Confirmed with Link: [TOR/OTT] Matt Murray (25% retention), a 3rd in 2023 and a 7th in 2024 for Future Considerations.

[Mess]

As its said you only have to make one more save than the other guy and its when you make the saves.
Murray has done it, Campbell hasn't.
Also Murray was trending up last season, so we can only hope he keeps going that way.

That makes it sound like a goalie that has won the Cup has better odds to win another Cup then a goalie that has never won one, until they do.

So Leafs with Campbell lost in round #1 because TB with Vasilevskiy has won multiple Cups makes sense based on your theory.

So when Leafs with Matt Murray who won 2 previous Cups with Pens in the past, plays TB and Vasilevskiy who has won multiple Cups what happens?

Has Leafs odds of advancement increased for the rematch?

 

[justashadowof]

Over the past 4 seasons, the Toronto Maple Leafs have participated in 9 elimination games. The Leafs have scored a total of 17 goals in those games. That's less than 2 goals per game on average.

 

[fahad203]

Over the past 4 seasons, the Toronto Maple Leafs have participated in 9 elimination games. The Leafs have scored a total of 17 goals in those games. That's less than 2 goals per game on average.

Over the 4 seasons leafs also are 0-7 I think closing out games

Leafs played plenty of game 6 to close out. Leafs also had a 3-1 series lead

No doubt offense had to come through. But our goalies needed to steal a game in any of those

 

[Zybalto]

Over the past 4 seasons, the Toronto Maple Leafs have participated in 9 elimination games. The Leafs have scored a total of 17 goals in those games. That's less than 2 goals per game on average.

Over the past 2 playoffs, the Lightning have participated in 9 elimination games. They scored a total of 18 goals in those games.....and won 7 of them some reason....

The Leafs have outplayed their oppositon far greater than Tampa as well.

The Leafs are searching for the guy who can be that difference maker. Lets give this proven guy a chance to prove himself again.....

 

[saltming]

That makes it sound like a goalie that has won the Cup has better odds to win another Cup then a goalie that has never won one, until they do.

So Leafs with Campbell lost in round #1 because TB with Vasilevskiy has won multiple Cups makes sense based on your theory.

So when Leafs with Matt Murray who won 2 previous Cups with Pens in the past, plays TB and Vasilevskiy who has won multiple Cups what happens?

Has Leafs odds of advancement increased for the rematch?

I have not given any theory. I'm talking about their accomplishments.
This theory is of your making.

FYI Murray and vasi have won the same amount of cups, so if vasilesky has won multiple cups and Murray has won 2, in your words, it seems that you're using words to strengthen your argument since the merit of the facts don't fit.

 

[Mess]

Over the past 4 seasons, the Toronto Maple Leafs have participated in 9 elimination games. The Leafs have scored a total of 17 goals in those games. That's less than 2 goals per game on average.

Leafs have 1/2 their entire teams salary Cap wrapped up in 4 forwards and its always the goalies fault when they lose.

They get SH 3-0 to Columbus, 3-1 to Montreal and 2-1 to Tampa Bay in the series deciding games and its the goalies that couldn't save them.

The only way Leafs could have won any of these games is if their goalie posted a shutout because the offense provided 2 goals total in 3 series clinching games.

Now its apparently Matt Murray coming off a 20 game 5 win season that is being tasked with saving the Leafs because he won a Cup 5 seasons ago with a different team.

Clutch goal scoring not clutch goaltending is the Leafs downfall.

 

[saltming]

Leafs have 1/2 their entire teams salary Cap wrapped up in 4 forwards and its always the goalies fault when they lose.

They get SH 3-0 to Columbus, 3-1 to Montreal and 2-1 to Tampa Bay in the series deciding games and its the goalies that couldn't save them.

The only way Leafs could have won any of these games is if their goalie posted a shutout because the offense provided 2 goals total in 3 series clinching games.

Now its apparently Matt Murray coming off a 20 game 5 win season that is being tasked with saving the Leafs because he won a Cup 5 seasons ago with a different team.

Clutch goal scoring not clutch goaltending is the Leafs downfall.

 

[Mess]

I have not given any theory. I'm talking about their accomplishments.
This theory is of your making.

FYI Murray and vasi have won the same amount of cups, so if vasilesky has won multiple cups and Murray has won 2, in your words, it seems that you're using words to strengthen your argument since the merit of the facts don't fit.

Yes Cup accomplishments.

I wasn't trying to trick you by using different words 2 and multiple that mean the same thing in this case.

I was pointing out the flaw in Leaf Nation thinking that they believe they have upgraded their goaltending because of past accomplishments. But what if Leafs face TB again and the opposion goalie has just as many accomplishments if not more like the Conn Smythe as well and doing it on his current team as opposed to Murray doing his with Crosby and Malkin that have nothing to do with Leafs current roster.

When a goalie with 2 past Cups faces Vas another goalie with 2 past recent Cups, what happens that would change the outcome of the series, because the reason to believe in Murray has been nulified by the opposition?

So If Leafs lose to Tampa Bay again next year in the playoffs because MOST people believe Vas is the better goalie, then what, we need goalie with 3 past Cups now?

 

[saltming]

Yes Cup accomplishments.

I wasn't trying to trick you by using different words 2 and multiple that mean the same thing in this case.

I was pointing out the flaw in Leaf Nation thinking that they believe they have upgraded their goaltending because of past accomplishments. But what if Leafs face TB again and the opposion goalie has just as many accomplishments if not more like the Conn Smythe as well and doing it on his current team as opposed to Murray doing his with Crosby and Malkin that have nothing to do with Leafs current roster.

When a goalie with 2 past Cups faces Vas another goalie with 2 past recent Cups, what happens that would change the outcome of the series, because the reason to believe in Murray has been nulified by the opposition?

So If Leafs lose to Tampa Bay again next year in the playoffs because MOST people believe Vas is the better goalie, then what, we need goalie with 3 past Cups now?

Well personally I feel that we may have upgraded because 1st Murray was trending up and had adjusted his style to improve his game
2nd he had proven he can hack the pressure to win a cup.

Does this mean we will win a cup because we aquired him? I have no clue. I have always believed it takes a team to win. Goalie is the most important position, much like a QB in football, the team around him can be excellent, but if the goalie is mediocre, the team will struggle. Now if the goalie is good, the team is good.
Vasi meets Murray in the playoffs? Luck skill and determination will determine the outcome.
Back to the original subject, for reasons already stated I would rather take a chance that Murray trending up is going to be the normal vs Campbell suddenly becoming worth 5X5.
I think Campbell is what he is and Murray can once again become what he once was

 

[Jmo89]

Leafs have 1/2 their entire teams salary Cap wrapped up in 4 forwards and its always the goalies fault when they lose.

They get SH 3-0 to Columbus, 3-1 to Montreal and 2-1 to Tampa Bay in the series deciding games and its the goalies that couldn't save them.

The only way Leafs could have won any of these games is if their goalie posted a shutout because the offense provided 2 goals total in 3 series clinching games.

Now its apparently Matt Murray coming off a 20 game 5 win season that is being tasked with saving the Leafs because he won a Cup 5 seasons ago with a different team.

Clutch goal scoring not clutch goaltending is the Leafs downfall.

Clutch goalscoring is definitely an issue, but Campbell let in two bad goals in both game 6 OT games (Montreal and Tampa) when Toronto was controlling the pace of the OT.

Sometimes a team needs their goalie to make the saves he's supposed to until they can score.

It's a bit of both.

 

[Bomber0104]

Leafs have 1/2 their entire teams salary Cap wrapped up in 4 forwards and its always the goalies fault when they lose.

They get SH 3-0 to Columbus, 3-1 to Montreal and 2-1 to Tampa Bay in the series deciding games and its the goalies that couldn't save them.

The only way Leafs could have won any of these games is if their goalie posted a shutout because the offense provided 2 goals total in 3 series clinching games.

Now its apparently Matt Murray coming off a 20 game 5 win season that is being tasked with saving the Leafs because he won a Cup 5 seasons ago with a different team.

Clutch goal scoring not clutch goaltending is the Leafs downfall.

The bar has never been lower.

3rd string goalie on a last place team for $4.6M..

I think it's still other way around, you think that Campbell can be as good as Murray can be.

Not a single team would pick up Murray on waivers for free with just 2.5 years left on his contract.

Campbell just signed for $5M x 5 years.

The free market has spoken on who is better valued in the NHL.

Sorry but the league voted with their wallets and Not even Dubas wanted Murray last year

Only out of pure desperation did this move happen.

 

[BrannigansLaw]

Every morning I wake up and see this thread I can't help but LOL at this trade. The solution to our goaltending woes is a garbage trade for a garbage goalie. Dubass logic at work

But he's from the Soo!

 

[Dayjobdave]

Clutch goalscoring is definitely an issue, but Campbell let in two bad goals in both game 6 OT games (Montreal and Tampa) when Toronto was controlling the pace of the OT.

Sometimes a team needs their goalie to make the saves he's supposed to until they can score.

It's a bit of both.

I suspect this is what drove Leaf management thinking here.

They see the players in the dressing room, and they have an opinion on how mindsets are when the chips are down.

Jack really didn’t rise to the occasion in those final games, and really didn’t last year against the Habs. He certainly played better than game 7 Freddie. Murray has been a big moment player, so I think management wanted that element of feistiness on the back end.

I believe that management believes Murray will be much better with the team in front of him competing for wins than with the team in front of him playing out the lottery string.

It will be great to watch if that’s the case.

 

[Racer88]

Leafs have 1/2 their entire teams salary Cap wrapped up in 4 forwards and its always the goalies fault when they lose.

They get SH 3-0 to Columbus, 3-1 to Montreal and 2-1 to Tampa Bay in the series deciding games and its the goalies that couldn't save them.

The only way Leafs could have won any of these games is if their goalie posted a shutout because the offense provided 2 goals total in 3 series clinching games.

Now its apparently Matt Murray coming off a 20 game 5 win season that is being tasked with saving the Leafs because he won a Cup 5 seasons ago with a different team.

Clutch goal scoring not clutch goaltending is the Leafs downfall.

This is so true. I just cannot believe some people can’t see this or maybe simply won’t accept it because it may makes Dubas’s team structure look as bad as it is

 

[deprw]

Not a single team would pick up Murray on waivers for free with just 2.5 years left on his contract.

Campbell just signed for $5M x 5 years.

The free market has spoken on who is better valued in the NHL.

Sorry but the league voted with their wallets and Not even Dubas wanted Murray last year

Only out of pure desperation did this move happen.

You're absolutely right about it. Same goes with Evander Kane, no one wouldn't touch him with a stick until he was bought out. Contracts can limit and make player impossible to move. At least mid season. We have acquired Murray with retention and got small sweetener with him. We also had right to make full medical examination on Murray before the trade. It's bit different situation, since health and contract were the issues with him. He was basicly worthless mid season and now he might have same value for us.

I don't like this bargain bin shopping on goalies, which we are now. I also at the same time think that you don't pay a goalie, until you know you got the guy. If his a "guy" you pay him like a "guy" not like the guy.

Oilers decided to pay Campbell like the guy and it's unmovable contract if it's going south. Murray is movable and short term and I like it because of that.

Almost all the teams make some kind of mistake when they acquire core piece from free agency on long term with big money. Campbell is expensive if you look his resume and he has that value at the moment. Good for him and Oilers.

Murray has his credentials, we know his health and if this goes south it's on Dubas and we can fix the issue. We really need the guy, but there wasn't any available this summer. Teams like Detroit can take risks with the issue. We actually can't and I think same goes on Edmonton. They're more reckless than us.

 

[Racer88]

You're absolutely right about it. Same goes with Evander Kane, no one wouldn't touch him with a stick until he was bought out. Contracts can limit and make player impossible to move. At least mid season. We have acquired Murray with retention and got small sweetener with him. We also had right to make full medical examination on Murray before the trade. It's bit different situation, since health and contract were the issues with him. He was basicly worthless mid season and now he might have same value for us.

I don't like this bargain bin shopping on goalies, which we are now. I also at the same time think that you don't pay a goalie, until you know you got the guy. If his a "guy" you pay him like a "guy" not like the guy.

Oilers decided to pay Campbell like the guy and it's unmovable contract if it's going south. Murray is movable and short term and I like it because of that.

Almost all the teams make some kind of mistake when they acquire core piece from free agency on long term with big money. Campbell is expensive if you look his resume and he has that value at the moment. Good for him and Oilers.

Murray has his credentials, we know his health and if this goes south it's on Dubas and we can fix the issue. We really need the guy, but there wasn't any available this summer. Teams like Detroit can take risks with the issue. We actually can't and I think same goes on Edmonton. They're more reckless than us.

Well thought out and articulated post……..unfortunately it doesn’t make me feel any better about our goalie situation. Lol

 

[HockeyVirus]

That seems to be quite an obvious escape for someone who has been injured so much, but whatever bet Dubas elected to make, I think we'll have to give Murray a little bit of leeway to get established. Hope for the best.

Yeah right. Every goal against is going to have our GDT going "LOL DUBAS" it's so predictable. At least until he plays through that and puts up a decent run then they will all vanish for a bit. It's why being a goalie here is so difficult, fans want you to fail.

Fact is, all I am reading is he is injury prone. Isn't Campbell? Didn't he get injured as our starter in the shortened year? Then he was out multiple times with injuries making us run our 3rd string for weeks at a time at critcal parts of the season?

So the option is an injury prone goalie with meh stats 5x5 or 4.5x2. Dubas thinks we will get similar results to Campbell.

Regardless, I think one of our goalies will be a fit and people are all forgetting we have a strong farm system of goalies and someone will show they are ready. Whether Kallgren, Woll, one of our UFA signings out of college systems or someone like last year where they added a goalie from overseas, there is depth here and we just need 1 player to find their game here.

 

[Mess]

Every morning I wake up and see this thread I can't help but LOL at this trade. The solution to our goaltending woes is a garbage trade for a garbage goalie. Dubass logic at work

But he's from the Soo!

The first 1/2 of this very thread, where the majority of Leafs nation is outraged at how little the Leafs got only a 3rd and 7th and 25% retention to haul away an injury prone goalie on an unwanted ugly contract, similarly how the Leafs needed to add an asset to dump the Mrazek contract.

Now it has morphed into Murray is the missing piece and answer all Leafs problems in net, huge upgrade and the final solution to when we take on Conn Smythe and 2 time Stanley Cup winning Vasilevskiy and Tampa for the rematch again, only a speed bump now as we sail towards the Stanley Cup uncontested.

The first part seems to be the more realistic portion of the thread, and the later part now the wishful thinking part.

 

[saltming]

The first 1/2 of this very thread, where the majority of Leafs nation is outraged at how little the Leafs got only a 3rd and 7th and 25% retention to haul away an injury prone goalie on an unwanted ugly contract, similarly how the Leafs needed to add an asset to dump the Mrazek contract.

Now it has morphed into Murray is the missing piece and answer all Leafs problems in net, huge upgrade and the final solution to when we take on Conn Smythe and 2 time Stanley Cup winning Vasilevskiy and Tampa for the rematch again, only a speed bump now as we sail towards the Stanley Cup uncontested.

The first part seems to be the more realistic portion of the thread, and the later part now the wishful thinking part.

I think the second half of the thread is "there is hope that Murray can bounce back" and "Murray @ 2 years is better than soup at 5"
Only you have been interpreting this as posts saying "Murray is the answer"

 

[Dekes For Days]

3rd string goalie on a last place team for $4.6M..

Murray wasn't a 3rd string goalie, and Ottawa wasn't the last place team, for the record.

Not a single team would pick up Murray on waivers for free with just 2.5 years left on his contract.

Picking up a goalie on waivers mid-season at 6.25 x 2.5 years =/= Picking up a goalie in the offseason at 4.69m x 2 years + 2 draft picks.

There were multiple suitors for Murray this offseason.

 

[saltming]

Murray wasn't a 3rd string goalie, and Ottawa wasn't the last place team, for the record.

Picking up a goalie on waivers mid-season at 6.25 x 2.5 years =/= Picking up a goalie in the offseason at 4.69m x 2 years + 2 draft picks.

There were multiple suitors for Murray this offseason.

I don't get how posters can't grasp the fact that players pass through waivers for different reasons and the logic that a team can't take that cap hit mid season eludes them.
I guess if it doesn't fit a narrative it's overlooked?

 

[Racer88]

Murray wasn't a 3rd string goalie, and Ottawa wasn't the last place team, for the record.

Picking up a goalie on waivers mid-season at 6.25 x 2.5 years =/= Picking up a goalie in the offseason at 4.69m x 2 years + 2 draft picks.

There were multiple suitors for Murray this offseason.

this sounds strangely similar to the Tavares justifications. Others wanted our target but Dubas rode in on his white stead and snatched them away.

I don't get how posters can't grasp the fact that players pass through waivers for different reasons and the logic that a team can't take that cap hit mid season eludes them.
I guess if it doesn't fit a narrative it's overlooked?

You are right but it is probably similar to the posters that go in about his 2 cups……..5 years ago……..a lot of water under that bridge

 

[Hoglund4MvP]

Yes Cup accomplishments.

I wasn't trying to trick you by using different words 2 and multiple that mean the same thing in this case.

I was pointing out the flaw in Leaf Nation thinking that they believe they have upgraded their goaltending because of past accomplishments. But what if Leafs face TB again and the opposion goalie has just as many accomplishments if not more like the Conn Smythe as well and doing it on his current team as opposed to Murray doing his with Crosby and Malkin that have nothing to do with Leafs current roster.

When a goalie with 2 past Cups faces Vas another goalie with 2 past recent Cups, what happens that would change the outcome of the series, because the reason to believe in Murray has been nulified by the opposition?

So If Leafs lose to Tampa Bay again next year in the playoffs because MOST people believe Vas is the better goalie, then what, we need goalie with 3 past Cups now?

no goalie exists superior to vas right now in playoffs so wasting your time thinking about "what if you face tampas goaltending". I hate the murray trade but this is not a good support why it was a bad trade.

 

[Nineteen67]

Campbell is not the reason Toronto lost to the Lightning

He was part of it, same with Montreal, and the same with Andersen when he was playing.

Other than game 7 against TB last year ( this year it was on Brodie forgetting how to play a one on one) goaltenders have given up a stinker every single elimination game.

The hope is Samsonov, or maybe Murray, can change that.

 

[Bellzy]

The best ability is availability..

Murray played his last game last year March 5th, 2022 and has spent the last 4 months recovering from a serious concussion.

Murray wouldn't have even been a playoff option last year because of injury, so its hard to hoist the Cup when sitting on LTIR.

For the record - The last time Murray played in the playoffs was 2018-19 with the Pens when they got swept by NYI's in round #1 and Murray went 0-4-0 3.50 GAA and .891 sv%..

Why do you guys have nothing but negative things to say. At the end of the day, we are stuck with Murray for good or bad. So just relax and let it play out. You guys are stressing for no reason. Best case, we win a cup. Worst case, we lose again and everything is wiped. Who cares, it’s just a game. Go enjoy your life.