Player Discussion Tony DeAngelo - Part II

[Off Sides]

I am a little surprised to see so much faith being placed in Quinn.

I mean we'll see how it works out, I too am hoping he has the correct read on what a players intentions were, has a good grip on whatever level of maturity is required, etc.

I am just not really quite ready to praise his methods until some level of positive results come about.

If his methods lead to ADA, Buch and such becoming better players, I'll be more supportive. Yet if this just leads to players like that being jettisoned from the team in order to import lesser talented yet easier to work with players, I'm not sure if I'll see that as a positive development.

 

[Kovalev27]

I agree Quinn hasn’t done anything in this league why the blind faith in him I don’t know

 

[JCProdigy]

Nobody knows exactly what got Tony D benched and whether it would have crossed their line if they were the coach in that situation but Quinn is the coach and it crossed his line. I'm certainly not going to go off on Quinn and his decisions without knowing the whole story. Quinn is human, so he'll screw up with interpersonal issues at some point. All coaches do, some more than others, but it's hard to tell until the post-mortem.

What I do know is that it's likely some people here haven't been part of a well functioning work group in a professional setting, or a manager of said group. It's f'n difficult. Once you have been, given that your self-aware, you have a whole new appreciation for group dynamics.

 

[Edge]

You know, we keep going back to the less talented line and yet we kind of ignore Chytil, Kreider, Zibanejad, and Hayes.

I don't get the sense that Quinn is looking for every player to be the same. I think, for lack of a better phrase, that Quinn is looking for the players to be the best versions of themselves.

He's not trying to turn Buch into Adam Graves. But I don't think anyone would argue that Buch isn't even the best version of Buch on too many nights. And amazingly, he seems to respond every time he is really pushed harder.

With ADA, I think Quinn's comments were pretty straight forward --- he's too damn talented to let stupid crap get in the way of the player he could be.

At no point do I get the impression that Quinn wants these guys to be anything more than the best versions of the players they are capable of.

 

[Ori]

Not sure that he has a lot of time to figure it out. One team has already quit on him.

I know I remember his history in Arizona cross fingers they figure it out - it`s how they communicate with players too. I just hope Quinn is understanding like Travis Green since all players have a different personality and they need to be approached different related to the communication topic.

 

[JimmyG89]

I mean, Quinn has been dealing with 19-23 year olds for decades at this point. That's what most of these guys are. It's better than anything AV was doing. At least he talks to these guys.

 

[Edge]

I agree Quinn hasn’t done anything in this league why the blind faith in him I don’t know

It's really not blind faith.

If anything, I think the pushback and anti-Quinn crap is far more over the top than the so-called faith.

I think people have wanted accountability and they feel that for the first time in a long time, they are seeing it.

I think they're seeing the progress of certain players, and factoring in that there's quite a few positive signs.

I think after listening to the non-stop complaining about AV, there's also a mindset that the problem isn't that every coach is just a moron in spite of the obvious genius at work on these boards.

I think there's a handful of people who literally bitch incessantly about everything. In some cases, I'm not even sure they realize that they do it. But they're miserable and frankly only seem happy when other people are miserable with them.

So in general, I think that's more of what we're seeing than blind faith per se.

 

[Kovalev27]

The thing is I don’t know if I believe him. He couldn’t wait to put Pionk back with staal in that philly game. He has consistently played Pionk over DeAngelo all year. So when Pionk is out and tony is playing and we’re winning all is fine but the second Pionk is back Tony has maturity issues. I just don’t really buy it. I think he’s too emotional and makes some bad decisions with that but a lot of good players do that. He never dogs it out there. He works his ass off on the ice and performs that’s what we should care about.

Pionk looked like a 12 year old out there. It’s laughable the coaches today are going to go back and watch that game and say hmm Pionk should def keep playing he’s looking good. Kid is awful.

 

[Kovalev27]

The thing is I don’t know if I believe him. He couldn’t wait to put Pionk back with staal in that philly game. He has consistently played Pionk over DeAngelo all year. So when Pionk is out and tony is playing and we’re winning all is fine but the second Pionk is back Tony has maturity issues. I just don’t really buy it. I think he’s too emotional and makes some bad decisions with that but a lot of good players do that. He never dogs it out there. He works his ass off on the ice and performs that’s what we should care about.

Pionk looked like a 12 year old out there. It’s laughable the coaches today are going to go back and watch that game and say hmm Pionk should def keep playing he’s looking good. Kid is awful.

 

[dangsLITE]

I wonder if the lack of a captain/clear leadership has had any impact here. Would be responsive to leader putting him in his place as opposed to just the coach. Obviously, we have leaders without captains but maybe him and other players would be more accountable if it was more explicitly by the team.

Don't know what is going on in the locker room, but perhaps he needs a wake up call from someone else and in a different way. Or maybe he's already gotten in. Just a thought

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

This may not have been performance related, but sometimes decisions need to be made that ARE performance related. I'm fine with a one off, but why should we trust Quinn when for much of the season he has prioritized a clearly inferior Pionk over ADA.

It would be one thing if this wasn't a regular thing. But he just continuously rides a pair that is one of the worst in the NHL and certainly the worst 'First-Pair.'

 

[McRanger]

You know, we keep going back to the less talented line and yet we kind of ignore Chytil, Kreider, Zibanejad, and Hayes.

I don't get the sense that Quinn is looking for every player to be the same. I think, for lack of a better phrase, that Quinn is looking for the players to be the best versions of themselves.

He's not trying to turn Buch into Adam Graves. But I don't think anyone would argue that Buch isn't even the best version of Buch on too many nights. And amazingly, he seems to respond every time he is really pushed harder.

With ADA, I think Quinn's comments were pretty straight forward --- he's too damn talented to let stupid crap get in the way of the player he could be.

At no point do I get the impression that Quinn wants these guys to be anything more than the best versions of the players they are capable of.

I agree completely that is his intention.

The question is what happens if those players never become the "best version" of themselves while the inferior version is still superior to the alternatives? What is Quinn's responsibility in that case?

Does he prioritize playing his best players or building a culture? Can he even give them ice time just to showcase them or will that go against his message of accountability?

 

[Blue Blooded]

He's shown he can carry a top pairing 5v5 and be a top-flight PPQB.

Just sort out the unaccepable immaturity behaviours and don't have that level be unneccesarily high and everything should be dandy. Don't let him get away with unacceptable stuff, but also don't hold him to a significantly higher standard to prove a point. Tony is always going to be a bit of a loose cannon and shit talker, that's never going to go away, just find a way where it doesn't get out of hand.

Hopefully Tony and Dave both realize this.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

He's shown he can carry a top pairing 5v5 and be a top-flight PPQB.

Just sort out the unaccepable immaturity behaviours and don't have that level be unneccesarily high and everything should be dandy. Don't let him get away with unacceptable stuff, but also don't hold him to a significantly higher standard to prove a point. Tony is always going to be a bit of a loose cannon and **** talker, that's never going to go away, just find a way where it doesn't get out of hand.

Hopefully Tony and Dave both realize this.

This is a fine response, but what other recourse does a coach have for "not letting it get out of hand" than benching/scratching someone when it does?

The people losing their minds when DeAngelo gets scratched have completely lost site of the bigger picture, especially considering this iteration of the Rangers is competing most for the #1 pick and not a Stanley Cup.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

"History" cute. Lay out his "history" for me. We have absolutely zero info aside from 2 extremely vague comments by Quinn this season.

If you're unwilling to do the homework on DeAngelo's time before the Rangers, I suppose that is why you come forward with such an uninformed viewpoint.

 

[True Blue]

If they aren't going to play him regularly, trade him. Get something back for him.

Or maybe Gorton and Quinn recognize the talent and want to try to get DeAngelo to stop certain tendencies that may short circuit his career.

 

[True Blue]

ADA probably ripped one on the bench and Quinn got all offended and is saying Tony is immature so he benches him.

Yes, I am sure that was the case.

It’s lose lose for Tony, no matter what he does he will be sat with quinn. He just doesnt like him.

By far the easiest and simplest reasoning. This also allows one to absolve DeAngelo of something that has been preached to him and put it all on the disciplinarian.

 

[True Blue]

I 100 percent agree.

All those bland, talentless hacks having career years. Damn Zibanejad, and Hayes, and Kreider --- those hard-working, talentless, vanilla, lunch-pale bastards! Damn them all!

How they manage to achieve with Quinn is beyond comprehension.

I mean, where's the damn grit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!????????????????

I don't even know what ADA said or did, but I'll be damned if I'm going to let the coach tell me that he felt it crossed a line! Who in the *@#! does he think he is?!?!?!?!?!

He's treating all this kids like they're in college, even though some of them are old enough to still be there. How DARE he guide them and set expectations. For Chrissakes, when has discipline and expectations ever gotten a player anywhere in this life?

I say %&!@ Quinn, !@$! him right in the ear! That bean eating nobody!

Gold

 

[offdacrossbar]

It's really not blind faith.

If anything, I think the pushback and anti-Quinn crap is far more over the top than the so-called faith.

I think people have wanted accountability and they feel that for the first time in a long time, they are seeing it.

I think they're seeing the progress of certain players, and factoring in that there's quite a few positive signs.

I think after listening to the non-stop complaining about AV, there's also a mindset that the problem isn't that every coach is just a moron in spite of the obvious genius at work on these boards.

I think there's a handful of people who literally ***** incessantly about everything. In some cases, I'm not even sure they realize that they do it. But they're miserable and frankly only seem happy when other people are miserable with them.

So in general, I think that's more of what we're seeing than blind faith per se.

your preachiness is tiresome yours is the only opinion that matters ? i respect your opinion and agree with you often but here you have fallen into a trap of name calling and judging. you need to step back.

there are many here who dont agree with your take or quinns methods. imagine that.

im sorry, not buying the quinn love at all. i am disagreeing with his tactics and methods of favoritism and playing lesser talented players more and specifically, ADA sitting when pionk returns healthy. where's there accountability there ?

ADA gives his all every shift. kids engaged, physical, emotional and plays hard non stop. his performance on the ice is as good or better than any other dman. i haven't read one thing to tell me hes a bad teammate. larrys article detailed that and supports my belief.

ADA's metrics support his overall play as stellar. kid has a defense leading +4. thats saying something with this tire fire D.

and lastly, maybe quinn should try to get pionk to be the "best version of him he can be" or whatever that means because this version of "neal pionk being neal pionk" isnt very good.

i want a winning team not a team that tries hard with good intentions and loses.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

The thing is I don’t know if I believe him. He couldn’t wait to put Pionk back with staal in that philly game. He has consistently played Pionk over DeAngelo all year. So when Pionk is out and tony is playing and we’re winning all is fine but the second Pionk is back Tony has maturity issues. I just don’t really buy it. I think he’s too emotional and makes some bad decisions with that but a lot of good players do that. He never dogs it out there. He works his ass off on the ice and performs that’s what we should care about.

Pionk looked like a 12 year old out there. It’s laughable the coaches today are going to go back and watch that game and say hmm Pionk should def keep playing he’s looking good. Kid is awful.

Quinn lying about DeAngelo being immature to get Pionk into the lineup is the most ridiculous hot take yet. Thanks for that.

 

[True Blue]

That’s on Buch and ADA no matter what anyone wants to argue to the contrary. It doesn’t matter if they’re better players than X, Y or Z

THEY WONT PLAY UNTIL THEY LEARN

Exactly. Spooner could not or would not. He is not here. Nametsnikov could and does. And is playing. ADA either had turrets syndrome and cannot help himself, in which case he needs help. Or he consciously choosing not to adhere. In which case, he needs help. Quinn is choosing to help him. He will either change a la Nametsnikov or not and then will not find himself dressing for games and will soon be on his 4th NHL team. Not a great distinction for one so young.

 

[Inferno]

You know, we keep going back to the less talented line and yet we kind of ignore Chytil, Kreider, Zibanejad, and Hayes.

I don't get the sense that Quinn is looking for every player to be the same. I think, for lack of a better phrase, that Quinn is looking for the players to be the best versions of themselves.

He's not trying to turn Buch into Adam Graves. But I don't think anyone would argue that Buch isn't even the best version of Buch on too many nights. And amazingly, he seems to respond every time he is really pushed harder.

With ADA, I think Quinn's comments were pretty straight forward --- he's too damn talented to let stupid crap get in the way of the player he could be.

At no point do I get the impression that Quinn wants these guys to be anything more than the best versions of the players they are capable of.

U need to post more.

 

[JCProdigy]

At no point do I get the impression that Quinn wants these guys to be anything more than the best versions of the players they are capable of.

As any successful manager of people would. From an outside view, that is the impression that I get as well.

The biggest thing I took away from Quinn's comment was that he actually sees and believes in Tony's talent.

" He’s too good to let maturity issues get in the way of him becoming the kind of player that he can be" -Quinn

Of course, that would totally destroy the narrative that some people on here are trying to push forward.

 

[True Blue]

He has consistently played Pionk over DeAngelo all year. So when Pionk is out and tony is playing and we’re winning all is fine but the second Pionk is back Tony has maturity issues.

Maybe if DeAngleo has done what was being asked of him, he would have found himself playing more and Pionk less?

And this suddenly did not come up. He found himself stapled to the bench for a long stretch the previous game.

 

[True Blue]

Does he prioritize playing his best players or building a culture? Can he even give them ice time just to showcase them or will that go against his message of accountability?

I think that right now, his priority is to build a culture. That was clear when Buch was scratched to play 7 defensemen. No one is playing who he believes doesn't deserve to be.