TV: The Last of Us (HBO)

[ThePhoenixx]

I'm not being facetious about anything. As to everything else I don't need to add to what others responded to you with other than real facetiousness: man the first season of Game of Thrones must be a real piece of shit given that 70% of the script is exposition.

Ya, the reason everyone eventually loved season 1 was for the long drawn out exposition dumps. That was real water cooler talk there.

Let me be clear. The group was no issue at all. Your massive wall of text led me to skim your post in around three seconds. It was boring and unwieldy, just like exposition dumps. You know that. People mention the problem with walls of text all the time. You were in a hurry.

I saw the term FEDRA. Didn't recognize it. What does the acronym even stand for? Did they tell us that anywhere?

Just like your wall of text, people such as me lose interest when characters start droning on and telling. Some don't. This thread is proof of that.

Ever wonder why a story isn't grabbing you even though the premise is strong? Well, if your curiosity leads you to read a few books on screenplay and story construction, you see why.

Then you watch a show like this and see these bad techniques jump out at you.

It's lazy writing and just because others are OK with that, doesn't mean that everyone is good with it. If everyone just explains away poor techniques because they like a show, then we end up with GOT. A poor writing creep. This thread is proof of that, IMO. It's become a bit of an echo chamber since episode 3. Plenty of subtle personal attacks.

Anyway, I really entered the chat when people started denigrating those who didn't like episode 3, or when one wondered why she suddenly turned stupid in episode 4. This whole side discussion from my one written line really took away from that point. Hmmm.


This was all just my opinion of course. And to those who just read my whole exposition dump. Congrats. I probably wouldn't have.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

Yes, people in real life who blame the doctor for a death of their loved one might kill them. This isn't that hard to grasp.

And in this case the doctor was actually guilty of playing role in death of her brother and others from that interaction

Defending himself that they forced him to talk by pointing gun at him is not going to fly with those who's loved one's died especially if they themselves have refused to talk/work with those doing killing

Unless I missed something, they or their spores(?)(Isn't it a bite?) are not immune to fire. The burning pits showed that. Her order to quarantine the building also implies that it cannot just emerge spontaneously anywhere.

So she has supposedly kept her people alive for how many years and at this time, just as our protagonists arrive, we are to believe that she is suddenly willing to shoot her only doctor, ignore the mess in the basement that is going to kill everyone, and disrespect her second in command like a grunt. How did they survive so long with such leadership?

When did they say she had been leading them for years? There was no mention of when FEDRA was overthrown and when she became leader of those people from what I recall of show

Ellie and Joel both seemed shocked that FEDRA QZ was open and abandoned when they saw it but there was no indication of when FEDRA was overthrown from power or fled city

Usually the leaders of a successful revolution don't act irrationally. They usually act with rational irrationality. What did shooting the doctor gain her or her "movement." Nothing.

I mean if it was a lacky, ok. But, I dunno I don't see Castro shooting the one doctor left in Havana. But what do I know.

Everything else has been well done this felt like a cartoon.

Human history is littered with irrational leaders doing shit that doesn't make sense

Stalin for instance purging his best military leaders at moment when threat to his nation was rising or the infamous rounding up most of the top doctors/surgeons/etc and torturing them/killing some that devastated medical community in Moscow near end of his reign.

And I could go on with Stalin, Hitler, Mao, etc doing things that were irrational and in Hitler's case blunders that destroyed his own regime/nation/military.

I could go on with long list from leaders in just recent history who quickly devovled into terrible leaders/people making irrational decisions

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Ya, the reason everyone eventually loved season 1 was for the long drawn out exposition dumps. That was real water cooler talk there.

Let me be clear. The group was no issue at all. Your massive wall of text led me to skim your post in around three seconds. It was boring and unwieldy, just like exposition dumps. You know that. People mention the problem with walls of text all the time. You were in a hurry.

I saw the term FEDRA. Didn't recognize it. What does the acronym even stand for? Did they tell us that anywhere?

Just like your wall of text, people such as me lose interest when characters start droning on and telling. Some don't. This thread is proof of that.

Ever wonder why a story isn't grabbing you even though the premise is strong? Well, if your curiosity leads you to read a few books on screenplay and story construction, you see why.

Then you watch a show like this and see these bad techniques jump out at you.

It's lazy writing and just because others are OK with that, doesn't mean that everyone is good with it. If everyone just explains away poor techniques because they like a show, then we end up with GOT. A poor writing creep. This thread is proof of that, IMO. It's become a bit of an echo chamber since episode 3. Plenty of subtle personal attacks.

Anyway, I really entered the chat when people started denigrating those who didn't like episode 3, or when one wondered why she suddenly turned stupid in episode 4. This whole side discussion from my one written line really took away from that point. Hmmm.


This was all just my opinion of course. And to those who just read my whole exposition dump. Congrats. I probably wouldn't have.

Sorry wall of text I tuned out.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Ya for sure, it's a different kind of love story, and not one that is often in any medium, let alone video games (father/daughter type). Good conversation, sorry if I came across abrasive at any point, not used to open minds on these forums haha.

all good man, I think the last Bioshock had that vibe to it as well although she was like 18 or something in the 3rd game.
but yeah not many games has that father/daughter story to it.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Ya, the reason everyone eventually loved season 1 was for the long drawn out exposition dumps. That was real water cooler talk there.

Let me be clear. The group was no issue at all. Your massive wall of text led me to skim your post in around three seconds. It was boring and unwieldy, just like exposition dumps. You know that. People mention the problem with walls of text all the time. You were in a hurry.

I saw the term FEDRA. Didn't recognize it. What does the acronym even stand for? Did they tell us that anywhere?

Just like your wall of text, people such as me lose interest when characters start droning on and telling. Some don't. This thread is proof of that.

Ever wonder why a story isn't grabbing you even though the premise is strong? Well, if your curiosity leads you to read a few books on screenplay and story construction, you see why.

Then you watch a show like this and see these bad techniques jump out at you.

It's lazy writing and just because others are OK with that, doesn't mean that everyone is good with it. If everyone just explains away poor techniques because they like a show, then we end up with GOT. A poor writing creep. This thread is proof of that, IMO. It's become a bit of an echo chamber since episode 3. Plenty of subtle personal attacks.

Anyway, I really entered the chat when people started denigrating those who didn't like episode 3, or when one wondered why she suddenly turned stupid in episode 4. This whole side discussion from my one written line really took away from that point. Hmmm.


This was all just my opinion of course. And to those who just read my whole exposition dump. Congrats. I probably wouldn't have.

FEDRA's meaning is on the signs in the game: Federal Disaster Response Agency

 

[Dubi Doo]

The doctor was turning people over to FEDRA, likely for infractions. The father was the one who said something about her brother. So, yeah, the doctor wasnt the actual one who turned in her brother to FEDRA but he was protecting the one who did, Henry, and he also turned in other people who were presumably killed

Snitches get stitches, yo.

 

[AstrophysicalJet]

Started with a bang imo - Last episode was snoozefest imo.

 

[Natey]

Started with a bang imo - Last episode was snoozefest imo.

Crazy. This last episode (4) was by far my favourite. It felt the most like The Last of Us so far.

 

[HanSolo]

Ya, the reason everyone eventually loved season 1 was for the long drawn out exposition dumps. That was real water cooler talk there.

Let me be clear. The group was no issue at all. Your massive wall of text led me to skim your post in around three seconds. It was boring and unwieldy, just like exposition dumps. You know that. People mention the problem with walls of text all the time. You were in a hurry.

I saw the term FEDRA. Didn't recognize it. What does the acronym even stand for? Did they tell us that anywhere?

Just like your wall of text, people such as me lose interest when characters start droning on and telling. Some don't. This thread is proof of that.

Ever wonder why a story isn't grabbing you even though the premise is strong? Well, if your curiosity leads you to read a few books on screenplay and story construction, you see why.

Then you watch a show like this and see these bad techniques jump out at you.

It's lazy writing and just because others are OK with that, doesn't mean that everyone is good with it. If everyone just explains away poor techniques because they like a show, then we end up with GOT. A poor writing creep. This thread is proof of that, IMO. It's become a bit of an echo chamber since episode 3. Plenty of subtle personal attacks.

Anyway, I really entered the chat when people started denigrating those who didn't like episode 3, or when one wondered why she suddenly turned stupid in episode 4. This whole side discussion from my one written line really took away from that point. Hmmm.


This was all just my opinion of course. And to those who just read my whole exposition dump. Congrats. I probably wouldn't have.

I read it. I just don't see the point in continuing to argue with someone who admits to not having the viewing consumption bandwidth to pay attention to basic contextual writing.

 

[Natey]

Why are you shooting and killing a doctor? If this were real doctors would be the worlds most valued asset you wouldn't do something that stupid

Joel explains that earlier in the episode.

Family.

I didn't like this episode. Why would any logical person ignore whatever is under that building?

I mean it's clear the leader isn't thinking logically... clearly something happened recently that deeply hurt her. But she's kept her group alive, supplied, and feed for awhile, so main henchman #1 still follows her despite disagreeing.

 

[AstrophysicalJet]

Crazy. This last episode (4) was by far my favourite. It felt the most like The Last of Us so far.

Could have been one of those days, just didn't stick with me, very slow paced.

Maybe because it followed episode 3, which even though very different, really caught me off guard in a good way.

 

[Natey]

Could have been one of those days, just didn't stick with me, very slow paced.

Maybe because it followed episode 3, which even though very different, really caught me off guard in a good way.

I find it so strange that you thought this was slow paced but episode 3 wasn't. I was definitely the opposite. I wish episode 3 was cut down about 15 minutes and added to the last episode. I loved Ellie and Joel's relationship growing.

But that's what makes the world great (and terrible lol) is that we all have different opinions and as long as you're not a dick about your opinion, they're all valid!

 

[Unholy Diver]

I've enjoyed the series a great deal so far, most recent episode seemed to fly by to me

 

[Osprey]

I've enjoyed the series a great deal so far, most recent episode seemed to fly by to me

It was half an hour shorter than the previous episode.

 

[Unholy Diver]

It was half an hour shorter than the previous episode.

That could have something to do with it

 

[HoseEmDown]

Never played either game, watched the 4 episodes and read this thread only.

With what I've watched and what people are saying in here then episode 3 made no sense to me. Well acted episode and a good story but it just didn't make sense and fit in with anything else going on. Seems like that should have been episode 5 after they showed some interactions with Joel, Tess, Bill and Frank previously. To me I didn't care for either character so their loss meant nothing and they only had a brief interaction with Joel so I don't see how he would be affected by their loss either.

Seems weird to me that they spent a whole episode telling that love story and glossed over what happened between Joel and Tess. We were supposed to assume the two of them were together but we get one shot of her crawling into bed and putting her arm around him and the lunch with Bill and Frank. If this is a love story it's about a brotherly love. So far everything Joel has done from pre apocalypse to know is about finding his brother and making sure he's ok.

 

[TheAngryHank]

Never played either game, watched the 4 episodes and read this thread only.

With what I've watched and what people are saying in here then episode 3 made no sense to me. Well acted episode and a good story but it just didn't make sense and fit in with anything else going on. Seems like that should have been episode 5 after they showed some interactions with Joel, Tess, Bill and Frank previously. To me I didn't care for either character so their loss meant nothing and they only had a brief interaction with Joel so I don't see how he would be affected by their loss either.

Seems weird to me that they spent a whole episode telling that love story and glossed over what happened between Joel and Tess. We were supposed to assume the two of them were together but we get one shot of her crawling into bed and putting her arm around him and the lunch with Bill and Frank. If this is a love story it's about a brotherly love. So far everything Joel has done from pre apocalypse to know is about finding his brother and making sure he's ok.

it was an episode of gilligans island [ survival ]in the ,middle of a walking dead season.. It made no sense especially after episode 4 where Joel and Ellie started to bond on THEIR OWN.. I predicted it would happen organically because both seem like good people not psyco killers.. All of us sane folk have a basic instint to protect kids , like seeing a kid in the grocery store running without their mum. you might just keep an eye on them till the mum finds them in a panic.. it's natural. I also figured after she found the hand gun and he realized she didn't kill him there would be weapons training [ bingo also predicted ] is oredr to keep her from hurting herself I didn't see her saving his life but it wasn't un predictable.. I'' post this now because there is only 1 day for the next episode not a whole week for this board to shit on me for thinking ep 3 was senseless .

 

[Osprey]

Never played either game, watched the 4 episodes and read this thread only.

With what I've watched and what people are saying in here then episode 3 made no sense to me. Well acted episode and a good story but it just didn't make sense and fit in with anything else going on. Seems like that should have been episode 5 after they showed some interactions with Joel, Tess, Bill and Frank previously. To me I didn't care for either character so their loss meant nothing and they only had a brief interaction with Joel so I don't see how he would be affected by their loss either.

Seems weird to me that they spent a whole episode telling that love story and glossed over what happened between Joel and Tess. We were supposed to assume the two of them were together but we get one shot of her crawling into bed and putting her arm around him and the lunch with Bill and Frank. If this is a love story it's about a brotherly love. So far everything Joel has done from pre apocalypse to know is about finding his brother and making sure he's ok.

I agree. They didn't establish much of a relationship between Joel and Tess, so her death didn't feel very impactful to me. I assumed that we'd see the impact on him after the fact as he grieved his way through Episode 3, only for that episode to barely feature him. It felt strange to kill her off, immediately pivot to a new story and then return to Joel seemingly days later, after the initial shock had worn off. If the intention was to show a loving, trusting relationship to contrast with what Joel had with Tess, it was really poorly timed.

You also mention his brother, and that's another relationship that wasn't established very well. We barely saw him and don't have much idea of what their relationship is like. He matters more to Joel than he does to us, which basically makes him a MacGuffin. He's seemingly just an extra reason for Joel to risk his life making this trek, so whether he finds him or not probably makes little difference.

I just wonder if some of the extra hour, as good as it was, might've been better spent fleshing out Joel's relationships. It feels a bit like the writers put more attention and affection into the development of two side characters who they introduced and killed off in the same episode than into the series' main character.

 

[norrisnick]

Ep 3 was to show that love and contentment was still possible. And the lynch-pin was the suicide note where Bill tells Joel to fight and protect for whom he loves, ie Tess. And that's the kick in the nuts for Joel, because he feels he failed. That also ties to the car discussion about what's important family and Tess was like family. Which then guides the growing bonds between Joel and Ellie.

Episode 3 highlights the goal for life in this environment. Find fulfillment and protect it. It does a good job IMO to flip the script a bit. Rather than beating your head over the loss/grief of Tess, they hinted at that and highlighted the potential that everyone should be fighting for.

 

[TheAngryHank]

Ep 3 was to show that love and contentment was still possible. And the lynch-pin was the suicide note where Bill tells Joel to fight and protect for whom he loves, ie Tess. And that's the kick in the nuts for Joel, because he feels he failed. That also ties to the car discussion about what's important family and Tess was like family. Which then guides the growing bonds between Joel and Ellie.

Episode 3 highlights the goal for life in this environment. Find fulfillment and protect it. It does a good job IMO to flip the script a bit. Rather than beating your head over the loss/grief of Tess, they hinted at that and highlighted the potential that everyone should be fighting for.

horse shit..
the only factual thing we learned is don't stand in the middle of the road in a gun fight, The rest is nonsense your reading in to it.. Why not just read the note without an hour long when harry met sally episode , it was senseless.

 

[Mongo]

horse shit..
the only factual thing we learned is don't stand in the middle of the road in a gun fight, The rest is nonsense your reading in to it.. Why not just read the note without an hour long when harry met sally episode , it was senseless.

I agree. I hate that they spent an entire episode (which was extra-long to begin with) on the relationship of 2 side characters. It barely did anything to push the story forward. The little bit that actually did push the story forward, could have been done in 15-20 minutes easily. I much rather had some more insight into Joel/Tommy/Tess or at least some of the action that happened in the game at that point.

 

[tacogeoff]

Finally caught up on this series in the last few few days. Absolutely love it thus far. Episodes 1, 2 and 4 were all great for me. episode 3 I thought was decent but it really felt like a filler. why invest so much time into two characters that will not carry on. I personally feel like they could have condensed alot of that episode to make room for more interesting interactions and information. It did also kind of blow to see Offerman's talent be used up in one episode..............kind of hoping they do that to Melanie Lynskey as her performance wasn't all that good. overall though it has been a fun watch.

 

[HanSolo]

I'm not sure if they ever intended to have Tess' death have a deep impact on Joel or the audience. I can't speak for the writers but to me it just struck me like it's supposed to be just another loss in Joel's life, while the people that matter or are supposed to eventually matter, Tommy and Ellie, are the focus. Not to say that she wasn't intended to be depicted as important or some throwaway, but I think it lines up with the cynical reality of life post-apocalypse. You lose someone you care about, you find the strength to move on for the people you have left, but I don't think this story was meant to dwell on Tess and her death.

I think if they meant for it to be deeper they would have taken the time to develop the personal relationship between Joel and Tess, not just their survival/business relationship. To me, it felt intentional.

 

[TheAngryHank]

I'm not sure if they ever intended to have Tess' death have a deep impact on Joel or the audience. I can't speak for the writers but to me it just struck me like it's supposed to be just another loss in Joel's life, while the people that matter or are supposed to eventually matter, Tommy and Ellie, are the focus. Not to say that she wasn't intended to be depicted as important or some throwaway, but I think it lines up with the cynical reality of life post-apocalypse. You lose someone you care about, you find the strength to move on for the people you have left, but I don't think this story was meant to dwell on Tess and her death.

I think if they meant for it to be deeper they would have taken the time to develop the personal relationship between Joel and Tess, not just their survival/business relationship. To me, it felt intentional.

Ellie condition was important to Tess enough so that Joel vowed to deliver her to professionals , With Tess out of the picture so to speak Joel can now bond with Ellie which might not fully develop with Tess by his side.

 

[HanSolo]

Ellie condition was important to Tess enough so that Joel vowed to deliver her to professionals , With Tess out of the picture so to speak Joel can now bond with Ellie which might not fully develop with Tess by his side.

Yeah I didn't even consider this, very obvious point on why the de-emphasis on Tess was intentional.