Pre-Game Talk: Stanley Cup Final: New York Rangers vs. Los Angeles Kings

[Tundra]

And what about if we neutralized their powerplay, which in my estimation is much more of an obtainable and doable goal than suppressing a player's speed.

They have 2 options:

1) Stack up the neutral zone, like they usually do, and force a dump and chase game... which will benefit the Rangers because they'll dump pucks in and retrieve them because of their speed.
2) Keep their defenders farther back to limit odd man rushes and get to dumped in pucks faster, which will open up the center of the ice for the Rangers to enter the zone with their transition game... again another strength of the Rangers.

We are not a good match up for this team. Especially not a good match up for them when they've played the most games possible for any team in the playoffs. They'll be playing chase for the majority of the time. Have fun with that.

I think you're going to be shocked when you see how well coached the kings are at creating interference on incoming fore-checkers and getting away it. And they are also will bend the rules a bit in the corners. If they don't call the game tight, the rangers will be at a disadvantage.

 

[Fitzy]

If we get a forward injured or suspended, Carcillo is a nice option to have.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Call me biased, whatever, I sincerely doubt DD really wanted to give the kid a snowshower there. I think the goal was to spray the Canadiens coming onto the ice, and the kid skated there. Wrong place, wrong time. Dumb on DD, but to judge his character from that, not me, because I don't think he skated there and was like, "I'm gonna snow shower the **** out of this kid". Who would do that?

I think you overrate Carcillo's skills, and underrate Dorsett's. DD was killing penalties before Nash came in and showed he could do that. DD broke his leg killing a penalty.

You defend Carcillo in the heat of the moment, and theneven mention the linesman situation (which I have my own problems with that do not stem from Carcillo, but the linseman himself) and just blow it off by saying "he should have handled it better". If his appeal doesn't get accepted by the league, Carcillo might be out of the NHL. Meanwhile, if the Rangers don't re-sign him, Dorsett will be on to another organization to be a quite effective PKer and fourth-liner.

EDIT - Posted before I saw Carcillo's suspension reduced. Very good news for him and NYR.

It doesn't matter to me if Dorsett did it intentionally. It supplied motivational ammunition to some extent to that Habs team for that game. The head butt could have got him suspended in a time when the Rangers had lost Carcillo and Miller. That's stupidity. I speak nothing of his intentions, he could be a kind hearted man.

He's constantly behind on the play because he goes in for a kamikaze kill hit and ends up falling down. He can't locate the net with a shot. He can't locate a player with a pass. He can't win a fight. He takes stupid and untimely penalties. He provides emotional ammunition against our team.

I'm done with him for much more than "taking 1 stupid penalty". Glad that Carcillo's suspension is reduced. We can use him in the event of an injury. LA was his former team.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

I think you're going to be shocked when you see how well coached the kings are at creating interference on incoming fore-checkers and getting away it. And they are also will bend the rules a bit in the corners. If they don't call the game tight, the rangers will be at a disadvantage.

Habs interfered with us nearly the entire series to slow us down. Did very little for them.

 

[silverfish]

It doesn't matter to me if Dorsett did it intentionally. It supplied motivational ammunition to some extent to that Habs team for that game. The head butt could have got him suspended in a time when the Rangers had lost Carcillo and Miller. That's stupidity. I speak nothing of his intentions, he could be a kind hearted man.

He's constantly behind on the play because he goes in for a kamikaze kill hit and ends up falling down. He can't locate the net with a shot. He can't locate a player with a pass. He can't win a fight. He takes stupid and untimely penalties. He provides emotional ammunition against our team.

I'm done with him for much more than "taking 1 stupid penalty". Glad that Carcillo's suspension is reduced. We can use him in the event of an injury. LA was his former team.

The hate you have for Dorsett is undeniable. And that's okay, everyone has their opinion. I will agree to disagree, and move on.

 

[Tundra]

Habs interfered with us nearly the entire series to slow us down. Did very little for them.

But that was the habs. Greene and Mitchell especially are savvy vets who know how to bend the rules. And all the kings centers are built solidly and possess strong sticks. The kings are literally the antithesis of the habs, aside from Subban and Price.

 

[KingP]

Feel so confident after listening to AV's interviews

 

[Fugazy]

Took the NHL long enough to make the damn decision.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

The hate you have for Dorsett is undeniable. And that's okay, everyone has their opinion. I will agree to disagree, and move on.

Hatred is an awfully strong word. I have dislike for Dorsett. I start off giving any and every player a fair shake when they become a part of the team. Rooting for Carcillo was hard after he fought Gaborik because he knew he'd win and crush him. That's like the bully in HS fighting the kid who stayed at home and studied physics 5 nights a week. Fair match up? No.

I remember the comments about Dorsett coming to us from the trade. That he'd leave it all on the ice for us. That he'd fight the biggest guy on the opposing team to get justice or revenge or whatnot.

I was excited. Losing Prust hurt in that regard and I was hoping Dorsett could provide something similar.

He didn't stick up for our team mates in the beginning of the year. After about the 5 game mark he was done fighting. We'd be creamed and there would be no retaliation. At one point, I remember a player from an opposing team saying something after delivering a dirty hit like "what are you going to do about it?". The team's image league wide was one of passiveness and an inability to stick up for each other.

Dorsett got hurt and the outlook looked worse. We traded for Carcillo, and I doubted he could help. And it was hard for me to even think that I could root for him because of his time with Philly.

And then we played that game against Philly several days after he was traded to us, and he energized the entire team. That's right around the time that the Rangers started ramping it up, too. They started fighting for each other. I will not attribute all or even most of that to Carcillo, but he did the role that Dorsett was supposed to supply earlier in the season.

Carcillo continued playing well and when Dorsett was ready to return he still was not on my **** list. In fact, I didn't care which one of them played. Seemed like an even swap to me. I don't know how to look at my past posts from several months ago but you can see that I have no reservations about playing Dorsett over Carcillo.

My opinion on him has changed, as my opinion on Rick Nash has changed. I don't have hatred, I just don't like what he brings to the table any longer. I have many reasons for this and I don't think it's unjustified, either. If we were to compare the two, I would hands down pick Carcillo being the better and smarter player.

 

[Inferno]

Exactly. You've got Matthew Barnaby claiming the Rangers haven't faced a center like Kopitar. What the hell were Crosby, Malkin and Giroux. I heard David Pagnotta of TFP claiming that the Kings depth allowed Sutter to roll three forward lines. How does that make any sense? The pundits keep talking about the Kings depth at forward. Meanwhile, AV has been able to evenly spread out his ice time among both the forwards and D. And no one has made mention that the Rangers have been the best 5-on-5 team throughout the playoffs, and not had to generate scoring on the PP. And, the PK ranks 2nd overall in the playoffs, bested only by the Flyers who had the luxury of facing Rangers during their historic drought. The PK shut down both the Pens and Habs, teams whose PP helped to victory in the previous rounds. I understand why LA is favored. Anybody who thinks it will be a cakewalk is fooling themselves.

pretty much my take on this as well.

 

[mandiblesofdoom]

I think you're going to be shocked when you see how well coached the kings are at creating interference on incoming fore-checkers and getting away it. And they are also will bend the rules a bit in the corners. If they don't call the game tight, the rangers will be at a disadvantage.

Good point - there was a lot of interference in Game 7 by LA.

 

[AHB*]

But that was the habs. Greene and Mitchell especially are savvy vets who know how to bend the rules. And all the kings centers are built solidly and possess strong sticks. The kings are literally the antithesis of the habs, aside from Subban and Price.

Greene is slower then Emelin.

 

[TheTakedown]

I think you're going to be shocked when you see how well coached the kings are at creating interference on incoming fore-checkers and getting away it. And they are also will bend the rules a bit in the corners. If they don't call the game tight, the rangers will be at a disadvantage.

TUndra, have you EVER watched the Penguins? They are the GODS of interference and hooking...

 

[Inferno]

Both teams have a lot of depth up front, there is no doubt about that, but I think it is fair to say that the Kings' depth is more skilled than the Rangers depth, if that makes sense, not that the Rangers' depth is bad.

id say that is true...in the playoffs. its not been true in a much larger sample size..the regular season.

how much of their so called skill depths offensive production was horrendous goaltending and how much of it was their actual skill level?

just ignore, for a minute, the results of the playoffs thus far for BOTH teams.

just look at the names...

Nash, St. Louis, Richards, Kreider, Stepan, Hagelin, Brassard, Zucc, McD, Staal, Girardi, Lundqvist.

How many Olympians are there? How many WC players are there? How many Former All-Stars are there?

There's a reason we are where we are. I really think the Kings talent level is seriously overblown.

YES, they ARE an elite team.

They are NOT the Edmonton Oilers with TGO and Messier. They aren't the Bossy Islanders.

Theyre a beatable team that causes us matchup problems...we're also a beatable team that causes THEM matchup problems.

Its the ultimate Size VS Speed matchup. Should be fun.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Greene is slower then Emelin.

NHL mandates him to use nitrous boosters on his skates. So, you're clearly wrong.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

id say that is true...in the playoffs. its not been true in a much larger sample size..the regular season.

how much of their so called skill depths offensive production was horrendous goaltending and how much of it was their actual skill level?

just ignore, for a minute, the results of the playoffs thus far for BOTH teams.

just look at the names...

Nash, St. Louis, Richards, Kreider, Stepan, Hagelin, Brassard, Zucc, McD, Staal, Girardi, Lundqvist.

How many Olympians are there? How many WC players are there? How many Former All-Stars are there?

There's a reason we are where we are. I really think the Kings talent level is seriously overblown.

YES, they ARE an elite team.

They are NOT the Edmonton Oilers with TGO and Messier. They aren't the Bossy Islanders.

Theyre a beatable team that causes us matchup problems...we're also a beatable team that causes THEM matchup problems.

Its the ultimate Size VS Speed matchup. Should be fun.

I completely agree with this assessment. I don't think it'll be easy, but I don't think we should clear underdogs, either.

And the longer the series goes for them the harder it will be for them to beat us.

 

[Xref]

id say that is true...in the playoffs. its not been true in a much larger sample size..the regular season.

how much of their so called skill depths offensive production was horrendous goaltending and how much of it was their actual skill level?

just ignore, for a minute, the results of the playoffs thus far for BOTH teams.

just look at the names...

Nash, St. Louis, Richards, Kreider, Stepan, Hagelin, Brassard, Zucc, McD, Staal, Girardi, Lundqvist.

How many Olympians are there? How many WC players are there? How many Former All-Stars are there?

There's a reason we are where we are. I really think the Kings talent level is seriously overblown.

YES, they ARE an elite team.

They are NOT the Edmonton Oilers with TGO and Messier. They aren't the Bossy Islanders.

Theyre a beatable team that causes us matchup problems...we're also a beatable team that causes THEM matchup problems.

Its the ultimate Size VS Speed matchup. Should be fun.

And we aren't giving up much of anything in the size department either. Too much being made of that slight advantage to LA.

 

[Tundra]

Good point - there was a lot of interference in Game 7 by LA.

Trust me. I watched it in the 2011 SCF finals. Parise was getting slowed down constantly. They coach it well. Simply thinking that the rangers speed will disrupt on the forecheck is abit naive, when playing a physical team that is that well coached.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Trust me. I watched it in the 2011 SCF finals. Parise was getting slowed down constantly. They coach it well. Simply thinking that the rangers speed will disrupt on the forecheck is abit naive, when playing a physical team that is that well coached.

The '12* Devils were no where near as good as we are now. They weren't as fast, nor as balanced, nor did they have the goalie to shut down the Kings.

 

[aufheben]

The Kings also take a lot of penalties.

NYR: PP-PK time = 25:00
LAK: PP-PK time = -19:20

That's a 45:00 difference in how many penalties we take/draw versus how many the Kings take/draw.

 

[chosen]

A lot of you have convinced yourselves that the Rangers are better and that they will win. I hope so, because this place will be unbearable if things turn out poorly

It is always fun, though, when a Ranger makes a "mistake" 1 minute into the game and some folks start losing their minds.

That's entertainment!

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

A lot of you have convinced yourselves that the Rangers are better and that they will win. I hope so, because this place will be unbearable if things turn out poorly

It is always fun, though, when a Ranger makes a "mistake" 1 minute into the game and some folks start losing their minds.

That's entertainment!

Chosen, you come onto these boards during the games? Rookie mistake.

 

[AHB*]

Hatred is an awfully strong word. I have dislike for Dorsett. I start off giving any and every player a fair shake when they become a part of the team. Rooting for Carcillo was hard after he fought Gaborik because he knew he'd win and crush him. That's like the bully in HS fighting the kid who stayed at home and studied physics 5 nights a week. Fair match up? No.

I remember the comments about Dorsett coming to us from the trade. That he'd leave it all on the ice for us. That he'd fight the biggest guy on the opposing team to get justice or revenge or whatnot.

I was excited. Losing Prust hurt in that regard and I was hoping Dorsett could provide something similar.

He didn't stick up for our team mates in the beginning of the year. After about the 5 game mark he was done fighting. We'd be creamed and there would be no retaliation. At one point, I remember a player from an opposing team saying something after delivering a dirty hit like "what are you going to do about it?". The team's image league wide was one of passiveness and an inability to stick up for each other.

Dorsett got hurt and the outlook looked worse. We traded for Carcillo, and I doubted he could help. And it was hard for me to even think that I could root for him because of his time with Philly.

And then we played that game against Philly several days after he was traded to us, and he energized the entire team. That's right around the time that the Rangers started ramping it up, too. They started fighting for each other. I will not attribute all or even most of that to Carcillo, but he did the role that Dorsett was supposed to supply earlier in the season.

Carcillo continued playing well and when Dorsett was ready to return he still was not on my **** list. In fact, I didn't care which one of them played. Seemed like an even swap to me. I don't know how to look at my past posts from several months ago but you can see that I have no reservations about playing Dorsett over Carcillo.

My opinion on him has changed, as my opinion on Rick Nash has changed. I don't have hatred, I just don't like what he brings to the table any longer. I have many reasons for this and I don't think it's unjustified, either. If we were to compare the two, I would hands down pick Carcillo being the better and smarter player.

I agree, they're interchangeable players. I prefer Carcillo, personally, but it's a matter of choice.

Carcillo was a completely different player back in the day, he's matured significantly.

Dorsett on the other hand, was described perfect by Weaver, a player who runs around like a chicken with his head cut off. The guy has taken so many dumb penalties since he came here, he just doesn't get it.

Spraying that kid in Montreal, head butting Weaver and spearing him. I want toughness, but toughness I can root for. The stuff he pulls is bush league.

 

[Inferno]

SJ played Alex Stalock in the LA series after Niemi was pulled. Anaheim played 3 goalies in the LA series. Crawford was hoping the puck would hit him in the LA series. Anaheim went with Gibson to save their season. He's just a baby. All of those series went the distance. If Crawford can make a lousy save and Chicago does a better job in the neutral zone in game 7, they win game 7. Crawford could not stop a beach ball in the Los Angeles series.

totally agreed...the goaltending they faced was horrendous...of course the argument can be made that they made them look horrendous.

i did notice that a lot of their goals seemed to be AIDED by aggressive goalies being out of their crease and the Kings getting empty net slam dunks.

that wont be the case with Henrik in net, a goalie who sits waaaayyy back.

 

[Tundra]

The '12* Devils were no where near as good as we are now. They weren't as fast, nor as balanced, nor did they have the goalie to shut down the Kings.

We were better defensively up front and we were bigger than this current ranger team. Obviously, this ranger team is quicker and your defense is deeper. Plus, we placed an emphasis on board play as opposed to this quick strike, transitional based rangers attack. The kings were simply deeper and we had no answer for Doughty & couldn't overcome the Kovalchuk injury. But here's the scary conclusion. The kings of 2014 are a grade above that team. They didn't have Gaborik not did they have the two speedy rookies flanking Carter.