The one move that likely gets Dubas fired

[Pebble live]

As much as I want this team to fail, they are still a playoff team, a playoff failure team, but a playoff team. That’s not good enough, but for some it is unfortunately

Looking at how much better the rest of the division got compared to the leafs this off-season. It's not out of the realm of possibility that they miss the playoffs this year.

 

[Puckstuff]

One serious question.

Why didn't Shanahan veto the Matt Murray trade?

I was going to suggest Shanny taking over but if he can't even a block a deal like that I'm not even sure about him either.

 

[Menzinger]

One serious question.

Why didn't Shanahan veto the Matt Murray trade?

I was going to suggest Shanny taking over but if he can't even a block a deal like that I'm not even sure about him either.

Probably because he agreed with ithe trade

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

I'm feeling nervous that if Shanny/Dubas/Keefe are removed this offseason the board will replace them and over-correct to other managers too far in the other direction

 

[ACC1224]

I'm feeling nervous that if Shanny/Dubas/Keefe are removed this offseason the board will replace them and over-correct to other managers too far in the other direction

So successful ones?

 

[Leafs87]

He’s made many imo. If he hasn’t been fired after all that, who’s to say he will now?

 

[Matthews4Calder]

I don't think it is hard to get fair value for Marner. He is still a 1st team All-Stars.
If Tkachuk can get you a 1st, Hubie and Weegar, there is no way Marner cannot get you that or more.

Blues is struggling and they do have pieces that fits the Leafs.

Seattle might want a big name to get more attention, dont know who fits with the Leafs beside Wright and their 1st.

There is always the Jets with Helly and Ehlers.


I would not put Muzzin there since you still need a horse in the back. Just so happened Muzzin is injured.

Murray is the one thats hurt.

Pass on Wright no need to get rid of one conceded head case and pick up another.

 

[Clyde Brewer]

I don't think it is hard to get fair value for Marner. He is still a 1st team All-Stars.
If Tkachuk can get you a 1st, Hubie and Weegar, there is no way Marner cannot get you that or more.

Blues is struggling and they do have pieces that fits the Leafs.

Why do you say this? I don't believe that Marner fetches more than Tkachuk. Would Florida make the trade?

I'd trade Marner for Matthew Tkachuk, straight up. I'd prefer Brady, but I'd take Matthew.

 

[ToneDog]

Why do you say this? I don't believe that Marner fetches more than Tkachuk. Would Florida make the trade?

I'd trade Marner for Matthew Tkachuk, straight up. I'd prefer Brady, but I'd take Matthew.

Doubt Florida or Ottawa make either trade. I am not sure where Marner fits best now that Gaudreau is in Columbus.

 

[EK392000]

Both Marner and Nylander signed contracts that were well above their comparables. We could've saved 1.5-2 million with a better negotiator at the helm.

Signing Tavares was the biggest mistake imo. He's great but it really messes up the cap and the makes the team too top heavy. Just because we had a good shot at landing him doesn't obligate us to make an offer. I would've been happy keeping Kadri as 2C. We could've used the extra cap to sign Pietrangelo or surround our stars with better players.

 

[Buds17]

One serious question.

Why didn't Shanahan veto the Matt Murray trade?

I was going to suggest Shanny taking over but if he can't even a block a deal like that I'm not even sure about him either.

I can't see much good coming out of a President overruling his GM in such a situation. Have to allow the GM to operate as he wishes and let the chips fall where they may.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Running it back is what will get him fired

 

[Racer88]

One serious question.

Why didn't Shanahan veto the Matt Murray trade?

I was going to suggest Shanny taking over but if he can't even a block a deal like that I'm not even sure about him either.

He looks like an absentee President……..how else could he allow Dubas to do many of the things he does

 

[keonsbitterness]

Probably because he agreed with ithe trade

Being the GM is also not Shanahan's job.

 

[ToneDog]

Both Marner and Nylander signed contracts that were well above their comparables. We could've saved 1.5-2 million with a better negotiator at the helm.

Signing Tavares was the biggest mistake imo. He's great but it really messes up the cap and the makes the team too top heavy. Just because we had a good shot at landing him doesn't obligate us to make an offer. I would've been happy keeping Kadri as 2C. We could've used the extra cap to sign Pietrangelo or surround our stars with better players.

They should have offered JT what their budget dictated knowing they had the greedy 3 up next. I mean if JT wanted to come home as much as Johnny hockey wanted out of Calgary, he would have accepted less that what the Isles offered. It is really sad that the signing of a star who wanted to come home had led us where we are today.

 

[fancy lad]

Being the GM is also not Shanahan's job.

What exactly is his job?
For a guy that has such a big title and a guy that is a big name in his sport he sure flies under the radar to the point of invisibility.

One real obvious comparable to Shanahan is Ujiri, but my god is he just about the polar opposite as far as public perception. Even though Ujiri is not the GM by title, everyone and their mother knows he has a hand in just about every player decision even if it's just approval. He's also the first one to face the media when the situation calls for it. He's a true representative and leader of the Raptors.

Shanahan on the other hand? huh? meh?

 

[WTFMAN99]

It just feels like we lost all our depth with Dubas running the team.

We were super deep before at forward.

 

[TheScandal89]

A year before Tavares came, or shortly before he came, I was speculating everyone's cap hit in order to fit his contract.

I had Tavares at 10 Million, Matthews at 10 Million, Marner at 8.5 Million and Nylander at 6.5 Million.

The thing that boosted Marners perceived value was that he started killing penalties in his contract year, and there was fear of an offer sheet. Also the fact that Nylander's hold out pretty much ruined his season was something Dubas did not want to happen again.

Imo it comes down to the player, if they truly want to win, they won't be fighting to squeeze every penny out of the team. Especially when you play here, where endorsements are plenty.

 

[keonsbitterness]

What exactly is his job?
For a guy that has such a big title and a guy that is a big name in his sport he sure flies under the radar to the point of invisibility.

One real obvious comparable to Shanahan is Ujiri, but my god is he just about the polar opposite as far as public perception. Even though Ujiri is not the GM by title, everyone and their mother knows he has a hand in just about every player decision even if it's just approval. He's also the first one to face the media when the situation calls for it. He's a true representative and leader of the Raptors.

Shanahan on the other hand? huh? meh?

One could argue the Raptors need (or needed) a salesman and Leafs don't, so the Leafs hired someone who is primarily a figurehead and mostly stays in the background.

 

[Gabriel426]

Why do you say this? I don't believe that Marner fetches more than Tkachuk. Would Florida make the trade?

I'd trade Marner for Matthew Tkachuk, straight up. I'd prefer Brady, but I'd take Matthew.

MM is a much better player than Tkachuk.
I highly doubt if MM is traded, Leafs wont get at least a similar package than what Flames got for Tkachuk.

 

[Antropovsky]

When you have an unconventional cap management - ie three 11 million dollar players - it needs to work or you have to pivot. It hasn't worked at all.

Marner has been bad in 4 straight playoffs...

Before anyone says what about Matthews... I suggest watching replays of all Marners points and all Matthews points. Matthews is the driver of the points and all Marners points are generated mostly by his linemates doing the heavy lifting for him (again mostly Matthews). If Matthews had someone helping him, he'd have produced much more. Marner rode his coat tails last playoffs. Marner also has shown a history of breaking in high pressure games. See the mistakes that lead to game 6 gwg goals against and look at him absolutely breaking during the Anaheim game.

We are not a team lacking in skill, or top end players we are a team lacking top defensemen, top goalies and top depth. We can afford to move one of our 11 million dollar players. By the time Dubas does it though, Tavares will be less effective because of age.

 

[WTFMAN99]

When you have an unconventional cap management - ie three 11 million dollar players - it needs to work or you have to pivot. It hasn't worked at all.

Marner has been bad in 4 straight playoffs...

Before anyone says what about Matthews... I suggest watching replays of all Marners points and all Matthews points. Matthews is the driver of the points and all Marners points are generated mostly by his linemates doing the heavy lifting for him (again mostly Matthews). If Matthews had someone helping him, he'd have produced much more. Marner rode his coat tails last playoffs. Marner also has shown a history of breaking in high pressure games. See the mistakes that lead to game 6 gwg goals against and look at him absolutely breaking during the Anaheim game.

We are not a team lacking in skill, or top end players we are a team lacking top defensemen, top goalies and top depth. We can afford to move one of our 11 million dollar players. By the time Dubas does it though, Tavares will be less effective because of age.

Pivoting made sense even if it worked but cap remained flat. It can't be 3 11M forwards either.

It reminds me of Tampa after the lock out, all the money in Vinny, St.Louis and Richards...no good supporting players really.

 

[Clyde Brewer]

MM is a much better player than Tkachuk.
I highly doubt if MM is traded, Leafs wont get at least a similar package than what Flames got for Tkachuk.

I'm not sure what criteria you're using to define "much better player", but I'm not convinced at all.

Tkachuk will score more goals, provide much more physicality/aggression, and makes almost $1.5 million less than Marner.

Last season, they each had 62 assists. Marner played 10 fewer games, but had the best goal scorer on his line.


Marner is much softer, physically and mentally. He disappears when the game gets physical.

Leafs need more grit, that's been obvious. Marner is the opposite of grit.

 

[mapleleaf979]

After Kadri gets suspended and he nixes the Calgary trade. Lets assume Dubas felt let down by Kadri.

Dubas; Nazem u got suspended twice in the playoffs, most important time of the year, we dont trust u, we are moving on.

Kadri: WHAT? I STUCK UP FOR YOUR MISTAKES BUILDING THIS ROSTER. THE TEAM HAS NO TOUGHNESS, I HAD TO DEFEND MY TEAM-MATES CUZ U DID NOT GET ANYONE TO PROTECT US!!! NOW I PAY THE PRICE FOR YOUR MISTAKES?? BLEEP U, MAN.

In what way would Kadri be wrong for telling Dubas this, for his team-mates to understand Kadri wasnt at fault completely for his actions. Its ultimately on Dubas, Leafs had no one with push back on those squads. Kadri over whelmed with passion, aggression, loyalty, pride....kicked in. I respect and miss Kadri, a guy we need. Dubas turned his back on the soul of this team, a guy who loved the jersey. Fire Dubas.

 

[snipes29]

The Kadri trade. Everyone needs to own up about how badly Kadri was treated in his early days in Toronto. We need a player exactly like him, second line centre. It was a mistake and people on this board did not help. In one of the more absurd claims made here, Kadri was blamed for losing a whole playoff series because he was taken out of the series by a suspiciously over the top suspension for an admittedly dirty hit. That is not his fault: the NHl decided this. At lease one of his suspensions was based on reputation alone. Scott Stevens used to do stuff like this every game, and people clapped.

I would much rather have Kadri than Marner.

id rather have Kadri than Tavares Dumbass gave Tavares 6million more to take Kadris 2nd line spot plus a no trade clause? are you kidding me