Post-Game Talk: That was unexpected! Jets beat VGK 4-3 in OT

[GeorgeJETson]

The best top pairing defenseman compliment one another. Ranking the NHL's top 5 defensive pairings

He’s a top pairing guy in my opinion, but even Starsky needed Hutch, Batman needed Robin, and Bert needed Ernie to be an effective duo!

I’m hoping we can find a top pairing dman for Morrissey once the Byfuglien situation reaches a resolve.

Someone with size, a great shot, and offensive presence that can allow Morrissey to be his normal defensive/intelligent self and quit over compensating for the lack thereof.

I was about to post something similar, but it would have been less eloquent.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

You can hardly put all the blame on a coach if the only top 6 guy playing to his potential is Ehlers. Every other coach has their players lighting the other teams up. Is the fact that Barzal is playing like a true superstar all because of Trotsky.

Show me where I put all the blame on the coach.

If the players are not performing up to their potential does that not reflect on the coach? Is getting the potential out of them, one way or another, not pretty much the coach's only job?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Had Maurice done anything?

You are completely ignorant to anything he does unless you can spin it in to a negative, so your interpretation of his input on the game is as meaningless as it is one sided.

This isn't even worthy of a response.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Uhhhhh, which is it? Either I can be too generous to Bro or I can hold him to too high a standard. It can't be both.

He was very good for us last year. This year, I think he has played much better than his sv% would indicate. He has been the victim of the team in front of him several times. I think he was bad in 1 game. This was not that game.

I’m asking a question whether it’s fair to hold a back up to the same standards. We’d be harder on Helly for those 3 goals. Not a contradiction st all.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Show me where I put all the blame on the coach.

If the players are not performing up to their potential does that not reflect on the coach? Is getting the potential out of them, one way or another, not pretty much the coach's only job?

Coaches have multiple roles from drawing up systems. If chef is playing bad because of a break up it’s not Mo’s job to find him a rebound.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I said in the summer we need Lowry to start impacting the game like Tom Wilson.

All he needs to is up the scoring a bit and he is there. It's going to come. Great job.

Yup. Hockey is about nothing but bar fights on ice.

If Lowry started drawing penalties like Wilson does, people here would be running him out of town - and rightly so.

 

[jepjepjoo]

No not injury related and pp1 finally scored.

PP1 hasn't had Laine on it for the past 3 games and have scored once... Clearly Laine was the problem.

Wheeler is still 0g 0a on the PP.

 

[brendan smith]

I agree with most in that J.Morrissey has been a bit off as of late, but I cant help but think he’s been a stud (along with others [KC]) in OT.

Without those 3 OT wins, this team would be 5-7-3 (0.333), instead of 8-7-0 (0.533).

At face value, thats a scary looking stat!

 

[Teemusalami204]

Yup. Hockey is about nothing but bar fights on ice.

If Lowry started drawing penalties like Wilson does, people here would be running him out of town - and rightly so.

Nothing wrong with one player on our team throwing huge hits and fighting. Sticking up for the Crest on our jersey.

 

[jepjepjoo]

Not almost in a full year he hasn't. Their trying different things. He will still get his looks.

Full year (2018/11/03-2019/11/03):
Wheeler 2g 23pts
Scheifele 11g 21pts
Laine 9g 20pts

year 2019:
Trouba 2g 17pts
Laine 4g 14pts
Wheeler 2g 14pts

16-17 - today:
Wheeler 13g 94pts
Laine 44g 72pts
Scheifele 29g 58pts

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I’m asking a question whether it’s fair to hold a back up to the same standards. We’d be harder on Helly for those 3 goals. Not a contradiction st all.

I don't think so. Well, some might. I would not. The biggest differences between a starter and a backup are consistency and stamina. A quality start looks the same from each and you expect quality starts from your backup. Just a little lower ratio of quality:poor starts. In fact, it isn't too unusual to see a backup with a better sv% than the starter, like Helle v Brossoit last year. But when those backups get the opportunity to start they very frequently fail to handle the work load.

I am just looking at Brossoit this year relative to some of the play he has had in front of him. Like the first period last night, he has had very poor support. I think that in the small sample, that has been more coincidental than anything else. Bro has played in 5 games, 4 starts and 1 relief. I think he has played well in 3 of the 4 starts. That is a good ratio of quality starts, backup or starter. But opponents have scored a lot of goals on him. That is not all his fault. I just hope he doesn't lose confidence.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Coaches have multiple roles from drawing up systems. If chef is playing bad because of a break up it’s not Mo’s job to find him a rebound.

Hockey is not rocket science. There are only so many systems and ALL of the coaches at this level know ALL of them. Using the right ones to suit the abilities of your players is part of getting the potential out of them.

If Scheif has a broken heart Maurice needs to find a way to get him playing like he can in spite of it. Is that too much to expect of a coach? It may be very hard to do but I think that is what the coach is for. How long should a player be allowed to let a breakup negatively affect his play? How long is acceptable in any other work place? It doesn't take very long for your boss to sit you down and very sympathetically, explain that you have to stop bringing it to work with you. Most employers will be supportive - to a point. They may allow you to use some sick leave if you need that, they may have an EAP of some kind to help you out. But it can't affect your work for any extended time. Especially if you are making 6 mil a year to perform.

If that is what is happening with Scheifele, he needs a good swift kick in the ass.

 

[Whileee]

Yes, Trouba is off. Very shrewd of JoMo to jump at that long term deal after that trade happened. I'm sure he saw a difficult season coming and his bargaining power being reduced.

I think Morrissey will bounce back. He's too good not to. But the Jets won't be a good team until Morrissey starts to play close to his potential. Meanwhile, Pionk has been much better than expected and looks very much like a good 2nd pairing D with offensive productivity. Kulikov has also had a bit of a bounce-back season so far. I think the Jets main problem has been the poor play of the Scheifele line defensively and anemic offense.

By the way, Little has been very good this year, and ELL is more than holding their own with all three players playing better than last season. It's almost like Maurice was right when he said that the line would work when Ehlers and Laine had their game on target.

 

[scelaton]

OK - but then why attack all of the Maurice critics, lumped together, for not criticizing him for a win? Or do you want all of the critics to rush to eat crow because the Jets managed to play 1 good game, sparked by Lowry not Maurice? I'm not about to come on here and say Yaaayy, we win, wahoooo - but Maurice is still a bad coach. And neither am I going to come here and say I was wrong, all the complaints I have had with Maurice over the last 5+ years were wrong and unfair, he is a great coach - just because they played 2/3rds of a good game.

Had Maurice done anything that stood out as having led to the win I would be happy to give him credit.

I think you may be missing the point. Maurice is vilified here on a regular basis even though, by and large, coaching has much less impact on wins and losses than the quality of the team itself. Maurice's entire coaching history is testament to that. But HFers love to blame the coach and you see the same complaints in the forums of all the most ardent fan bases when their team struggles.

I would be more than happy if the Maurice debates were quarantined to the dedicated thread, but they infect almost every other thread.
Wish we had an effective vaccine.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Nothing wrong with one player on our team throwing huge hits and fighting. Sticking up for the Crest on our jersey.

Nothing wrong with playing physically and a team needs to stick up for its members. Playing like Tom Wilson is something else.

Lowry needs to score at least a little. So far this year - zero pts. His play last night led the team. It sparked them to play the way they can, the way they should play much more of the time without needing that kind of spark. I hope that will give them a bit of a boost in the future.

I also hope Lowry will continue to play like he has in the past, hard hitting, close checking.

 

[Jet]

Could it be that Morrissey’s true ceiling is 2nd pairing, and he was carried by Trouba and Buff?

I don't think so. I think this is just part of his development into an elite first pairing defender. It's a different thing to be 'the man' and carrying a pair responsible for the toughest assignments.

I do want to see him paired with one guy consistently, someone who compliments his skillset so they can build chemistry. If Buff doesn't come back, someone like Hamonic would be perfect.

Morrissey wasn't carried by Trouba I think that was a mutually beneficial pairing

 

[Evil Little]

Gallant and Reaves were both out to lunch on the Lowry/Tuch play. It was hip-to-hip as the primary point of contact, and unlike Kylington, Tuch had time and space to brace for contact. Don't know why he didn't.

Yea if the shoe was on the other foot and Vegas scored a goal on us like our 3rd goal this thread would be double the size. What a horse**** missed call. Nice it went our way.

In fairness to the linesman, the rule 81.1 reads, "[...] icing is completed upon the determination as to which player (attacking or defending) would first touch the puck."

Given that Schmidt leapt to the dots at the expense of staying on his skates, it's pretty hard to argue that he would've first touched the puck.

Granted, as it's written isn't how it's usually called, but at least when Foley stops crying long enough to call Bettman, he won't have much of a case by the letter of the law.

I think the other one--called icing against Vegas--was more indisputably wrong.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Hockey is not rocket science. There are only so many systems and ALL of the coaches at this level know ALL of them. Using the right ones to suit the abilities of your players is part of getting the potential out of them.

If Scheif has a broken heart Maurice needs to find a way to get him playing like he can in spite of it. Is that too much to expect of a coach? It may be very hard to do but I think that is what the coach is for. How long should a player be allowed to let a breakup negatively affect his play? How long is acceptable in any other work place? It doesn't take very long for your boss to sit you down and very sympathetically, explain that you have to stop bringing it to work with you. Most employers will be supportive - to a point. They may allow you to use some sick leave if you need that, they may have an EAP of some kind to help you out. But it can't affect your work for any extended time. Especially if you are making 6 mil a year to perform.

If that is what is happening with Scheifele, he needs a good swift kick in the ass.

Its a lot harder to hide than in most other workplaces, as any little thing makes a big difference. A player with a cold usually is worse. A teacher with a cold, no one cares. They also have to maximize lines. A thing Mo has done badly. Instead of three offensive lines only two. Also, maybe coaches are just figureheads if you get a Barzal or a Mathews you look great. Did Babcock or Trotsky do anything to get these players, no he didn't. If Laine was scoring like was 2 years ago, Pomo looks great. Players can't figure it out, coaches play musical chairs.

 

[kanadalainen]

PP1 hasn't had Laine on it for the past 3 games and have scored once... Clearly Laine was the problem.

Wheeler is still 0g 0a on the PP.

Laine was the O.G. in the three on three O/T.

 

[Guardian17]

No supplemental discipline for Lowry.

 

[Guardian17]

Lowry earned the helmet tonight!

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think you may be missing the point. Maurice is vilified here on a regular basis even though, by and large, coaching has much less impact on wins and losses than the quality of the team itself. Maurice's entire coaching history is testament to that. But HFers love to blame the coach and you see the same complaints in the forums of all the most ardent fan bases when their team struggles.

I would be more than happy if the Maurice debates were quarantined to the dedicated thread, but they infect almost every other thread.
Wish we had an effective vaccine.

I will grant you that the criticism is sometimes over the top and always too widespread.

You didn't see me criticize Maurice in this thread. I responded to someone sticking a needle in the Maurice critics for not speaking up here, after a really gutsy win.

I don't think it should be quarantined. It is entirely fitting in a lot of threads, maybe most. Any thread were someone can say the team is playing badly is open for coaching to come up. Any thread were we are talking about a player underperforming, coaching will come up.

Tell you what, I will find something positive to say about Maurice. This team has demonstrated a never quit attitude this year. At least some credit for that should go to Maurice. Impossible to say how much, but motivation is part of the coach's job description. I would criticize him if they were quiting, so I will give him credit that they do not.

I also liked Scheif, Wheels, Ehlers in OT. That is coaching. That is 2 positives.

Back up a game. Considering the new rules on challenges, credit for the goalie interference win. That's a freebie.

Now, I could find some negatives, if I tried. But I won't. Why would I want to do that after winning both ends of a b2b?

 

[Guardian17]

Joe Pascucci explains why the "no icing" on the Jets third goal was the correct call.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Its a lot harder to hide than in most other workplaces, as any little thing makes a big difference. A player with a cold usually is worse. A teacher with a cold, no one cares. They also have to maximize lines. A thing Mo has done badly. Instead of three offensive lines only two. Also, maybe coaches are just figureheads if you get a Barzal or a Mathews you look great. Did Babcock or Trotsky do anything to get these players, no he didn't. If Laine was scoring like was 2 years ago, Pomo looks great. Players can't figure it out, coaches play musical chairs.

Who said "show me a Vezina winning goalie and I will show you a good coach"? Maybe a bit simplistic, but there is a lot of truth in that. Maurice is limited by his D corps this year.

I criticized his use of Bitetto over Niku. Then it turned out Niku wasn't fit to play. Then it was over Heinola. But Ville the kid was never going to get more than 9 games. They are rightly more concerned with his development that with him helping the Jets a bit this year. And truth is, Bitetto has not been as bad as I thought he would be. At least he didn't injure Laine. There, I've said it. That's twice today. Insert dead crow emoji.

 

[Jetfaninflorida]

That was a **** move by Gallant - there should be league discipline for a coach doing that.

Good on Lowry for standing up, even more so for winning the fight. I think it was a turning point.

But that said, that kind of fighting in hockey shouldn't exist. It isn't manly. It is childish.

The 'hit' wasn't something VGK should have been looking for revenge over. All Lowry did was brace himself for the impact. Tuch ran into him. It wasn't high. What was that SN a***ole talking about? Legal, clean, shoulder height, to the front.

If someone, a big guy on anotgher team, did that to Ehlers, I would do the same thing as a coach if one of the players on the ice didnt already do something. Even if there was no intent to injur like in this case, I am going to let you know that you better be careful around my smaller star players or you will have to answer. Call me whatever names you want.