Tribute Timothy Liljegren Discussion Thread

[ULF_55]

Some wishful thinking on his performance for sure. He made a nice block to stop a scoring chance early and the tv crew praised him, but failed to mention that he needed to make that block because he was lost in his own end to begin with and not covering anybody. We only see what we want to see out of this player apparently. The accepted narrative is that he's a star waiting to break out, not that he's an overripe prospect on his last kick at making the club 4 years post draft. Don't present facts that muddy the waters on what a star he is, just accept it because Zeke said so.

Balance is important.

Like calling him a star, or saying he's on his last kick at making the club as a 22 year old defenseman is the extreme fringe.

Most people understand those are two unreasonable takes.

 

[Martin Skoula]

I'm not sure how you can be down on the guy, he's shown obvious tools and has shown an adaptable toolkit at every level he's played. Probably our 3rd best all-direction skater on D behind Rielly and Brodie, top-3 functional strength in his own zone, arguably the most consistent first pass on the blueline, arguably the best shooter on the blueline, probably 2nd best gap control against the rush after Brodie. All he needs is to play consistent minutes to make his decision making more automatic like he's done over a month or two every time he's moved up a level so far in his career.

I really just don't see what's going to stop him from becoming something close to Brodie.

 

[Borschevsky]

He's matured a lot since his first year in the AHL when I used to go to Marlies game and see him falling all over the place.

My only issue... the nickname some of you use for him. Lilypad is the worst nickname I've ever heard.

 

[nobody]

I'm a huge Lilly fan and I think he had a very shaky night last night. At least compared to what we had previously seen in the preseason. With that said, I think a lot of it has to do with nerves and the kid may be just trying to be too perfect with the few opportunities he gets. Even with the less than spectacular play he still looked better than Holl and the advanced stats seem to show the same (yes very small sample size). I think Holl has a spot on this team but maybe we should phase out Dermott and rotate him and Holl in. Let Lilly grow with Muzz and reassure him that even if he has a bad shift or bad game, he's not going to be punished for it.

 

[Morgs]

It's funny because if you look at his raw xG that game its the worst of the defenseman. Because his primary partner last night was Muzzin though and he had such an awful start to the season, Liljegren actually graded ridiculously well because its giving him credit for dragging Muzzin back to being a good defenseman.

At this point you gotta play the 3 "kids" and bench Holl until these numbers go down. None of the 3 would be a remotely good choice to bench.

I'd also give Ritchie a game before it's time to have a conversation about that as well.

 

[FiveHoleo]

Balance is important.

Like calling him a star, or saying he's on his last kick at making the club as a 22 year old defenseman is the extreme fringe.

Most people understand those are two unreasonable takes.

Except that they don't. You have been reading the thread, right? I don't feel its his last kick at the can so much as it's his last free kick at the can. He's waiver eligible next season so this is going to be his last opportunity to be carried along and given opportunities without consequences for failing to seize an NHL job. That's absolutely true. Bogosian left as a free agent and opened a spot for him to take and he hasn't, others have. That's a true story. Now maybe he gets in there and takes a job from Sandin or Dermott eventually but so far its clear that hasn't happened. Last night was his first chance and he got torched by NHL calibre forward Stutzle on a few occasions, looked a bit lost at times and struggled despite being paired with the Leafs sturdiest defender. Sandin and Dermott looked a lot better without question. If he is unable to elevate to even their level yet, why is it controversial to suggest the clock is ticking on his time as a Leaf? I think its obvious.

 

[ULF_55]

Except that they don't. You have been reading the thread, right? I don't feel its his last kick at the can so much as it's his last free kick at the can. He's waiver eligible next season so this is going to be his last opportunity to be carried along and given opportunities without consequences for failing to seize an NHL job. That's absolutely true. Bogosian left as a free agent and opened a spot for him to take and he hasn't, others have. That's a true story. Now maybe he gets in there and takes a job from Sandin or Dermott eventually but so far its clear that hasn't happened. Last night was his first chance and he got torched by NHL calibre forward Stutzle on a few occasions, looked a bit lost at times and struggled despite being paired with the Leafs sturdiest defender. Sandin and Dermott looked a lot better without question. If he is unable to elevate to even their level yet, why is it controversial to suggest the clock is ticking on his time as a Leaf? I think its obvious.

I'm not sure who has taken Bogosian's spot?

You think it is 24 (25 in December) year old Dermott or 29 year old Holl?

I watched all the defenders last night and couldn't find one who didn't make a mistake, including the supposed #1 defender 27 year old Rielly.

Liljegren played fine for his 1st. game of the year. Was he perfect? Nope. Did one play result because of a poor pass cross ice pass from a mate, certainly did. Did he make some good plays, yes again.

 

[shaner8989]

Very impressed. Lets get Holl out. No room for him.

 

[Phion Keneuf]

Dermott, Sandin, and Liljegren all look good so far.

Muzzin & Holl… not so much.

Rielly has looked great, but his shooting always frustrates me. Brodie has been ok

I’d move Holl at this point, all 3 of Dermott/Sandin/Liljegren should be in

 

[Knies iT]

I'm not sure how you can be down on the guy, he's shown obvious tools and has shown an adaptable toolkit at every level he's played. Probably our 3rd best all-direction skater on D behind Rielly and Brodie, top-3 functional strength in his own zone, arguably the most consistent first pass on the blueline, arguably the best shooter on the blueline, probably 2nd best gap control against the rush after Brodie. All he needs is to play consistent minutes to make his decision making more automatic like he's done over a month or two every time he's moved up a level so far in his career.

I really just don't see what's going to stop him from becoming something close to Brodie.

He's not a better shooter than Sandin and not a better skater than Dermott, but otherwise his overall package is something that any winning team would want in their top 6 on the blueline.

 

[TMLAM34]

To Toronto: Hampus Lindholm (50% retained) and Max Jones

To Anaheim: Travis Dermott, Justin Holl and Ilya Mikheyev



Ritchie - Matthews - Marner
Nylander - Tavares - Kase
Bunting - Kampf - Kerfoot
Jones - Engvall/Simmonds - Spezza/Simmonds

Rielly - Brodie
Lindholm - Sandin
Muzzin - Liljegren
Biega

Campbell - Mrazek


I’d look into resigning Lindholm to a 6x6 contract.

 

[Gabriel426]

I really don’t understand the hate on Lilly. It seemed like some of you just don’t want to see him to succeed. Last I check, he is a Leafs prospect. As Leafs fans, I wish all Leafs prospects to be good to great Leafs.

 

[LeafChief]

To Toronto: Hampus Lindholm (50% retained) and Max Jones

To Anaheim: Travis Dermott, Justin Holl and Ilya Mikheyev



Ritchie - Matthews - Marner
Nylander - Tavares - Kase
Bunting - Kampf - Kerfoot
Jones - Engvall/Simmonds - Spezza/Simmonds

Rielly - Brodie
Lindholm - Sandin
Muzzin - Liljegren
Biega

Campbell - Mrazek


I’d look into resigning Lindholm to a 6x6 contract.

Lindholm is worth more than this.

 

[TheGoldenJet]

When there are injuries, he should be the first call up every time, and that experience will do him a lot of good IMO. However, I don’t think he should play when the top 6 are all healthy, he’s not quite there yet.

This is not how you develop an elite prospect at Liljegren’s age and experience level.

 

[Wendelstache]

Realistically they need to develop Timmy to his potential, with no foreseeable cap space some one needs to take Reilly’s minutes…

Hint: Holl is not the answer.

 

[Apex Predator]

Realistically they need to develop Timmy to his potential, with no foreseeable cap space some one needs to take Reilly’s minutes…

Hint: Holl is not the answer.

As of now I don’t think there’s anyone on the team that can take his minutes.

 

[bbgobie]

It's a long season. If the leafs are truely looking towards the playoffs now's the time to develop the kids.

 

[3headeddragon]

Dermott, Sandin, and Liljegren all look good so far.

Muzzin & Holl… not so much.

Rielly has looked great, but his shooting always frustrates me. Brodie has been ok

I’d move Holl at this point, all 3 of Dermott/Sandin/Liljegren should be in

There is no way at this point I'd move Holl. I would like to see consistency over a series of games before hand.

With that said I'd like to see Liljegren get 15-20 games in a row beside Muzzin. Let's see what the kid can do.

 

[zeke]

There's going to be plenty of games for 7 dmen to play.

Hopefully we don't need much more than that, but we probably will.

 

[ponder]

This is not how you develop an elite prospect at Liljegren’s age and experience level.

He’s a good prospect, not an elite one. When everyone is healthy, who would you sit for Lily? Obviously not any of Rielly/Brodie/Muzzin, and IMO fairly clearly not Sandin.

I think he’s got higher upside than Holl or Dermott, but I don’t think he’s quite as good as either today. Maybe he will be soon - as our #7 and first injury callup, he’ll likely get 30-50 games, plenty of development opportunities.

 

[Stonehands1990]

There's going to be plenty of games for 7 dmen to play.

Hopefully we don't need much more than that, but we probably will.

Yeah people seem to forget 7 D works out to about 70 games each player. With injuries and grind of an NHL season might even need 8

 

[TheGoldenJet]

He’s a good prospect, not an elite one. When everyone is healthy, who would you sit for Lily? Obviously not any of Rielly/Brodie/Muzzin, and IMO fairly clearly not Sandin.

I think he’s got higher upside than Holl or Dermott, but I don’t think he’s quite as good as either today. Maybe he will be soon - as our #7 and first injury callup, he’ll likely get 30-50 games, plenty of development opportunities.

For winning games today, I’d sit Sandin. With an eye on the future (which the Leafs should have where Liljegren/Sandin are concerned), I would sit one of Dermott or Holl, who has been mediocre to start this year.

 

[horner]

I'm a huge Lilly fan and I think he had a very shaky night last night. At least compared to what we had previously seen in the preseason. With that said, I think a lot of it has to do with nerves and the kid may be just trying to be too perfect with the few opportunities he gets. Even with the less than spectacular play he still looked better than Holl and the advanced stats seem to show the same (yes very small sample size). I think Holl has a spot on this team but maybe we should phase out Dermott and rotate him and Holl in. Let Lilly grow with Muzz and reassure him that even if he has a bad shift or bad game, he's not going to be punished for it.

I agree .

All our dman have hiccups in there game.
Let Lilly and Sandin grow as players.
We will need them both next year.

We won't be able to sign Morgan.

 

[horner]

He’s a good prospect, not an elite one. When everyone is healthy, who would you sit for Lily? Obviously not any of Rielly/Brodie/Muzzin, and IMO fairly clearly not Sandin.

I think he’s got higher upside than Holl or Dermott, but I don’t think he’s quite as good as either today. Maybe he will be soon - as our #7 and first injury callup, he’ll likely get 30-50 games, plenty of development opportunities.

I don't think Dermott is that great
Holl trade
Would take Lilly over both

 

[stickty111]

Garbage stuff by TSN again. Carlo should have been let go a long time ago.