TV: The All - Encompassing Star Trek Thread. Debate Long + Prosper

[johnjm22]

You literally claimed the number of people voting on it indicates how many people watch it, which isn't true.

The amount of feedback a show gets does give an indication of how many people are watching.

Discovery S4 has so few critic ratings that Metacritic can't even give it a score:

Star Trek: Discovery season 4 Reviews

Before the Enterprise, the U.S.S. Discovery set out to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations, to boldly go where no one has gone before. The first episode will air on CBS, subsequent episodes will air only on CBS All Access.

www.metacritic.com

 

[Jussi]

The amount of feedback a show gets does give an indication of how many people are watching.

Discovery S4 has so few critic ratings that Metacritic can't even give it a score:

Star Trek: Discovery season 4 Reviews

Before the Enterprise, the U.S.S. Discovery set out to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations, to boldly go where no one has gone before. The first episode will air on CBS, subsequent episodes will air only on CBS All Access.

www.metacritic.com

Ehh. As I've said before Discovery was among the most watched shows when it was on Netflix and since it wasn't anymore, it was one of the most pirated current tv shows.

 

[Osprey]

Discovery S4 has so few critic ratings that Metacritic can't even give it a score:

The critic review numbers at RT are interesting, as well:

S1: 373
S2: 209
S3: 33
S4: 13

Picard S2 already has 71 critic reviews and the season isn't even over yet, so it makes you wonder how STD S4 has only 13 over a month after it concluded.

Also, it's no wonder that the scores have been going up, with S4 having the highest of them all at 92%, since only the most diehard few must be sticking with it.

 

[Commander Clueless]

I haven't seen today's episode yet, but I've found this to be a flaw in most of what we've seen from this era from Star Trek so far even though I've liked most of it. They set up a bunch of stuff towards the beginning, meander a little bit in the middle, and then rush to wrap it all up in the final 2 episodes. That damages the ends of the seasons to me.

I 100% agree.

It starts out with some very interesting ideas and throws a huge amount plot threads into the air, then it slows down and gets a little weird, and then it ends without most of those threads landing anywhere in a narrative culmination that screams "writing staff turnover".....or at least "we ran out of episodes to close all this stuff up"....or maybe "we didn't think this far ahead"....I don't know.


Picard in particular seems to have these pacing issues. I honestly thought S1 would have been better if they cut it to around 5 episodes....


Lower Decks is my favourite new series so far. It's shameless fan service crap humour, but it's good at what it does


Strange New Worlds looks like it might be more up my alley. We'll see I guess.

 

[Jumptheshark]

long episode only because they needed more fraking exposition on a character that has been around longer than most on this board have been alive

 

[Osprey]

The Picard backstory is so tedious and boring and doesn't seem to have much to do with the main plot. It feels like the writers just put it in to have some melodramatic, Picard-focused character drama and mystery and thought that it'd be a lot more interesting than it is. Tonight's revelation also retcons something minor from TNG...

Spoiler

Picard's Mother Secret Retcons Star Trek: TNG Season 1

Yvette Picard never became the old lady Jean-Luc saw in TNG season 1.

screenrant.com

Brent Spiner's acting was pretty bad already, but he's even more laughable as a villain. Maybe they shouldn't let fan service dictate their casting decisions.

Does a hologram really need to dodge bullets and how could it possibly know Elnor's last thoughts?

The Borg queen now uses expletives. Also, she gets lectured about the value of mercy by a woman who murdered a helpless man in Season 1.

 

[Canadiens Ghost]

Wasn't that scene when Seven and Raffi went out into the open armed only with a knife and ice pick against a dozen guys armed with machine guns exciting?




Such a shame Star Trek has come down to this.

 

[johnjm22]

Can anyone honestly say they thought that was a good episode?

 

[Jumptheshark]

Can anyone honestly say they thought that was a good episode?

ending was predictable. The Borg thing is wrapped up at least

 

[Guardian17]

You guys took all my talking points!

This season of Picard is not Star Trek.

It's bad fanfiction using characters from Star Trek.

No wonder they announced the Next Generation cast would be appearing in Season 3 before Season 2 ended.

The producers know their show sucks and they're desperate for ratings.

 

[Jussi]

ending was predictable. The Borg thing is wrapped up at least

I really liked how they finally managed to do an alternative solution with the Borg.

 

[Jussi]

Can anyone honestly say they thought that was a good episode?

It was much better than the last two.

 

[Mimsy]

Overall, I'm satisfied with the season because I enjoy the show, warts and all. However, I was disappointed with ep. 9. The flashbacks are cumbersome and their resolution predictable. Young Picard had way too much screen time this season, and his scenes always repeat the same beats. Did not enjoy watching the child actor. His through line should have been condensed to a couple of episodes. Flashbacks in the early going were fine. By ep. 9, they're aggravating and momentum killing. Last two episodes were filler. Still shaking my head at Ep. 8's heavy focus on FBI interview. Pointless.

Agree that Spiner is cartoonish when he's anyone other than Data or a modest Soong relative. You can see him acting. I still like having him in the show, but his character is a mustache twirling caricature.

The season looks good on paper but execution is flawed. The main story has almost no use for Seven/Raffi or Rios. Soji and Elnor were mostly sidelined (right move), but the others were consigned to side missions that play like 80s tv drama. Time wasted on frivolous stuff that did little to advance the story.

Enjoyed the Borg scenes. Wersching's take on the Queen is fresh. We're in the Confederation 2024 timeline, so it's fine if her character takes new directions (it's fine regardless). Jurati much improved this season.

I have hope for the finale. Two possibilities for the Queen reveal from ep 1. Obvious is Jurati, but also wondering about (spoiler = educated guess)

Spoiler

Renee Picard, since she's the only one who heard Picard's "Look up" reference. Depends on how the Europa mission plays out.

Unsure if original TNG cast signed for all 10 episodes next season. If so, Rios likely stays in 2024, Elnor remains dead in Prime universe, and Soji's role is minimal to nothing next season. Not sure how Ep. 10 resolves Jurati prime with Confederation Queen. I guess she remains Borg.

 

[Commander Clueless]

This season of Picard is not Star Trek.

Modern Star Trek is definitely not what Star Trek was in the TNG era. I get it, they are trying to reach a new audience and what I loved has been changed because of that and I've made my peace with that.


All that said an accepted, this show is uh......not good.

Once again, it was interesting concepts like what's going on with Q, exploring why Picard was in fact a loner his whole life (beyond his obvious disdain for social situations), a dark future due to something that seems minor in the past (a common Trek theme)...all good!

The execution is...hard to follow the logic behind it, when it's at its best. At worst, it's painful to watch. At very worst, they just let threads die without much addressing them.

This show desperately wants to be an action film or something at times, and it's really not very good at it.



All my previous criticisms of Discovery seem like minor nitpicks right now.



Disclaimer: I admit I don't enjoy much TV at all, so I'm probably not the best judge of what makes TV but like....I don't think this is very good.

 

[Osprey]

Modern Star Trek is definitely not what Star Trek was in the TNG era. I get it, they are trying to reach a new audience and what I loved has been changed because of that and I've made my peace with that.

According to IMDb ratings, they don't seem to be doing a good job of reaching a new audience.

Discovery
1.5% are females under 30
6.9% are males under 30
12.5% are females over 30
79.1% are males over 30

Picard
1.1% are females under 30
4.6% are males under 30
12.3% are females over 30
82% are males over 30

 

[Commander Clueless]

According to IMDb, they don't seem to be doing a good job of reaching a new audience.

Discovery
8.4% of ratings come from viewers under age 30
12.5% come from females age 30+
79.1% come from males age 30+

Picard
5.7% of ratings come from viewers under age 30
12.3% come from females age 30+
80% come from males age 30+

Well, I suppose trying and succeeding are very different things. I'm at a loss.

 

[Jussi]

Well, I suppose trying and succeeding are very different things. I'm at a loss.

One could also say those numbers highlight the problem of Star Trek fans. It's mostly old men. It's no wonder they can't makea hit when your biggest fan base is dying.

Also side note, I've noticed that Disovery season 4 had much higher numbers on torrent sites than Picard season 2.

 

[johnjm22]

One could also say those numbers highlight the problem of Star Trek fans. It's mostly old men. It's no wonder they can't makea hit when your biggest fan base is dying.

Also side note, I've noticed that Disovery season 4 had much higher numbers on torrent sites than Picard season 2.

If it was good, it would be making new fans.

 

[Osprey]

One could also say those numbers highlight the problem of Star Trek fans. It's mostly old men. It's no wonder they can't makea hit when your biggest fan base is dying.

3/4ths of the ratings for The Sopranos and The Wire are from men over 30 and 2/3rds of the ratings for The Mandalorian and The Clone Wars are. Those were all hit shows despite their fans being "mostly old men."

Also, 3/4ths of Halo's ratings are from men over 30 and its largest demographic (men aged 30-44) is the same as Discovery's and Picard's.

 

[Guardian17]

 

[Mimsy]

Picard is trending on Twitter since at least this morning.

 

[johnjm22]

Picard is trending on Twitter since at least this morning.

Some of the trending topics you see are personalized to the user. Picard may be trending for you but it's not for me.

I looked at the overall trending, non personalized, USA topics/tags for Twitter and Picard was no where to be found.

 

[johnjm22]

It looks fake. Mediocre CGI.

The TNG intro from 30 years ago looked more realistic.

 

[Osprey]

Some of the trending topics you see are personalized to the user. Picard may be trending for you but it's not for me.

I looked at the overall trending, non personalized, USA topics/tags for Twitter and Picard was no where to be found.

I did the same thing earlier and didn't find it in today's top-50 trending hashtags. What may've happened is that the release of the season finale teaser this morning boosted usage of the hashtag higher than normal and that was presented to him as "trending" because it's a topic that he'd shown interest in.

The TNG intro from 30 years ago looked more realistic.

Whenever I watch an episode, I'm impressed by how good the intro looks, especially for 1987.

 

[Mimsy]

Some of the trending topics you see are personalized to the user. Picard may be trending for you but it's not for me.

I looked at the overall trending, non personalized, USA topics/tags for Twitter and Picard was no where to be found.

I accept this explanation. Makes sense.

Anyway, SNW is episodic. Better opportunity to course correct as needed. In the old DISCO threads, response to Anson Mount's Pike was positive, even among some of DISCO's harshest critics. I don't watch trailers and few episode previews. I know next to nothing about SNW beyond its long established premise, but will watch.