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The Race for the Calder Trophy

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FLAMESFAN said:
It was a nice rush, but are you really posting "almost goals" to prop your boy?
You got a nice player there, but give it up - he ain't the best rookie.
The only "Race" here is for runner ups.
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I posted a clip from one of the top rookies in the Calder race thread and literally didn't even mention Bedard.

But I guess with the past few pages of arguments between Hawks and Wild fans, I can't blame you for assuming I have some ulterior motive.
 
FLAMESFAN said:
It was a nice rush, but are you really posting "almost goals" to prop your boy?
You got a nice player there, but give it up - he ain't the best rookie.
The only "Race" here is for runner ups.
Click to expand...
Faber has been better than Bedard this year. It's exceeding rare for a rookie defenseman to come in and have the sort of impact Faber has had. It's literally unprecedented. He's averaging more ice time than any rookie in NHL history, and doing it with fantastic results.
 
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WhiskeyYerTheDevils said:
Faber has been better than Bedard this year. It's exceeding rare for a rookie defenseman to come in and have the sort of impact Faber has had. It's literally unprecedented. He's averaging more ice time than any rookie in NHL history, and doing it with fantastic results.
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100% disagree.
How many 18 YO's come in and score at a PPG with a nothing roster?

Again, what Faber has done is good. But he's not some raw green 18 YO, he's physically & mentally ready to play. He's the same age as Jake Sanderson.

He's in that 2nd group with about 7 other players, and anyone one of those players have an arguement for being the runner up. None of them are close to Bedard.
 
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FLAMESFAN said:
100% disagree.
How many 18 YO's come in and score at a PPG with a nothing roster?

Again, what Faber has done is good. But he's not some raw green 18 YO, he's physically & mentally ready to play. He's the same age as Jake Sanderson.

He's in that 2nd group with about 7 other players, and anyone one of those players have an arguement for being the runner up. None of them are close to Bedard.
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Being 18 doesn't make him a better rookie
 
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Hattrick Kane said:
www.nhl.com

Bedard of Blackhawks named NHL Rookie of the Month for December | NHL.com

Forward had 5 goals, 15 points in 15 games
www.nhl.com www.nhl.com
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The most significant part of the article and the reason he won the month of December.

Bedard, who also shared second place among rookies in goals (5) and topped rookies in power-play assists (5), power-play points (5) and shots on goal (50), factored on 45.5 percent of Chicago’s total goals during the month (15 of 33). Only two players, rookie or veteran, recorded a higher share of their team’s offense in December: Nathan MacKinnon (56.9% w/ COL) and Nikita Kucherov (52.4% w/ TBL).
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No Fun Shogun said:
It really can't be understated how bad the team that surrounds Bedard happens to be. And he's still producing damn well.

If and when he gets a legitimate NHL roster around him, he's going to feast.
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I assure you, it’s been stated early and often that the Hawks have rostered the most incompetent batch of players that the league has ever seen. As impressive as Bedards 50 fantasy goals from playing with Lemiuex are, the fact remains that an award for demonstrating individual proficiency should have very little to do with teammates.

If you think he made a noteworthy play but his teammates failed it or whatever, I would encourage you to post it here, like the Faber attempt from the last page. I enjoy seeing or reading about these guys making unique skill plays, they don’t need to just be goals. With so much hockey going on this time of year it’s easy to miss out on the non-scoring plays, and this applies to all the rookies in this race.
 
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Obvious Fabertism said:
I assure you, it’s been stated early and often that the Hawks have rostered the most incompetent batch of players that the league has ever seen. As impressive as Bedards 50 fantasy goals from playing with Lemiuex are, the fact remains that an award for demonstrating individual proficiency should have very little to do with teammates.

If you think he made a noteworthy play but his teammates failed it or whatever, I would encourage you to post it here, like the Faber attempt from the last page. I enjoy seeing or reading about these guys making unique skill plays, they don’t need to just be goals. With so much hockey going on this time of year it’s easy to miss out on the non-scoring plays, and this applies to all the rookies in this race.
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You're asking for highlight clips of plays ending on other player sticks or just generally being bad? Not sure many of those exist for any player barring all-time laughers.

But as for reality, Bedard's the best-producing rookie by a healthy margin and is doing so on the worst team in the league. It's his award to lose at this point, players like Faber and Fantilli also putting up great rookie campaigns notwithstanding.
 
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No Fun Shogun said:
You're asking for highlight clips of plays ending on other player sticks or just generally being bad? Not sure many of those exist for any player barring all-time laughers.

But as for reality, Bedard's the best-producing rookie by a healthy margin and is doing so on the worst team in the league. It's his award to lose at this point, players like Faber and Fantilli also putting up great rookie campaigns notwithstanding.
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Nope, I am asking for clips or discussion about a rookie demonstrating proficiency of a hockey skill. I don’t care what skill it is, but I feel that is more pertinent to this discussion than more talk about what if Bedard had better teammates.

How has Bedard looked on his breakouts lately? Any fun tricks he has used to gain space for himself? Any clean takeaways or well timed stick lifts recently worth describing? His pull in and release is pretty well documented but has anyone done anything against him to stop it or does he do something different to make it indefensible? Proficiency requires nuance and a demonstration of adaptability, it’s a lot more coherent of an argument for Bedard if people actually speak to those points, just my IMO of course.
 
If you're asking for highlight reels, Youtube is full of them. Dude stakes fast, has had great playmaking moments, and has a sick shot and puck handling.











And to top it all off, his stats have been the best, too.

Plus, you know, I'm expressing basically the consensus view that Bedard's been the best rookie this season so far. It's not like I'm saying that some random Joe Schmoe is the best rookie, he's been pretty widely held up as the Calder favorite by most analysts and talking heads.

Further, I'm not saying that he'd hypothetically be the best rookie with better teammates. I'm saying the he is the best rookie and would hypothetically be much, much better than he is with even a halfway competent squad surrounding him. He's not winning the Calder for the latter, but the latter is reason for excitement all the same for his future.
 
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FLAMESFAN said:
It was a nice rush, but are you really posting "almost goals" to prop your boy?
You got a nice player there, but give it up - he ain't the best rookie.
The only "Race" here is for runner ups.
Click to expand...
Can't the play just be appreciated alone? He's a player in the Calder discussion that did something really bad ass on the ice - that alone is with showing everyone. Nothing about the post said anything about anyone else, just plain showing a really cool play that happened on the ice by a player that is a subject in this thread.
 
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No Fun Shogun said:
If you're asking for highlight reels, Youtube is full of them. Dude stakes fast, has had great playmaking moments, and has a sick shot and puck handling.











And to top it all off, his stats have been the best, too.

Plus, you know, I'm expressing basically the consensus view that Bedard's been the best rookie this season so far. It's not like I'm saying that some random Joe Schmoe is the best rookie, he's been pretty widely held up as the Calder favorite by most analysts and talking heads.

Further, I'm not saying that he'd hypothetically be the best rookie with better teammates. I'm saying the he is the best rookie and would hypothetically be much, much better than he is with even a halfway competent squad surrounding him. He's not winning the Calder for the latter, but the latter is reason for excitement all the same for his future.
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The assist to Murphy was a new one for me, and probably the highlight of the bunch in my eyes. Nice delay until the lane opened up and a beautiful backhand saucer on the money. That’s a great demonstration of proficiency even if the shot hadn’t scored. Those other ones don’t do much for me personally, but I see the mass appeal.

Even if you think it’s a runaway, this is still a good place to discuss why that’s so. And we have seen countless times how injuries or other things happen to derail a season. Having discussions about the whole field is meaningful IMO. I still stand by my opinion that Faber is demonstrating an extremely high level of proficiency across many different aspects of the game and with so few drawbacks it makes Bedards flaws due to experience more glaring when I watch him. There are some cumulative measurements of performance that back up this opinion, and others do see similar strengths in his game, it’s fun to discuss players in this context, there are message boards with better functionality all over but there are some posters here with deep hockey knowledge and valid opinions.
 
Obvious Fabertism said:
I assure you, it’s been stated early and often that the Hawks have rostered the most incompetent batch of players that the league has ever seen. As impressive as Bedards 50 fantasy goals from playing with Lemiuex are, the fact remains that an award for demonstrating individual proficiency should have very little to do with teammates.

If you think he made a noteworthy play but his teammates failed it or whatever, I would encourage you to post it here, like the Faber attempt from the last page. I enjoy seeing or reading about these guys making unique skill plays, they don’t need to just be goals. With so much hockey going on this time of year it’s easy to miss out on the non-scoring plays, and this applies to all the rookies in this race.
Click to expand...
Let's give the Hawks a bit of a break here. Hall's injury and Perry's dismissal weren't part of this seasons roster plan
Bedard is showing a lot with his play and his results (goals) despite completely losing Hall & Perry

btw Minny has both Faber & Rossi in the Calder race
 
SaltNPeca said:
Let's give the Hawks a bit of a break here. Hall's injury and Perry's dismissal weren't part of this seasons roster plan
Bedard is showing a lot with his play and his results (goals) despite completely losing Hall & Perry

btw Minny has both Faber & Rossi in the Calder race
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Yeah, the Wild are facing some extreme challenges with the roster too this season. Kaprizov, Zuccarello, Brodin, Gus all out for weeks currently. Last game played with $41MM in rostered players and Foligno potentially out now too. This has been the most injured year I can remember for the Wild and they have had some bad ones in the past, real shame because they would have been very competitive because of those two rookies playing well.

I’ve talked about Rossi a bit in here, he has done very well and I have really liked his season so far, has made massive advancements to his game from last year. Faber is pretty clearly ahead of him for performance this year but both these guys are in my top 5 for Wild performances on the whole this year.
 
Faber has not look all that impressive in the games I’ve watched, Bedard is a game breaking talent. It’s not a race Bedard will win and I highly doubt any of the mini duo while good will finish top 3
 
WPGDEVILS said:
Faber has not look all that impressive in the games I’ve watched, Bedard is a game breaking talent. It’s not a race Bedard will win and I highly doubt any of the mini duo while good will finish top 3
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This isn't very useful without additional information. Have you watched 2 games? Have you watched 20 games?
 
Since Thanksgiving, Bedard has really struggled at 5v5. Meanwhile, Fantilli and Rossi have both been awesome, definitely starting to close the gap on him among forwards*:

1704306978732.png


Bedard's 8.0% oish% in this stretch is a little low, but nothing crazy. And he's been getting caved in from a possession perspective, even relative to the rest of the Hawks. He has by far the worst CF% and rel CF% of anyone in the above graphic. I think he's really starting to feel that lack of support.

It's gotten to the point where Bedard is now 5th among rookies in p/60 for the entire season:

1. Voronkov 2.83
2. Rossi 2.55
3. Zary 2.47
4. Fantilli 2.35
5. Bedard 2.32

If this trend continues, the discussion for Calder could start to get interesting. If Fantilli or Rossi start to get more ice time, especially on the PP, the gap could close even more.

*FYI, the nhl.com 5v5 ice time stats are all wonky right now, so ignore all the p/60 stuff in the graphic (it looks like 5v5 ice time is blank for all games after Dec 5th).
 
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Dr Jan Itor said:
This isn't very useful without additional information. Have you watched 2 games? Have you watched 20 games?
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I’ve watched about 5 and have found that the stats and my eyes tell me Hughes and fantilli are better rookies, Faber plays a very responsible game I just haven’t really witnessed him tilting the ice if you know what I mean at least compared to the others in the top crop of rookies
 
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