Pobodys nerfect!
He’s made some mistakes, as have we all. Everyone deserves a chance to rebound - he’s trying and seems sincere. Let’s see how it goes.
Ticket/Attendance Discussion: The Sequel
- Thread starter nobody imp0rtant
- Start date
He’s made some mistakes, as have we all. Everyone deserves a chance to rebound - he’s trying and seems sincere. Let’s see how it goes.
Blue Shakehead
because lol Jets
There's a lot of smoke and mirrors going on here. TNSE is being praised for finally dropping their Anthony Soprano "nice team you got here, it'd be terrible if anything happened to 'em" campaign they've been running without an ounce of shame for the past two years. For anyone born before 1996, its pretty bizarre to see Gary Bettman of all people flying up to Winnipeg to air-lift fans off the same cliff that His Majesty and Our Savior Mark Chipman was threatening to throw all of us and our families off of as recently as last week. Disgraceful. 
Per Forbes (which is not great, but the best ballpark we have until Chippy opens his books), the Jets gate revenues were $51M USD in 2022-23 compared to their estimated total revenue (including revenue sharing) of $162M. Which means our gate revenue is about 1/3rd of total revenue. So if we sold out every seat to every game, we could expect to add about $7.3M CDN in seat revenue. Lets round it up to $10M CDN to account for concessions - which is only $7.3M USD/yr. Barely moves the needle. What is the problem here?
Hockey fans, more than most (and Winnipeggers more than any) have been brought up to believe that empty seats = imminent bankruptcy, and in the 1967 - 2005 period, that was mostly true. But the economics of pro sports has changed dramatically. We now have a salary cap and revenue sharing. Massive corporate sponsorships and national TV deals. Gaming revenues. Licensing. Playoffs. Outdoor games. Draft and All Star Weekends. The Oakland A's lost 102 games last year, their attendance rate was 15% and they still made a profit of $60M USD. Hockey is not quite there, but its a lot closer than it ever has been.
Every team in the NHL receives $30.9M USD from national TV contracts ($335M US from Rogers, $400M Disney, $225M TNT). Then add another $10.4M USD per team for national sponsorships, $0.7M in national gaming revenue and $0.5M in licensing. So the Jets get $42.5.M in corporate revenue, not including revenue sharing. Nobody knows the exact numbers, but the bottom 22 teams get revenue sharing from a pool of 6% of total HRR which is 372M USD, which is $16.9M USD average. For fun, lets say the Jets get half of that at $8.4M USD. So just from national shared revenue, your Winnipeg Jets make approx. $50.9M USD each year.
Then we have our local TV contract. If we just assume its the same as Ottawa's - which its not because that one was signed 5 years earlier than the Jets - that $24M USD/yr. Then...Chippy gets to cash cheques from the mayor for $4.7M USD in entertainment taxes and $4M USD from Wab for VLTs. That's $83.6M USD in annual revenues before selling a single seat, a $12 bud light or a jumbo jet dog.
The Jets total salaries for 2024 are $88.3M USD. So without selling tickets, we are losing money. But wait - there is a 17% escrow, which goes directly to owners to pay back player debt from the pandemic. So actual salaries for 2024 are $73.3M or $10.3M less than total non-gate revenue.
But we are finally getting to where the "problem" lies. Owners agreed to pay player salaries through the pandemic but that money was always coming back to them through escrow. It was a loan. The economics of hockey are such that it should be nearly impossible to lose money when the owners get to keep 50% of total revenues and the have-nots like Winnipeg get a larger share of corporate revenues. So the owners lost a lot of money in the pandemic but 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025 and 2026 is the owners time to make it all their covid losses back. In Winnipeg's case though, our time to make hay is happening exactly when the sun is not shining. So its extremely bad timing and unlucky for Chipman in this regard. Which is unusual for the guy who bought the team for two hundred bucks down and ham sandwich, backed by the richest owner in NHL history when the CDN dollar was above par and then went on to cash expansion fees cheques for $37M USD, which represents about 1/3 of the present US value of what he paid for the Jets at a time when owner share of revenues was only 42% vs the current take at 50%. But I digress...
The longer-term issue is corporate support. If only 15% of our tickets are sold to corporations (compared to 50% for other CDN teams), we are not only relying more on the average Joe, we need average Joe to buy the most expensive seats and we are missing out on significant and lucrative other revenue streams like local sponsorships.
Local sponsorships made up over 17% of total NHL revenues last year at 1.1B USD. Thats an average of $34M USD per team. Suffice to say, we aren't making that. We probably aren't even making 40% of that. The problem in Winnipeg is not that we have 2,000 empty seats. Its much more who is going to games and more importantly, who is not going to games/supporting the team.
Per Forbes (which is not great, but the best ballpark we have until Chippy opens his books), the Jets gate revenues were $51M USD in 2022-23 compared to their estimated total revenue (including revenue sharing) of $162M. Which means our gate revenue is about 1/3rd of total revenue. So if we sold out every seat to every game, we could expect to add about $7.3M CDN in seat revenue. Lets round it up to $10M CDN to account for concessions - which is only $7.3M USD/yr. Barely moves the needle. What is the problem here?
Hockey fans, more than most (and Winnipeggers more than any) have been brought up to believe that empty seats = imminent bankruptcy, and in the 1967 - 2005 period, that was mostly true. But the economics of pro sports has changed dramatically. We now have a salary cap and revenue sharing. Massive corporate sponsorships and national TV deals. Gaming revenues. Licensing. Playoffs. Outdoor games. Draft and All Star Weekends. The Oakland A's lost 102 games last year, their attendance rate was 15% and they still made a profit of $60M USD. Hockey is not quite there, but its a lot closer than it ever has been.
Every team in the NHL receives $30.9M USD from national TV contracts ($335M US from Rogers, $400M Disney, $225M TNT). Then add another $10.4M USD per team for national sponsorships, $0.7M in national gaming revenue and $0.5M in licensing. So the Jets get $42.5.M in corporate revenue, not including revenue sharing. Nobody knows the exact numbers, but the bottom 22 teams get revenue sharing from a pool of 6% of total HRR which is 372M USD, which is $16.9M USD average. For fun, lets say the Jets get half of that at $8.4M USD. So just from national shared revenue, your Winnipeg Jets make approx. $50.9M USD each year.
Then we have our local TV contract. If we just assume its the same as Ottawa's - which its not because that one was signed 5 years earlier than the Jets - that $24M USD/yr. Then...Chippy gets to cash cheques from the mayor for $4.7M USD in entertainment taxes and $4M USD from Wab for VLTs. That's $83.6M USD in annual revenues before selling a single seat, a $12 bud light or a jumbo jet dog.
The Jets total salaries for 2024 are $88.3M USD. So without selling tickets, we are losing money. But wait - there is a 17% escrow, which goes directly to owners to pay back player debt from the pandemic. So actual salaries for 2024 are $73.3M or $10.3M less than total non-gate revenue.
But we are finally getting to where the "problem" lies. Owners agreed to pay player salaries through the pandemic but that money was always coming back to them through escrow. It was a loan. The economics of hockey are such that it should be nearly impossible to lose money when the owners get to keep 50% of total revenues and the have-nots like Winnipeg get a larger share of corporate revenues. So the owners lost a lot of money in the pandemic but 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025 and 2026 is the owners time to make it all their covid losses back. In Winnipeg's case though, our time to make hay is happening exactly when the sun is not shining. So its extremely bad timing and unlucky for Chipman in this regard. Which is unusual for the guy who bought the team for two hundred bucks down and ham sandwich, backed by the richest owner in NHL history when the CDN dollar was above par and then went on to cash expansion fees cheques for $37M USD, which represents about 1/3 of the present US value of what he paid for the Jets at a time when owner share of revenues was only 42% vs the current take at 50%. But I digress...
The longer-term issue is corporate support. If only 15% of our tickets are sold to corporations (compared to 50% for other CDN teams), we are not only relying more on the average Joe, we need average Joe to buy the most expensive seats and we are missing out on significant and lucrative other revenue streams like local sponsorships.
Local sponsorships made up over 17% of total NHL revenues last year at 1.1B USD. Thats an average of $34M USD per team. Suffice to say, we aren't making that. We probably aren't even making 40% of that. The problem in Winnipeg is not that we have 2,000 empty seats. Its much more who is going to games and more importantly, who is not going to games/supporting the team.
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Somebody spent a lot of time and effort to put together this "summary". At the very least, it is an interesting read and at best very informative.There's a lot of smoke and mirrors going on here. TNSE is being praised for finally dropping their Anthony Soprano "nice team you got here, it'd be terrible if anything happened to 'em" campaign they've been running without an ounce of shame for the past two years. For anyone born before 1996, its pretty bizarre to see Gary Bettman of all people flying up to Winnipeg to air-lift fans off the same cliff that His Majesty and Our Savior Mark Chipman was threatening to throw all of us and our families off of as recently as last week. Disgraceful.
Per Forbes (which is not great, but the best ballpark we have until Chippy opens his books), the Jets gate revenues were $51M USD in 2022-23 compared to their estimated total revenue (including revenue sharing) of $162M. Which means our gate revenue is about 1/3rd of total revenue. So if we sold out every seat to every game, we could expect to add about $7.3M CDN in seat revenue. Lets round it up to $10M CDN to account for concessions - which is only $7.3M USD/yr. Barely moves the needle. What is the problem here?
Hockey fans, more than most (and Winnipeggers more than any) have been brought up to believe that empty seats = imminent bankruptcy, and in the 1967 - 2005 period, that was mostly true. But the economics of pro sports has changed dramatically. We now have a salary cap and revenue sharing. Massive corporate sponsorships and national TV deals. Gaming revenues. Licensing. Playoffs. Outdoor games. Draft and All Star Weekends. The Oakland A's lost 102 games last year, their attendance rate was 15% and they still made a profit of $60M USD. Hockey is not quite there, but its a lot closer than it ever has been.
Every team in the NHL receives $30.9M USD from national TV contracts ($335M US from Rogers, $400M Disney, $225M TNT). Then add another $1.1M USD per team for national sponsorships, $0.7M in national gaming revenue and $0.5M in licensing. So the Jets get $33.2M in corporate revenue, not including revenue sharing. Nobody knows the exact numbers, but the bottom 22 teams get revenue sharing from a pool of 6% of total HRR which is 372M USD, which is $16.9M USD average. For fun, lets say the Jets get half of that at $8.4M USD. So just from national shared revenue, your Winnipeg Jets make approx. $41.6M USD each year.
Then we have our local TV contract. If we just assume its the same as Ottawa's - which its not because that one was signed 5 years earlier than the Jets - that $24M USD/yr. Then...Chippy gets to cash cheques from the mayor for $4.7M USD in entertainment taxes and $4M USD from Wab for VLTs. That's $74.3M USD in annual revenues before selling a single seat, a $12 bud light or a jumbo jet dog.
The Jets total salaries for 2024 are $88.3M USD. So without selling tickets, we are losing money. But wait - there is a 17% escrow, which goes directly to owners to pay back player debt from the pandemic. So actual salaries for 2024 are $73.3M or $1M less than total non-gate revenue.
But we are finally getting to where the "problem" lies. Owners agreed to pay player salaries through the pandemic but that money was always coming back to them through escrow. It was a loan. The economics of hockey are such that it should be nearly impossible to lose money when the owners get to keep 50% of total revenues and the have-nots like Winnipeg get a larger share of corporate revenues. So the owners lost a lot of money in the pandemic but 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025 and 2026 is the owners time to make it all their covid losses back. In Winnipeg's case though, our time to make hay is happening exactly when the sun is not shining. So its extremely bad timing and unlucky for Chipman in this regard. Which is unusual for the guy who bought the team for two hundred bucks down and ham sandwich, backed by the richest owner in NHL history when the CDN dollar was above par and then went on to cash expansion fees cheques for $37M USD, which represents about 1/3 of the present US value of what he paid for the Jets at a time when owner share of revenues was only 42% vs the current take at 50%. But I digress...
The longer-term issue is corporate support. If only 15% of our tickets are sold to corporations (compared to 50% for other CDN teams), we are not only relying more on the average Joe, we need average Joe to buy the most expensive seats and we are missing out on significant and lucrative other revenue streams like local sponsorships.
Local sponsorships made up over 17% of total NHL revenues last year at 1.1B USD. Thats an average of $34M USD per team. Suffice to say, we aren't making that. We probably aren't even making 30% of that. The problem in Winnipeg is not that we have 2,000 empty seats. Its much more who is going to games and more importantly, who is not going to games/supporting the team.
Thank you for posting this, it was a very interesting read...There's a lot of smoke and mirrors going on here. TNSE is being praised for finally dropping their Anthony Soprano "nice team you got here, it'd be terrible if anything happened to 'em" campaign they've been running without an ounce of shame for the past two years. For anyone born before 1996, its pretty bizarre to see Gary Bettman of all people flying up to Winnipeg to air-lift fans off the same cliff that His Majesty and Our Savior Mark Chipman was threatening to throw all of us and our families off of as recently as last week. Disgraceful.
Per Forbes (which is not great, but the best ballpark we have until Chippy opens his books), the Jets gate revenues were $51M USD in 2022-23 compared to their estimated total revenue (including revenue sharing) of $162M. Which means our gate revenue is about 1/3rd of total revenue. So if we sold out every seat to every game, we could expect to add about $7.3M CDN in seat revenue. Lets round it up to $10M CDN to account for concessions - which is only $7.3M USD/yr. Barely moves the needle. What is the problem here?
Hockey fans, more than most (and Winnipeggers more than any) have been brought up to believe that empty seats = imminent bankruptcy, and in the 1967 - 2005 period, that was mostly true. But the economics of pro sports has changed dramatically. We now have a salary cap and revenue sharing. Massive corporate sponsorships and national TV deals. Gaming revenues. Licensing. Playoffs. Outdoor games. Draft and All Star Weekends. The Oakland A's lost 102 games last year, their attendance rate was 15% and they still made a profit of $60M USD. Hockey is not quite there, but its a lot closer than it ever has been.
Every team in the NHL receives $30.9M USD from national TV contracts ($335M US from Rogers, $400M Disney, $225M TNT). Then add another $1.1M USD per team for national sponsorships, $0.7M in national gaming revenue and $0.5M in licensing. So the Jets get $33.2M in corporate revenue, not including revenue sharing. Nobody knows the exact numbers, but the bottom 22 teams get revenue sharing from a pool of 6% of total HRR which is 372M USD, which is $16.9M USD average. For fun, lets say the Jets get half of that at $8.4M USD. So just from national shared revenue, your Winnipeg Jets make approx. $41.6M USD each year.
Then we have our local TV contract. If we just assume its the same as Ottawa's - which its not because that one was signed 5 years earlier than the Jets - that $24M USD/yr. Then...Chippy gets to cash cheques from the mayor for $4.7M USD in entertainment taxes and $4M USD from Wab for VLTs. That's $74.3M USD in annual revenues before selling a single seat, a $12 bud light or a jumbo jet dog.
The Jets total salaries for 2024 are $88.3M USD. So without selling tickets, we are losing money. But wait - there is a 17% escrow, which goes directly to owners to pay back player debt from the pandemic. So actual salaries for 2024 are $73.3M or $1M less than total non-gate revenue.
But we are finally getting to where the "problem" lies. Owners agreed to pay player salaries through the pandemic but that money was always coming back to them through escrow. It was a loan. The economics of hockey are such that it should be nearly impossible to lose money when the owners get to keep 50% of total revenues and the have-nots like Winnipeg get a larger share of corporate revenues. So the owners lost a lot of money in the pandemic but 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025 and 2026 is the owners time to make it all their covid losses back. In Winnipeg's case though, our time to make hay is happening exactly when the sun is not shining. So its extremely bad timing and unlucky for Chipman in this regard. Which is unusual for the guy who bought the team for two hundred bucks down and ham sandwich, backed by the richest owner in NHL history when the CDN dollar was above par and then went on to cash expansion fees cheques for $37M USD, which represents about 1/3 of the present US value of what he paid for the Jets at a time when owner share of revenues was only 42% vs the current take at 50%. But I digress...
The longer-term issue is corporate support. If only 15% of our tickets are sold to corporations (compared to 50% for other CDN teams), we are not only relying more on the average Joe, we need average Joe to buy the most expensive seats and we are missing out on significant and lucrative other revenue streams like local sponsorships.
Local sponsorships made up over 17% of total NHL revenues last year at 1.1B USD. Thats an average of $34M USD per team. Suffice to say, we aren't making that. We probably aren't even making 30% of that. The problem in Winnipeg is not that we have 2,000 empty seats. Its much more who is going to games and more importantly, who is not going to games/supporting the team.
abax44
Registered User
- Jan 22, 2005
- 2,662
- 2,085
Long story short, they need corporate support. Exactly what they said. I guess it's nice to have the novel, too, though. 
really disappointed on how chipman and the media(local and national) handled this "situation".
Buffdog
Registered User
- Feb 13, 2019
- 8,324
- 20,203
Excellent post. Answered most of the questions I had but was too lazy to dig up answers tooThere's a lot of smoke and mirrors going on here. TNSE is being praised for finally dropping their Anthony Soprano "nice team you got here, it'd be terrible if anything happened to 'em" campaign they've been running without an ounce of shame for the past two years. For anyone born before 1996, its pretty bizarre to see Gary Bettman of all people flying up to Winnipeg to air-lift fans off the same cliff that His Majesty and Our Savior Mark Chipman was threatening to throw all of us and our families off of as recently as last week. Disgraceful.
Per Forbes (which is not great, but the best ballpark we have until Chippy opens his books), the Jets gate revenues were $51M USD in 2022-23 compared to their estimated total revenue (including revenue sharing) of $162M. Which means our gate revenue is about 1/3rd of total revenue. So if we sold out every seat to every game, we could expect to add about $7.3M CDN in seat revenue. Lets round it up to $10M CDN to account for concessions - which is only $7.3M USD/yr. Barely moves the needle. What is the problem here?
Hockey fans, more than most (and Winnipeggers more than any) have been brought up to believe that empty seats = imminent bankruptcy, and in the 1967 - 2005 period, that was mostly true. But the economics of pro sports has changed dramatically. We now have a salary cap and revenue sharing. Massive corporate sponsorships and national TV deals. Gaming revenues. Licensing. Playoffs. Outdoor games. Draft and All Star Weekends. The Oakland A's lost 102 games last year, their attendance rate was 15% and they still made a profit of $60M USD. Hockey is not quite there, but its a lot closer than it ever has been.
Every team in the NHL receives $30.9M USD from national TV contracts ($335M US from Rogers, $400M Disney, $225M TNT). Then add another $1.1M USD per team for national sponsorships, $0.7M in national gaming revenue and $0.5M in licensing. So the Jets get $33.2M in corporate revenue, not including revenue sharing. Nobody knows the exact numbers, but the bottom 22 teams get revenue sharing from a pool of 6% of total HRR which is 372M USD, which is $16.9M USD average. For fun, lets say the Jets get half of that at $8.4M USD. So just from national shared revenue, your Winnipeg Jets make approx. $41.6M USD each year.
Then we have our local TV contract. If we just assume its the same as Ottawa's - which its not because that one was signed 5 years earlier than the Jets - that $24M USD/yr. Then...Chippy gets to cash cheques from the mayor for $4.7M USD in entertainment taxes and $4M USD from Wab for VLTs. That's $74.3M USD in annual revenues before selling a single seat, a $12 bud light or a jumbo jet dog.
The Jets total salaries for 2024 are $88.3M USD. So without selling tickets, we are losing money. But wait - there is a 17% escrow, which goes directly to owners to pay back player debt from the pandemic. So actual salaries for 2024 are $73.3M or $1M less than total non-gate revenue.
But we are finally getting to where the "problem" lies. Owners agreed to pay player salaries through the pandemic but that money was always coming back to them through escrow. It was a loan. The economics of hockey are such that it should be nearly impossible to lose money when the owners get to keep 50% of total revenues and the have-nots like Winnipeg get a larger share of corporate revenues. So the owners lost a lot of money in the pandemic but 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025 and 2026 is the owners time to make it all their covid losses back. In Winnipeg's case though, our time to make hay is happening exactly when the sun is not shining. So its extremely bad timing and unlucky for Chipman in this regard. Which is unusual for the guy who bought the team for two hundred bucks down and ham sandwich, backed by the richest owner in NHL history when the CDN dollar was above par and then went on to cash expansion fees cheques for $37M USD, which represents about 1/3 of the present US value of what he paid for the Jets at a time when owner share of revenues was only 42% vs the current take at 50%. But I digress...
The longer-term issue is corporate support. If only 15% of our tickets are sold to corporations (compared to 50% for other CDN teams), we are not only relying more on the average Joe, we need average Joe to buy the most expensive seats and we are missing out on significant and lucrative other revenue streams like local sponsorships.
Local sponsorships made up over 17% of total NHL revenues last year at 1.1B USD. Thats an average of $34M USD per team. Suffice to say, we aren't making that. We probably aren't even making 30% of that. The problem in Winnipeg is not that we have 2,000 empty seats. Its much more who is going to games and more importantly, who is not going to games/supporting the team.
Thank you
Its supporters like you that will the team returned, and will continue to operate in our market.
Actually the next lowest Canadian team is 45%!
Jetfaninflorida
Southernmost Jet Fan
Ggg99
Registered User
- Sep 17, 2018
- 1,888
- 5,548
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flyingkiwi
Registered User
Watched Bettman's media availablity and as a completely non interested party... I liked it.
If I was Joe fan I'd be feeling pretty reassured, and I think that was his goal. To reassure the individual fans and ticket holders who have been supporting the team disproportionately, while giving those that can a slight push to consider tickets.
If anyone should feel told off, it's Chipman and co and the media. I imagine Chipman and co may have got a bigger growling behind closed doors about not reserving enough corporate seats in 2011 and how they have handled STH relations/messaging. Hopefully that gets fixed for you guys.
And I believe him about the routine visit bit, just bad timing so had to get out in front of the rumours swirling and fearmongering. I enjoyed his comment about being there for Filipino heritage night haha. Was there as much noise about that?
And hopefully those hotels will get built, bring in the Draft.
If I was Joe fan I'd be feeling pretty reassured, and I think that was his goal. To reassure the individual fans and ticket holders who have been supporting the team disproportionately, while giving those that can a slight push to consider tickets.
If anyone should feel told off, it's Chipman and co and the media. I imagine Chipman and co may have got a bigger growling behind closed doors about not reserving enough corporate seats in 2011 and how they have handled STH relations/messaging. Hopefully that gets fixed for you guys.
And I believe him about the routine visit bit, just bad timing so had to get out in front of the rumours swirling and fearmongering. I enjoyed his comment about being there for Filipino heritage night haha. Was there as much noise about that?
And hopefully those hotels will get built, bring in the Draft.
White Out 902
I'm usually right.
What do you think TN's net revenue is in a year - if the team sells out?There's a lot of smoke and mirrors going on here. TNSE is being praised for finally dropping their Anthony Soprano "nice team you got here, it'd be terrible if anything happened to 'em" campaign they've been running without an ounce of shame for the past two years. For anyone born before 1996, its pretty bizarre to see Gary Bettman of all people flying up to Winnipeg to air-lift fans off the same cliff that His Majesty and Our Savior Mark Chipman was threatening to throw all of us and our families off of as recently as last week. Disgraceful.
Per Forbes (which is not great, but the best ballpark we have until Chippy opens his books), the Jets gate revenues were $51M USD in 2022-23 compared to their estimated total revenue (including revenue sharing) of $162M. Which means our gate revenue is about 1/3rd of total revenue. So if we sold out every seat to every game, we could expect to add about $7.3M CDN in seat revenue. Lets round it up to $10M CDN to account for concessions - which is only $7.3M USD/yr. Barely moves the needle. What is the problem here?
Hockey fans, more than most (and Winnipeggers more than any) have been brought up to believe that empty seats = imminent bankruptcy, and in the 1967 - 2005 period, that was mostly true. But the economics of pro sports has changed dramatically. We now have a salary cap and revenue sharing. Massive corporate sponsorships and national TV deals. Gaming revenues. Licensing. Playoffs. Outdoor games. Draft and All Star Weekends. The Oakland A's lost 102 games last year, their attendance rate was 15% and they still made a profit of $60M USD. Hockey is not quite there, but its a lot closer than it ever has been.
Every team in the NHL receives $30.9M USD from national TV contracts ($335M US from Rogers, $400M Disney, $225M TNT). Then add another $10.4M USD per team for national sponsorships, $0.7M in national gaming revenue and $0.5M in licensing. So the Jets get $42.5.M in corporate revenue, not including revenue sharing. Nobody knows the exact numbers, but the bottom 22 teams get revenue sharing from a pool of 6% of total HRR which is 372M USD, which is $16.9M USD average. For fun, lets say the Jets get half of that at $8.4M USD. So just from national shared revenue, your Winnipeg Jets make approx. $50.9M USD each year.
Then we have our local TV contract. If we just assume its the same as Ottawa's - which its not because that one was signed 5 years earlier than the Jets - that $24M USD/yr. Then...Chippy gets to cash cheques from the mayor for $4.7M USD in entertainment taxes and $4M USD from Wab for VLTs. That's $83.6M USD in annual revenues before selling a single seat, a $12 bud light or a jumbo jet dog.
The Jets total salaries for 2024 are $88.3M USD. So without selling tickets, we are losing money. But wait - there is a 17% escrow, which goes directly to owners to pay back player debt from the pandemic. So actual salaries for 2024 are $73.3M or $10.3M less than total non-gate revenue.
But we are finally getting to where the "problem" lies. Owners agreed to pay player salaries through the pandemic but that money was always coming back to them through escrow. It was a loan. The economics of hockey are such that it should be nearly impossible to lose money when the owners get to keep 50% of total revenues and the have-nots like Winnipeg get a larger share of corporate revenues. So the owners lost a lot of money in the pandemic but 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025 and 2026 is the owners time to make it all their covid losses back. In Winnipeg's case though, our time to make hay is happening exactly when the sun is not shining. So its extremely bad timing and unlucky for Chipman in this regard. Which is unusual for the guy who bought the team for two hundred bucks down and ham sandwich, backed by the richest owner in NHL history when the CDN dollar was above par and then went on to cash expansion fees cheques for $37M USD, which represents about 1/3 of the present US value of what he paid for the Jets at a time when owner share of revenues was only 42% vs the current take at 50%. But I digress...
The longer-term issue is corporate support. If only 15% of our tickets are sold to corporations (compared to 50% for other CDN teams), we are not only relying more on the average Joe, we need average Joe to buy the most expensive seats and we are missing out on significant and lucrative other revenue streams like local sponsorships.
Local sponsorships made up over 17% of total NHL revenues last year at 1.1B USD. Thats an average of $34M USD per team. Suffice to say, we aren't making that. We probably aren't even making 40% of that. The problem in Winnipeg is not that we have 2,000 empty seats. Its much more who is going to games and more importantly, who is not going to games/supporting the team.
When you say 10M barely moves the needle, that could be the difference between profit or loss for this organization. It was always going to be a razor thin line between making money or losing money with this team.
There definitely are other revenue streams to continue to grow, but especially with us being a cap team, we have to maximize all streams, including butts in seats.
Also, many of the corporate sponsorship deals they have are contingent on having x number of butts in the seats.
So selling out does more then just drive gate and concession revenue. It also drives how much they can take in in terms of sponsorship revenue.
Also more people at games impacts their other revenue streams around the arena.
While I do think the attendance issue is being a bit overstated by ownership it is in their best interest to have a packed arena.
Yup I think the truth is squarely in the middle between " it doesn't matter" and "ZOMG THE TEAM IS GOING TO LEAVE!"
Chipman and the club have made some missteps, particularly in not investing in the fanbase when times were good, and some of the things that Mark had said.
I appreciate his honesty, but you have to be tactful considering what the city went through in 96 and the fact that going to a game is a huge investment for many, especially in these economic times.
I always remember that Mark Chipman is the only reason that Winnipeg has a nhl team. Sure, a lot of people helped, but he was the one that methodically took the steps and drove the initiative to make it happen, from getting an ahl team, to getting the building built, to fostering and nurturing the relationship with the nhl, and finally, creating a strong business case through building multiple, sustainable revenue streams.
He's earned a lot of forgiveness from me.
Bring back the JetsTV subscription once the current TV deal is done. Force the TV watchers to pay their share.
Everyone makes mistakes. I fully expect people to come back if he does as he says and puts the effort into fan engagement.
cbcwpg
Registered User
From one Old Coot to another, I'm not sure Winnipeggers would "buy" that. Winnipeg used to be a "wholesale" city, always looking for a deal. (It still may be. Please correct me if I'm wrong.) And I think that we're already paying through our cable/streaming subscriptions.
Jetfaninflorida
Southernmost Jet Fan
Hmm. Ggg99's wife may have been wrong for the first time in her life.
Or maybe she is still right and it is seat location dependent.
You think that would bring in more revenue than what they get now in a traditional TV deal? And that the outrage and backlash would make it all worth it, when Jets fans are the only ones anywhere in Canada who are forced to pay this?
And one more thing. Do we apply this all across the province, no matter how inconvenient it is to attend a game? Say for The Pas, Brandon, and Thompson?
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