The state of the Habs Rebuild - The Next step

[Sorinth]

Reinbacher would likely flirt with NHL time this year if not for his unfortunate injury. Suzuki, Caufield, and Guhle are not youngsters any more -- the Habs didn't start with zero prospects.

Just want to highlight that no rebuild by any team starts with zero prospects/young NHLers. So it doesn't make sense to say we didn't start at zero so our rebuild should be shorter/faster then other successful rebuilds, because those successful rebuilds also didn't start at zero.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

I'm mad because I got a back in the mix meme I've been sitting on for a week and we are so trash i can't post it. Might be a while

 

[WeThreeKings]

Another thing that gets mentioned is things like "Hughes should have just signed a bunch of vets like SJS or Chicago" but the cap space didn't allow them to do that.

It was either Laine and a 2nd or two 4ish million UFAs, with term, to be 'vets' during the rebuild.

The issue is the veterans left from MB's build are worse than the rookies for the most part.

 

[Vachon23]

going into the lottery with 3rd and 12th OA would be sick.

Martone + Desnoyers and call it a day

 

[Tabarouette]

Another thing that gets mentioned is things like "Hughes should have just signed a bunch of vets like SJS or Chicago" but the cap space didn't allow them to do that.

It was either Laine and a 2nd or two 4ish million UFAs, with term, to be 'vets' during the rebuild.

The issue is the veterans left from MB's build are worse than the rookies for the most part.

well anything was possible if he had just invited Gallagher and Anderson to a nice little friendly walk next to some staircase

accidents happen so fast, you know

take the cannoli

 

[themilosh]

Yes we get their pick if they draft 11th and later.

Then why are "we" looking to get their stud RHD Andersson? Do it in the off season ffs!! Lol

 

[themilosh]

Martone + Desnoyers and call it a day

Martone YES.. and whichever of the top 5 Cs are left at 12..

 

[Kosseca]

Montreal really over estimated the step their D kids would take. But, that was a mistake by management as most of the kids were not sure fire, locks for the NHL.

Barron, X, and Struble were still finding their way in the NHL. All could have used playing with a solid veteran to help them develop. Combined about 200 games total for these 3 guys. Then there was Guhle, their best youngster in terms of development so far. And Hutson. All while having 2 seasoned vets. Once one of those 2 and/or Guhle got hurt, it was a mess as the Habs had 4 inexperienced kids in the lineup. Like playing 8 forwards with limited experience.

I think that there is something more profound taking place here. Last year the team was in almost all the game and lost so many by just 1 goal. We start this season and without having any significant lost on the roster, we add Laine and Dach. It was a very reasonable expectation that the team would take at least a small step forward.... not take 5 back like it seems to have taken right now.

I wonder how much of a deflating effect the Laine injury had on the team mental aspect. To a certain degree, it had to bring back bad memories from last year with Dach but also maybe felt like that their hope to improve got destroyed for a short period of time. The pre-season was bad and the team hasn't recover yet. Right now nothing is working: Defensive play is bad, effort is inconsistent at best, players confidence is low.

You can't expect things to turn around on a dime here, but you can't expect things to fix themselves either. Every game now is more information on what is not working. So... let view that as a evaluation process and hope that steps are taken to address the shortcomings.

 

[Habs 4 Life]

At this point season is over, we are on pace for worse than last season so ya f*** it!

The guy I really want to see in a Habs uniform next June at the draft is Porter Martone and no one else!

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

I think that there is something more profound taking place here. Last year the team was in almost all the game and lost so many by just 1 goal. We start this season and without having any significant lost on the roster, we add Laine and Dach. It was a very reasonable expectation that the team would take at least a small step forward.... not take 5 back like it seems to have taken right now.

I wonder how much of a deflating effect the Laine injury had on the team mental aspect. To a certain degree, it had to bring back bad memories from last year with Dach but also maybe felt like that their hope to improve got destroyed for a short period of time. The pre-season was bad and the team hasn't recover yet. Right now nothing is working: Defensive play is bad, effort is inconsistent at best, players confidence is low.

You can't expect things to turn around on a dime here, but you can't expect things to fix themselves either. Every game now is more information on what is not working. So... let view that as a evaluation process and hope that steps are taken to address the shortcomings.

Monahan Pearson Ylonen Kovacevic Harris Allen all gone from last year. Dach rehabilitating. Laine injured. Several rookies. This year's roster is super green. Pretty deceiving to say the roster this year is improved from last year.

 

[Vachon23]

Martone YES.. and whichever of the top 5 Cs are left at 12..

Desnoyers would be a massive add too. The combo of skills size and caractere/toughness we need

 

[LaP]

Another thing that gets mentioned is things like "Hughes should have just signed a bunch of vets like SJS or Chicago" but the cap space didn't allow them to do that.

It was either Laine and a 2nd or two 4ish million UFAs, with term, to be 'vets' during the rebuild.

The issue is the veterans left from MB's build are worse than the rookies for the most part.

I agree. We have plenty of vets they are just not good.

Desnoyers would be a massive add too. The combo of skills size and caractere/toughness we need

If he keeps playing like that his stock will likely raise a bit though

 

[Kosseca]

Monahan Pearson Ylonen Kovacevic Harris Allen all gone from last year. Dach rehabilitating. Laine injured. Several rookies. This year's roster is super green. Pretty deceiving to say the roster this year is improved from last year.

Lets not over sell Kovacevic, Harris, Pearson and Ylonen's contribution to the team. You wont convince me that adding Dach, Laine and Hutson over any of them is a downgrade in either skill or impact on the locker room.

As far as Allen got, I can see how this can play on Montanbault's performance, but Monty is 27, not a rookie anymore. He shouldn't need a vet to help him. I will give you Monahan be a huge lost. That said, the team after last year TDL didn't play like it does right now.

You are right that this team is very green, I think it the youngest (or close to) in the NHL. So mental breakdown are to be expected. That is why I said I dont think you can turn this thing around quickly. I said in another tread that my first move would get rid of Dvorak ASAP. To me, right now the only thing you can fix is the work ethic. If that isn't fix you wont be able to address any other aspect of the team. If you can get them to work hard, some lucky break will come their way, this will boost confidence and help them buy into the system.

 

[themilosh]

At this point season is over, we are on pace for worse than last season so ya f*** it!

The guy I really want to see in a Habs uniform next June at the draft is Porter Martone and no one else!

Id be happy with Martone/Hagens/Misa

 

[Habs]

Desnoyers would be a massive add too. The combo of skills size and caractere/toughness we need

Toughness? They won't draft him, against the rules

 

[LaP]

Lets not over sell Kovacevic, Harris, Pearson and Ylonen's contribution to the team. You wont convince me that adding Dach, Laine and Hutson over any of them is a downgrade in either skill or impact on the locker room.

As far as Allen got, I can see how this can play on Montanbault's performance, but Monty is 27, not a rookie anymore. He shouldn't need a vet to help him. I will give you Monahan be a huge lost. That said, the team after last year TDL didn't play like it does right now.

You are right that this team is very green, I think it the youngest (or close to) in the NHL. So mental breakdown are to be expected. That is why I said I dont think you can turn this thing around quickly. I said in another tread that my first move would get rid of Dvorak ASAP. To me, right now the only thing you can fix is the work ethic. If that isn't fix you wont be able to address any other aspect of the team. If you can get them to work hard, some lucky break will come their way, this will boost confidence and help them buy into the system.

The biggest difference with last year is Monahan/Newhook and the goalies.

We had Monahan before the TDL and after march 1st Newhook did 16 points in 22 games playing mostly center. This year Newhook is dog **** and Dach is struggling. And don't get me wrong i'm not blaming the goalies for anythying but they are definitely not as good as they were last season.

 

[themilosh]

Desnoyers would be a massive add too. The combo of skills size and caractere/toughness we need

Im nit opposed to Desnoyer, just that rankings change over the course of the draft season.. there are 5 Cs who all have something we need..
Martone is (gasp) a Slaf 2.0 with more scoring touch.. can you imagine adding adding 6'3" 220lb RW rookie to play with (Hage or Misa/Desnoyer) and Slaf on the left?
Add in Demidov with CC and SZ.. that leaves Laine and Dach as depth top 6..

Mailloux and RB on the back end.. next year is the start of a 10 year window.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Toughness? They won't draft him, against the rules

Drafted Slafkovsky due to the size and skill package.
Draft Owen Beck who is a pest and plays a physical and agitation game.
Signed Luke Tuch when they could have let him go to UFA.
Signed Struble when they could have let him go to UFA.
Wanted to keep Anderson as part of the team due to his blend of size and toughness.
Drafted Jared Davidson, a rugged forward who sticks up for his teammates and is no stranger to dropping the gloves.
Drafted Florian Xhekaj, a fighter like his brother.
Drafted Owen Protz, one of the most physical and violent players in the draft and a willing fighter.
Drafted Tyler Thorpe a 6'5 physical forward.
Drafted Ben Merrill a 6'4 defensive forward with some bite.

 

[SlafySZN]

Martone + Desnoyers and call it a day

Martone + Carter Bear*

 

[Kosseca]

The biggest difference with last year is Monahan/Newhook and the goalies.

We had Monahan before the TDL and after march 1st Newhook did 16 points in 22 games playing mostly center. This year Newhook is dog **** and Dach is struggling. And don't get me wrong i'm not blaming the goalies for anythying but they are definitely not as good as they were last season.

I agree that Newhook did well after Monahan left. But Armia and Xhekaj both play much better then right now once they where call back from Laval last season. Slaf was more dominant, Savard more solid on D, etc. it's a team wide (almost) step back from my perspective.

This team has zero confidence so being down by 2 goals in a game it like "game over". Unfortunately, this team need both G to stand on their head right now... it is hasn't happen.

I'm on the "lets Dach get back into form" camp. I see flash... I still hope that he can turn this into a consistant performance.

 

[overlords]

Toughness? They won't draft him, against the rules

As wtk pointed out, we've been drafting size/toughness. What's odd is valuing it at that level while completely foregoing it on the current NHL squad for the last two years

 

[Kosseca]

Drafted Slafkovsky due to the size and skill package.
Draft Owen Beck who is a pest and plays a physical and agitation game.
Signed Luke Tuch when they could have let him go to UFA.
Signed Struble when they could have let him go to UFA.
Wanted to keep Anderson as part of the team due to his blend of size and toughness.
Drafted Jared Davidson, a rugged forward who sticks up for his teammates and is no stranger to dropping the gloves.
Drafted Florian Xhekaj, a fighter like his brother.
Drafted Owen Protz, one of the most physical and violent players in the draft and a willing fighter.
Drafted Tyler Thorpe a 6'5 physical forward.
Drafted Ben Merrill a 6'4 defensive forward with some bite.

people have a very selective memory

 

[Draft]

Reinbacher would likely flirt with NHL time this year if not for his unfortunate injury. Suzuki, Caufield, and Guhle are not youngsters any more -- the Habs didn't start with zero prospects.

The tanking phase, ie Management Shrugs Its Shoulders After Losses, should be over but as long as the fans don't mind, management won't mind losing for longer. It's easier on the organization, easier on the players, and easier on the pocket-book of the owner (ie doesn't need to spend in arms-races, can comfortable slither under the cap).

Seems to me like a lot of fans are fed up of losing and the visible regression... and a small but ferociously loud minority of fans are extremely satisfied with losing and visible regression.


It would mean the Habs were putrid this year and didn't step forward one bit and didn't learn to win. Not sure if that's good long-term.


I think it was a calculated risk.

The other option was to sign one of those awful July 1st contracts. They made the right decision. Now it's on the coaches to play a tighter and more serious game... this team's country club culture has to stop immediately.

I think Reinbacher would have done a lot more than flirt with NHL time. His defensive game is considerably further along than Barron/Mailloux and more consistent than Xhekaj/Struble. It might not have been ideal for his offensive development and I’d anticipate it being on the bottom pairing, but I think he’d be playing consistent minutes in MTL if not for the injury.

 

[Hannibal]

One thing for sure, next f***ing draft i want size and grit. No more f***ing Farrel, Kidney of this world. We have a shit load of those players.

 

[ReimanSum1908]

There is no next step - you stay the course because the rebuild is only half over.

What did people think was going to happen, here? It was always a five-year rebuild, and we just started year three.