Confirmed with Link: [TOR/CBJ] TOR acquire Riley Nash for Conditional. 7th Pick in 2022

[TheGroceryStick]

what in gawds name are you talking about?

he won't be on our cap ever this year,,he won't be back till the POs and there is no cap in the POs

Give him a break he may have came in late. I to had to read a bit before I got the jist

 

[Wafflewhipper]

If Dubas aquires another goalie, I'd say Freddy is done. If not, they most likely think he will be ready. Start Campbell like the Caps started Grubauer and bring in Freddy as needed.

He has to. Freddy is done or minimum getting the full rest now until playoffs. They don’t really tell anything.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

I understand what you're saying. I'm saying this trade has nothing to do with cap space and everything to do with us making Foligno's retention "free" for Columbus.

Foligno probably isn't the only trade we're going to make. Andersen is done and will likely be traded, he was retroactively put on the LTIR to facilitate today's trade in cap space and us acquiring Nash facilitates Columbus retaining 50% of Foligno.

You are free to dream sir or madam!

 

[BertCorbeau]

Just saw the pick is conditional. If Nash appears in 25% of the Leafs' playoff games, the pick becomes a 6th rounder.

Given he number of late round picks the Leafs had last year, they've got an abundance of long term prospects in the system.

 

[Teeder Keon]

Skip to 1:40 .. O Dog looks like he hasn't gotten an exercise since he retired, and this is hilarious

Just a day earlier he was working out and doing some running drills to prepare for that run you have shown us , I just got that footage

 

[Wrong Wilson]

I love that "nothing happens on the ice for either team"

Not only does he shut down the opposition, he shuts down his own team too!

 

[fahad203]

Awesome
I know that is hilarious

Hard to believe he was once a professional hockey player. That he once scored 40 goals in NHL
Joking aside though, he was a very good finisher

 

[Teeder Keon]

Hard to believe he was once a professional hockey player. That he once scored 40 goals in NHL
Joking aside though, he was a very good finisher

Yes he was very good at finishing buffets
And yes he was a good sniper

 

[Teeder Keon]

Hard to believe he was once a professional hockey player. That he once scored 40 goals in NHL
Joking aside though, he was a very good finisher

Have you seen daddy Tkachuk lately

 

[Thornbury]

Cap space and a player you can build a checking line around we got for dirt cheap, a lot of wins for us in this one

We also used the MLSE chequebook to make the deal. Saves Columbus a half million or so.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Skip to 1:40 .. O Dog looks like he hasn't gotten an exercise since he retired, and this is hilarious

OK, this is ridiculous. I'm 7 years older than O'Neill and in 10 times better shape than him and he was a pro athlete. How could he have fallen off that fast? He was still in the league 15 years ago, I've never been in more than a beer league and I'd be comfortable going head to head against him on the ice right now. WTF? Seems like a really good guy and someone I'd love to hang out with so it feels slimy saying this but...damn.

 

[123offtheglass]

We're going to really appreciate this trade in the playoffs.

 

[Stonehands1990]

You are free to dream sir or madam!

Parts of the post make sense. We just saved CBJ some real dollars. Could lessen the blow of them having to retain on Foligno or Savard

 

[Faltorvo]

Give him a break he may have came in late. I to had to read a bit before I got the jist

ok fair point

 

[Nash 2]

Had to reset a password to get back on here for this thread.
Lurker mode deactivated. lol

Like this move. Freeing up cap space for.....

 

[Ashdown2]

they could literally could just have done .
foligno (some retention) and nash for like picks/prospects instead of going through this extra step now 2 days later lol

 

[Faltorvo]

Just saw the pick is conditional. If Nash appears in 25% of the Leafs' playoff games, the pick becomes a 6th rounder.

Given he number of late round picks the Leafs had last year, they've got an abundance of long term prospects in the system.

so he only has to play 1 game then?

 

[Mr Knies Guy]

Absolutely perfect for playoff hockey 4th line. I love this.

 

[Teeder Keon]

they could literally could just have done .
foligno (some retention) and nash for like picks/prospects instead of going through this extra step now 2 days later lol

I’m pretty sure that they know what they’re doing in terms of options and caps and procedures and more up there in the offices

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Skip to 1:40 .. O Dog looks like he hasn't gotten an exercise since he retired, and this is hilarious

Drove his truck to the starting line

 

[Marshy]

so he only has to play 1 game then?

Yup. We're always swept in the playoffs.

Zero times since 80-81 vs. the Isles.

Or if we're counting 4 game sweeps only....1978 vs the Habs dynasty.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

I tried reading the LTIR rules on Capfriendly just now but I went into a vegetative state. That said, I thought we got the full value back in cap space for a LTIR salary as long as we were spending to the limit otherwise? Isn't that why we picked up a couple of LTIR players over the past few years, to increase the cap?

It's a bit of a brain bender. Here's an example set of transactions that show how Nash is not making more cap space available to us for acquisitions:

Cap expenditure: How much salary cap hit we are spending
Cap limit: Our upper cap limit

1. Before the Nash trade, let's say we are firm up against the cap. Freddy is not on LTIR yet.

Cap expenditure: $81.5m
Cap limit: $81.5m
Free space: $0

2. We put Freddy on LTIR to make room to bring Nash in. We get $5m in relief from Freddy which puts up our limit, but our expenditure stays the same (Freddy included in our expenditure!).

Cap expenditure: $81.5m
Cap limit: $86.5m
Free space: $5m

3. We acquire Nash ($2.75m cap hit), he is on IR not LTIR. So our cap limit stays the same but he gets added to our expenditure.

Cap expenditure: $84.25m
Cap limit: $86.5m
Free space: $2.25m

4. We immediately put Nash on LTIR. This increases our cap limit, but our cap expenditure stays the same similar to when we LTIR'd Freddy. So the LTIR space that was freed up for us is effectively consumed by Riley Nash himself. We are back to exactly $5m in free space (Freddy's cap hit):

Cap expenditure: $84.25m
Cap limit: $89.25m
Free space: $5m

Furthermore, we have to plan for the fact that Freddy isn't done for the season (like 99% likely). So at some point after the trade deadline while the cap is still in effect, we have to keep that $5m available on the roster to activate him. So that $5m can't really be used for TDL acquisition purposes.

In the past we've acquired players to bring us up to as close to $81.5m as possible so that we could go into LTIR and get the maximum relief. Here is another example where we are not optimizing our relief pool. Before we signed Marner, we were sitting somewhere like $6m under the cap ceiling even with Horton on our roster, and we were going to have to use LTIR for the whole season. If we didn't acquire Clarkson, this would have happened:

1. We're in the offseason before we sign Marner

Cap expenditure: $75.5m
Cap limit: $81.5m
Free space: $6m

2. Put Horton's $5m on LTIR

Cap expenditure: $75.5m
Cap limit: $80.5m (it came down! This is because our cap hit was $75.5m when we activated LTIR. This $75.5m is now our "ACSL" -- whoops...)
Free space: $5m

So, we couldn't go into LTIR yet without seriously f***ing up our cap, we wouldn't have the space to sign Marner. So we acquired Clarkson first:

1. We're in the offseason before we sign Marner

Cap expenditure: $75.5m
Cap limit: $81.5m
Free space: $6m

2. Acquire Clarkson (say he was $6m)

Cap expenditure: $81.5m
Cap limit: $81.5m
Free space: $0

3. Put both Clarkson and Horton on LTIR (combined $11m)

Cap expenditure: $81.5m
Cap limit: $92.5m
Free space: $11m

4. Sign Marner!

So for purposes of pushing your cap expenditure as close to the salary cap as possible so as to optimize your LTIR relief pool, then acquiring LTIR contracts can help increase your cap space. But once your ACSL is optimized or you are already in LTIR, adding more LTIR contracts does not afford you more cap space.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

Parts of the post make sense. We just saved CBJ some real dollars. Could lessen the blow of them having to retain on Foligno or Savard

You sure about that? Is Nash not insured for injury?

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

It's a bit of a brain bender. Here's an example set of transactions that show how Nash is not making more cap space available to us for acquisitions:

Cap expenditure: How much salary cap hit we are spending
Cap limit: Our upper cap limit

1. Before the Nash trade, let's say we are firm up against the cap. Freddy is not on LTIR yet.

Cap expenditure: $81.5m
Cap limit: $81.5m
Free space: $0

2. We put Freddy on LTIR to make room to bring Nash in. We get $5m in relief from Freddy which puts up our limit, but our expenditure stays the same (Freddy included in our expenditure!).

Cap expenditure: $81.5m
Cap limit: $86.5m
Free space: $5m

3. We acquire Nash ($2.75m cap hit), he is on IR not LTIR. So our cap limit stays the same but he gets added to our expenditure.

Cap expenditure: $84.25m
Cap limit: $86.5m
Free space: $2.25m

4. We immediately put Nash on LTIR. This increases our cap limit, but our cap expenditure stays the same similar to when we LTIR'd Freddy. So the LTIR space that was freed up for us is effectively consumed by Riley Nash himself. We are back to exactly $5m in free space (Freddy's cap hit):

Cap expenditure: $84.25m
Cap limit: $89.25m
Free space: $5m

Furthermore, we have to plan for the fact that Freddy isn't done for the season (like 99% likely). So at some point after the trade deadline while the cap is still in effect, we have to keep that $5m available on the roster to activate him. So that $5m can't really be used for TDL acquisition purposes.

In the past we've acquired players to bring us up to as close to $81.5m as possible so that we could go into LTIR and get the maximum relief. Here is another example where we are not optimizing our relief pool. Before we signed Marner, we were sitting somewhere like $6m under the cap ceiling even with Horton on our roster, and we were going to have to use LTIR for the whole season. If we didn't acquire Clarkson, this would have happened:

1. We're in the offseason before we sign Marner

Cap expenditure: $75.5m
Cap limit: $81.5m
Free space: $6m

2. Put Horton's $5m on LTIR

Cap expenditure: $75.5m
Cap limit: $80.5m (it came down! This is because our cap hit was $75.5m when we activated LTIR. This $75.5m is now our "ACSL" -- whoops...)
Free space: $5m

So, we couldn't go into LTIR yet without seriously f***ing up our cap, we wouldn't have the space to sign Marner. So we acquired Clarkson first:

1. We're in the offseason before we sign Marner

Cap expenditure: $75.5m
Cap limit: $81.5m
Free space: $6m

2. Acquire Clarkson (say he was $6m)

Cap expenditure: $81.5m
Cap limit: $81.5m
Free space: $0

3. Put both Clarkson and Horton on LTIR (combined $11m)

Cap expenditure: $81.5m
Cap limit: $92.5m
Free space: $11m

4. Sign Marner!

So for purposes of pushing your cap expenditure as close to the salary cap as possible so as to optimize your LTIR relief pool, then acquiring LTIR contracts can help increase your cap space. But once your ACSL is optimized or you are already in LTIR, adding more LTIR contracts does not afford you more cap space.

OK, thanks for the explanation. What I don't get is this part: "We immediately put Nash on LTIR. This increases our cap limit, but our cap expenditure stays the same similar to when we LTIR'd Freddy. So the LTIR space that was freed up for us is effectively consumed by Riley Nash himself."

Why is Nash any different than Andersen in this regard? You increased the cap limit by $5M when Andersen goes on LTIR but not for Nash when moved to LTIR, that's where I'm missing something.

Also, for what it's worth, I'm think you don't get the full value of those contracts, it must be a prorated portion of what's left of those salaries.

 

[moon111]

I can still remember losing to Boston in a Game 7 without Bozak to win face-offs or shut the opposition down. All we had were one-way centers that embarrassed the team. If he can cause time to stand still, I'm all for it, because if we're desperate for a goal, I can think of a few other players on the team I'd gladly give more ice-time to.