Player Discussion Stuart Skinner

[TheNumber4]

Its a high danger chance because its Skinner in net.


jk around. haha.

Yeah, sure, class it as high danger chance. I say scoring chance, tomato, tomatoe. But you were saying Triple AAA prime grade most dangerous type scoring chances... You're using hyperbole to upside the degree of challenge involved when both shots were imminently stoppable. Bouchard, a more dangerous shooter had two of his howitzer bar under shots stopped by the other goalie, a goalie playing his first NHL game and having to go up against the vaunted Oilers offense, fortunately something Skinner only see's in practice.

Rush chances have been well studied. Maybe you haven’t read up on them, but like I cited they are the most likely chances to go in, in this League. Rush chances are chances that happen within 5-7 seconds of zone entry by the way. You see these types of goals beat goalies all the time. It’s not hyperbole to say they are High Danger Chances, by mathematical definition they are. But sure some hyperbole with my Grade AAA lol. But I also noted shot location and the uncontested nature of defence quality in front of that rush chance to make that higher than high danger definition.

Oh before I watched the game I remember you citing that Villalta outplayed Skinner. And yet after watching the game I noticed he let in 2 posts plus a McDavid whiff on an empty net in the 1st. How you came away with the impression that he outplayed Skinner in a game where he let in a 5 plus those posts I don’t know, but it makes me think there’s a bias. It could have easily been a 7-3 type result.

 

[TheNumber4]

You realize that every team has breakdowns, its the nature of hockey to exploit. The Nucks play many of their games like a clownshow getting tons of luck while Demko holds the fort. The one rare night Demko isn't in the Minny Wild of all teams blow by 10 goals past the backup with the usual sorry ass Nuck defending. You seem to be expecting the Oilres to play flawless hockey every night so that Skinner can get some allstar votes. The same team that has seen Skinner blow multiple important games in playoffs and be the reason they lost a series.

Oilers went status quo in offseason keeping both Woody and Skinner as #1. I said at the time that was a mistake on both counts. Skinner would be fine as a backup, he isn't a good NHL starter. He's average.

That said Skinner appears to have worked hard on his game and on some of his more obvious deficits like puck handling or being too deep in cage but its a large body of work for him to get around the game we need him to be at come playoff time.

The trouble is in the West every team except LA that is in spots has better goaltending than we do. Thats an issue at a critical spot.

But I get your point. its the Oilers fault because they allow ANY scoring chances. If only the Oilers never allowed any scoring chances Skinner could have a 1GAA.

Remind me what the purpose of a goalie is when a scoring chance does occur.

I’m not saying no chances should not and will not happen. Knob hockey has been getting sloppy for awhile actually. In fact MANY chances and breakdowns happened near the tail end of the streak that Skinner held the Fort on and still came up with the saves and got us the Win. But of course there was zero acknowledgment there, that wouldn’t fit the pre-decided narrative. Just the other night during this slump for Skinner, McDavid cited Skinner holding us in it for the win when they shat the bed in the 2nd period. Even last night outside of the rush chances (again the most dangerous of chances), Skinner made many clutch in-zone saves when he had to. A onetimer in the slot was stopped with his shoulder/chest. An uncontested slapped from the side boards also stopped for the high dangers that I remember. The higher than high dangers which are the uncontested rush chances he did not stop though, he won’t get all of those, he does get some

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Saros is available

You'd have to make the cap work and the GM doesn't seem capable of that.

 

[Drivesaitl]

The one Bjugstad shot was from a dangerous area and got close in. But still, wasn't a breakaway, was a 2 on 1 which seems bad news for Skinner most times it happens. Bjugstad was telegraphing shot, and did in fact shoot. The pass was sealed off but somehow Skinner was still thinking pass.

The two other GA were questionable. on the 2nd Bjugstad goal big bird is jumping off the bench, on the wing, and hard to read those and Bjugstad is contained firing not from the slot, as somebody keeps mentioning but from exactly the faceoff circle. But because Skinner was beat clean on first shot he overcompenstates to short side and leafs half the net on far side open. Bjugstad easily finds that.

The other goal was a complete joke where Skinner doesn't read any of the play.

This was yet another subpar goalie performance by Skinner giving up even 3 goals to the hapless yotes.

The funny thing is Bjugstad hadn't scored for quite awhile. Not one in 10games. Skinner served again as slumpbuster.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

The one Bjugstad shot was from a dangerous area and got close in. But still, wasn't a breakaway, was a 2 on 1 which seems bad news for Skinner most times it happens. Bjugstad was telegraphing shot, and did in fact shoot. The pass was sealed off but somehow Skinner was still thinking pass.

The two other GA were questionable. on the 2nd Bjugstad goal big bird is jumping off the bench, on the wing, and hard to read those and Bjugstad is contained firing not from the slot, as somebody keeps mentioning but from exactly the faceoff circle. But because Skinner was beat clean on first shot he overcompenstates to short side and leafs half the net on far side open. Bjugstad easily finds that.

The other goal was a complete joke where Skinner doesn't read any of the play.

This was yet another subpar goalie performance by Skinner giving up even 3 goals to the hapless yotes.

By this measure the Avalanche are in serious trouble.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I’m not saying no chances should not and will not happen. Knob hockey has been getting sloppy for awhile actually. In fact MANY chances and breakdowns happened near the tail end of the streak that Skinner held the Fort on and still came up with the saves and got us the Win. But of course there was zero acknowledgment there, that wouldn’t fit the pre-decided narrative. Just the other night during this slump for Skinner, McDavid cited Skinner holding us in it for the win when they shat the bed in the 2nd period. Even last night outside of the rush chances (again the most dangerous of chances), Skinner made many clutch in-zone saves when he had to. A onetimer in the slot was stopped with his shoulder/chest. An uncontested slapped from the side boards also stopped for the high dangers that I remember. The higher than high dangers which are the uncontested rush chances he did not stop though, he won’t get all of those, he does get some

This is a fair post. A better post. I get this.

But still. You call this a great goalie and alledge that all the stats back up that claim and yet the backup is running slightly better stats than Skinner in any stat you want to look at. Conversely in other places like Vancouver Demko has a signficant edge in stats over the back up. Like as if they're not even playing on the same club. Demko is stoning opponents. Nucks give up tons of chances, always have, and he's sporting a 2.45 record.

 

[Canovin]

This is a fair post. A better post. I get this.

But still. You call this a great goalie and alledge that all the stats back up that claim and yet the backup is running slightly better stats than Skinner in any stat you want to look at. Conversely in other places like Vancouver Demko has a signficant edge in stats over the back up. Like as if they're not even playing on the same club. Demko is stoning opponents. Nucks give up tons of chances, always have, and he's sporting a 2.45 record.

I agree with this. Skinner is putting up the same stats as our backup Pickard behind the same defense and system. Hard to get excited

 

[TheNumber4]

The one Bjugstad shot was from a dangerous area and got close in. But still, wasn't a breakaway, was a 2 on 1 which seems bad news for Skinner most times it happens. Bjugstad was telegraphing shot, and did in fact shoot. The pass was sealed off but somehow Skinner was still thinking pass.

The two other GA were questionable. on the 2nd Bjugstad goal big bird is jumping off the bench, on the wing, and hard to read those and Bjugstad is contained firing not from the slot, as somebody keeps mentioning but from exactly the faceoff circle. But because Skinner was beat clean on first shot he overcompenstates to short side and leafs half the net on far side open. Bjugstad easily finds that.

The other goal was a complete joke where Skinner doesn't read any of the play.

This was yet another subpar goalie performance by Skinner giving up even 3 goals to the hapless yotes.

Rush chances still which have the highest probability to go in. Which again, don’t happen with proper defence.

You say “telegraphed” shot as if it should have been an easy save. But it’s a shot from 10 feet out in prime scoring area slot from an on-rushing and speedy entry. Those are not easy shots to stop by any definition, the shot location and velocity of entry alone reduces reaction time. And no coach in their right mind would blame a goalie for that goal 2on1 turned quasi-breakaway goal.

You also say he gave up the top of the net and didn’t read the shot, and yet the shot actually hits Skinner in the colloarbone area and banks off the side of his mask LOL. So there goes your didn’t cover the top of the net narrative.

The 2nd Bjugstad goal again, was a rush chance created by a defensive lapse. By definition a high danger. But the shot location makes it less dangerous than the first, but Bjustad also lasered that one exactly where he wanted unconstested. I would be more willing to “blame” Skinner on this one, but still wouldn’t cause the blame goes squarely to the bad line change that created the chance in the first place.

On and the other goal was a PK goal, off rapid multi pass one timer while Skinner was screened. How is that a “joke”? It’s on the PK, it’s a one timer with two passes that were allowed to happen by the defence, and there’s a screen cause that’s what happens when your a man down.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

By this measure the Avalanche are in serious trouble.

I think the Avs are going to address their goaltending.

 

[TheNumber4]

This is a fair post. A better post. I get this.

But still. You call this a great goalie and alledge that all the stats back up that claim and yet the backup is running slightly better stats than Skinner in any stat you want to look at. Conversely in other places like Vancouver Demko has a signficant edge in stats over the back up. Like as if they're not even playing on the same club. Demko is stoning opponents. Nucks give up tons of chances, always have, and he's sporting a 2.45 record.

I’ve always defined Skinner as a good enough goalie that’s been great at times with the potential to be better. By the way, in the past you had said or implied that he had no potential to be better which I now see you’ve walked back. For a long stretch he was a great goalie though and this is proven out by the numbers. The gaudy numbers during what a 20-30 game stretch, don’t just happen out of nowhere. He was literally the best in the league when our defence was at a level that Vegas, Jets, Boston are able to replicate nearly ALL the time. In that sense, yes I do believe that as our team continues to master the Knob defence and do it a consistent level that he will be good enough and even great at times. This does not mean I think he’s the best goalie in the league, he doesn’t have a long enough history of that performance to make anywhere close to that call nor have I.

 

[guymez]

I’ve always defined Skinner as a good enough goalie that’s been great at times with the potential to be better. By the way, in the past you had said or implied that he had no potential to be better which I now see you’ve walked back. For a long stretch he was a great goalie though and this is proven out by the numbers. The gaudy numbers during what a 20-30 game stretch, don’t just happen out of nowhere. He was literally the best in the league when our defence was at a level that Vegas, Jets, Boston are able to replicate nearly ALL the time. In that sense, yes I do believe that as our team continues to master the Knob defence and do it a consistent level that he will be good enough and even great at times. This does not mean I think he’s the best goalie in the league, he doesn’t have a long enough history of that performance to make anywhere close to that call nor have I.

Good post.
Something to consider as well is that this is Skinners 2nd year as a starter in the NHL. Thats an important detail that tends to get overlooked.

Skinner hasnt yet learned how to manage 60+ games and that is my major concern with him.
If Knoblauch over plays Skinner down this very condensed stretch of games then I think this team is in trouble in the playoffs.
All of the above is why I am in the camp of bringing in a Vet 1B goalie. Someone that has a ton of NHL experience to help mentor Skinner and also take the amount of starts worthy of a 1B goalie.
Someone that can take over in the playoffs if necessary.
IMO that player isnt Pickard.

 

[TheNumber4]

By this measure the Avalanche are in serious trouble.

And every other team the Yotes put up an egregious THREE goals on.

Oh look they torched Helly for 3 this year too. Oh and Vasy. Oh and Oettinger too. Oh and Ullmark. Oh and Binnington for 5. Oh and Saros for 6.

 

[TheNumber4]

Good post.
Something to consider as well is that this is Skinners 2nd year as a starter in the NHL. Thats an important detail that tends to get overlooked.

Skinner hasnt yet learned how to manage 60+ games and that is my major concern with him.
If Knoblauch over plays Skinner down this very condensed stretch of games then I think this team is in trouble in the playoffs.
All of the above is why I am in the camp of bringing in a Vet 1B goalie. Someone that has a ton of NHL experience to help mentor Skinner and also take the amount of starts worthy of a 1B goalie.
Someone that can take over in the playoffs if necessary.
IMO that player isnt Pickard.

It’s true lack of experience which is no fault of his own needs to be considered. That said the lack of experience didn’t stop Francouz or Hill from backstopping their teams to the Cup. Goalies are voodoo, sometimes you just don’t know despite your best estimations.

A 1B to Skinner would be nice though, take the load off, potentially help with some mental training. But that’s really a conversation for the trades thread where it’s been well borne out what options are even available, and that hasn’t come up with much options. We also need to consider the overall strengths / weaknesses of the team to make that call, there’s only so much you can add at the TDL.

 

[guymez]

It’s true lack of experience which is no fault of his own needs to be considered. That said the lack of experience didn’t stop Francouz or Hill from backstopping their teams to the Cup. Goalies are voodoo, sometimes you just don’t know despite your best estimations.

I agree but those teams had a lot more defensive stability in terms of the system. For a goalie (especially a young goalie) knowing and relying on the right coverage decisions being made that vast majority of the time makes a massive difference. Prior to Knoblauch this team would go from being reliable defensively to a literal shit show defensively.
Its been better under Knoblauch but this team (unlike Vegas) is not built to play a tight defensive system so relapses are more likley to happen.

A 1B to Skinner would be nice though, take the load off, potentially help with some mental training. But that’s really a conversation for the trades thread where it’s been well borne out what options are even available, and that hasn’t come up with much options. We also need to consider the overall strengths / weaknesses of the team to make that call, there’s only so much you can add at the TDL.

For sure.
Holland/Jackson has to be creative in the remaining weeks. This team needs upgrades at forward, on D and in net.
Figuring out a way to move Campbell has to be part of the solution IMO.
That opens the dorr to making the necessary upgrades.

 

[Drivesaitl]

It’s true lack of experience which is no fault of his own needs to be considered. That said the lack of experience didn’t stop Francouz or Hill from backstopping their teams to the Cup. Goalies are voodoo, sometimes you just don’t know despite your best estimations.

A 1B to Skinner would be nice though, take the load off, potentially help with some mental training. But that’s really a conversation for the trades thread where it’s been well borne out what options are even available, and that hasn’t come up with much options. We also need to consider the overall strengths / weaknesses of the team to make that call, there’s only so much you can add at the TDL.

As much as goalies can be voodoo I was on record in the playoffs that Vegas SHOULD be using Adin Hill instead of Brossoit. That was clear as day and I'd seen both goalies and Hill to me was a far better choice. Again thats before Hill got in, and those posts were made here.

But it should give you pause for effect that Skinner was on the wrong end of that exchange and that he and the Oilers got goalied. The Oilers had the edge in play in the series and deserved to win most of the games. Still, they lost, and Skinner fared worst than Hill who you are mentioning.

Its great I guess to think Skinner is a hill. They are goalies, and similar in size, there are few other comparisons in the way that they play.

In anycase the Oilers are loaded with talent. They should be a sure bet to go far in playoffs. But I have one doubt. I see one critical position that the org hasn't filled. Skinner is only in the net, lets remember because the org has been a gongshow when it comes to assessing and bringing in good goalies. Skinner is exceedingly fortunate to be on one org that has been so woeful in goalie accrual that Skinner is himself the defacto starter. But Skinner has been 2nd to any goalie he's faced in playoffs and even Korpisalo. There has been no series Skinner has been in yet where it could be said he's the better goalie. This becomes the Oilers problem as they face potentially guys like Hill, Ott, Demko, Hellebuck, Binnington etc. The only team that doesn't have better goaltending is the LA Kings.

I don't know why an org, other than afterthought, and poor planning would find themselves in this same situation so many years. Indeed the whole McDrai canon, we haven't had commensurate goaltending. Its a shame.

 

[TheNumber4]

I agree but those teams had a lot more defensive stability in terms of the system. For a goalie (especially a young goalie) knowing and relying on the right coverage decisions being made that vast majority of the time makes a massive difference. Prior to Knoblauch this team would go from being reliable defensively to a literal shit show defensively.
Its been better under Knoblauch but this team (unlike Vegas) is not built to play a tight defensive system so relapses are more likley to happen.

For sure.
Holland/Jackson has to be creative in the remaining weeks. This team needs upgrades at forward, on D and in net.
Figuring out a way to move Campbell has to be part of the solution IMO.
That opens the dorr to making the necessary upgrades.

True. Those teams did have a better defensive system than the Oilers have had. Specifically Cassidy, who himself is a master of zone defence that brought honed his system in Boston then exported it to Vegas. Vegas has their defence more figured out and consistent than the Oilers at this point. And their personnel bottom 6 and overall D core may be better suited to that game. That said, Knob has been running zone defence since before it was cool. He may not have a the NHL experience but he’s been running this system since his UofA days. So i am optimistic about his abilities to teach it and we’ve already seen some amazing results which prove this out. Our personnel, like I’ve said does need to be improved though. And overall the mentality of the team in committing to this team defence system still needs work. Hopefully we can get that going before the playoffs, I’m optimistic.

Mathematically, we can do the 2RW, 4RD, and 4C without Campbell out or very close to. Would need Ceci out to do all 3 though. But if Campbell is going out we may not have the assets left to spend to get those other additions. Since dumping Campbell is going to be a 1st++ type deal.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I’ve always defined Skinner as a good enough goalie that’s been great at times with the potential to be better. By the way, in the past you had said or implied that he had no potential to be better which I now see you’ve walked back. For a long stretch he was a great goalie though and this is proven out by the numbers. The gaudy numbers during what a 20-30 game stretch, don’t just happen out of nowhere. He was literally the best in the league when our defence was at a level that Vegas, Jets, Boston are able to replicate nearly ALL the time. In that sense, yes I do believe that as our team continues to master the Knob defence and do it a consistent level that he will be good enough and even great at times. This does not mean I think he’s the best goalie in the league, he doesn’t have a long enough history of that performance to make anywhere close to that call nor have I.

Specifically Skinner is a lot better than he used to be at handling puck. That said the former Skinner was terrible at it. During the string Skinner was doing a better job of sealing high shots and coming out more to prevent those bar under shots being open. (but he's lapsed in this area again lately) He seems to have worked on blocker and glove hand and having some more success there albeit without controlling puck. Skinner for some reason has difficulty still gloving pucks. Its more the case he blocks shots with his glove. (he's not the only one, sometimes I question todays equipment)

Skinner is also doing a much better job at pads across. Vasi has so much success because in his set position his pads are stacked pretty much from one post to the other. Skinner formerly was in a V pads spread instead of a wider T section type spread. I suspect because he lacks the stretching ability to do full pads across in butterfly. Thats unfortunate, but still he's seemingly working on it but I don't think hes ever going to pull off a perfect butterfly from, which is too bad because his height and leg length and pad length he should be able to do better with that.

Skinner still needs to work on conditioning I feel. Either he gets tired on ice or fatigued or its too many starts but he adopts standing straight up positions with puck in ownzone. This is lazy, and can be exploited as its not set form. I suspect hes' straightening out because his back gets sore (or he's lazy) its bad form to do it. Watch him do it. Goalies more typically stand straight up in repose when puck is not in own zone. It scares me Skinner does it with puck in his zone.

Finally, Skinner, and I'm not privy to all his body of work (excuse pun) but only that which he's stated and that I see) Is Skinner is the first person to state he didn't work seriously on athletics. that he somehow figured it wasn't important until he started hearing he could be a drafted goalie. This sets in with Skinners pregame work which is limited, hardly a warm up and you see other goalies doing intense cuts in ice, doing back and forth, going through their stretches, drills. Then you look across and Skinner is hitting posts with his stick like thats his pregame. You watch goalies around the league and Skinner pregame looks lethargic as it gets. The most he does is when he bumps the goal posts. He's not working on edges, doing splits, working on moves across. he's doing very little pregame. Whats that about?

After a pregame like Carolina where Skinner was laughed at by the canes as he loses his edges maybe he doesn't want to do as much anymore. The Canes picked him apart in the game.

 

[guymez]

True. Those teams did have a better defensive system than the Oilers have had. Specifically Cassidy, who himself is a master of zone defence that brought honed his system in Boston then exported it to Vegas. Vegas has their defence more figured out and consistent than the Oilers at this point. And their personnel bottom 6 and overall D core may be better suited to that game. That said, Knob has been running zone defence since before it was cool. He may not have a the NHL experience but he’s been running this system since his UofA days. So i am optimistic about his abilities to teach it and we’ve already seen some amazing results which prove this out. Our personnel, like I’ve said does need to be improved though. And overall the mentality of the team in committing to this team defence system still needs work. Hopefully we can get that going before the playoffs, I’m optimistic.

I agree and im optimistic as well.
I am a huge fan of Knoblauch and I think that he is a near perfect fit for what this team is trying to acheive.

Mathematically, we can do the 2RW, 4RD, and 4C without Campbell out or very close to. Would need Ceci out to do all 3 though. But if Campbell is going out we may not have the assets left to spend to get those other additions. Since dumping Campbell is going to be a 1st++ type deal.

I am on board for the Ceci out Tanev in scenario.
In terms of Campbell you will proabaly have to use deferred assets.

 

[TheNumber4]

As much as goalies can be voodoo I was on record in the playoffs that Vegas SHOULD be using Adin Hill instead of Brossoit. That was clear as day and I'd seen both goalies and Hill to me was a far better choice. Again thats before Hill got in, and those posts were made here.

But it should give you pause for effect that Skinner was on the wrong end of that exchange and that he and the Oilers got goalied. The Oilers had the edge in play in the series and deserved to win most of the games. Still, they lost, and Skinner fared worst than Hill who you are mentioning.

Its great I guess to think Skinner is a hill. They are goalies, and similar in size, there are few other comparisons in the way that they play.

In anycase the Oilers are loaded with talent. They should be a sure bet to go far in playoffs. But I have one doubt. I see one critical position that the org hasn't filled. Skinner is only in the net, lets remember because the org has been a gongshow when it comes to assessing and bringing in good goalies. Skinner is exceedingly fortunate to be on one org that has been so woeful in goalie accrual that Skinner is himself the defacto starter. But Skinner has been 2nd to any goalie he's faced in playoffs and even Korpisalo. There has been no series Skinner has been in yet where it could be said he's the better goalie. This becomes the Oilers problem as they face potentially guys like Hill, Ott, Demko, Hellebuck, Binnington etc. The only team that doesn't have better goaltending is the LA Kings.

I don't know why an org, other than afterthought, and poor planning would find themselves in this same situation so many years. Indeed the whole McDrai canon, we haven't had commensurate goaltending. Its a shame.

Well you say we got goalied in that series based on overall controlling of play. I don’t think that’s how you make that assessment. Our offensive juggernaut nature can have us control play and possession and even shot shares, but It’s the egregious breakdowns that lead to goals against in most games and most series. Multiple times in that series players left wide open at net front cause Woody has us chasing guys like Eichel around like a bunch of chickens with our heads cut off. Multiple times we gave the puck away in our own zone. Multiple times we missed assignments on the back check. Go back and review the goals against and instead of tunnel visioning on Skinner for not making a miraculous save on a grade A chance given up, focus on why that grade A chance was given up in the first place.

We went 6 games against the Knights with a shoddy system and even shoddier team defence focus, that’s now been night and day improved, it’s not like we were blown out of it cause Hill>Skinner, it was more so Cassidy>Woody. And we were even blown out, It was close. And now that Shoddy system has been replaced and it’s lead to an elite performing Skinner that created a 16 game historic win streak. So I’m optimistic about our chances as long as Knob defence holds on the same level as the best teams in this League.

 

[guymez]

Well you say we got goalied in that series based on overall controlling of play. I don’t think that’s how you make that assessment. Our offensive juggernaut nature can have us control play and possession and even shot shares, but It’s the egregious breakdowns that lead to goals against in most games and most series. Multiple times in that series players left wide open at net front cause Woody has us chasing guys like Eichel around like a bunch of chickens with our heads cut off. Multiple times we gave the puck away in our own zone. Multiple times we missed assignments on the back check. Go back and review the goals against and instead of tunnel visioning on Skinner for not making a miraculous save on a grade A chance given up, focus on why that grade A chance was given up in the first place.

We went 6 games against the Knights with a shoddy system and even shoddier team defence focus, that’s now been night and day improved, it’s not like we were blown out of it cause Hill>Skinner, it was more so Cassidy>Woody. And we were even blown out, It was close. And now that Shoddy system has been replaced and it’s lead to an elite performing Skinner that created a 16 game historic win streak. So I’m optimistic about our chances as long as Knob defence holds on the same level as the best teams in this League.

100%
The image of Nurse chasing that Knights player from in front of the net out to the blueline is tough to forget. I have to think that it was a major misread on Nurses part (who tends to wander in his coverage) but a system that plays a part time man to man utilizing dmen is going to be exposed by a smart coach.
That to me encapsulated exactly why this team lost to vegas.

Cassidy absolutely schooled Woody in that series. The only reason why that series went 6 games was due to the top end talent on this team.

 

[TheNumber4]

Specifically Skinner is a lot better than he used to be at handling puck. That said the former Skinner was terrible at it. During the string Skinner was doing a better job of sealing high shots and coming out more to prevent those bar under shots being open. (but he's lapsed in this area again lately) He seems to have worked on blocker and glove hand and having some more success there albeit without controlling puck. Skinner for some reason has difficulty still gloving pucks. Its more the case he blocks shots with his glove. (he's not the only one, sometimes I question todays equipment)

Skinner is also doing a much better job at pads across. Vasi has so much success because in his set position his pads are stacked pretty much from one post to the other. Skinner formerly was in a V pads spread instead of a wider T section type spread. I suspect because he lacks the stretching ability to do full pads across in butterfly. Thats unfortunate, but still he's seemingly working on it but I don't think hes ever going to pull off a perfect butterfly from, which is too bad because his height and leg length and pad length he should be able to do better with that.

Skinner still needs to work on conditioning I feel. Either he gets tired on ice or fatigued or its too many starts but he adopts standing straight up positions with puck in ownzone. This is lazy, and can be exploited as its not set form. I suspect hes' straightening out because his back gets sore (or he's lazy) its bad form to do it. Watch him do it. Goalies more typically stand straight up in repose when puck is not in own zone. It scares me Skinner does it with puck in his zone.

Finally, Skinner, and I'm not privy to all his body of work (excuse pun) but only that which he's stated and that I see) Is Skinner is the first person to state he didn't work seriously on athletics. that he somehow figured it wasn't important until he started hearing he could be a drafted goalie. This sets in with Skinners pregame work which is limited, hardly a warm up and you see other goalies doing intense cuts in ice, doing back and forth, going through their stretches, drills. Then you look across and Skinner is hitting posts with his stick like thats his pregame. You watch goalies around the league and Skinner pregame looks lethargic as it gets. The most he does is when he bumps the goal posts. He's not working on edges, doing splits, working on moves across. he's doing very little pregame. Whats that about?

After a pregame like Carolina where Skinner was laughed at by the canes as he loses his edges maybe he doesn't want to do as much anymore. The Canes picked him apart in the game.

We atleast according to your eye he’s improved now. Something you doubted he had the ability to do before. I don’t disagree with a lot of your breakdown though, stamina is a concern. And yeh there were moments to doubt his puck handling in the past off some specific plays, but that hasn’t shown up lately, we talked about this before. I always thought Skinner challenged shots positionally well though, not something new in his game. And his lateral movement has also been discussed in the past.

100%
The image of Nurse chasing that Knights player from in front of the net out to the blueline is tough to forget. I have to think that it was a bit of a misread on Nurses (who tends to wander in his coverage) part but a system that plays a part time man to man utilizing dmen is going to be exposed by a smart coach.
That to me encapsulated exactly why this team lost to vegas.

Cassidy absolutely schooled Woody in that series. The only reason why that series went 6 games was due to the top end talent on this team.

Yeh and Ceci was a huge victim of that later on in the series too, which means it must have been systemic. I view it was as a clear indictment of Woodys man on man system. And a key reason why his system failed the team and Skinner.

 

[elmeroil]

The only way the Oilers are winning a cup with Stu in net is if they play that all in defensive system they played during the streak. Stu does not have the stamina to face high quality chances for 4 rounds in the playoffs. He doesn't steal you many games, Roloson and Cujo flat out stole games.

 

[GOilers88]

This is a fair post. A better post. I get this.

But still. You call this a great goalie and alledge that all the stats back up that claim and yet the backup is running slightly better stats than Skinner in any stat you want to look at. Conversely in other places like Vancouver Demko has a signficant edge in stats over the back up. Like as if they're not even playing on the same club. Demko is stoning opponents. Nucks give up tons of chances, always have, and he's sporting a 2.45 record.

Pickard has played 10 games. Skinner has played 39.

Desmith has also played almost twice the amount of games as Pickard at 17.

This needs to be considered when comparing stats like this, imo.

 

[HockeyGuy1964]

I'm not ignoring the streak. I'm saying that he's inconsistent and outside of that streak he's been terrible. Great he had a sensational 12 games where the team was barely giving up a chance a game. The rest of the season he's been bad. Including his last handful of starts.

You have no credibility writing nonsense like this. Every goaltending & defensive metric says you're 100% totally out to lunch saying that.
I'll say his last couple starts have not been great but get real with that hot take.

 

[PULSATING]

The Oilers lost to the Knights because they completely exploited our defensive structure. Maybe some HHOF tender could’ve bridged the gap but they got out-coached and outmatched (Ceci in particular).

I too wish we had The Dominator in net but I think we have bigger holes than Skinner rn.