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OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: They Killed Kenny!

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The more I think about it, the more I truly believe true best course of action for this team is the clean out of the entire coaching staff, and the organization hiring Eric Bieniemy. He has waited for a long time for his shot. He has put together a solid offense in Washington in his first year. We need a refresh. Move Tomlin into a different role in the organization...bring him to the front office or something. But we need a new coach on the field.

MrBrightside said:
Yes, the scheme is garbage. But again, if Pickett was a legitimate NFL starting QB, you'd be seeing a bigger difference in the results than you see if Trubisky and Rudolph. And really, if you're actually going to argue that the 2021 Ben was anything more than a complete shell of himself, your credibility on the subject is not very high.
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A shell of a first ballot HOFer is still better than an average NFL QB.

You don't like Kenny...we get it. But watching this offense regardless of who is under center, it is very easy to see that every single QB has struggled, the running game has struggled, and regardless of who is playing OL, they have struggled.

This was Kenny's first year as the starter. Remember, he received zero first team reps in camp last year, and he was thrust into the game when Mitch sucked. He was never going to be a guy that just came in and balled out. That was never ever going to happen. Anyone with reasonable expectations knew that would be the case.
 
MrBrightside said:
Let's not act like that goal line play was something more than it was. That was a pretty basic set that is very hard to defend in short yardage if executed. That play was all on Pickett, but the fact that you'd resort to cherry picking an individual play as a defense of Canada generally says all you need to know.
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It was not just against Jacksonville KP missed on a similar play against the 49ers week 1. For all the talk from KP about getting GP the ball he wasn’t targeted against Jacksonville until Mitch came in. I am just asking for basic execution of this basic college offense
 
JTG said:
A shell of a first ballot HOFer is still better than an average NFL QB.

You don't like Kenny...we get it. But watching this offense regardless of who is under center, it is very easy to see that every single QB has struggled, the running game has struggled, and regardless of who is playing OL, they have struggled.
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2021 Ben Roethlisberger was not an above-average NFL QB. He couldn't move and his arm was shot. He was 30th in passer rating in the NFL in 2021.

And look, we get it, we can make as many excuses for Pickett as we want either because he went to Pitt or because you want to have hope. I hope I'm wrong. H2P and all.
 
JTG said:
I don't know what age matters. It's all about experience. The only thing drafting an older guy provides is more maturity, and I think you see that in spades with Kenny. He stepped into the huddle and immediately took the reigns and was seen as the leader. He needs to NFL experience, and this...


...is why I can't totally blame Kenny. Has he sailed balls? Yes. Has he held on to the ball too long and taken unnecessary sacks? Sure. But if a defense is calling out plays and they know exactly what is coming, it's not far fetched to believe that Kenny legitimately has no where to throw, or when he does throw, he's throwing to double or triple coverage. This offensive scheme is absolutely garbage. Multiple QBs...same results. One was a first ballot HOFer.
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MT is an avg starting QB that put up pretty decent numbers on a bad team, and helped lead them to the playoffs.

I wasn't a fan of his signing, but Canada's offense has made him look like a third stringer.

Let's not act like MT was a complete scrub that never had success at the NFL level before.

If Canada was even a decent OC, he and MT should have made for at least an avg offense, not a historically bad one.
 
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bigdaddyk88 said:
It was not just against Jacksonville KP missed on a similar play against the 49ers week 1. For all the talk from KP about getting GP the ball he wasn’t targeted against Jacksonville until Mitch came in. I am just asking for basic execution of this basic college offense
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All I’m asking for is after SEVEN years that Tomlin figures out how to get his running game out of the bottom five.

Is that too much to ask from a “top five” coach?
 
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MrBrightside said:
2021 Ben Roethlisberger was not an above-average NFL QB. He couldn't move and his arm was shot. He was 30th in passer rating in the NFL in 2021.

And look, we get it, we can make as many excuses for Pickett as we want either because he went to Pitt or because you want to have hope. I hope I'm wrong. H2P and all.
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He was still an above average QB. He was never really able to move, but there was a reason when he came in and called his own plays the offense clicked. It's not hard to see the real issue here.

I'm not claiming Pickett is the savior here, but I also do not think he has had the best circumstance whatsoever to succeed and he was never going to be the guy to throw the offense on his back, though in a few wins, he absolutely did that.

I see enough in him to believe he can be a good starter. I watched him develop at Pitt. He's going to need another year or two.
 
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Mr Jiggyfly said:
All I’m asking for is after SEVEN years that Tomlin figures out how to get his running game out of the bottom five.

Is that too much to ask from a “top five” coach?
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If teams don’t respect your passing game and dare you yo throw it it’s tough to run again the ravens said to beat the Steelers you stop Najee that’s what most teams do
 
bigdaddyk88 said:
If teams don’t respect your passing game and dare you yo throw it it’s tough to run again the ravens said to beat the Steelers you stop Najee that’s what most teams do
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In 2017 and 2018 combined, Ben literally threw for almost 10,000 yards. You're arguing they couldn't run those seasons because no one feared the passing game?
 
bigdaddyk88 said:
If teams don’t respect your passing game and dare you yo throw it it’s tough to run again the ravens said to beat the Steelers you stop Najee that’s what most teams do
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Ya I can flip this just the same, please.

If they could establish even an avg running game, they could pass the ball, like the last several games last season.

Tomlin has had seven years and decrees from on high to fix the running game, yet he still has no clue what the f*** to do.

It’s not too much to ask that after seven years maybe they finish in like the bottom ten instead of bottom five.

Feel like it’s not unfair to expect Tomlin to not still have one of the worst running games in the league seven years after the problem started.
 
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JTG said:
He was still an above average QB. He was never really able to move, but there was a reason when he came in and called his own plays the offense clicked. It's not hard to see the real issue here.

I'm not claiming Pickett is the savior here, but I also do not think he has had the best circumstance whatsoever to succeed and he was never going to be the guy to throw the offense on his back, though in a few wins, he absolutely did that.

I see enough in him to believe he can be a good starter. I watched him develop at Pitt. He's going to need another year or two.
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Give me a list of good starting NFL QB's who took until their 4th season to be above-average. It just doesn't happen. Good NFL QB's are almost always successful from the drop or at least by their second season.
 
MrBrightside said:
In 2017 and 2018 combined, Ben literally threw for almost 10,000 yards. You're arguing they couldn't run those seasons because no one feared the passing game?
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Bell had 1200 yards in 2017 and Connor had over 900 in 2018. Najaee has 2 straight 1000 yard seasons. Najee caught 70 balls from ben and 40 last season
 
Mr Jiggyfly said:
He was on his last legs but was never the problem with the offense.

His corpse still took over games in the second half when he called his own plays.

The problems are all still here two years later… shitty schemes, can’t run, can’t pass, can’t score.

I was told Canada had a good scheme and just needed a decent mobile QB and he would show his stuff.

I’m still waiting…
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Canada sucks. Not even going to attempt to defend that turd. I still think it is fair to worry about Pickett because he simply has not flashed like you would expect a top end talent to flash, no matter how bad the offense is. I have not seen anything special from him other than the ability to step it up at the end of games after sucking the whole game (if that is special). Obviously the team is not what it was when Ben started originally, but I feel like Ben on this team would have shown a lot more than Pickett has so far. I am just not seeing the hope for upside with Pickett. I really hope to be wrong though.
 
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MrBrightside said:
Give me a list of good starting NFL QB's who took until their 4th season to be above-average. It just doesn't happen. Good NFL QB's are almost always successful from the drop or at least by their second season.
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Drew Brees. Aaron Rodgers. Josh Allen. Alex Smith.

That's just without looking. Year 3 or 4 is when you need to see that jump.
 
CheckingLineCenter said:
Lmao. Tomlin reportedly makes $12.5M a year so A) you’re wrong on the bolded and B) clearly the owners and decision makers place value on coaching.
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Wow, if true and he makes that much to be a complete failure, it makes Art II look that much worse…embarrassing to pay a guy that much to get one win above .500 each season lol
 
bigdaddyk88 said:
I didn’t say that. I am i big believer in players play and coaches coach. Players get paid a ton more then coaches
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Here's a challenge:
Show a post where you've been critical of Tomlin on here?

For those watching, Big Daddy and I made a bet last year that Tomlin wouldn't win 10 games.
 
Andy99 said:
Wow, if true and he makes that much to be a complete failure, it makes Art II look that much worse…embarrassing to pay a guy that much to get one win above .500 each season lol
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It may be more than that actually. It is rumored Belichick makes 17m. That is probably where Tomlin ends up if they sign him this offseason. He may make closer to that now.

Buddy Bizarre said:
Here's a challenge:
Show a post where you've been critical of Tomlin on here?

For those watching, Big Daddy and I made a bet last year that Tomlin wouldn't win 10 games.
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He may win 10 games, but was the team ever a threat? The answer is no...not since Bell held out.
 
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TooManyHumans said:
Canada sucks. Not even going to attempt to defend that turd. I still think it is fair to worry about Pickett because he simply has not flashed like you would expect a top end talent to flash, no matter how bad the offense is. I have not seen anything special from him other than the ability to step it up at the end of games after sucking the whole game (if that is special). Obviously the team is not what it was when Ben started originally, but I feel like Ben on this team would have shown a lot more than Pickett has so far. I am just not seeing the hope for upside with Pickett. I really hope to be wrong though.
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This is where I'm at. Even QB's that struggled like Burrow or Manning or even Purdy you saw a couple times a game where you go "wow".

I haven't said that watching KP in the past 10 or so games. I want to like him, but I just don't see anything that jumps out. I realize KP isn't a physical specimen and doesn't have those tools but I want to see good processing speed and I haven't seen that either.

I fear that KP's career will be "top tier backup QB". I really want to be wrong on him for this franchise's sake
 
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JTG said:
Drew Brees. Aaron Rodgers. Josh Allen. Alex Smith.

That's just without looking. Year 3 or 4 is when you need to see that jump.
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Ha ok. In his first season as a starter Rodgers threw 28 TD's and for over 4,000 yards, He was a Pro Bowler his second season. Allen was 2nd in the MVP voting his age 24 season (3rd as a starter). Alex Smith, whatever - he was never more than a serviceable game manager. This is really reaching.

But fine, we can throw away 2 more seasons hoping the Kenny Pickett can be the next Alex Smith. I'm excited.
 
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