The Jarmo Thread

[Cheddarcheese]

People just want their pound of flesh to feel better about themselves. No sane organization would cut their GM without a succession plan (though I do believe he's handcuffed and gone at the end of the year) but considering a vast majority of the games we lost were one goal/blown leads the talent is there but the motivation to play a full 60 isn't. This is on the players to figure out and I am gonna be honest...they probably don't care what happens to the guy who hired them or signs their checks, I mean at work I don't give a shit about that, I just care about my direct superiors, my team's performance and I couldn't imagine its like that with this team...the problem needs fixed in the room and there's something wrong in there right now at this point.

thumbs up!

 

[majormajor]

I am gonna be completely honest...Flynn doesn't seem like "the guy" I rather just handcuff Jarmo and do it right in the summer. Also show's that the fan theory of Rick Nash being the successor to Jarmo isn't as correct as we expected or they would had pulled the trigger on that already.

I'd rather Flynn than Jarmo, and there's no reason to think Flynn would be the interim over any number of other folks. We have a lot more folks in the org that people don't seem to know about.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Who is making the decision about whether Sillinger stays up?

Who just waived Bemstrom and recalled TFW?

None of that has to do with the likelihood of what CBJW posted, though.

 

[BB88]

People just want their pound of flesh to feel better about themselves. No sane organization would cut their GM without a succession plan (though I do believe he's handcuffed and gone at the end of the year) but considering a vast majority of the games we lost were one goal/blown leads the talent is there but the motivation to play a full 60 isn't. This is on the players to figure out and I am gonna be honest...they probably don't care what happens to the guy who hired them or signs their checks, I mean at work I don't give a shit about that, I just care about my direct superiors, my team's performance and I couldn't imagine its like that with this team...the problem needs fixed in the room and there's something wrong in there right now at this point.

Yup.

Untill the players start playing it doesn’t matter who’s the Gm.
The players underperforming are the reason why they are where they are, not the Gm right now.

& to those overall comments I’ve seen this year.

Fans complain about Werenskis game and how he’s not a true 1D.
What Gm is going to make a change? No one.
The play lies purely on the shoulders of Werenski, not a single Gm will walk in and trade Werenski.

No Gm is going to make Gaudreau a superstar once again, again that’s on Gaudreau to become a superstar or even a star level player

Fans are afraid Jarmo will make a move to save his job and trade a young high end piece(he won’t) but at the same time they question whether or not they are going to be good enough to be building blocks.
No new Gm is going to come in and trade Johnson/Jiricek and will see them as future building blocks.
So the team is anyways ”stuck” with them no matter who’s the Gm.

I damm hope they start winning games and get to a 10-12 range.
How many years and rebuilds has Buffalo needed trying to become relevant?
Detroit started their rebuild in what 16-17 and are now starting to become relevant, Edmonton& Devils another examples of how damm hard it is to erase losing culture.

Them hitting rock bottom would set back the rebuild by years and I don’t think anyone should want that

 

[DarkandStormy]

Out of our blue, we rise.

 

[JacketsDavid]

Them hitting rock bottom would set back the rebuild by years and I don’t think anyone should want that

I assumed Rock Bottom was last year.

I still stand by with a new coach that we are going to suck for most of the first half. Few new guys, they are being asked to do something most of them didn't do last year (play defense), a couple vets not playing well (Laine has been hurt), etc.

I think we will be ok in the 2nd half. JG and Laine can't be bad forever unless they get hurt.

No that doesn't make us a playoff team but over 70 points.

 

[BB88]

I assumed Rock Bottom was last year.

I still stand by with a new coach that we are going to suck for most of the first half. Few new guys, they are being asked to do something most of them didn't do last year (play defense), a couple vets not playing well (Laine has been hurt), etc.

I think we will be ok in the 2nd half. JG and Laine can't be bad forever unless they get hurt.

No that doesn't make us a playoff team but over 70 points.

Finishing bottom3 would be an even bigger rock bottom than last years, atleast they had the injury excuse.

Finishing at the bottom this year would lead to major changes and teach the players more about losing. Both 2 things that could really lead them to Buffalo waters and take years to get out of.

I rather see them with a 5-7 spots weaker draft position& avoid losing culture than a better pick and teach more about losing/bad habits

They will anyways be in the range to add an elite/borderline elite prospect

 

[majormajor]

Yup.

Untill the players start playing it doesn’t matter who’s the Gm.
The players underperforming are the reason why they are where they are, not the Gm right now.

& to those overall comments I’ve seen this year.

Fans complain about Werenskis game and how he’s not a true 1D.
What Gm is going to make a change? No one.
The play lies purely on the shoulders of Werenski, not a single Gm will walk in and trade Werenski.

No Gm is going to make Gaudreau a superstar once again, again that’s on Gaudreau to become a superstar or even a star level player

Fans are afraid Jarmo will make a move to save his job and trade a young high end piece(he won’t) but at the same time they question whether or not they are going to be good enough to be building blocks.
No new Gm is going to come in and trade Johnson/Jiricek and will see them as future building blocks.
So the team is anyways ”stuck” with them no matter who’s the Gm.

I damm hope they start winning games and get to a 10-12 range.
How many years and rebuilds has Buffalo needed trying to become relevant?
Detroit started their rebuild in what 16-17 and are now starting to become relevant, Edmonton& Devils another examples of how damm hard it is to erase losing culture.

Them hitting rock bottom would set back the rebuild by years and I don’t think anyone should want that

For me the case for firing Jarmo is pretty thick at this point, and it doesn't include anything about the way Laine, Werenski, and Gaudreau are playing right now. The GM obviously can't fix that. I'm sure you're aware of the many bad decisions Jarmo has made in recent years and don't need to hear about them again.

 

[JacketsDavid]

Finishing bottom3 would be an even bigger rock bottom than last years, atleast they had the injury excuse.

Finishing at the bottom this year would lead to major changes and teach the players more about losing. Both 2 things that could really lead them to Buffalo waters and take years to get out of.

I rather see them with a 5-7 spots weaker draft position& avoid losing culture than a better pick and teach more about losing/bad habits

They will anyways be in the range to add an elite/borderline elite prospect

But injuries were an excuse. yes we had a lot of them. But root cause of last year was a horrible defensive system (if any by a Coach that should not have been hired) and equally bad goaltending. Even when Zach was healthy early last year the team wasn't going anywhere. Maybe not 2nd worst in the league but not sniffing the playoffs.
So I don't buy if we are bad again this year that we are set back any further than where we are.

 

[BB88]

For me the case for firing Jarmo is pretty thick at this point, and it doesn't include anything about the way Laine, Werenski, and Gaudreau are playing right now. The GM obviously can't fix that. I'm sure you're aware of the many bad decisions Jarmo has made in recent years and don't need to hear about them again.

I know I know.

I just don’t see the point of blaming him for these current lossess, I’m not letting the leaders (players) off the hook to blame the management

Just let the season play out and figure things out in the offseason

But injuries were an excuse. yes we had a lot of them. But root cause of last year was a horrible defensive system (if any by a Coach that should not have been hired) and equally bad goaltending. Even when Zach was healthy early last year the team wasn't going anywhere. Maybe not 2nd worst in the league but not sniffing the playoffs.
So I don't buy if we are bad again this year that we are set back any further than where we are.

They had a franchise record man games lost to injury, wouldn’t have mattered how they were coached injuries were a legit reason for them finishing at the bottom.

With that said they were also poorly coaches and coaching had to be changed, without the amount of injuries they wouldn’t have landed Fantilli or been anywhere close to it, I’m certain.
So in that way they were ”lucky” to have the injury season when Bedard/Carlsson/Fantilli were available

 

[Doggy]

I am not arguing for or against Jarmo but this was in The Athletic's power rankings today...CBJ ranked 31:

The American Dream? It’s job security in a high-paying field regardless of performance. Jarmo Kekalainen is living the dream, baby! We salute you, Jarmo!

 

[Michigan Magic]

I am not arguing for or against Jarmo but this was in The Athletic's power rankings today...CBJ ranked 31:

The American Dream? It’s job security in a high-paying field regardless of performance. Jarmo Kekalainen is living the dream, baby! We salute you, Jarmo!

Until the peasants revolt and ticket sales and gear flounder it will be business as usual.

 

[Michigan Magic]

 

[NotWendell]

Do we really have to do this in public?

 

[Michigan Magic]

Do we really have to do this in public?

Its not like we didn't know already.
To be honest the players opened the privacy door when they used a podcast to out Babcock.
But yeah it all should have been in house.
Its about to explode in Columbus and get real messy.
This season is done.

 

[Mogo]

Crazy this thread started in 2019 and Kekäläinen is still the GM

 

[Michigan Magic]

Crazy this thread started in 2019 and Kekäläinen is still the GM

if he survies this year, there should be competency hearing for whoever decided his fate.

 

[Byrral]

Crazy this thread started in 2019 and Kekäläinen is still the GM

I bumped this thread about a year ago and got a lot of push back for doing so. Good times. A lot more have jumped on the fire Jarmo train since then combined with the horrible start to this season. I was hoping to see some improvement this season and it hasn't come thus far. Unless ownership is completely out of touch or some miraculous change in the teams play suddenly occurs I can't see JD and Jarmo being around much after the season ends. If nothing happens I would start to question JPMac.

 

[tunnelvision]

I bumped this thread about a year ago and got a lot of push back for doing so. Good times.

Just for bumping the thread? Or for criticizing Jarmo? Or for criticizing Jarmo for "wrong" reasons?

 

[Byrral]

Just for bumping the thread? Or for criticizing Jarmo? Or for criticizing Jarmo for "wrong" reasons?

If you cared enough to quote me then you'd care enough to go back through the thread and read why. I'm not doing it for you.

 

[tunnelvision]

If you cared enough to quote me then you'd care enough to go back through the thread and read why. I'm not doing it for you.

Are you referring to this post?

Are we still all in with Jamo and Co? Is this current management team of Jarmo and JD the group that we want to put our continued faith in for the near/long term future based on previous results and the current roster and salary structure? Are we happy with some of these contracts given out to what appear to be average players?

I can't sit here and accept excuses anymore. It's been a decade for these guys and I see a handful of long term solutions on this current roster. The rest appears to be a disaster. How much longer do I have to be patient with this group when the results have been a couple playoff appearances, one non-covid series win, a mass exodus of players from our team do to a variety of reasons and a current roster that seems years away from being a contender if they are even capable of getting them there.

This isn't a bash Jarmo post but how long am I suppose to be patient with the mediocrity of the team before we are a contender? Would it be better to find a candidate to move this team forward? Or am I just angry/frustrated and completely out of line? Just saying.

I scrolled through pages 41-45 and couldn't find tons of any kind of push back. Maybe we have different definitions for that word, or maybe the push back from Jarmo defenders was more noticeable in other threads?

 

[Byrral]

Are you referring to this post?


I scrolled through pages 41-45 and couldn't find tons of any kind of push back. Maybe we have different definitions for that word, or maybe the push back from Jarmo defenders was more noticeable in other threads?

Fair enough and it is definately on the topic in general. You post here so you know that I have been clear on where I stand on this management group. If you are defending Jarmo feel free but I have been consistent that he is out of time. Other than that I don't know what your point is.

 

[stonec]

Crazy this thread started in 2019 and Kekäläinen is still the GM

There was no reason to fire Jarmo in 2019. In fact the downhill didn't start until the first lockdown season ended in 2020.

I wasn't a big fan of Torts, but the team had an identity under him. Defend well, work hard, etc. Also the team lost some key leader players after 2020 that it hasn't been able to replace.

Since then Jarmo has brought in lots of new players, some older and some younger with potential, but today's Columbus doesn't seem like it has many great leaders in the locker room, at least that's my speculation.

What has maybe saved Jarmo from losing his job is that he hasn't committed to any terrible contracts and in fact got rid of expensive players like Seth Jones while having reasonable success in drafting.

On the other hand we have some terrible decisions regarding coaching, committing to goaltenders that are below par in the league and aforementioned lack of leader types in the current team. If I had to guess I think he'll be gone after this season due to the mistakes made post 2020.

 

[Crede777]

I think Ferraro nailed this on every point. That includes his asserion that this franchise is heading nowhere this year. Jarmo should be barred from making any trades unless it’s simply cleaning off the barnacles on the ships hull until year end when the GM, asst GMs (incl Nash), JD and Vincent all need to go.

What would any GM do differently?

I'm looking back at all the decisions Jarmo has made and they all seem to make sense at the time knowing what you do then.

I honestly think this is 100% on the players who aren't holding up their end of the bargain. They didn't train hard enough in the summer. They're not working hard enough now. Not much a coach or GM can do about that if guys just refuse to work hard after they're signed.

Find me one GM who could convince Panarin, Jones, or PLD to stay. Find me one who wouldn't trade PLD for Laine. Find me one who wouldn't sign Gaudreau. Or find me one who wouldn't bring in the two best UFA drfensemen on the market after last season exposed the defense for what it was.

If you think hiring Babcock and then replacing him with Vincent was a mistake, fine but tell me what coach was available who is better than them.

I'll wait.

 

[stevo61]

What would any GM do differently?

I'm looking back at all the decisions Jarmo has made and they all seem to make sense at the time knowing what you do then.

I honestly think this is 100% on the players who aren't holding up their end of the bargain. They didn't train hard enough in the summer. They're not working hard enough now. Not much a coach or GM can do about that if guys just refuse to work hard after they're signed.

Find me one GM who could convince Panarin, Jones, or PLD to stay. Find me one who wouldn't trade PLD for Laine. Find me one who wouldn't sign Gaudreau. Or find me one who wouldn't bring in the two best UFA drfensemen on the market after last season exposed the defense for what it was.

If you think hiring Babcock and then replacing him with Vincent was a mistake, fine but tell me what coach was available who is better than them.

I'll wait.

Thats not our job. Even if we like what he did (plenty dont) hes had almost 11 years now to get results and aside from a small window where they were legit its been failures. I think hes good at acquiring talent but not so good at building a team. That and the whole contract signing thing