So when are people gonna start talking about Zach Hyman?

[ChaoticOrange]

His first couple years in Edmonton he actually scored at a similar rate 5v5 as he did in his last couple years in Toronto. This year is an aberration.

The Leafs' failure was in recognizing his value as a net front presence on the powerplay. Averaged 50 seconds a game from 2018-2021.

 

[Goose]

All Leafs fan were sad to lose him and knew he'd do well once he signed in Edmonton, though I don't remember anyone predicting this well.

Leafs wanted to keep him as an in-house rental, which was a fair move, it's not like they stupidly let him go without any idea of what was happening. With their cap situation, their hands were tied.

But let's be real, Hyman is not the leading scorer if he's on the Panthers, he's a right time/right place situation that is operating at his absolute ceiling for potential thanks to McDavid.

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

Meh it's funnier that they signed John Tavares and blew up any chance they had at winning when they already had a group for 4-5 great forwards.

Tavares who has been at a cost of 11M/season for the last 6 years has finished once in the top-20 in scoring (16th).

I guess it's something to look forward to for Leafs fans that both him and Marner are off the books after next season.

But yeah what a waste of time. And yet, back then when Tavares went all LeBron james......talk was different around here.

A re-tool is in order. But what will this cursed organization do?

Grab your popcorn!

 

[ijuka]

Yeah, 5.5mil a year wasn't even too much for what Hyman was giving them.

Hyman just needed a 1C capable of making players around him better(so not Matthews).

 

[TS Quint]

Yes because the big boys have escaped any critics or blame right? Smh.

Putting this thread on ignore

No, your love of the overpaid Leafs core is making you miss the point. Its not a personal attack. Relax.

You were trying to make the point that Hyman, a 2.5m player wasn't known as a playoffs performer with the Leafs. He's not there to drive the team. He's not there to drive the Oilers at twice the price. At the end of the day both the Leafs and the Oilers (as almost every other team) will go as far as their stars take them. Not the guy making $2.5m. He is there to compliment the stars.

This is why it's so stupid the Leafs convince their fans it's always some complimentary piece that caused their playoff woes every year. They go as far as their stars can take them. I don't think Hyman scores 50 or even 40 goals on any other team in the NHL. But he does because of McDavid.

 

[Oddbob]

When was Connor McDavid a Leaf?

 

[BLNY]

It is to me.

It's called holy shit hindsight.

Hyman is a freakin' legend, a mythical creature.

Let's go back and think about it..............

Did ANYONE see this coming? 50 goals? Playoff scoring machine?

We knew he was a hard working hard grinding player but come on!

Very happy for the guy. He should be making double.

No one expected a 50g season. I expect it will likely be a blip year, and he'll return to 30 goal pace.

What's obvious is that with the Leafs commitment to 'the big four' he'd priced himself out of their available cap space. The Leafs tried replacing him with Bunting. Bunting had two good years and priced himself out again. Rinse, repeat.

 

[FerrisRox]

I’m all for shitting on the Leafs but Hyman wouldn’t have scored 50 in Toronto.

Considering not a single person in this thread said he would score 50 in Toronto, I have to say this is a very strange response.

But if he could have scored 30 for the Leafs, while continuing to go to the hard areas, continuing to dig out pucks and win board battles and play with a burr in his saddle in general, he would be a huge improvement on what they have, and I don't think that's a wild take or a big stretch in any way.

It's hilarious in this thread to see a few of the usual suspects from Leaf Land, who can't stop telling us how great Matthews and Marner are now telling us that Hyman would never have performed that way cause he wouldn't be surrounded by the high end talent he has in Edmonton.

Suddenly Mitch Marner isn't an elite playmaker? Suddenly Matthews can't elevate his teammates? How odd.

 

[Gorskyontario]

Yes because the big boys have escaped any critics or blame right? Smh.

Putting this thread on ignore

Hymen is playing for the cup, Marner and Matthews play for respect in the handshake line.

That's the key difference here.

 

[Golden_Jet]

When was Connor McDavid a Leaf?

He never was, the leading goal scorer is Hyman. He has 9 more goals than McDavid.

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

No one expected a 50g season. I expect it will likely be a blip year, and he'll return to 30 goal pace.

What's obvious is that with the Leafs commitment to 'the big four' he'd priced himself out of their available cap space. The Leafs tried replacing him with Bunting. Bunting had two good years and priced himself out again. Rinse, repeat.

I'm not so sure anymore.

Hyman is blowing minds is he not? He's blown my mind.

When he signed $5.5m for 7 years I'm pretty sure just about everyone was going "that's not going to turn out well"

And wow, we were ALL wrong.

I don't want the Oilers to win the cup, but if they do I will absolutely be watching Hyman lift the cup and be very happy to witness it.

He's incredible.

But then you have Jack Campbell and Connor Brown. I liked those guys too especially Connor Brown.

Yes because the big boys have escaped any critics or blame right? Smh.

Putting this thread on ignore

That's probably a good idea but I don't believe you'll do that.

Yet I love your enthusiasm but eh, gotta be realistic sometimes.......

 

[Fataldogg]

Imagine how the Leafs would do in the post season if they had a player like him.

 

[Grifter3511]

This thread screams of either bad faith/trolling or someone with zero ability to do any research before posting.

 

[Killer Orcas]

he didnt try, he was offered a bigger deal, and took the $$
on the Leafs he was nothing special, and actually stagnated the offense because he didnt have decent hands yet, ...then he got a lot better.

His hands didn't get better but the quality of his linemates sure did improve.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Today's Headlines

Sometimes, Some People Get it Wrong

Sometimes, Things Change

Sometimes, People Get It Right But Things Change

 

[BLNY]

I'm not so sure anymore.

Hyman is blowing minds is he not? He's blown my mind.

When he signed $5.5m for 7 years I'm pretty sure just about everyone was going "that's not going to turn out well"

And wow, we were ALL wrong.

I don't want the Oilers to win the cup, but if they do I will absolutely be watching Hyman lift the cup and be very happy to witness it.

He's incredible.

But then you have Jack Campbell and Connor Brown. I liked those guys too especially Connor Brown.



That's probably a good idea but I don't believe you'll do that.

Yet I love your enthusiasm but eh, gotta be realistic sometimes.......

Don't

I'm not so sure anymore.

Hyman is blowing minds is he not? He's blown my mind.

When he signed $5.5m for 7 years I'm pretty sure just about everyone was going "that's not going to turn out well"

And wow, we were ALL wrong.

I don't want the Oilers to win the cup, but if they do I will absolutely be watching Hyman lift the cup and be very happy to witness it.

He's incredible.

But then you have Jack Campbell and Connor Brown. I liked those guys too especially Connor Brown.

Don't get me wrong. He's been a great fit from day one. I think he'll maintain a 70-80 point pace for another year or so, but I don't expect 50 goals again. I think the 36 he had last year is a realistic adjusted for McDavid inflation from his years in Toronto. He's 32 this week. The numbers 'should' drop off, at which point he'll still be a manageable number.

It just wasn't for the the Leafs. They had three big contracts and knew there'd be another with Nylander. There just wasn't room for Hyman, even if you could predict the rise, or Bunting. Edmonton hasn't been great with their cap management, but they don't have 4 guys making $11 million or more. If the Leafs had avoided JT, they could have acquired a strong #2 at a reasonable number and kept Hyman. Maybe Bunting too.

 

[Darren McCord]

Kyle Dubas has made some questionable calls over the years.

Hyman was a 40 pt player in toronto and got a 5.5 x 7 year contract. If the leafs would have given him that people would of lost there minds.

Man the hindsight here is ridiculous

 

[HabsQC]

Next question

The Maple Leaf effect

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

1) Free agency.
2) Playing chicken with the wrong guy.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Hyman was a 40 pt player in toronto and got a 5.5 x 7 year contract. If the leafs would have given him that people would of lost there minds.

Man the hindsight here is ridiculous

He scored at a 30+ goal, 60+ point pace in the two years prior (94 games due to COVID) and scored at a 24 goal, 47 point pace the year before.

At the very least, he was a 20-30 goal, 45-60 point all-situations winger.

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

Don't

Don't get me wrong. He's been a great fit from day one. I think he'll maintain a 70-80 point pace for another year or so, but I don't expect 50 goals again. I think the 36 he had last year is a realistic adjusted for McDavid inflation from his years in Toronto. He's 32 this week. The numbers 'should' drop off, at which point he'll still be a manageable number.

It just wasn't for the the Leafs. They had three big contracts and knew there'd be another with Nylander. There just wasn't room for Hyman, even if you could predict the rise, or Bunting. Edmonton hasn't been great with their cap management, but they don't have 4 guys making $11 million or more. If the Leafs had avoided JT, they could have acquired a strong #2 at a reasonable number and kept Hyman. Maybe Bunting too.

I kinda agree with just about everything you're saying.

I keep saying "hindsight" because that's what we have now. Super easy to shit on an organization years later and say "they should have kept this player, they shouldn't have signed that player"

Really easy low hanging fruit if you want to rip on another team.

So I can just let it all go. It is what it is. That happened, hopefully something was learned and will be remembered.

Yeah, we really didn't have the cap room for the Hyman that was a Leaf. Tavares was a mistake, yet not a mistake at the time necessarily.

And yet, I feel like he's a very ineffective captain. Dude is a robot. Does he have an emotional pulse? Does he ever come across to anyone like in the locker room, he inspires or challenges the rest of the team?

I feel like if he has concerns about anything, he goes to management reluctanly and takes questions. I don't get the feeling he's in the room hyping them up or anything. Like just a useless leader really.

Morgan Rielly should have been the captain after Phaneuf who was also a robot type (worst Leafs captain since I've been a fan)

I should go do something else though. Zach Hyman has turned into an incredible hockey player. He is a rare thing and to think talk used to be about how he came from money and had favours galore to get into the NHL...................

 

[Suntouchable13]

He scored at a 30+ goal, 60+ point pace in the two years prior (94 games due to COVID) and scored at a 24 goal, 47 point pace the year before.

At the very least, he was a 20-30 goal, 45-60 point all-situations winger.

Regular season is not the issue here. He wasn't producing anywhere near those numbers in the playoffs for Toronto. Just like most of Toronto's players for whatever reason.

 

[BLNY]

I kinda agree with just about everything you're saying.

I keep saying "hindsight" because that's what we have now. Super easy to shit on an organization years later and say "they should have kept this player, they shouldn't have signed that player"

Really easy low hanging fruit if you want to rip on another team.

So I can just let it all go. It is what it is. That happened, hopefully something was learned and will be remembered.

Yeah, we really didn't have the cap room for the Hyman that was a Leaf. Tavares was a mistake, yet not a mistake at the time necessarily.

And yet, I feel like he's a very ineffective captain. Dude is a robot. Does he have an emotional pulse? Does he ever come across to anyone like in the locker room, he inspires or challenges the rest of the team?

I feel like if he has concerns about anything, he goes to management reluctanly and takes questions. I don't get the feeling he's in the room hyping them up or anything. Like just a useless leader really.

Morgan Rielly should have been the captain after Phaneuf who was also a robot type (worst Leafs captain since I've been a fan)

I should go do something else though. Zach Hyman has turned into an incredible hockey player. He is a rare thing and to think talk used to be about how he came from money and had favours galore to get into the NHL...................

Rielly would have been a good choice. Certainly seems to wear his heart on his sleeve compared to others.

When I saw the JT contract, I felt like any team that might have reached out dodged a bullet. JT's a very talented player, but no matter how they sold it or sell it he was coming in to support Matthews. Even in a 1A/1B scenario, you can't have both making that much.

He was just too tantalizing to say no to for them. There were no other comparable UFAs that year. They'd have had to make a trade, and that takes far more imagination and work.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Regular season is not the issue here. He wasn't producing anywhere near those numbers in the playoffs for Toronto. Just like most of Toronto's players for whatever reason.

Totally fair, thats a different argument than what I responded to though

 

[Vilica]

Year	Cap	Growth	Year	Cap	Growth
18-19	79.5		18-19	79.5
19-20	81.5	2.52%	19-20	81.5	2.52%
20-21	81.5	0.00%	20-21	83.5	2.50%
21-22	81.5	0.00%	21-22	87.7	5.00%
22-23	82.5	1.23%	22-23	92.1	5.00%
23-24	83.5	1.21%	23-24	96.7	5.00%
24-25	87.7	5.03%	24-25	101.5	5.00%
25-26	92	4.90%	25-26	106.6	5.00%

Left is actual, right is projected.

The entirety of the Tavares contract being bad and handcuffing Toronto is due to a Black Swan event. The 21-22 season was the first of the new US TV deal with TNT/ESPN, so the cap would have gone up that year without the pandemic bottoming out revenues. Hyman signs in Toronto with that extra 6 million in cap space they were "supposed" to have. When Dubas was talking about not needing to move any of the Core 4, the projection on the right was his working assumption, and he'd have been correct. Imagine how much better their depth would have been with an extra 10-15 million in cap space, with all their big contracts already signed.