So what happens if this team is actually bad?

[dechire]

If I had to pick the biggest issue for the team I'd say it's our zone entries/exits and neutral zone play. I watch a lot of teams around the league and I would say that we have the worst zone exits and neutral zone play in the league outside of Buffalo and maybe Colorado who I haven't seen much of. When the puck exits the zone it should be passed quickly and cleanly up through the zone. Instead we frequently see one player trying to carry the puck alone which leads to way too many turnovers and takeaways since the other team just surrounds that player. Often it's because the wingers are pushing forward without a presence in the middle so there's no one for the puck carrying winger to pass to except the other wing which is a risky pass to make. This also leads to a lot of offsides calls because the lack of a neutral zone system makes it difficult for the players to time their entries.

When the puck is brought into the offensive zone it's often just dumped and control is lost. We rarely see the team set up in an offensive formation with solid passing and cycling. I was watching Arizona play yesterday and they had a clear system of passing to the point and cycling the puck. They aren't even a good team and I couldn't help thinking about how much more in control they seemed in the offensive zone than the Stars are. Whenever we're in the offensive zone it seems like a complete cluster**** of players just throwing the puck around and hoping something comes of it which leads to losing the puck and the ridiculous number of breakaways we give up especially on the powerplay. This is most obvious when you look at the Benn-Spezza-Seguin line who were basically thrown together because they're great players and they toss around the puck and sometimes they score just because they're very skilled players.

These are all coaching issues. There is no ****ing system to the Stars' play right now. We say we have a speed-based system but that isn't really true. It's more like the plan is to toss a bunch of fast players on the ice together and hope they'll do something with it. It doesn't matter how many elite skilled players we have on the team if the system of play leads to us losing possession every 15 seconds. There is no excuse for our play to be as sloppy as it is. If it's just a few players we can say that maybe it's a personnel issue. If it's every player on the team it's an issue with the coaches. Think about why Klingberg looks so good out there. Is it really because he's the only player with high hockey iq and creativity or has he just not been coached out of it yet ? It's not a coincidence that every defenseman has "regressed" this year. It's not a coincidence that every forward is struggling.

 

[OttMorrow]

This is incredibly short sighted. We have only 3 forwards who are playing well right now. Dumping Hemskey damages our reputation with future UFAs and would return pennies on the dollar.

I never said to dump him, you just put my thoughts next to somebody else's who wanted to dump him. Don't know if you meant to call me short-sighted for being frustrated with Hemsky or not?

 

[Zrhutch]

I'm going to tell you all something, and you're either A) not going to like it, or B) youre going to dismiss it entirely.

Trevor Daley is literally bringing down everyone else he plays with.

 

[Satan]

We traded away his only good defensive partner

 

[Frozen Failure]

I'm going to tell you all something, and you're either A) not going to like it, or B) youre going to dismiss it entirely.

Trevor Daley is literally bringing down everyone else he plays with.

Which is why they only run Daley on the first unit?

It's either indicative that Daley is INDEED bringing everyone around him down, or his minutes are bringing everyone around him down. I wonder what happens if they put him and Klingberg together.

For more than three minutes, obviously.

 

[dechire]

I'm going to tell you all something, and you're either A) not going to like it, or B) youre going to dismiss it entirely.

Trevor Daley is literally bringing down everyone else he plays with.

That 1:28 he played with Gonchar wasn't bad

 

[MetalGodAOD*]

I'm going to tell you all something, and you're either A) not going to like it, or B) youre going to dismiss it entirely.

Trevor Daley is literally bringing down everyone else he plays with.

I mentioned that yesterday that he's been bad at 5v5. It surprised me too but I guess isn't that surprising considering the team's success as awhole.

 

[Mr Misty]

I never said to dump him, you just put my thoughts next to somebody else's who wanted to dump him. Don't know if you meant to call me short-sighted for being frustrated with Hemsky or not?

My bad then. I'd say given his track record we should be patient with him, but it seems like a lot of scapegoating of him is going on and I am overreacting to it.

 

[Mr Misty]

I'm going to tell you all something, and you're either A) not going to like it, or B) youre going to dismiss it entirely.

Trevor Daley is literally bringing down everyone else he plays with.

I read in the past two weeks about how Daley and Goligoski were a struggling pair and that the Stars should split up the much more effective Dillon-Benn pair to shore up that weakness. On a major Canadian hockey website, not some goofy blog somewhere, a person thought that and then typed it out and published it.

 

[OttMorrow]

My bad then. I'd say given his track record we should be patient with him, but it seems like a lot of scapegoating of him is going on and I am overreacting to it.

No prob.

 

[phil7488]

The next couple of weeks will very possibly decide the rest of the season for us. We have a slightly "lighter" schedule it terms of difficulty and if we don't take most of them, then I'm all for making drastic moves. This team, specifically in the 3rd period, is horrifying to watch.

1. Jamie Benn is not playing like Jamie Benn. His confidence is shot and he needs something to stimulate him. He's better than this. He knows it; we all know it. Maybe bench him too, send a message.

2. Trevor Daley is having the worst month of his career. Straight cancerous.

3. The D core all around just sucks. Turnovers galore, out of position constantly and just leaving Kari in precarious positions consistently. Klingberg is the only real bright spot and when you have a rookie coming in as your best player, you know you're in trouble. The key question with him is, will he come down to earth? Or can he sustain his great play?

4. Hemsky? Who knows? Is he just really bad or just really unlucky?

5. Tough to fully put the blame squarley on Ruff and his staff but some more shakeups may need to happen. I personally think it's more of a personel issue than a coaching issue.

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

Tend to agree its personnel, especially since Ruff isn't the kind of coach to lose the room as it were, in such a short span.

As I have mentioned, it turns out we really didn't fix our personnel issues from last year - With Spezza on line one, and Nuke out, the Eakin line is still no. 2. D is still bad. Backup goalie still bad.

I think Nil knows he needs another year or maybe two to put all the players he needs in place.

 

[Stargazer1111]

This is incredibly short sighted. We have only 3 forwards who are playing well right now. Dumping Hemskey damages our reputation with future UFAs and would return pennies on the dollar.

No it isn't. 2 assists in 17 games is inexcusable for a forward who gets paid 4 million per year.

It isn't short sighted to realize that Dallas may not be the best fit for Hemsky either. It might be better for him as a player to play somewhere else.

 

[Elysian]

I still think we need to see an Eakin-Spezza-Roussel 2nd line. Keep Hemsky with Benn and Seguin, see where it goes. That 2nd line would be formidable, IMO. Defensively responsible, and dominant on the dot.

 

[Mr Misty]

No it isn't. 2 assists in 17 games is inexcusable for a forward who gets paid 4 million per year.

It isn't short sighted to realize that Dallas may not be the best fit for Hemsky either. It might be better for him as a player to play somewhere else.

If you think 17 games in the context of this mess is a better predictor for the 2.75 seasons he has left under contract than the previous 5 seasons of his career, that is the definition of short sighted.

And 4m is pretty reasonable for a UFA top 6 forward. It's a lower cap hit than Cole, Horcoff, Whitney, or Jagr had as Stars.

Maybe the Stars aren't a good fit for Hemsky, but the current setup is a good fit for any hockey players right now, maybe waiting for the team to figure things out a bit is a better idea than giving up on a historically productive player.

 

[ElGuapo]

I definitely don't think he should be dumped after 17 games, but in his last three seasons before the change of scenery in Ottawa he was just under a 0.5 PPG per season pace. Not that impressive but at this point I'd be really happy with a 40 point guy considering his current 10 point pace.

 

[Elysian]

Honestly, he's got to get better, his shooting percentage is WAY below average, that's not sustainable with the effort he's putting in. He's looked a LOT better with Benn and Seguin, just been unlucky.

 

[glovesave_35]

If you think 17 games in the context of this mess is a better predictor for the 2.75 seasons he has left under contract than the previous 5 seasons of his career, that is the definition of short sighted.

And 4m is pretty reasonable for a UFA top 6 forward. It's a lower cap hit than Cole, Horcoff, Whitney, or Jagr had as Stars.

Maybe the Stars aren't a good fit for Hemsky, but the current setup is a good fit for any hockey players right now, maybe waiting for the team to figure things out a bit is a better idea than giving up on a historically productive player.

You have to at least admit that his not scoring is a problem right now. That offensive track record you mention is something they were counting on and as of yet he just hasn't shown any hint of it. It's not like he's hitting posts and setting up teammates for tap-in goals that are being missed, he just isn't generating much positive at all. He's most noticeable when he's causing an offsides call with that one extra dipsy doodle at the blue line.

In light of that, what do you recommend we do with him? I agree 17 games is too soon to dump him but by the time the trade deadline rolls around if he is still running entirely on his resume pre-Dallas it would be a fair time to trade him. If that were the case Hemsky would probably welcome a change.

 

[Elysian]

You have to at least admit that his not scoring is a problem right now. That offensive track record you mention is something they were counting on and as of yet he just hasn't shown any hint of it. It's not like he's hitting posts and setting up teammates for tap-in goals that are being missed, he just isn't generating much positive at all. He's most noticeable when he's causing an offsides call with that one extra dipsy doodle at the blue line.

In light of that, what do you recommend we do with him? I agree 17 games is too soon to dump him but by the time the trade deadline rolls around if he is still running entirely on his resume pre-Dallas it would be a fair time to trade him. If that were the case Hemsky would probably welcome a change.

We've got a team-wide scoring problem though. If he was the only one, it'd be something to discuss, but his play as of late has been much improved, now we need the whole team to improve.

 

[glovesave_35]

We've got a team-wide scoring problem though. If he was the only one, it'd be something to discuss, but his play as of late has been much improved, now we need the whole team to improve.

That's one way of looking at it. Another way is to realize that scoring was always expected to be top heavy on this roster and that Hemsky had options of playing with either Spezza or Seguin, both of whom have good numbers. Dallas is 16th in the league in goals per game, so pretty average rather than really bad. I'm not willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for much longer.

 

[dechire]

That's one way of looking at it. Another way is to realize that scoring was always expected to be top heavy on this roster and that Hemsky had options of playing with either Spezza or Seguin, both of whom have good numbers. Dallas is 16th in the league in goals per game, so pretty average rather than really bad. I'm not willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for much longer.

We're only 16th in the league because we used to be much higher and have dropped because of our recent terrible play. If we'd started out with average scoring we'd be at the bottom of the league right now. Jamie Benn has 2 points in the last 5 games. Daley has 0. Eakin has 0. Goligoski has 0. Hemsky has 1. In fact the only players with 3 or more points in the past 5 games are Seguin, Spezza, Roussel and Cole.

I don't know why everyone is choosing to scapegoat Hemsky as though he hasn't been noticeably improved since being benched, was one of the few players that looked like they gave a **** in the 3rd against Chicago and also is no worse than anyone else on this team. He's also only been a top 6 player for the last 2 games and he collected a point in one of them.

Everyone is acting so ****ing alarmist and picking players to blame instead of accepting the fact that the entire team sucks right now. All of them. The defense is bad. The offense is bad. You can blame individual players if you want but even if those players are gone the team will still be bad unless the entire team plays better. Jordie Benn isn't the reason we lose. Hemsky is not the reason we lose. No individual player is the reason we lose. And once the team gets their **** together and starts playing the way we all know they can then all this dramatic **** and blaming players is going to look short-sighted.

 

[StarsTx]

To be fair though, while Dallas may be average in goal scoring statistically, that's only because Seguin has been playing lights out, and seems like most of Spezza's points have come curtesy of Seguin's ability to put the puck in the net. Not saying he is playing bad, but he has been hit or miss this year. Other then Seguin and Roussel I'll agree everyone else is struggling along with Hemsky. Obviously not as bad but if he stays on Seguin's line this week against lesser opponents (as opposed to teams with great d like The hawks and wild) I suspect we will see a spike in his scoring. Maybe Fiddler and Horcoff are playing pretty decent.

 

[StarsTx]

One person might not be reason we are losing, but when your consistently playing losing hockey and not helping in any way but rather consistently hurting the team with your individual play, being called out like Jordie has been is perfectly acceptable and warranted. I like Jordie and would love for him to turn it around but he has been awful and literally brought whoever he has been partnered with down with him. For that reason, I personally see nothing wrong with us as fans stating that what we see.

 

[Mr Misty]

You have to at least admit that his not scoring is a problem right now. That offensive track record you mention is something they were counting on and as of yet he just hasn't shown any hint of it. It's not like he's hitting posts and setting up teammates for tap-in goals that are being missed, he just isn't generating much positive at all. He's most noticeable when he's causing an offsides call with that one extra dipsy doodle at the blue line.

In light of that, what do you recommend we do with him? I agree 17 games is too soon to dump him but by the time the trade deadline rolls around if he is still running entirely on his resume pre-Dallas it would be a fair time to trade him. If that were the case Hemsky would probably welcome a change.

As others have said, I don't think this sort of run is sustainable given his career numbers. He wasn't ever a shooter, so I don't expect him to be hitting the post a bunch, but I am satisfied with how much he is creating. He stuck out for me last game, the Chicago play by play guy hates him and spent about 2 solid minutes tearing him down and expecting him to disappear after the big hit in the 1st, but then did give him props for making things happen even if it didn't result in a goal.

The first thing I do is split Benn and Seguin and call up Ritchie. Blend it all up and find something new that works. If Hemsky isn't playing well by the deadline and wants to go, I don't think you will find a buyer for 2 years at 4m each. I'd be very surprised if he is playing elsewhere before a year is up. Hemsky isn't the problem, moving him won't solve the problem, selling at a loss will hurt the team depth Bruce Levine wouldn't shut up about all preseason, that leaves only patience and perhaps acceptance that this is a lost year.

 

[Elysian]

One person might not be reason we are losing, but when your consistently playing losing hockey and not helping in any way but rather consistently hurting the team with your individual play, being called out like Jordie has been is perfectly acceptable and warranted. I like Jordie and would love for him to turn it around but he has been awful and literally brought whoever he has been partnered with down with him. For that reason, I personally see nothing wrong with us as fans stating that what we see.

Our D is definitely the ones that deserve the blame, especially in games where we score 3 or more. Games like with that many goals need to be wins. I won't blame Hemsky because I don't think for a second he'll keep this up. Cole on the other hand...