Confirmed with Link: The Ottawa Senators Sale - PART 2

[Golden_Jet]

We aren’t going to know until the BOG passes the winning bid.
NHL won’t want to announce a winner, and then have it rejected by BOG.
Sounds like after the playoffs now.

 

[Big Muddy]

How does it take longer to sell this team than a 6B$ NFL team?

I'm not sure, but did the Commanders sale also involve building a new stadium?

 

[Loach]

I'm not sure, but did the Commanders sale also involve building new stadium?

Contracted to play at Fedex field until 2027. After that free to build elsewhere it seems.

 

[Big Muddy]

Contracted to play at Fedex field until 2027. After that free to build elsewhere it seems.

So maybe the real estate & build a new arena part of the Senators sale is the tricky part & creating issues?

 

[Loach]

So maybe the real estate & build a new arena part of the Senators sale is the tricky part & creating issues?

What would the team had sold for if EM sold it with the deal for all of Lebreton in place? Lol

 

[Golden_Jet]

What would the team had sold for if EM sold it with the deal for all of Lebreton in place? Lol

He wouldn’t have sold it, assuming he was still alive.

 

[Loach]

He wouldn’t have sold it, assuming he was still alive.

No he wouldn't have, he wouldn't have sold it now if he was alive. It was just a "what if". What would you guess? How many years ago was it? Lol.

 

[BankStreetParade]

If this team sells for over $1B, I can’t wait to see what ticket prices are going to be in Kanata for the next 3-5 years. This is absolute nonsense. One of the smallest markets in the league, in any measurable capacity, is worth one of the largest sale prices in NHL history?

 

[thinkwild]

I would reckon that if the team thought they could get more revenue by raising ticket prices they would have already done so. I don’t think there are teams that think, well we had nice low prices for our fans but now we are forced to charge more because our costs are higher. Seems we saw from that playoff game 2,000 short of a sellout that doing so might lead to less revenues not more.



But since the pandemic, the world has gone through a huge price reset everywhere. Seeing the Sens, plus arena, plus rights to primo land for development, possibly selling for $1 bil, likely means that the next NHL team to sell will be even more. I would guess that when the next Forbes valuations come out, Sens will still be in the lower half of the league.

 

[Tap on the Ankle]

thinking about it more the 1 billion price maybe isn’t so crazy

End of year 2019, just before covid, Forbes estimated the Penguins at 665 million and Ottawa at 445. This was shortly after Penguins back to back Cups and while #MelnykOut was going on. Two years later, in December 2021, the Penguins sell for 900 million - 35% more than the Forbes estimate. A 1 billion pricetag on the Sens would be a 25% increase on Forbes December 2022 estimate of 800 million.

Considering inflation, young team with key players signed long term (probably more exciting than an aging roster), and potential (non-arena) real estate opportunities that could open up it’s not really an absurd price.

1.2 does seem kinda high though

 

[Cosmix]

Contracted to play at Fedex field until 2027. After that free to build elsewhere it seems.

Anyone can build a stadium anywhere; however, if you have an NHL franchise in a city you cannot move it out of that city without NHL Board approval.

 

[Que]

Bidder fatigue is a real thing. Wealthy people use their money to make more money and if you’re taking too long and another equally good opportunity comes along - they pivot.

I’ve always felt that this sale is more about condo and arena development than the Sens themselves. Winning bidder with a free pass at Lebretton flats could make someone a lot of money. 1.2 billion for the CTC, team and 400 million in negative equity sounds about right.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Bidder fatigue is a real thing. Wealthy people use their money to make more money and if you’re taking too long and another equally good opportunity comes along - they pivot.

I’ve always felt that this sale is more about condo and arena development than the Sens themselves. Winning bidder with a free pass at Lebretton flats could make someone a lot of money. 1.2 billion for the CTC, team and 400 million in negative equity sounds about right.

Where are the condos going, or are you assuming they get more land.

 

[Cosmix]

Where are the condos going, or are you assuming they get more land.

Perhaps it's a Madison Square Garden type of multi-level structure!

 

[Que]

Where are the condos going, or are you assuming they get more land.

So I believe there will never be an arena downtown. In the past I thought it was viable and wanted but it just won’t happen. It’s all going to be turned into residential development. The arena is just a facade to get the NCC to finally lay down minimal guidelines for new development.

Mind you I’m very uninformed on the matter but from my casual reading I feel like this is where this process ends up.

The winning bidder for the Sens will renovate the CTC but gain an inside track to future development in Lebretton flats.

 

[Que]

Perhaps it's a Madison Square Garden type of multi-level structure!

That would be pretty sweet. But isn’t Lebretton only like 49 acres or something with a little more available but difficult to add more (possible however).

 

[RealSpartan]

If this team sells for over $1B, I can’t wait to see what ticket prices are going to be in Kanata for the next 3-5 years. This is absolute nonsense. One of the smallest markets in the league, in any measurable capacity, is worth one of the largest sale prices in NHL history?

As the saying goes…it’s worth whatever people are willing to pay for it. But I concur it’s pretty wild.

 

[Loach]

Anyone can build a stadium anywhere; however, if you have an NHL franchise in a city you cannot move it out of that city without NHL Board approval.

What? Read up a few posts about what the conversation was about.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

That would be pretty sweet. But isn’t Lebretton only like 49 acres or something with a little more available but difficult to add more (possible however).

That's the sticking point. Pretty much all we know is that the NCC wouldn't necessarily oppose an arena on that one tiny part of NCC land in the Flats. There's no solid agreement in place and the other parcels are completely up in the air. And iirc, there might be an offer to either pay the costs of the toxic cleanup, or reduce the cost of that land by the same amount. But again, no contracts in place or solid guarantees.

That's likely why Remington backed out. You're committing to spending a ton of money to buy something where the big value is in a piece of land the city controls and you have no guarantees or solid contracts in place for what you'll get or what it will cost or how much the city would help in various things. There's a real risk of the NCC pulling the rug out and robbing the hell out of whoever wins knowing they need that land to be viable long term.

 

[Big Muddy]

That would be pretty sweet. But isn’t Lebretton only like 49 acres or something with a little more available but difficult to add more (possible however).

From what I recall, the site proposed by NCC for the new arena is six (6) acres, although the 2nd article mentioned 7.5 acres.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/senators-arena-options-ottawa-location-1.6793300

NCC, Ottawa Senators agree to MOU for new LeBreton Flats arena - Arena Digest

We have a revived LeBreton Flats arena in the works for the Ottawa Senators, as the team and the National Capital Commission unveil a MOU.

arenadigest.com

Bayview Yards, an alternative site owned by the City is 13.5 acres.

Regarding the NCC and the land involved, I did find this: "The MOU from last June does allow for flexibility regarding the size of the site dedicated to an arena, Nussbaum said, and he remains confident prospective owners want to build at LeBreton."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/ncc-board-april-lebreton-update-1.6816557

 

[Golden_Jet]

From what I recall, the site proposed by NCC for the new arena is six (6) acres, although the 2nd article mentioned 7.5 acres.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/senators-arena-options-ottawa-location-1.6793300

NCC, Ottawa Senators agree to MOU for new LeBreton Flats arena - Arena Digest

We have a revived LeBreton Flats arena in the works for the Ottawa Senators, as the team and the National Capital Commission unveil a MOU.

arenadigest.com

Bayview Yards, an alternative site owned by the City is 13.5 acres.

Regarding the NCC and the land involved, I did find this: "The MOU from last June does allow for flexibility regarding the size of the site dedicated to an arena, Nussbaum said, and he remains confident prospective owners want to build at LeBreton."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/ncc-board-april-lebreton-update-1.6816557

All land at LeBreton is 49 acres poster is saying.
Bettman said it was 6.6 acres I think. so ya it’s in the ballpark of all reports. Lots of unknowns with LeBreton , is the issue probably.
First Nations. Cleanup, size of land, dealing with NCC.

 

[Big Muddy]

All land at LeBreton is 49 acres poster is saying.
Bettman said it was 6.6 acres I think. so ya it’s in the ballpark of all reports. Lots of unknowns with LeBreton , is the issue probably.
First Nations. Cleanup, size of land, dealing with NCC.

Yes, I agree.

 

[Silencio]

This is the sale that doesn't end
Yes, it goes on and on, my friend

 

[Micklebot]

This is the sale that doesn't end
Yes, it goes on and on, my friend

Lamb chop for GM.

 

[ottawah]

So maybe the real estate & build a new arena part of the Senators sale is the tricky part & creating issues?

100%.

Or more correctly, the lack of insight or commitment for more development land at Lebreton is responsible for making this into a gamble play.Without anything other than already committed, its questionable whether the team could/would even build an arena, and this is probably a 600-700M purchase. If significant land is given beyond the arena development to allow for a lot of profit to a developer then it is likely more of a 1.2B+ purchase. You think its 50-50, maybe you go at 900M.