WC: Team Finland 2022 roster talk

[mattihp]

In retrospect, registering 7 d-men at the start of the tournament was a mistake. Not one that destroys Finland's chances, but one that prevented our team from having the best possible lineup.

Of course, hindsight's 20/20, and we've no way of telling if the games so far would have brought the same results with a different lineup.

What difference would it have made? Do you think Jukka would have had the patience to wait longer for a player than this?

Jalonen teams go for consistency and getting the guys to play together as much as possible. I was shocked that there was more than one spot open for guys who went to the playoffs!

 

[FinPanda]

In retrospect, registering 7 d-men at the start of the tournament was a mistake. Not one that destroys Finland's chances, but one that prevented our team from having the best possible lineup.

Of course, hindsight's 20/20, and we've no way of telling if the games so far would have brought the same results with a different lineup.

I don't think it was a mistake, we have had a very good defence so far in the tournament because of it. Maybe that could've been a forward spot for someone overseas but who knows. We'll see how things go.

 

[FiLe]

What difference would it have made? Do you think Jukka would have had the patience to wait longer for a player than this?

Well, he wouldn't have had to wait any longer than this to have both Heiskanen, Lindell and an additional forward if he'd started the tournament with six d-men.

Also, even if what he did is completely consistent with his MO, it doesn't mean it can't be called a mistake regardless. Of course, it's one no one will remember if Finland takes gold. But if that doesn't happen... it leaves a "what if" to mull over.

I don't think it was a mistake, we have had a very good defence so far in the tournament because of it.

I did acknowledge this, didn't I? Whether we consider it a mistake or not, one thing we can't do is just assume the results of the games already played would have remained the same. But the winner is usually not the team that starts the best, but the one that improves the most towards the finish line. Further the tournament advances, the smaller the margins will get... and that early call may end up eating into those margins.

And I've no complaints about the calls Jalonen made before that or the calls he's made after. So it's more like splotch on an otherwise impeccable record.

 

[FinPanda]

Well, he wouldn't have had to wait any longer than this to have both Heiskanen, Lindell and an additional forward if he'd started the tournament with six d-men.

Also, even if what he did is completely consistent with his MO, it doesn't mean it can't be called a mistake regardless. Of course, it's one no one will remember if Finland takes gold. But if that doesn't happen... it leaves a "what if" to mull over.


I did acknowledge this, didn't I? Whether we consider it a mistake or not, one thing we can't do is just assume the results of the games already played would have remained the same. But the winner is usually not the team that starts the best, but the one that improves the most towards the finish line. Further the tournament advances, the smaller the margins will get... and that early call may end up eating into those margins.

And I've no complaints about the calls Jalonen made before that or the calls he's made after. So it's more like splotch on an otherwise impeccable record.

I seriously doubt one extra forward makes or breaks this team. The forward wouldn't have been Hintz anyway, so it is not like we left an amazing forward out of the tournament. Can argue with Haula but he is more like 3rd line center in the NHL who was playing top 6 because Boston was lacking a better center for the 2nd line.

I don't see us going back and thinking "why we didn't have Haula". He is not that gamebreaking talent. No matter if the tournament ends in the QF or not.

 

[FiLe]

I seriously doubt one extra forward makes or breaks this team.

You could try reading what I'm saying before commenting, you know. As I said: "Not one that destroys Finland's chances." I'm talking about maximizing the odds going forward. And in that sense, it may have been a mistake. And, for emphasis: Not a mistake that may end up preventing Finland from capturing the gold. But that doesn't make it a non-mistake.

 

[FinPanda]

You could try reading what I'm saying before commenting, you know. As I said: "Not one that destroys Finland's chances." I'm talking about maximizing the odds going forward. And in that sense, it may have been a mistake. And, for emphasis: Not a mistake that may end up preventing Finland from capturing the gold. But that doesn't make it a non-mistake.

I did read what you said. More like sometimes I forget parts or just skip and focus on the bigger picture which can be sometimes wrong. Sorry.

 

[Husqvarna]

Esa Lindell - my kinda guy that really can do the ... business.

 

[Eye of Ra]

So how many more can join the team? Any more NHLer to come that is realistic?

 

[FinPanda]

So how many more can join the team? Any more NHLer to come that is realistic?

With Heiskanen and Lindell the team is full. 13 F, 9 D and 3 G all registered.

 

[IceHockeyDude]

Both have been fine imo

Yeah perhaps a bit stupidly said by me. I just wanted to point out how big additions Heiskanen and Lindell are. The real difference comes from the ability to make just a little bit quicker decisions and more often than Vatanen and Lehtonen.

 

[Mestaruus]

He was exclusively a forward 'til the age of 20, and even debuted in (then SM-)Liiga as one. But then Juuso Nieminen, the TPS U20 coach at the time, was running a bit thin on d-men and converted him into one. (Fun fact: Partially because the big club decided to hog a bunch of them, amongst them such names as Mikko Lehtonen and Rasmus Ristolainen... So if his fellow Lion Lehtonen had been less talented, Friman could still be a forward.)

Oh interesting.

 

[FinPanda]

So if my math is correct, if Sweden or Czechs beat USA and the Czechs lose even one more point, we are 2nd in the group after winning GB and Austria no matter if we lose to the Czechs.

We would've lost 5 points, US 5/6 points and the Czechs 6/7 points.

 

[FiLe]

So if my math is correct, if Sweden or Czechs beat USA and the Czechs lose even one more point, we are 2nd in the group after winning GB and Austria no matter if we lose to the Czechs.

Yes. If we assume no more upsets happen, then a beneficial result for us would be SWE beating USA and USA beating CZE. Or, alternately, CZE-USA going to OT (no matter who wins after that) regardless of what happens with SWE-USA.

 

[karhukissa]

Heiskanen and Lindell are the ones this team needs right now. Sweden showed that our defensive game is weaker than usual, weird mistakes and bad marking etc.

Lindell brings that toughness and security, while Miro is just all around engine.

 

[Mestaruus]

So if my math is correct, if Sweden or Czechs beat USA and the Czechs lose even one more point, we are 2nd in the group after winning GB and Austria no matter if we lose to the Czechs.

We would've lost 5 points, US 5/6 points and the Czechs 6/7 points.

I just don't see Czech losing points before the Finland game. Their fail quota is filled for this tournament. I don't think that they keep sucking if you can even call it that. Austria has proved to be a lot better than expected this tournament against 3 top countries. It would be amazing if Czech would loose a point but I don't envision that.

Heiskanen and Lindell are the ones this team needs right now. Sweden showed that our defensive game is weaker than usual, weird mistakes and bad marking etc.

Lindell brings that toughness and security, while Miro is just all around engine.

Which D-man you would leave out of the line up?

 

[ijuka]

Heiskanen and Lindell are the ones this team needs right now. Sweden showed that our defensive game is weaker than usual, weird mistakes and bad marking etc.

Lindell brings that toughness and security, while Miro is just all around engine.

Finland's forwards were the main issue.

Defensemen also bad, of course.

Which D-man you would leave out of the line up?

Ohtamaa first and foremost.

 

[karhukissa]

I just don't see Czech losing points before the Finland game. Their fail quota is filled for this tournament. I don't think that they keep sucking if you can even call it that. Austria has proved to be a lot better than expected this tournament against 3 top countries. It would be amazing if Czech would loose a point but I don't envision that.



Which D-man you would leave out of the line up?

Probably Pokka, too many mistakes.

 

[karhukissa]

Finland's forwards were the main issue.

Defensemen also bad, of course.

Ohtamaa first and foremost.

Our forwards are able to score enough to win, it comes down to Jalonen thesis, defence comes first.

PP is amazing and 5 on 5 we're able to create enough. And we need 1 goal more than the opponent, hence it's vital to have 2 great d-men. Obviously if we could've gotten Hintz or Barkov etc. It would've been different story.

Sweden's forward core is poor and worse than ours which we saw today, but their d-men are very good. Which allows them to win any team.

 

[Mestaruus]

Probably Pokka, too many mistakes.

Long time duo broken then. I wonder if Jalonen would do such a thing. Olympic gold medalist D-man after all, but Seppälä has looked pretty decent. It could be Lindell there too if he isn't paired with Heiskanen as both Lindell and Heiskanen are both lefties.

 

[Mestaruus]

Okay I checked on the defensive pairings now. I didn't check them before the Sweden game. This was what we had when the Sweden game started. So Jalonen was already experimenting Seppälä with Ohtamaa here.

Mikko Lehtonen - Juuso Hietanen
Mikael Seppälä - Atte Ohtamaa
Niklas Friman - Sami Vatanen
Ville Pokka

This is an interesting one. If they would leave Pokka out we would have 2 righties and 6 lefties. Considering it's that many lefties, I guess it's just better to keep Lindell & Heiskanen as a pair. I don't think that Heiskanen plays that often as a pair with Lindell in Dallas, but sometimes he does, so it's best to keep it that way I guess regardless of them both being lefties.

For GBR game and Austria game it could continue to be some experimenting by Jalonen as they aren't top teams, so I'll only talk about the Czech game. My feeling is that it will be the old pair reunited, because of their history and success together.

For the Czech game it will be:

Lindell - Heiskanen
Lehtonen - Juuso Hietanen
Friman - Sami Vatanen
Pokka - Ohtamaa

Sadly Seppälä out despite of a pretty good tournament so far. Jalonen will trust on the guys who are more proven on high stakes situations on international level. We know how Jalonen loves to trust on experienced guys.

 

[FinPanda]

I just don't see Czech losing points before the Finland game. Their fail quota is filled for this tournament. I don't think that they keep sucking if you can even call it that. Austria has proved to be a lot better than expected this tournament against 3 top countries. It would be amazing if Czech would loose a point but I don't envision that.



Which D-man you would leave out of the line up?

I can easily see the Czechs losing a point against the imptoved US team.

 

[Esko6]

Which D-man you would leave out of the line up?

I guess Pokka and Friman are in danger.

 

[Zub]

I hope Heiskanen take's the opportunity and show's what he's capable of offensively, he's been abit too passive in the NHL of late.

 

[David OSullivan]

For me it should be Pokka or Friman too. Seppala deserves his spot but it could be him for reasons already said. I'm almost inderferrent between Pokka and Friman. Both a good players. It's just such is the quality of D this year. Maybe Pokka has enough in the bank here.

Man Heiskenen is going to be such a good watch. With his skating he is going to improve massively.

So for me Goalie, I'm favouring Olkinoura. Of course Sateri is a top goalie but I just got a sense about Olkinoura this tournament and feel he is on slightly better form.

Defense: I would go:
Lindell Heiskenen
Lehtonen Heitenen
Seppala Vatanen
Ohtamaa Pokka

The only thing for me that needs a little shake up is that third line. And I think Jalonen thinks the same. I would not do major thinkering but certainly I would put Pesonen back on line 2. What I would like to try personally is to put Sallinen at center. Inalla over Rajala.

Granlund Manninen Hartikanen
Pesonen Filppula Armia
Inalla Sallinen Lammikko
Maenelaenen Bjorninen Antilla

 

[FinPanda]

Heiskanen was paired with Seppälä at his practise. May mean Seppälä is the one who will not be playing after Lindell joins the practise.

I'm sad we lost to Sweden, but it stings way less due to the fact as a nation we are closer than maybe we have ever been. So we really are true brothers and sisters outside of hockey. Got to move on and lets hope for a good effort against GB.

I also absolutely hate the fact that the actual passionate hockey fans have no chance at seeing the games live. I remember how the whole environment was totally different at the WJC 2016 because the tickets prices were way lower. Shame they only care about the money and not the atmosphere. It looks like we are terrible hockey fans when we are not, its only because businesses buy all the tickets and most Finns can't affort them. No kids.. no fun.. just sitting in silence like in a church.

Its should be a party for families, have some great time together but no. I'm sad.