Confirmed with Link: [TOR/PIT] RW Kapanen, D Lindgren, LW Aberg for '20 1st(15th), LW Rodrigues, C Hallander, D Warsofsky

[Big Muddy]

Net Sum transaction to trade a 1st and recover a 1st in 2020.

Marleau + 2020 1st @ 13th OA + Lindgren + Aberg + Kapanen

for

2020 1st @ 15th OA + Rodrigues + Hallander + Warsofsky

Its interesting if you rearrange the order and bold. Maybe its more illuminative?

 

[Ciao]

Really? A few posters have said they thought he was a dark horse in a couple years

I would be interested to see those posts.

What I read was some people were surprised to see him get an ELC in 2018. One person felt he hadn't progressed and others had similar comments.

I don't know much about him, but I hadn't read anthing that remotely suggested that Jesper Lindgren was ever ready to join the Leafs.

 

[Gabriel426]

Ceci couldn't walk, he was already qualified by Ott. Bridging Marner saves some, but not enough. Rumblings around then we're ~9/yr for a bridge so you're saving under $2M

I don't see how Kadri + a prospect opens up more cap space. If anything Barrie was too cheap for our needs.

There were options on this roster, but I haven't read anything that keeps Marleau and makes us better. Cap was just too tight for it. We could have conceded a step back and used this year to flush out some issues, but that would have been an odd move at the time.

In hindsight, that might have been the right move but there is no way anyone would be okay for it last summer.
Ofcourse this is all hindsight, we are our victims of our early success four years ago.
If they didn’t make the playoffs, 1. They would not use a 2nd to trade for Boyle-not going to go into who they would have drafted, bc thats just fools gold with hindsight. 2. They might be able to trade Bozak or JVR at the deadline Or at least the summer for more picks and prospects.
3. They would probably still sign Hainsey due to being on a Cup winner and needing a vet in the backend.
Just think they arrived at least one year too early.
Don’t get me wrong, i am not blaming Lou or anything as you really can’t plan success and when it comes, you want to sustain it. That’s what he did.
The big three contacts are done and Dubas just need to find ways to work around it as well as hope those three start showing up and being dominant in the playoffs.

 

[daveleaf]

Well, the 2006 Carolina cup was a complete anomaly and the 2016 and 2017 Penguins were built by Ray Shero with some minor tinkering here and there.

2006 team rolled over the Leafs pretty good. The Penguins were not all Shero. Let's be honest, they were going no where until Rutherford made changes and Shero refused to.

 

[Menzinger]

Not so bad now.

Hollander and the 15th has more value than the 13th, and that's not even Touching on the 9.5, mil in capspace too

 

[Fonzieleaf]

Yeah, I agree. I think one of Carolina or Edmonton will take him if he is around at 13/14, so you would have to hope you can get up to 12.

Kid sure has a lot of hype, and I agree - not sure a goalie has got this much pre-draft attention since Price.

Schneider seems like a great pick if he is there, but I am betting the pick is traded for D help now.

Yep Dubas even said he’s open to trading it.

 

[thewave]

Hollander and the 15th has more value than the 13th, and that's not even Touching on the 9.5, mil in capspace too

I don't even know if Hollander will ever skate with the Leafs in a game. Just a late 2nd round pick a few years removed. A 1st is nice to have, Kappy let us down most nights.

 

[Menzinger]

I don't even know if Hollander will ever skate with the Leafs in a game. Just a late 2nd round pick a few years removed.

He's tracking well as a prospect (at worst he would still hold the same value as a 2nd round pick) and it likely wouldn't cost a 2nd's worth of value to move up just 2 draft spots outside of the top 10

 

[Stephen]

He's tracking well as a prospect (at worst he would still hold the same value as a 2nd round pick) and it likely wouldn't cost a 2nd's worth of value to move up just 2 draft spots outside of the top 10

That's a good way of putting it. I'm still surprised Dubas set that price and Rutherford was willing to match it. Good for us. Now we need a bit of draft day luck to make sure we get the guy we want, whomever it is.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Unfortunately the Leafs are still further back than they should be thanks to Marleau's contract, but that was unavoidable. Dubas does deserve credit for making it as painless as possible though

 

[thewave]

Unfortunately the Leafs are still further back than they should be thanks to Marleau's contract, but that was unavoidable. Dubas does deserve credit for making it as painless as possible though

It's not as painless as possible. We're now getting rid of the guys that we traded that 1st for in order to keep.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

It's not as painless as possible. We're now getting rid of the guys that we traded that 1st for in order to keep.

So as painless as possible then. Got it, thanks

 

[Wafflewhipper]

That's what I was trying to get at. We weren't locked into the corner at the time. We absolutely had options and players to move to get out of the situation we were in. The end result of what he did really speaks for itself though, it was not a good outcome for anyone.

He didn’t sign him to the bad contract lou lam did as we all know. You can think there were other ways around it and some may have been available. We can’t know what was. Sh!t contract with full control by Marleau. Some kind of verbal understanding came to pass because the contract was air tight in Marleau’s favour.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

It's not as painless as possible. We're now getting rid of the guys that we traded that 1st for in order to keep.

Kappy regressed and was not impressing anyone in management on or off the ice. He is not a big loss with Barabanov,Mikheyev and now Robertson emerging.

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

I would be interested to see those posts.

What I read was some people were surprised to see him get an ELC in 2018. One person felt he hadn't progressed and others had similar comments.

I don't know much about him, but I hadn't read anthing that remotely suggested that Jesper Lindgren was ever ready to join the Leafs.

I never said he was ready to step in and join the leafs. In both my posts you replied to, I said "in a few years".

The post I replied to from @SeaOfBlue said he could be a 3rd pairing d man in a few more years after more ice time in the AHL.

@LeafChief and @Maplebeasts had this to say on the main board as well.
RD Jesper Lindgren - MODO, Allsvenskan (2015, 95th, TOR, traded to PIT)

 

[Mess]

Hollander and the 15th has more value than the 13th, and that's not even Touching on the 9.5, mil in capspace too

That Marleau contract had only 1 year left for that $6.25 mil was only relevant to this last season 2019-20. It was a 1 time 1 year only cap savings and because of that there is no more cap space gained in 2020-21 by it. Even if it wasn't dealt, it would have expired naturally. Or if you like $6.25 mil of that $9.5 mil has already been used or spent on 2019-20, so there is no carry forward gained beyond this past season.

Also shortly after dealing Marleau the Leafs used that $6.25 mil free cap space to re-sign Kapanen $3.2 and Johnson $3.4 mil so they could use Kap and AJ in this season instead of having Marleau on the roster and unfortunately the Leafs failed to qualify for the playoffs and take adavantage.

Now you've dealt Kapanen = 1/2 of the Marleau cap away to recover the 1st round draft pick, but there is no accumulative $9.5 mil cap space as its was overlapping in part. The new cap space gained is only $3.2 mil (Kappy) for this upcoming season (that is excluding the other player contracts coming back) and if they're brought back in Rodrigues or Hallander which would be offsetting Kapanen's cap space created.

 

[Gallagbi]

That Marleau contract had only 1 year left for that $6.25 mil was only relevant to this last season 2019-20. It was a 1 time 1 year only cap savings and because of that there is no more cap space gained in 2020-21 by it. Even if it wasn't dealt, it would have expired naturally. Or if you like $6.25 mil of that $9.5 mil has already been used, so there is no carry forward gained beyond this past season.

Also shortly after dealing Marleau the Leafs used that $6.25 mil free cap space to re-sign Kapanen $3.2 and Johnson $3.4 mil so they could use Kap and AJ in this season instead of having Marleau on the roster and unfortunately the Leafs failed to qualify for the playoffs and take adavantage.

Now you've dealt Kapanen = 1/2 of the Marleau cap away to recover the draft pick, but there is no accumulative $9.5 mil cap space as its was overlapping in part. The new cap space gained is only $3.2 mil (Kappy) for this upcoming season (that is excluding the other player contracts coming back) and if they're brought back in Rodrigues or Hallander which would be offsetting Kapanen's cap space created.

True, it's more like a 1-year rental of Kap. What do we think a player like that's worth for 1 year?

 

[All Mod Cons]

I just had a harrowing thought. What if Kapanen's money is going to re-signing Barrie?

 

[All Mod Cons]

True, it's more like a 1-year rental of Kap. What do we think a player like that's worth for 1 year?

I hate that we keep renting our own players. Kapanen, Bozak, Gardiner, Barrie, JVR. Swear we're the only club to rent from themselves.

 

[Gallagbi]

I hate that we keep renting our own players. Kapanen, Bozak, Gardiner, Barrie, JVR. Swear we're the only club to rent from themselves.

Given we still eventually "sold" Kap, it makes sense in his case.

 

[Kurtz]

I just had a harrowing thought. What if Kapanen's money is going to re-signing Barrie?

You can rest easy - neither party wants anything to do with one another at this point.

 

[Stephen]

Given we still eventually "sold" Kap, it makes sense in his case.

I think in this case, it bought the Leafs a year to evaluate Kapanen in greater detail. Whatever he does in Pittsburgh from here on out, he didn't exactly play himself into the Leafs plans. He's sort of Big 4 Lite backed up with Connor Brown numbers.

 

[thewave]

Given we still eventually "sold" Kap, it makes sense in his case.

Renting your own players or own rental is one of the, if not the worst practices in the NHL. The teams that don't do it seem to find better success (CHI, STL, PIT, BOS, TB to name a few). Think about what we could have turned the returns from many of those players into, if even just drafting well.

 

[Gallagbi]

Renting your own players or own rental is one of the, if not the worst practices in the NHL. The teams that don't do it seem to find better success (CHI, STL, PIT, BOS, TB to name a few). Think about what we could have turned the returns from many of those players into, if even just drafting well.

Now go back and read my post, then think if any of the above relates to it.

Get a year of Kap, cash-in on a better return than expected last offseason and this offseason.

 

[Martin Skoula]

True, it's more like a 1-year rental of Kap. What do we think a player like that's worth for 1 year?

Considering we spend a 2nd on 2 months of Plekanec I can't imagine it's any less than a 1st+.