HF Habs: The official 2023-2024 tank thread

[Hannibal]

Tank not going good. f***.

 

[calder candidate]

I wish we would of been able to tank for the top 3 last year that would have basically completely change the trajectory of the rebuild now will miss it again this year if we don’t hit the lottery, land a other gem like CC or land a big UFA the rebuild will fall 1 or 2 player short…

 

[Miller Time]

Roster is super young...
Very likely we'll be selling at least a few vets before deadline...
Top teams tend to start playing tighter hockey in the last 1/3 of the year as they fine tune for playoffs...
Legit playoff contenders start playing with more desperation...

I wouldn't worry too much about where we're sitting now. A drop off remains quite likely barring Hughes deciding to be a deadline buyer, which seems very unlikely

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

This is the issue. If this roster's performances (much less results) cannot improve over last year's injury-ridden roster then it reveals an explicit lack of progress. Hence stuck.

I could be wrong, I haven't crunched the numbers but it really doesn't seem like any player has markedly improved their performance or production.

You can't call it rebuilding if the young players, the future core players, do not show improvement year-on-year. That's just 're' there is no building happening. The young players are there, we're hopeful for them, they have fresh faces... but if they don't actually improve their performances (much less results)... what's the point of keeping all of them together?

Going through seasons like a stumbling lush just to get a draft pick at the end is an awful waste of time. It's not a 'winning culture'. To have a winning culture you need to be as close as possible to winning, you need to be tough to play against, you need to bring the big effort but be slightly short on talent/experience. It's impossible to ask this Habs roster to have a winning culture today but it's equally impossible to be satisfied with the lack of progress year-on-year from last year. This is indisputable.

I was dead wrong about the short-rebuild, that's for certain. There was little chance Kent Hughes, a rookie GM, and Jeff Gorton would try to turn things around quickly. But the lack of progress shown THIS YEAR is a bad sign.

Suzuki seems capped. Caufield seems capped. Neither would be the 2nd best player on any winning roster. We're very far away. To rebuild you need to build on something... Kent Hughes and the roster he's presided over have not made sufficient progress, it feels. There's nothing we can do but hope. We're stuck.

You bring some good points but I disagree. We would see improvement IF Dach was there playing this year. He isn't there, so we lose. But to say there is no real improvement on the roster is half wrong. Ghule is improving fairly well and Slaf too. Even Newhook might become much more interretring that what he shows now. Barron shows interresting flahes too. If Dach was playing, with Barron, Ghule and Slaf that would make 4 young core improvement. I agree Suzuki and CC are stucked in their developpment. Next year we can see Dach back, add a young promising Roy, maybe Beck and few Ds will improve enough to start some sort of winning culture. Losing yes but being hard to beat. Having a fighting attitude.

The real improvement for the overall team will be in 3 years. Since then, anchor vets will be gone, a pick from between 3 to 9 next spring, between 9 to 16 the year after, some ufas signing because room in the cap. That's sure this team will improve in 2026. But the question is how much? Do you consider having a top 5 player in the league is an absolute must have asset to win a cup? You know there is examples of winning team without a superstar, St-Louis 19, Vegas this year. New Jersey and Canes in the past.

But there are fans who claim they want a winning team and the way they want it. With the style and the most spectacular way possible. McDavid you know. Big Hype. We tend to developp a cult over the superstar player and it tends to come and go by waves among hockey fans.

Football teams who were an impossible wall to play against became famous and epic and the same goes with german soccer teams and some nba teams too. And baseball to a certain degree. And boxing : Larry Holmes kept the belt for 7 years.

A lot of fans would say give me a trap winning team before a losing exciting team to watch. Winning is the fun at the end of the day.

 

[Monsieur Miz]

We're going to finish 10th aren't we? Woo...hoo!

 

[Sorinth]

We're going to finish 10th aren't we? Woo...hoo!

We might stick close to .500 for the next little while, but our post Xmas road trip will almost certainly end the dream of being a .500 team. The road trip is Carolina, Florida, Tampa, and Dallas, oh and those 4 games happen in 6 nights.

 

[Sorinth]

This is the issue. If this roster's performances (much less results) cannot improve over last year's injury-ridden roster then it reveals an explicit lack of progress. Hence stuck.

I could be wrong, I haven't crunched the numbers but it really doesn't seem like any player has markedly improved their performance or production.

You can't call it rebuilding if the young players, the future core players, do not show improvement year-on-year. That's just 're' there is no building happening. The young players are there, we're hopeful for them, they have fresh faces... but if they don't actually improve their performances (much less results)... what's the point of keeping all of them together?

Going through seasons like a stumbling lush just to get a draft pick at the end is an awful waste of time. It's not a 'winning culture'. To have a winning culture you need to be as close as possible to winning, you need to be tough to play against, you need to bring the big effort but be slightly short on talent/experience. It's impossible to ask this Habs roster to have a winning culture today but it's equally impossible to be satisfied with the lack of progress year-on-year from last year. This is indisputable.

I was dead wrong about the short-rebuild, that's for certain. There was little chance Kent Hughes, a rookie GM, and Jeff Gorton would try to turn things around quickly. But the lack of progress shown THIS YEAR is a bad sign.

Suzuki seems capped. Caufield seems capped. Neither would be the 2nd best player on any winning roster. We're very far away. To rebuild you need to build on something... Kent Hughes and the roster he's presided over have not made sufficient progress, it feels. There's nothing we can do but hope. We're stuck.

The team has improved, we have a positive goal differential at 5 on 5 which wasn't the case at this point in time last year. So even if the point totals are similar, that doesn't mean there's been no progress.

I'd also point out quite a few players have markedly improved compared to last year. Newhook is on pace for over 50 points when last year he had 30. Guhle has taken huge steps in his overall play, I think every single advanced stat metric has seen improvement often significantly so, like his xGF% going from 40.8% to 50.2%. Slafkovsky has improved noticeably both with the eye test and in terms of production. Caufield has made big strides in his play away from the puck, and the list goes on.

We are very far from being "stuck".

 

[sandviper]

We're going to finish 10th aren't we? Woo...hoo!

While I hope not, I did expect a 7-10 finish this season before it started.

However, we’re at the bottom for regulation wins and have a negative goal differential despite being like 3 points from the playoffs. I don’t think this .500 record is going to be sustainable and we’ll start dropping as we enter the new year.

 

[WeThreeKings]

We aren't going to finish 10th.

CBJ is just a hopeless franchise like Buffalo.. they will always be losers.

 

[nhlfan9191]

While I hope not, I did expect a 7-10 finish this season before it started.

However, we’re at the bottom for regulation wins and have a negative goal differential despite being like 3 points from the playoffs. I don’t think this .500 record is going to be sustainable and we’ll start dropping as we enter the new year.

Such a strange year. No teams seem to really wants it.

 

[morhilane]

Such a strange year. No teams seem to really wants it.

Most teams are playing like shit defensively. The ones at the top have most players execute defensively.

We will be back with the trap league-wide in a year or two...

 

[hardcorehabs]

If I had to bet, I don’t see any of Slaf, Beck, Mesar, Reinbacher becoming major impact type of players.

Hutson and Roy are wildcards.

We definitely need more elite talent out of the draft whether it’s pure luck or top picks.

 

[rik schau]

Tank not going good. f***.

Screwed it up last year and looking like the same this year.

 

[Twisted Sinister]

I'm honestly here for the Habs failing at everything, including tanking.

I'm a firm believer that you reap what you sow, and they deserve everything that's coming to them TBH.

 

[Riggins]

At least we've got a lot of games against crappy opponents out of the way already. It's already been 5 games (all wins) against probable bottom 5 teams (SJ/CHI/CBJ/ANA). There are only 4 games left against those teams in 60 more games.

 

[montreal]

I'm honestly here for the Habs failing at everything, including tanking.

I'm a firm believer that you reap what you sow, and they deserve everything that's coming to them TBH.

so what you are saying is that you are just a troll? Cause if you want the Habs to fail at everything then what the f*** are you doing here?

 

[Twisted Sinister]

so what you are saying is that you are just a troll? Cause if you want the Habs to fail at everything then what the f*** are you doing here?

Not trolling. I was always a fan, but I think I've gone full supervillain on the current iteration of the franchise and their decision-making. f*** those guys.

I'm a firm believer in accountability and consequences, and I feel like they're leading us straight into Buffalo-Detroit-Ottawa territory. And they deserve it.

Massive failure is required for things to change. Perhaps I still have enough runway in my life to see a full rejection of the mediocre garbage the Habs have become from the fanbase and for things to turn around.

Habs fans have been running on Copium fumes for decades. Maybe this will be the shock to the system they require. Or maybe they'll continue to enjoy shit product with a team that can't score. What can you do?

 

[Draft]

Not trolling. I was always a fan, but I think I've gone full supervillain on the current iteration of the franchise and their decision-making. f*** those guys.

I'm a firm believer in accountability and consequences, and I feel like they're leading us straight into Buffalo-Detroit-Ottawa territory. And they deserve it.

Massive failure is required for things to change. Perhaps I still have enough runway in my life to see a full rejection of the mediocre garbage the Habs have become from the fanbase and for things to turn around.

Cool story.

 

[Twisted Sinister]

Cool story.

Thanks. Enjoy the copium

 

[Milhouse40]

We're going to finish 10th aren't we? Woo...hoo!

Oh please, not again this year......you guys repeat the same things years in and years out, I red the exacty same quote last year all season long....

Not trolling. I was always a fan, but I think I've gone full supervillain on the current iteration of the franchise and their decision-making. f*** those guys.

I'm a firm believer in accountability and consequences, and I feel like they're leading us straight into Buffalo-Detroit-Ottawa territory. And they deserve it.

Massive failure is required for things to change. Perhaps I still have enough runway in my life to see a full rejection of the mediocre garbage the Habs have become from the fanbase and for things to turn around.

Habs fans have been running on Copium fumes for decades. Maybe this will be the shock to the system they require. Or maybe they'll continue to enjoy shit product with a team that can't score. What can you do?

The guys in place have not been long enough to evaluate a rebuild, it's actually the very beginning on it.....don't want to be a dick, but you guys proved what I knew for decade, Fans are NOT actually ready for a rebuild

 

[Sorinth]

Not trolling. I was always a fan, but I think I've gone full supervillain on the current iteration of the franchise and their decision-making. f*** those guys.

I'm a firm believer in accountability and consequences, and I feel like they're leading us straight into Buffalo-Detroit-Ottawa territory. And they deserve it.

Massive failure is required for things to change. Perhaps I still have enough runway in my life to see a full rejection of the mediocre garbage the Habs have become from the fanbase and for things to turn around.

Habs fans have been running on Copium fumes for decades. Maybe this will be the shock to the system they require. Or maybe they'll continue to enjoy shit product with a team that can't score. What can you do?

Given that you used the past tense to describe your fandom, and speak in the third person about other fans it's pretty clear you don't consider yourself a fan anymore. And frankly if your not a fan then it's definitely trolling, even if you leave the door open to one day in the future becoming a fan again.

 

[Twisted Sinister]

Oh please, not again this year......you guys repeat the same things years in and years out, I red the exacty same quote last year all season long....



The guys in place have not been long enough to evaluate a rebuild, it's actually the very beginning on it.....don't want to be a dick, but you guys proved what I knew for decade, Fans are NOT actually ready for a rebuild

A rebuild actually requires making the sacrifices necessary to get it done correctly. Holding onto goalies that are artificially inflating you in the standings, for example, making you draft Mid defensemen instead of elite offensive talent, is one of the ways they're failing. Of course, they had a chance to draft elite talent anyway, but they're too conservative and cuckish to do it.

If you don't make those sacrifices, you turn into Detroit, which I think will be a perpetual bubble team for years to come.

All while they play "won't back down" like a bunch of doofuses in the locker room.

Given that you used the past tense to describe your fandom, and speak in the third person about other fans it's pretty clear you don't consider yourself a fan anymore. And frankly if your not a fan then it's definitely trolling, even if you leave the door open to one day in the future becoming a fan again.

It is what it is. That's my opinion. You are correct. I have stopped huffing the copium... Which is what I said I'd do at the draft if things didn't go the way I wanted. The draft was the last straw for me, and I'm a man of my word.

 

[salbutera]

If I had to bet, I don’t see any of Slaf, Beck, Mesar, Reinbacher becoming major impact type of players.

Hutson and Roy are wildcards.

We definitely need more elite talent out of the draft whether it’s pure luck or top picks.

Did you see Bergeron, Marchand, Pavelski, Pastrnak, Aho, Robertson becoming “major impact type players”?

 

[Guy Larose]

A rebuild actually requires making the sacrifices necessary to get it done correctly. Holding onto goalies that are artificially inflating you in the standings, for example, making you draft Mid defensemen instead of elite offensive talent, is one of the ways they're failing. Of course, they had a chance to draft elite talent anyway, but they're too conservative and cuckish to do it.

If you don't make those sacrifices, you turn into Detroit, which I think will be a perpetual bubble team for years to come.

All while they play "won't back down" like a bunch of doofuses in the locker room.



It is what it is. That's my opinion. You are correct. I have stopped huffing the copium... Which is what I said I'd do at the draft if things didn't go the way I wanted. The draft was the last straw for me, and I'm a man of my word.

Entitled much?

 

[Twisted Sinister]

Did you see Bergeron, Marchand, Pavelski, Pastrnak, Aho, Robertson becoming “major impact type players”?

Those guys are the exception, not the rule

Entitled much?

Entitled to what? An actual decent, entertaining product to spend my money and time on? Sure, I'm entitled to that. They're not entitled to my money and time. I'm the customer, not them.