Confirmed Trade: [SJS/BUF] 2024 1st (11OA) for 2024 1st (14OA) and 2024 2nd (42OA)

[Juxtaposer]

Love?

You love giving up 42 for a 3 spot move up in a draft everyone agrees is the same tier from 6-18?

Not even “like”…you full on love it?

In my opinion, the tier breaks at 12. So as long as Grier takes someone in that tier (Parekh, Yakemchuk, Sennecke, Iginla, and Catton being the potential guys still left) then I’m thrilled with this trade.

If he just moved up to get Eiserman or Solberg or something then obviously I’d hate it.

 

[themelkman]

Because they had three seconds and just got one of them for basically nothing. They obviously think there is a guy they like that will be there at 11 but not 14.

Thats bad asset management, but I understand the rationale.

They trust their scouts can beat the data, I dont.

 

[biturbo19]

What on earth is going on with these pre-draft trades that are just picks going wherever? First Chicago-Isles, now this?


Are some teams seeing an absolutely brutal cutoff in talent and trying to get ahead of it? Others aren't as serious or planning on moving their 1st anyway? But even then...isn't a later first beyond that drop-off going to be worth a lot less anyway?

 

[MikeK]

Seems like a move to bolster a trade package.

 

[Sota Popinski]

Thats bad asset management, but I understand the rationale.

They trust their scouts can beat the data, I dont.

I guess. But the data says that less than 40% of 2nd round picks play 100 games in the NHL. And there is way less consensus about players as the draft goes along. So if you think that you can guarantee that you'll get a player you really like at 11 and might not at 14, they can still trade down from 33 to recoup another pick and still possibly get their targets in the 2nd round

 

[KrakenSabresMike]

In my opinion, the tier breaks at 12. So as long as Grier takes someone in that tier (Parekh, Yakemchuk, Sennecke, Iginla, and Catton being the potential guys still left) then I’m thrilled with this trade.

If he just moved up to get Eiserman or Solberg or something then obviously I’d hate it.

The tier is for sure not 12 - look at this list and tell me it’s 12 with a straight face

Minimum it’s 14 deep

 

[Juxtaposer]

The tier is for sure not 12 - look at this list and tell me it’s 12 with a straight face

Minimum it’s 14 deep View attachment 888322

With a straight face, I will tell you that Helenius, Eiserman, and Brandsegg-Nygard are not in my first tier.

Relax, it’s just my personal ranking.

 

[Zach716]

With a straight face, I will tell you that Helenius, Eiserman, and Brandsegg-Nygard are not in my first tier.

Relax, it’s just my personal ranking.

Helenius and MBN are perfect picks to add to Buffalo’s system, eventually some actual roster optimization needs to happen instead of collecting the highest skilled prospects. Granted Adams actually uses this pick

 

[Juxtaposer]

Helenius and MBN are perfect picks to add to Buffalo’s system, eventually some actual roster optimization needs to happen instead of collecting the highest skilled prospects. Granted Adams actually uses this pick

Totally, either of those guys would be great picks at 14, and would have been at the top of my list there. But the 12 guys I have ranked above them are either more talented or better fits for SJ. All I’m saying.

 

[Zach716]

Totally, either of those guys would be great picks at 14, and would have been at the top of my list there. But the 12 guys I have ranked above them are either more talented or better fits for SJ. All I’m saying.

Catton falling there could be huge for SJ

 

[BillR10]

The tier is for sure not 12 - look at this list and tell me it’s 12 with a straight face

Minimum it’s 14 deep View attachment 888322

If your target is say Yakemchuk or Sennecke then the odds are they won't be available at 14. Also let's be real this is 1 persons list not everyone's. Ive seen those 2 in many mocks go even higher than 11

 

[Juxtaposer]

Catton falling there could be huge for SJ

Unfortunately I don’t see the Sharks taking Catton because he’s smaller even though he’s 6 or 7 on my personal list, but being at 11 guarantees us one of the six defenseman, Iginla, or Sennecke.

 

[TheUnusedCrayon]

Absolutely wild decision considering this year's draft.

 

[KrakenSabresMike]

With a straight face, I will tell you that Helenius, Eiserman, and Brandsegg-Nygard are not in my first tier.

Relax, it’s just my personal ranking.

Ok good for you but people should judge the trade by consensus or analytics based ratings not personal ones…

If your target is say Yakemchuk or Sennecke then the odds are they won't be available at 14. Also let's be real this is 1 persons list not everyone's. Ive seen those 2 in many mocks go even higher than 11

Point being? They ( Buffalo) don’t have one specific target clearly and I’d argue I’ve heard multiple folks say Sennecke could go 6 or 7 so why are we even discussing them in relation to trading back from 11

 

[hamzarocks]

Laat few years the NHL has stopped being as robotic and fixed to trades as they were in 2006 to 2015 era

They trade picks 2-4 years out into future *never recall this happenning when I started watching hockey

There is now double retention when this never used to happen

Trades of NHL players happens after TDLs now sometimes

Trades happening in the playoffs for good and actual NHLers

And this, trading picks before the draft randomly

 

[flyersjim73]

I can understand why a team would trade back before the draft if they have a lot of players ranked similarly.

I truly do not understand why a team would trade up before the draft. You trade up to acquire a specific player. You don’t know whether that player will be available at the pick you’re trading up for or for that matter if they’re going to fall to the pick you already had.

 

[cheesymc]

Wow, I like it… Grier is killing it… 2nd rounder to take Walman, now moving up to get a better top prospect. Someone in their top 10 or higher can fall in in their laps this draft.

Celebrini + Yak/Sennecke? Lucky son of….

 

[Stewie Griffin]

I can understand why a team would trade back before the draft if they have a lot of players ranked similarly.

I truly do not understand why a team would trade up before the draft. You trade up to acquire a specific player. You don’t know whether that player will be available at the pick you’re trading up for or for that matter if they’re going to fall to the pick you already had.

It's been reiterated this whole thread. The Sharks traded up to ensure they get one of the top-6 D, or one of the higher ranked forwards. They want a defensemen...they wouldn't of gotten one of the top-6 at 14.

Either way though, you trade up because of tiers. If the Sharks draft board thinks this tier ends at pick 11/12, then they just traded up into it. Simple as that.

 

[aircobra]

I can understand why a team would trade back before the draft if they have a lot of players ranked similarly.

I truly do not understand why a team would trade up before the draft. You trade up to acquire a specific player. You don’t know whether that player will be available at the pick you’re trading up for or for that matter if they’re going to fall to the pick you already had.

Two things: It's possible Buffalo wanted to trade the pick before the draft, so the Sharks couldn't wait. The Sharks might now have an easier time moving up into the top-10.

 

[flyersjim73]

It's been reiterated this whole thread. The Sharks traded up to ensure they get one of the top-6 D, or one of the higher ranked forwards. They want a defensemen...they wouldn't of gotten one of the top-6 at 14.

Either way though, you trade up because of tiers. If the Sharks draft board thinks this tier ends at pick 11/12, then they just traded up into it. Simple as that.

Neither of these change the point that they are still not ensured to get a top 6 defenseman or player in the tier they’re aiming for at 11, and there’s no guarantee they wouldn’t have gotten them at 14. You simply can’t know that for sure until 11 is on the clock.

IMO for that reason it doesn’t make sense to do this before the draft.

 

[Stewie Griffin]

Neither of these change the point that they are still not ensured to get a top 6 defenseman or player in the tier they’re aiming for at 11, and there’s no guarantee they wouldn’t have gotten them at 14. You simply can’t know that for sure until 11 is on the clock.

IMO for that reason it doesn’t make sense to do this before the draft.

But like I said, one of the top-6 D or a top forward that they clearly have in a tier above the others. If the Sharks have a tier that ends at 11-13, it makes complete sense to move up from 14 to guarantee one of those guys.

 

[flyersjim73]

Two things: It's possible Buffalo wanted to trade the pick before the draft, so the Sharks couldn't wait. The Sharks might now have an easier time moving up into the top-10.

The first one is probably the best argument I’ve heard for this. Good thought.

The second one I suppose is possible, but if I’m them I’m just trying to move directly into the top 10 if the player I want is there. I guess they could have explored this and determined they weren’t going to be able to do it that way, but I sort of doubt it.

 

[Djp]

Hmmm... don't really get it from BUF's perspective. I guess they will have a shot at a decent 2nd rounder like O'Rielly or Brunicke. Seems like there could be a really nice player at 11oa, but maybe they are good with MBN?

I mean, why not wait till the draft to see who's there?

why

1.getting an additional 2nd as a trade piece for a different trade.

2. They player they are high on is likely still there at 14

3. In terms of value if they were to acquire Necas/winger they are looking st Reinhart an Fiala trades where the 1st I'd more like a playoff first.

 

[aircobra]

The first one is probably the best argument I’ve heard for this. Good thought.

The second one I suppose is possible, but if I’m them I’m just trying to move directly into the top 10 if the player I want is there. I guess they could have explored this and determined they weren’t going to be able to do it that way, but I sort of doubt it.

Or they teams they engaged with didn't want to move all the way back to 14.

 

[dkollidas]

Come on Kevyn, this is a precursor to a real asset acquisition, right? Right!?!?

I applaud his patience at times but sometimes it’s just too much.

Gotta give to get a bit.