The Core Has To Go

[horner]

Mathews holds all the cards

I saidvwe should have traded him last year now it is to late.

 

[koyvoo]

All that was needed was the best players to be the best players. Everyone else did their job.

The way the team really protected Holl from when he entered the series, for example, is a thing they couldn’t do a few years ago. Team wasn’t built as well, in terms of depth players.

Turns out, that was all good. In the end, especially if you’re getting good defensive or depth performances, if your best players aren’t at their best, it’ll sink you. The core blew this one for the others.

 

[ICE FIRE]

For me it looks pretty simple even if it is an atomic bomb solution.

These guys have had 7 years to prove their worth,and failed in every way.

Matthews next ask will be whatever the top cap percentage will be allowed,14-15 mil,easy pass.
He has to go at this draft or his NMC kicks in and we will end up with zip.
The return will be strong.

Nylander was better than I expected but we have seen what he is all about and his ask will be minimum 10 mil so another easy pass for me and we should get another good return.

We are stuck with Tavares and have another year to see about Mitch but I would have his name out there as well and he will get a solid return.

Trading all 3 now is an atomic bomb but the returns should be really really good and the rebuild would be super fast if we draft well and whatever young guys and prospects we get pan out.

I really think Matthews will not resign,Willy will be totally greedy and Mitch nothing on his own and not worth a big pay resign.

Needless to say Dubas and Keefe should be long gone,thank goodness, and really Shanny too.
A really tough thing for a new GM but someone with experience can pull it off.

 

[RAM]

Mathews holds all the cards

I saidvwe should have traded him last now it is to late.

I believe his no trade clause kicks in July 1 you can trade him at the draft to a team that is close to breaking out and into the playoff for a long time ie Buffalo, Detroit or to a team that is just one piece away ie Seattle, New Jersey, Rangers, Minnesota

 

[notDatsyuk]

No this is the important part. To suggest that it's managements fault for assuming it would go up as all teams did is just silly.

Believe it or not, the cap went up exactly the same amount for every team.

I don't see why people think that the flat cap affected Toronto, but not every other team, particularly the other teams at or near the top.

 

[notDatsyuk]

If Tavares is the problem get rid of him.

You don't fart and turn up the music to drown out the smell.

That's what Dubas and Keefe have been doing.

 

[TDotMassive]

Can we buyout Tavares??

 

[horner]

When we signed JT I knew this would happen .
Mathews Marner or Nylander would have to be traded.

You can't build a team with 40 million being eaten up.

The sad part is that not on of the 4 are leaders .

We can't even build a deffence.

 

[666]

Believe it or not, the cap went up exactly the same amount for every team.

I don't see why people think that the flat cap affected Toronto, but not every other team, particularly the other teams at or near the top.

Yes the cap went up equally for everyone but it's the timing that hurt the Leafs. When the Leafs signed Matthews the cap was $81.5M and 5 years later it's $82.5M. Crosby signed 10 years ago when the cap was $64.3 and still only makes $8.7M for two more years. Contracts that long aren't allowed anymore but that sure turned out well for the Pens.

Just as we got everyone (except Reilly) signed, the cap froze. The timing is different for every team but the Leafs were very unlucky. We did probably save $1M on Rielly though.

This might actually work out for us in the future because if we were to sign Matthews this summer for the same percentage of the cap he'd only get a very small raise.

 

[666]

They've managed it to the tune of playoff series victory in 7 years. Seems like it's you who doesn't understand that's not even close to being impressive.

Your expectations are unrealistic. We did better this season than Boston and the last few years finalists. We're pretty unlucky with the opponents we keep getting.

I remember our first conversation on here was about how we both agreed that buying out Grabovski was a bad idea. We both had the same number of posts at the time give or take. I don't know about you but I prefer this team much more than that team. But even I'm not going to poke the bear now as the hate fest going on around here is misguided and not for me.

 

[666]

Your expectations are unrealistic. We did better this season than Boston and the last few years finalists. We're pretty unlucky with the opponents we keep getting.

I remember our first conversation on here was about how we both agreed that buying out Grabovski was a bad idea. We both had the same number of posts at the time give or take. I don't know about you but I prefer this team much more than that team. But even I'm not going to poke the bear now as the hate fest going on around here is misguided and not for me. I think I'll go golfing today.

 

[NVious]

The funny thing about the core 4?

If they all took a bit less 1-2 million per person, we could've had 5+ million dollars to get a great 2D or another center or a goalie or a winger with heart.

They all made it their mission to squeeze every last penny out of the organization, so yeah for that they should all be on the market.

 

[stealth1]

Your expectations are unrealistic. We did better this season than Boston and the last few years finalists. We're pretty unlucky with the opponents we keep getting.

I remember our first conversation on here was about how we both agreed that buying out Grabovski was a bad idea. We both had the same number of posts at the time give or take. I don't know about you but I prefer this team much more than that team. But even I'm not going to poke the bear now as the hate fest going on around here is misguided and not for me.

How many times can you rearrange the bottom 6 and not see that the core 4 are the problem. They disappear more then they make a difference in the playoffs.

 

[NVious]

When we signed JT I knew this would happen .
Mathews Marner or Nylander would have to be traded.

You can't build a team with 40 million being eaten up.

The sad part is that not on of the 4 are leaders .

We can't even build a deffence.

All the games were close;
Marner/Tavares/Mitch combined for a grand total of
3 goals and 4 assists in 5games, I think Drai and Pavelski had more in a single game by themselves LMFAO.

If they actually cared to show up, we could've won and definitely beaten Carolina (not an easy task by any means but it would've been a great matchup).

The bottom line for this core is that the stars simply did not show up, how many goalies we tried, coaches, gms bla bla bla bla;

FFS we even got Schenn and O Reilly who really are amazing vet pickups that bring grit, experience and leadership....and still....

Because its the core!

 

[NVious]

Funnest fact to think about?

If Bergy and Krejci had retired before the season, the 1st round very well could've been Toronto/Florida, could you imagine us losing to 5 in the 1st? Lmfao well that could've been the case and it basically was.

 

[GQS]

The funny thing about the core 4?

If they all took a bit less 1-2 million per person, we could've had 5+ million dollars to get a great 2D or another center or a goalie or a winger with heart.

They all made it their mission to squeeze every last penny out of the organization, so yeah for that they should all be on the market.

Lets be real. If this team couldn't get it done with all the changes that Dubas made, I don't think an extra equivalent of a Meier, Chychrun or someone similar would be the difference between the Leafs losing and being a dominate team that would get to the finals.

People keep mentioning one or more of Matthews, Marner and Nylander being overpaid and by now Nylander's contract is fine and even if you really want to make the case Matthews and Marner are only slightly overpaid at best and their contracts aren't likely the difference between getting that one player that is the difference between huge success and failure.

 

[666]

How many times can you rearrange the bottom 6 and not see that the core 4 are the problem. They disappear more then they make a difference in the playoffs.

Barkov had 1 goal and 2 assists (both assists last night) and Tkachuk had no goals and 5 assists. We don't have any LW. When Marner and Matthews are on the ice with guys like Hands, Jarnkrok and Bunting they are basically short handed especially playing the same team 7 games in a row where the coaches can learn to neutralize them.

If you want to suggest that our coaching is a problem that's cool because acquiring ROR and keeping him and JT at center with our weak LW was a mistake once Knies (and Roberts) went down.

The problem isn't the top 4. It's the coaching and cap freeze not letting us support the top 4 well enough.

 

[Legion34]

Matthews holds the cards…. After sleeping on it you still stay the course. IF he wants to extend you extend him.
IF he wants out… my guesses are

1.) LA
2.) Dallas
3.) Vegas
4.) NYR
5.) carolina
6.) Anaheim.
7.) Arizona

I would GUESS he wants a big market with southern weather and a chance to compete. Tax rates probably Help.

1.) LA has the assets and can fit him in if there is retention this year with kopitar coming off the next year. My guesses would be

Iafallo/arvidsson, Walker for cap and a combo of vilardi/byfield/clarke
Something like arvidson, walker byfield, 1st,3rd could work

2.) Dallas has better prospects… I would look at faksa, dellandrea, Harley and something

3.) Vegas can actually fit him in. No taxes always competing close with eichel. I would look at Roy, Hague/whitecloud, Brisson, 1st.

4.) NYR. They will want changes. It is a huge team. Kane would probably sign there cheap. Colder, pressure, taxes… not sure if he would want that but
Chytil or Miller,Laff and 1st could work.

5.) Carolina. Dark horse. Freddie is his bestie. No real pressure. Good team. I wonder if they would pay him. But they have tons of space, good prospecrts/picks.

I would do necas straight up. Just because of RFA.

6.) Anaheim. Probably not because of where they are. But I would do mctavish/zellweger.

6.) Arizona. He is buddies with Keller. I don’t think he would ever go there… but grouse 6th and 12th may work.

Only if u think u could flip those picks and extend someone. Like lindholm for the 12th or something

 

[Aloysius]

No it won't. That goaltending and first line alone will take us to the playoffs. You don't watch enough hockey do you?

Nope. Just a self-appointed hfboards gm.

 

[Dreakmur]

Matthews holds the cards…. After sleeping on it you still stay the course. IF he wants to extend you extend him.
IF he wants out… my guesses are

1.) LA
2.) Dallas
3.) Vegas
4.) NYR
5.) carolina
6.) Anaheim.
7.) Arizona

I would GUESS he wants a big market with southern weather and a chance to compete. Tax rates probably Help.

1.) LA has the assets and can fit him in if there is retention this year with kopitar coming off the next year. My guesses would be

Iafallo/arvidsson, Walker for cap and a combo of vilardi/byfield/clarke
Something like arvidson, walker byfield, 1st,3rd could work

2.) Dallas has better prospects… I would look at faksa, dellandrea, Harley and something

3.) Vegas can actually fit him in. No taxes always competing close with eichel. I would look at Roy, Hague/whitecloud, Brisson, 1st.

4.) NYR. They will want changes. It is a huge team. Kane would probably sign there cheap. Colder, pressure, taxes… not sure if he would want that but
Chytil or Miller,Laff and 1st could work.

5.) Carolina. Dark horse. Freddie is his bestie. No real pressure. Good team. I wonder if they would pay him. But they have tons of space, good prospecrts/picks.

I would do necas straight up. Just because of RFA.

6.) Anaheim. Probably not because of where they are. But I would do mctavish/zellweger.

6.) Arizona. He is buddies with Keller. I don’t think he would ever go there… but grouse 6th and 12th may work.

Only if u think u could flip those picks and extend someone. Like lindholm for the 12th or something

LA - Vilardi, Clarke, 1st, 2nd… plus cap returns if needed

NYR - Miller, Lafreniere, 1st… plus cap returns if needed

 

[Trapper]

I don’t even care if we take a step back or have to claw our way to try and make the playoffs.
I’ve watched this team from Sittler to present and never has there been a core that I disliked until now. Members of the core that I’d rather see gone. When you dislike players on your own team as much as a Marchand/etc. on another, it makes it a tough watch. Losing is a double kick. At least I could not like them but they win. Nope. Not even that.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Your expectations are unrealistic. We did better this season than Boston and the last few years finalists. We're pretty unlucky with the opponents we keep getting.

I remember our first conversation on here was about how we both agreed that buying out Grabovski was a bad idea. We both had the same number of posts at the time give or take. I don't know about you but I prefer this team much more than that team. But even I'm not going to poke the bear now as the hate fest going on around here is misguided and not for me.

Expecting more than 1 playoff round win in 7 years is unrealistic. Got it.
We're pretty unlucky. Got it.
This team is better than some mediocre Leaf team from the distant past, that's enough to make you happy. Got it.

I'm happy you're enjoying your love fest. Maybe you should set the bar even lower, that way you can be happy forever no matter how the team plays.

 

[Marmoset]

Your expectations are unrealistic. We did better this season than Boston and the last few years finalists. We're pretty unlucky with the opponents we keep getting.

I remember our first conversation on here was about how we both agreed that buying out Grabovski was a bad idea. We both had the same number of posts at the time give or take. I don't know about you but I prefer this team much more than that team. But even I'm not going to poke the bear now as the hate fest going on around here is misguided and not for me.

It's not a "hate fest" to suggest a team that began with Matthews, Marner, Nylander and Rielly, an excellent cap situation, a solid stable of draft picks (before being used/traded), basically such a positive situation - is "unlucky" to have won a single playoff round in seven years, It is reality.

The Leafs have lost series where they were favoured. They have lost series where they were underdogs. They have lost series where they even changed the rules (CBJ/COVID season). At some point, if you have tried everything else, you have to look at your core, both on the ice and in management.

 

[666]

Expecting more than 1 playoff round win in 7 years is unrealistic. Got it.
We're pretty unlucky. Got it.
This team is better than some mediocre Leaf team from the distant past, that's enough to make you happy. Got it.

I'm happy you're enjoying your love fest. Maybe you should set the bar even lower, that way you can be happy forever no matter how the team plays.

This fan base literally rages every single loss. Be it a meaningless regular season game or a second round loss. You guys are only happy when we are winning and only one team gets to win every season so guess what, you guys are always miserable. Now that I think about it, the only time that you guys weren't raging was when Babcock took us to last overall. Weird huh?

I'm not going to keep repeating myself but I will for you. The Covid flat cap kept us unbalanced and top heavy with 4 guys consuming almost half the cap but the plan was solid. Because of that, we have two top lines and no LW. Because of that and the fact that in the playoffs you play the same team 7 games in a row, the opposing coaches learn how to shutdown our 4 stars because they are basically short handed with our horrible LW like Hands, Bunting and Jarnkrok especially with Knies and Robertson down. The flat cap also hurts other areas. Keeping both ROR and JT at center was a mistake. If you want to fire Keefe that's cool, we can do better.

The future is bright. If we can sign Matthews and Nylander this offseason while the cap is still low that might help. If we start trading people we might lose some loyalty from the others. If Knies and Roberts are healthy and can play in the top 6 with entry contracts next season could be fun. In two years JT's $11M clears up, the cap should be rising and we can easily re-sign Marner and hopefully find a 2C and a real goaltender by then too. The past few years were rough but it's really no ones fault but the future is bright. I'm off to my tee time. Have a good weekend.

 

[MCR74]

A fresh start wouldn't be a bad thing IMO. You think Matthews and Marner will display more effort in the playoffs if they resign big contracts? I strongly doubt it.