57special) and can extrapolate on how Hunt has been? Stats look super meh, but we know that isn't the important part for most defensemen.

PS- If Beckman doesn't crack this young guy lineup, I say move him.

 

[Minnewildsota]

This is essentially what I wanted during the dead cap era anyways, let your young guys learn and grow, albeit with some expected growing pains but this would also give us an opportunity to see what we have.

Also, can someone whose watched a lot of Iowa (@57special) and can extrapolate on how Hunt has been? Stats look super meh, but we know that isn't the important part for most defensemen.

PS- If Beckman doesn't crack this young guy lineup, I say move him.

I don't disagree with this approach, but the young players have to be ready IMHO. Throwing them in the deep end only sets them up for failure. I think this FO has a mostly correct approach with prospects. They're finally letting them stew/mature until they know they're ready for the next level.

This is vastly different than previous regimes. I think it will pay off for us in the end. a.e. more prospects develop better under this regime than under previous regimes. It'll be hard to quantify it but that's the feeling I get.

 

[Sota Popinski]

Every team for the most part did do this though to get the players that are dominating. If you're afraid to take risks, you'll never get anywhere. And they haven't. I know many people that don't pay attention to the wild at all anymore because they are boring to watch and sick of the same sh** every year. Goes both ways.

And those people that don't pay attention anymore would pay attention through a 3-5 year rebuild? No, they wouldn't. So drive away everyone but the die-hards in the hopes of regaining the interest of the casuals? Like it's easy to put together a dynasty with multiple HOF players. Just tank! Simple!

The players that are dominating like McDavid, Matthews and MacKinnon? The Oilers tanked for almost a decade and have still not made it back to the finals. Arizona has been tanking for how many years now and still not been rewarded with a #1 pick? Even when you win the lottery, the consensus #1 isn't guaranteed to be a superstar. Look at Yakupov or Lafreniere.

Selling off everything of value for a scorched-earth rebuild isn't the ballsy move you're making it out to be. It's basically a GM giving up. It buys them a couple years of job security with zero expectations of putting together a winning roster. It makes sense in some situations, but our best players are either under 27 like Kaprizov, Boldy, JEE or have no-move clauses like Spurgeon and Brodin.

 

[Minnewildsota]

And those people that don't pay attention anymore would pay attention through a 3-5 year rebuild? No, they wouldn't. So drive away everyone but the die-hards in the hopes of regaining the interest of the casuals? Like it's easy to put together a dynasty with multiple HOF players. Just tank! Simple!

The players that are dominating like McDavid, Matthews and MacKinnon? The Oilers tanked for almost a decade and have still not made it back to the finals. Arizona has been tanking for how many years now and still not been rewarded with a #1 pick? Even when you win the lottery, the consensus #1 isn't guaranteed to be a superstar. Look at Yakupov or Lafreniere.

Selling off everything of value for a scorched-earth rebuild isn't the ballsy move you're making it out to be. It's basically a GM giving up. It buys them a couple years of job security with zero expectations of putting together a winning roster. It makes sense in some situations, but our best players are either under 27 like Kaprizov, Boldy, JEE or have no-move clauses like Spurgeon and Brodin.

Well, not only that, but the Oilers have 2 of the best players in the league. Have they done shit with them? No. It takes more than just accumulating high draft picks. You have to successfully build a team around them.

Same could be said for Toronto.

 

[Digitalbooya]

This is essentially what I wanted during the dead cap era anyways, let your young guys learn and grow, albeit with some expected growing pains but this would also give us an opportunity to see what we have.

Also, can someone whose watched a lot of Iowa (@57special) and can extrapolate on how Hunt has been? Stats look super meh, but we know that isn't the important part for most defensemen.

PS- If Beckman doesn't crack this young guy lineup, I say move him.

I’ve seen a decent amount of Iowa games. Hunt doesn’t look super noticeable in a good or bad way. Don’t recall him on the PP. I believe Hicketts is usually the guy there. Hunt’s skating is decent. First pass is pretty good. His shot is good, he just needs to use it more.

 

[Wildabeast]

And those people that don't pay attention anymore would pay attention through a 3-5 year rebuild? No, they wouldn't. So drive away everyone but the die-hards in the hopes of regaining the interest of the casuals? Like it's easy to put together a dynasty with multiple HOF players. Just tank! Simple!

The players that are dominating like McDavid, Matthews and MacKinnon? The Oilers tanked for almost a decade and have still not made it back to the finals. Arizona has been tanking for how many years now and still not been rewarded with a #1 pick? Even when you win the lottery, the consensus #1 isn't guaranteed to be a superstar. Look at Yakupov or Lafreniere.

Selling off everything of value for a scorched-earth rebuild isn't the ballsy move you're making it out to be. It's basically a GM giving up. It buys them a couple years of job security with zero expectations of putting together a winning roster. It makes sense in some situations, but our best players are either under 27 like Kaprizov, Boldy, JEE or have no-move clauses like Spurgeon and Brodin.

I'm not saying sell everything off, but continuing to trade picks and assets for players that don't make a difference isn't the way. The wild have legit had what, a single top ten pick in the last 10 years or something? That's where the difference makers are. You can have a down year here and there; you don't have to blow your future assets away to try and save face all the time. Luckily they aren't like they used to, but to think they should try to compete during the dead cap is a fools errand. It's literally the time you try and land top picks and come out on top once it's over.

And the interest in the team is a absolutely dwindling among fans. This board is a case study in that. It used to be way more active

 

[57special]

I would personally prefer a rocky finish to the year, which is exactly why I know they’ll pick it up a bit and stay in the hunt until the very end.

Hey Judd, when do you think the forward strength in this draft tails off, and can you compare it to 2019, forward wise? I’m having a hard time figuring out how good guys like Dvorsky, Heidt, Sale, and Wood are relative to other years.I mean, are they even the equal of Yurov and Ohgren as prospects?

 

[Minnewildsota]

I'm not saying sell everything off, but continuing to trade picks and assets for players that don't make a difference isn't the way. The wild have legit had what, a single top ten pick in the last 10 years or something? That's where the difference makers are. You can have a down year here and there; you don't have to blow your future assets away to try and save face all the time. Luckily they aren't like they used to, but to think they should try to compete during the dead cap is a fools errand. It's literally the time you try and land top picks and come out on top once it's over.

And the interest in the team is a absolutely dwindling among fans. This board is a case study in that. It used to be way more active

Can you give examples of GMBG doing this?

 

[Wildabeast]

Can you give examples of GMBG doing this?

Thank God he hasn't. But there is a contingent on this board that thinks they should. That's where my thoughts are being directed at.

 

[MuckOG]

I'm not saying sell everything off, but continuing to trade picks and assets for players that don't make a difference isn't the way. The wild have legit had what, a single top ten pick in the last 10 years or something? That's where the difference makers are. You can have a down year here and there; you don't have to blow your future assets away to try and save face all the time. Luckily they aren't like they used to, but to think they should try to compete during the dead cap is a fools errand. It's literally the time you try and land top picks and come out on top once it's over.

And the interest in the team is a absolutely dwindling among fans. This board is a case study in that. It used to be way more active

Barring key injries, how exactly does a team have a "down year or there" on purpose? The only way to do that is: a) get the coaching staff to intentionally tank games by playing sub-par players or b) trade away talented players for futures.

There is no way that players like Kaprizov, Ek, Boldy, et al will sign on to intentionally losing games. More than likely, they would demand a trade to a team that is actually trying to compete. At that point, we basically turn into the Arizona Coyotes. How does that revive interest among the fanbase?

It's certainly possible that the Wild have a down year by simply not playing well enough to make the playoffs. But at worst, this is a bubble team, so unless this team goes on a major losing streak (possible), this team will not be picking in the top 10 in this draft.

 

[Minnewildsota]

Thank God he hasn't. But there is a contingent on this board that thinks they should. That's where my thoughts are being directed at.

Gotcha, the use of the word "continuing" made it sound like it was previously and still being done.

 

[57special]

This is essentially what I wanted during the dead cap era anyways, let your young guys learn and grow, albeit with some expected growing pains but this would also give us an opportunity to see what we have.

Also, can someone whose watched a lot of Iowa (@57special) and can extrapolate on how Hunt has been? Stats look super meh, but we know that isn't the important part for most defensemen.

PS- If Beckman doesn't crack this young guy lineup, I say move him.

I like Hunt…he’s been sick, I think, so missed a few games recently. For a rookie, he’s pretty strong, doesn’t make a lot of mistakes. Like his skating. Thing there is more there when it comes to offense, but Army refuses to play his young D on the PP, sticking with guys like Hicketts, Mermis, and even Sustr. I don’t get it. Those guys are not in line to be in the NHL…why is Guerin not demanding that they give the young guys a taste, at least? I mean, Sustr is pretty mediocre offensively.

Both ROR and Hunt look like they are on track to be NHL’ers with average or slightly better than average size and strength. Both seem to have decent defensive games, but can also skate, and pass the puck. More skill and skating than a guy like Middleton. Remains to be seen if they will end up being as tough, but the possibility is there. Scandella isn’t a bad comparison, though they are smaller and have less awkward skating strides.

You never know for sure how prospects are going to develop, but if they put in the work and stay away from bad lifestyle choices I can see them playing a bit next year, and certainly in 2024-25. I get wanting them to play sound positional and defensive games, but would also like Army to start encouraging them to lug the puck more, and see if they can expand their offensive games. They’ve got some tools in that area.

 

[Wildabeast]

Barring key injries, how exactly does a team have a "down year or there" on purpose? The only way to do that is: a) get the coaching staff to intentionally tank games by playing sub-par players or b) trade away talented players for futures.

There is no way that players like Kaprizov, Ek, Boldy, et al will sign on to intentionally losing games. More than likely, they would demand a trade to a team that is actually trying to compete. At that point, we basically turn into the Arizona Coyotes. How does that revive interest among the fanbase?

You can't compare the wild to the coyotes. Their franchise is run horrifically from the top down. They have an organizational structure that has been so bad for so long, that prospects come into losing culture and they are almost always put at a disadvantage that's impossible to dig out of.

For what it's worth, I would trade a key player or two for assets. Boldy is a core piece I would never part with. Kaprizov I would, because we lack a center in the organization to utilize him properly during his peak playing years,and his value is sky high and I do not believe we will end up resigning him.

 

[MuckOG]

You can't compare the wild to the coyotes. Their franchise is run horrifically from the top down. They have an organizational structure that has been so bad for so long, that prospects come into losing culture and they are almost always put at a disadvantage that's impossible to dig out of.

For what it's worth, I would trade a key player or two for assets. Boldy is a core piece I would never part with. Kaprizov I would, because we lack a center in the organization to utilize him properly during his peak playing years,and his value is sky high and I do not believe we will end up resigning him.

Trade Kaprizov and then watch what happens to the fan base. Especially all those kids wearing #97 jerseys. He's the best, and most popular, player this franchise has ever had. Trading him because his value is "sky high" and "we lack a center to properly utilize him" (when he is a 100+ point/season player) would result in the ticket buying fanbase revolting and this team would become the laughingstock of the NHL.

Regarding that center to play with Kaprizov, I think Rossi could be that center beginning next season.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Thank God he hasn't. But there is a contingent on this board that thinks they should. That's where my thoughts are being directed at.

Who is that contingent exactly? I see people exploring ways to make the team better for at least a couple of years.

 

[Wildabeast]

Trade Kaprizov and then watch what happens to the fan base. Especially all those kids wearing #97 jerseys. He's the best, and most popular, player this franchise has ever had. Trading him because his value is "sky high" and "we lack a center to properly utilize him" (when he is a 100+ point/season player) would result in the ticket buying fanbase revolting and this team would become the laughingstock of the NHL.

Regarding that center to play with Kaprizov, I think Rossi could be that center beginning next season.

I understand where you're coming from and it's a good point. That's just personally what I think about the situation. It's not like you're going to get nothing back for him. He absolutely would be capable of bringing in a top tier young player that would provide excitement for example.

I'm hopeful for Rossi, the wild cannot afford to have him not turn out to be a difference maker.

 

[Sota Popinski]

I'm not saying sell everything off, but continuing to trade picks and assets for players that don't make a difference isn't the way. The wild have legit had what, a single top ten pick in the last 10 years or something? That's where the difference makers are. You can have a down year here and there; you don't have to blow your future assets away to try and save face all the time. Luckily they aren't like they used to, but to think they should try to compete during the dead cap is a fools errand. It's literally the time you try and land top picks and come out on top once it's over.

And the interest in the team is a absolutely dwindling among fans. This board is a case study in that. It used to be way more active

I don't think anyone on this board is advocating trading futures for players that don't make a difference.

Message board usage in general has dwindled. I don't think it's just the Wild. I haven't seen the TV ratings or ticket sales, but i think those would be better indicators of whether the fanbase has lost interest.

 

[Minnewildsota]

I don't think anyone on this board is advocating trading futures for players that don't make a difference.

Message board usage in general has dwindled. I don't think it's just the Wild. I haven't seen the TV ratings or ticket sales, but i think those would be better indicators of whether the fanbase has lost interest.

I was just reading that Chicago TV ratings have dropped 36 or 37% this year.

Hawks TV ratings are DOWN 36%

forums.hfboards.com

 

[MNNumbers]

I would like a refresher on who the top prospects in the draft are, after Bedard. I think it's unlikely that we qualify for the playoffs, so we could be picking between, say, 13-16. How far down the list do the good guys go?

 

[Sota Popinski]

I was just reading that Chicago TV ratings have dropped 36 or 37% this year.

Hawks TV ratings are DOWN 36%

forums.hfboards.com

Ok, but they're also the worst team in the league and tanking the season