Speculation: Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXIII

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I'll take Shestyorkin at 5.6m for 4 years over Sorokin at 4m for 3 years any day.

 

[tomobson]

I think Chytil still has two more seasons before the front office decides to move on from him. If the rumors are true he was considered untouchable in a possible EIchel trade so it seems they are very positive on him.

 

[Avery16]

At the risk of re-igniting the Kotkaniemi market value debate, Spector had some interesting observations this morning:

Renaud Lavoie concurred with Jean while Felix Seguin considers that offer way too much for a player like Kotkaniemi. It feels it would be unreasonable for the Canadiens to match it.

Some reports speculated Kotkaniemi signed this offer sheet with the understanding he would ink a longer-term deal with the Hurricanes next summer for an annual average value lower than $6.1 million.

NHL Rumor Mill – September 1, 2021 | Spectors Hockey

Should be interesting to see what plays out.

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

The status quo with Chytil isn't even bad, unless it's the player that wants to leave for more opportunities somewhere else. But he knows that there's almost no way Mika and Strome are both here next season.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Fils high danger chances do nothing to set up Panarin or create space for him thats the problem and they are generally a one and done play. If Fils game doesn't morph into more of a distributer he will never get time with elite wingers. I cant count how many times Fil had passing options but passed on them to try and beat the d 1 on 1 and turn the puck over, thats not what Panarin or Lafreniere want, they want possession of that puck and a better chance of extended offensive zone time. People trash on Strome but if you watch him and Panarin together its all about passing and getting open for both of them and they both play the same way so they can figure out where each other will be before they even move, thats not on Fils radar at all.

Chytil has the size and speed to carry the puck better than strome, play in the corners better than strome, and play in the crease better than strome.

For all their effectiveness we saw time and again since the bubble that when things tighten up, strome cant do shit for panarin.

The Rangers aren't going to wait forever for Chytil. He needs to take a big step in his career if he wants to be part of the Rangers.

You can't see that?

He needs to take advantage of whatever opportunity the Rangers give him. He really hasn't taken advantage of the opportunities Quinn gave him. They may not have been great opportunities but he could have forced them to give them more responsibility with his play.

The excuses have to stop. This season will be his 4th full NHL season. He played 9 AHL games a few years ago. He played 60 nHL games that season. There comes a point in time where the Rangers will look to move on if Chytil has another mediocre season. Going through the motions is not enough.

Drury and Gallant will find someone else.

Yeah, now or never.

Chytil performed very well in his limited role. He outplayed his minutes and never saw a bump in ice time. Every time hes played with top six wingers--very few times--hes made them better. Buchnevich had fantastic results with chytil. Kreider had great results. Kakko had great results.

 

[Raspewtin]

The Rangers aren't going to wait forever for Chytil. He needs to take a big step in his career if he wants to be part of the Rangers.

You can't see that?

He needs to take advantage of whatever opportunity the Rangers give him. He really hasn't taken advantage of the opportunities Quinn gave him. They may not have been great opportunities but he could have forced them to give them more responsibility with his play.

The excuses have to stop. This season will be his 4th full NHL season. He played 9 AHL games a few years ago. He played 60 nHL games that season. There comes a point in time where the Rangers will look to move on if Chytil has another mediocre season. Going through the motions is not enough.

Drury and Gallant will find someone else.

Yeah, now or never.

What advantage? When did Chytil ever get an "advantage" in the top 6? For like, 10 games when Mika was hurt two years ago (where he was outstanding)?

You call it excuses, I call it reasoning.

 

[Harbour Dog]

This is bull shit.

He has like one of the highest (if not the highest, I forget but he's top 2) high danger chance for rates on the team. We have creative playmaking wingers, hes EXACTLY the type of center you want playing with those guys.

I believe Gauthier and Kakko were 1 and 2, but Chytil was probably 3; he was right at Kakko's heels in a lot of possession metrics.

edit - of guys that played at least 100 minutes, Chytil was actually 8th.

 

[GAGLine]

Rangers have 9 mil in cap space according to CapFriendly.com


I wonder if the rangers will sign one more player or trade for someone like Larkin (example, prefer him over Eichel) UFA in the summer of 23.

We need to be careful with our cap space. Assuming the cap is 82.5 mil in 2022-23, we will have about 33 mil in cap space with 14 players signed. We have to pay Fox for sure, and probably Zib as well, or replace him with someone making near the same. If we bring in Larkin to replace Strome, that's another 6.1 mil. Then we have to re-sign Kakko and Kravtsov. And the following year, Larkin will need a new deal, as will Chytil if he's still here, and Laf and Miller.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

The status quo with Chytil isn't even bad, unless it's the player that wants to leave for more opportunities somewhere else. But he knows that there's almost no way Mika and Strome are both here next season.

Chytil just reminds me of Anisimov, a lot. All the talent in the world, and when he's on his game, he plays like freaking mario Lemieux. But those games are few and far in between.

At age 22 (next week) he's still growing and the potential is there, but I'm aware that this might be his ceiling. Still great to have for 2.3m a year. If he develops into a 50-point player, that's great value. Let's hope he can get there.

Interesting note on Chytil: When talking to Jarin Chmelař, he mentioned that Chytil reached out to him straight after the draft and they've talked a few times, Chytil offering his support. That's great to hear, and the type of commitment you want your players to show.

 

[Raspewtin]

Chytil had one less ES point than Strome in 250 less minutes getting two snakebitten rookies as his major linemates instead of the best winger in the world and he had 5 less ES points than Zibanejad despite, again, getting 230 minutes less and Zibanejad having access to the 2nd and 3rd best wingers on the team.


"he squandered opportunities" my balls.

 

[Fitzy]

Y'all and rangerboy are talking past each other. Yes, Chytil is very young, but duration of play with a franchise matters too.

The Flyers just moved on from Nolan Patrick, same draft, played a similar number of games. Now granted, he was trending down, not up, but it does factor into the decision. Chytil's development isn't going to be treated the same way at the same age as a fresh face like Morgan Barron

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

The Rangers aren't going to wait forever for Chytil. He needs to take a big step in his career if he wants to be part of the Rangers.

You can't see that?

He needs to take advantage of whatever opportunity the Rangers give him. He really hasn't taken advantage of the opportunities Quinn gave him. They may not have been great opportunities but he could have forced them to give them more responsibility with his play.

The excuses have to stop. This season will be his 4th full NHL season. He played 9 AHL games a few years ago. He played 60 nHL games that season. There comes a point in time where the Rangers will look to move on if Chytil has another mediocre season. Going through the motions is not enough.

Drury and Gallant will find someone else.

Yeah, now or never.

I mean everything you said here is wrong but okay haha

He’s improved very season, what more exactly are you expecting from him?

What opportunities did Quinn provide him? Playing on a line with rookies? Playing 3C cause Quinn had a love affair with Strome?

He’s not scoring 60 points with no PP time and being buried on the third line.

Laughable logic

 

[GAGLine]

Y'all and rangerboy are talking past each other. Yes, Chytil is very young, but duration of play with a franchise matters too.

The Flyers just moved on from Nolan Patrick, same draft, played a similar number of games. Now granted, he was trending down, not up, but it does factor into the decision. Chytil's development isn't going to be treated the same way at the same age as a fresh face like Morgan Barron

I think there's an inherent bias there, particularly amongst fans. Fans watch a player for years and get impatient that he hasn't improved faster. The same exact player, if they had been playing in lower leagues and tearing it up, would get much more benefit of the doubt.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Chytil certainly seems to have done enough at 5v5 last year to "earn it", at least to me:

28th percentile in TOI / G (among all C with 500+ min last year)
86th percentile in Goals / 60 (not the team...him)
96th percentile in Total Assists / 60
89th percentile in Shots / 60
51st percentile in Shooting %
75th percentile in FO %

For context, here is Zibanejad, who most agree is pretty good (though had tougher usage in terms of d-zone starts):

59th percentile in TOI / G
69th percentile in Goals / 60
90th percentile in Total Assists / 60
61th percentile in Shots / 60
69th percentile in Shooting %
28th percentile in FO %

Chytil's biggest issue most likely is that Panarin likes playing w Strome.

 

[Raspewtin]

Y'all and rangerboy are talking past each other. Yes, Chytil is very young, but duration of play with a franchise matters too.

The Flyers just moved on from Nolan Patrick, same draft, played a similar number of games. Now granted, he was trending down, not up, but it does factor into the decision. Chytil's development isn't going to be treated the same way at the same age as a fresh face like Morgan Barron

but then it makes even less sense. he's trended up every year in every major metric including basic scoring stats. and his ice time has gone down from the year prior.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

The Flyers just moved on from Nolan Patrick, same draft, played a similar number of games. Now granted, he was trending down, not up, but it does factor into the decision. Chytil's development isn't going to be treated the same way at the same age as a fresh face like Morgan Barron

There is no commonalities between these two aside from both being in the same draft.

One can barely play in the NHL due to injury and is one hit from being done

the other has improved every year and hasn’t been given an opportunity to prove he can play at the level the Rangers need

whoever said it earlier was dead on. We complain about the Rangers not being able to draft and develop centers and yet people think Chytil who is 22 and has been with the team for 4 years and hasn’t scored 60 points playing third line minutes, so let’s move on.

it’s like the meme of Eric Andre shooting Hannibal Burress and then asking “who did this?”

 

[Boris Zubov]

If Fil has Goodrow take most of his draws and then switch like Landeskog does, I think a line with them and one of Kreids/Krav will do well this year.

I'd prefer to see a Goodrow, Kakko, Chytil line. Chytil looked his best when him & Kakko were in sync before the broken wrist & vs the Canes in the play-in.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Even by the “eye test” I don’t see any argument for Chytil having stagnated or even being inconsistent. He was pretty much very good from start to finish last year minus a few post COVID games.

 

[Fitzy]

whoever said it earlier was dead on. We complain about the Rangers not being able to draft and develop centers and yet people think Chytil who is 22 and has been with the team for 4 years and hasn’t scored 60 points playing third line minutes, so let’s move on.

it’s like the meme of Eric Andre shooting Hannibal Burress and then asking “who did this?”

We have made it quite the trend, however.

NYR moved on from Malhotra at 22, York at 23, Anisimov at 23, Andersson at 21, and Savard at 21.

The reason none of this bothers me that much is because I'm extremely confident that Chytil will continue his progression this season. Whether that means he is ready to be a 2C or perhaps stay as a 3C is irrelevant to me, because he could be useful in either role.

 

[TheDirtyH]

I feel like Chytils play should really be opening a conversation about whether in the next handful of seasons he’ll be better than Zibanejad, not whether he’ll still be an NHL center.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I'd prefer to see a Goodrow, Kakko, Chytil line. Chytil looked his best when him & Kakko were in sync before the broken wrist & vs the Canes in the play-in.

That would put Gauthier in the top-6 with either Panarin-Strome or Lafrenière-Zibanejad.

 

[Fitzy]

I feel like Chytils play should really be opening a conversation about whether in the next handful of seasons he’ll be better than Zibanejad, not whether he’ll still be an NHL center.

Hertl-Chytil could be a hell of a one-two punch if we could pull it off.

 

[Boris Zubov]

That would put Gauthier in the top-6 with either Panarin-Strome or Lafrenière-Zibanejad.

Not definitively, but I also wouldn't hate it if he earned it with a strong preseason.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Absolutely.

I could easily see 50 goals from a 3rd line of Kreider, Chytil, Goodrow. Probably more like 40 removing Chris's PP contributions.

Yeah and that would be a great "3rd" line that could match up against pretty much anyone. It's not a traditional checking line that LB has tried to wish into existence, but there is size, speed, grind, defense with more than enough offense to justify its existence.

The issue with our current roster construct is that line would likely be used as a match up line against an opponents top line. Unless you load up Zibanejad and Panarin on one line and go with the "f*** you, we're going to out offense you" approach, but then you have a Panarin less Strome centering some combo of Kakko/Laf/Kravtsov/Blais, and if its Blais, one of Kakko/Laf/Kravtsov floating around with out anywhere to play (likely Krav.)

I understand the intrigue with Hertl from that aspect, he provides great offense and defense where you can load Panarin and Zibanejad, pair him with Laf and Kakko and still do work, and have that 3rd line. If the knees weren't an issue, I'd offer up Strome, Krav, Nils or Schneider and a top 10 protected 1st for a signed Hertl with out any hesitation.

Regardless, it doesn't have to be Hertl, but it can't be Strome. There isn't any defense there to speak of and there isn't enough offense from him sans Panarin to keep him around. He's a blocker right now more than he is an asset.

 

[jay from jersey]

Y'all and rangerboy are talking past each other. Yes, Chytil is very young, but duration of play with a franchise matters too.

The Flyers just moved on from Nolan Patrick, same draft, played a similar number of games. Now granted, he was trending down, not up, but it does factor into the decision. Chytil's development isn't going to be treated the same way at the same age as a fresh face like Morgan Barron

this is exactly right. This is his 5th season. I’m not saying that chytil can’t make more progress after that going fwd. but with the timeline Drury n Co have, they are not going into another offseason of “ can chytil finally take the next step and be a full time 2 C”
It’s not gonna happen. It’s most likely part of the reason why he was given a 2yr deal. This is a make or break year whether we fans agree with it or not. If chytil doesn’t take a big step fwd, bet your bottle dollar he’s getting traded in a package for a 2C upgrade.
Likely a guy that just as young, perhaps a little older. But the upgrade would have a more proven resume.
They aren’t going to want to trade a “ maybe this guys could take a big step fwd” for another maybe. They are going to want someone who is already more established.